EPTTeam Melee Mini Mafia II - Page 3
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On September 27 2010 10:22 SouthRawrea wrote: Not my fault my teammates are lazy >.> and really I'm just voting you temporarily for now. I've mentioned that I managed to only find a bit of information about you two "medic" teams and I'm basically going to go over your actions again before the day is over and think about changing my vote. Your buddy just wagoned me so T_T I'm not really expecting you to change your vote, so if you're mafia, you don't have to bother trying. You have nothing to lose by disappearing and not doing what you say. | ||
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Look at the votes and look at the positions people have taken. If I'm mafia, then my behavior doesn't make much sense unless Foolishness is mafia. If Foolishness was mafia, there is no reason for me to medic claim. RoL was scummy enough as it is. I wouldn't have needed to risk claiming when the three other teams are plenty scummy enough to lynch. Besides, It also doesn't make sense for Foolishness to defy my T1 analysis in favor of T7 if we're both mafia. Plainly speaking, its highly unlikely for me to be mafia at this point. Lynch team 6. | ||
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[Vote]Team 1 | ||
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Adendum: The other option is that Foolishness is mafia. Which I'm analyzing at this point, but I find extremely unlikely. | ||
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On September 29 2010 13:08 Foolishness wrote: I think this confirms Incognito and Infundibulum as medic. If we assume they are mafia, then the situations as follows: 1) We have a medic, which doesn't make sense since they would have said something by now. 2) There is no medic. But this does not make sense either since Incognito and Infundibulum claimed to have protected themselves. If they were mafia, it'd be much more plausible for them to say they protected team 3 (or any other team maybe). This is because they'd instantly be seen as confirmed, and rastaban and I would instantly be on their side, and they'd virtually have no way of losing. Also consider that it'd be believable for the mafia to hit us (team 3), especially given that people were talking about it during the night. Long way of saying what we pretty much already know, but it's more reason not to doubt their claim, and more reason for us to focus on teams 1 through 3. I still think team 2 is mafia at the moment, but I'll be looking. 2) is not possible. Mafia are not allowed to no hit. The fact that nobody died last night means that a medic exists. Since nobody else has claimed, we're the medic. Night 1: Ace/BM dies. Ace's top suspect was LSB (Team 1). Night 2: Pandain/BB dies. Pandain wrote two long posts on why LSB was mafia and why Pyrr was mafia. And another one on why meeple was town. Night 3: I am targetted. I pushed Team 1 day 1. I also stated I was for sure going to vote Team 1 after Team 6 was lynched. Common thread here? People who accuse Team 1 die. 3x is more than a coincidence to me. With that said, I have reason to believe Team 1 may not be mafia. Unvote: Team 1 Pyrr/LSB have had bad activity and haven't been pro-town at all. Granted, I attacked them very close to the beginning of the game, so the townie-defense-mode kneejerk reaction might well be the case. Their recent (in)activity might just be disgust of my attacks. The night kills totally don't look good for them. However, I'm looking at the day 2 lynch. I linked Team 7 and Team 1. Why would Team 1 be so outraged at the connection if they were mafia? They would have known Team 7 is innocent. Since I was going for Team 7 for lynch instead of Team 1, Team 1 shouldn't have any worries about the Team 7 lynch because Team 7's death would discredit my connection. Pyrr has the idea that I know Pyrr is mafia, therefore YellowInk is mafia. Let's assume he believes that that was my actual argument. As mafia, why would he care if an Innocent YellowInk is lynched? He doesn't. YellowInk flipping green is good for his case. Pyrr has no reason to discredit the link there, especially since we're going after YI before Pyrr. As Foolishness also said, Team 1 accusing Team 6 day one doesn't make too much sense unless they were feeling really desperate. Team 2 doesn't make sense. I was targetted by the mafia. Given Foolishness' adamant attacks on Team 2, it doesn't make sense for Team 2 to kill me, since I would save them and kill team 1. Killing Foolishness seems the most sensible here, as the risk of Team 2 losing by Foolishness's vote is just too great to warrant using a WIFOM argument. Looking at those two teams, we find that by process of elimination, Team 3 must be mafia. However, lets still examine them a little closer: Team 3 makes sense. Team 7 blindly calls out Team 6 on day 2. Foolishness attacks this and says he'd go for it but nobody's presented any analysis on Team 6. Then on day 3, Foolishness votes Team 6 and tells us to just read their posts to see why. Something that YellowInk said the day before but Foolishness criticized. This comes after I claim medic. Now why does Foolishness decide to vote Team 6 instead of me? Even after he said he'd go after me if meeple flipped green. First of all, if he's mafia, he can't discount my statement of disgust/ragequit. He has to assume it is a trap. Foolishness probably knows that Pyrr did the same thing as mafia. It is easy for him to sit back while town viciously kills me for this "tell". Its hard for him to jump on board because that's just not his style. He isn't known for lynching off of these bogus "tells". Since he has to assume that I'm bluffing and that I'm not ragequitting, he can't safely jump on that wagon. Therefore, he has to do it by analysis. However, its hard for Foolishness to do a full post analysis of me in the context of me being mafia. If he is forced to quote all my posts, like he did for meeple, its painfully obvious that I'm town from my first few posts and the general fact that I'm the driving force of this game. So he might as well let others deduce that I'm fishy by themselves. Notice how the entire game Foolishness has been dropping posts indicating that he thinks I'm mafia. He never backs up a single one of those attacks with evidence. Interesting, given that I've dared him multiple times to analyze my posts and find me scummy. In any case, its hard for Foolishness to get away with good analysis noting why I'm mafia. Also hard for him to get away with a BS reason on why I'm mafia, as he doesn't know if my ragequit statement was planned or not. Safer for him to let other people find me scummy and lynch me, while he votes his own team mate. Notice how he never gives Pyrr a reason why he thinks RoL is more scummy than me. He also never gives inf an answer to where inf dropped "medic tells". Because quite frankly, he prefers if I'm lynched. He doesn't want to convince anyone that I'm innocent. Besides, a lot of people are going to find me suspicious. I lynched an innocent, and made funny statements. So now he's caught. He can't really lynch Team 1 or 8. Which leaves his scumbuddy and Team 2. Gunning for Team 2 doesn't make sense given his previous statements about team 6. Politically he was suspicious of Team 6 at the end of Day 2. Which makes it hard for him to vote team 2 off the bat. After RoL's fakeclaim though, notice Foolishness suggesting a switch to Team 2. Even after the fakeclaim he still can't really vote me because he'd have to have real analysis. Foolishness can't viably push Team 1 because he's opposed it all game. Perhaps he was banking on me pushing it to lead him to victory. He also can't push Team 2 given that they aren't really on anyone's radar at this point. He can't push me if he thinks I'm going to win in the analysis battle. So he has to push Team 6, who is on people's radar, and has been playing scummily. He just has to rely on either me pushing Team 1 ruthlessly, or people wanting to kill me for whatever reason. Then, if the vote is close enough, a last minute switch would win him the game. Furthermore, Foolishness hasn't been giving much analysis this game, if at all. The main piece of analysis here is on meeple. Which I previously stated was superficially agreeable yet in reality it was sketchy analysis. He does none of the usual fishing, jabs, or other provocative moves whatsoever in the thread aimed at gaining information. His only other "analytical" piece is a process of elimination move where he picks Team 2/6 for mafia. All the hits on proponents of a Team 1 lynch could be fabricated to convince me that something is up with Team 1. After all, I'm the most vocal player here so far, so convincing me of something while opposing me in thread gains him credibility when I eventually get Team 1 lynched and they flip green. My main worry right now is that I think Foolishness plays a much more passive mafia than he has played this game. Team 1's play is absolutely attrocious apart from the day 2 defense followed by a green flip. That's the main reason for me keeping them alive at this point. Note that the stuff on Team 3 isn't pure analysis. It has a lot of weird logic in it. The main reason I see for Team 3 to be mafia is that Team 1/2 doesn't really fit. Foolishness fits a lot more in my opinion. Main points: 1) Foolishness hasn't really been doing analysis, or at least, with the exception of meeple (sketchy analysis), he hasn't been posting it. 2) Foolishness hasn't been actively gathering information. 3) Pointing to Foolishness's willingness to lynch Team 6 doesn't quite work because a) he had few other options after my post-Day 2 comments. As long as he got one townie to vote me, he would still be safe with a last minute switch, winning the game. [Vote]Team 3 | ||
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He knew Team 1 was innocent. He knew how adamantly I was pushing Team 1 on day 1. He knew that opposing it could give him town cred in the future. With my accusations of team 7, it doesn't look all too suspicious for Foolishness because I'm pretty much at the head of the lynch. Causing some chaos, veering me off my course, and later trapping me with my own convictions on Team 1 gives mafia the easy win, as that's already two mislynches right there. | ||
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On September 29 2010 16:55 Divinek wrote: shit you know the foolishness thing does make alot of sense, like ALOT of sense to me. I was majorly considering it but team 1 seemed so convincing. Probably just blind with rage for lsb attacking me  i guess i can pull my vote off since i won't get mod killed and think about it for a while longer ##unvote You're a sheep. Both your team and team 1 are utter garbage. | ||
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On September 29 2010 23:23 Foolishness wrote: Yes, you're right, that is weird logic there. I still say team 2 is mafia over team 1 since it doesn't make much sense for team 1 to have been voting for their mafia buddy the other day. You haven't even commented on this "process of elimination" that I have posted about multiple times have you? I already said that it probably doesn't mean much to the rest of you but when it's plain obvious to me at the moment it's hard to say anything more. At least team 1 has put in effort to defending people. When we were lynching team 7 they backed them up properly. If they were mafia (team 1) why bother putting up their mafia buddy as the other lynch, especially since RoL and BC looked really bad due to inactivity and lack of contributing. They could have easily just pushed for team 2 since team 2 was taking heat from the first day. Team 1 has made those long posts, has tried to figure things out. Have you seen team 2 do any of that from any of their 3 players? Not so much. SouthRawrea makes a semi-long post from time to time but that's about it. Not to mention, I just went through 2 past games with each of these three. When they weren't mafia they were much more aggressive in their posting and calling people out. I haven't seen any of them perform as they did the last game when they were town. Almost all of their votes have been "yeah I agree with you, let's vote this guy", and Divinek just pulled it again after you accused me. If you ask me, the choice between hitting you and hitting rastaban and I isn't an easy decision to make. That's probably debatable though. And yes dude, I realize completely that I probably haven't been performing up to my usual town standards (although I thought my meeple analysis was sound at the time). And yes dude, I realize that rastaban hasn't really done anything in the thread this game. But I'm sitting here trying to figure things out and making sure that I'm not wrong about team 2. Team 2 hasn't done anything but blindly vote for anyone who's not team 6 (except when it was clear team 6 was getting lynched). So Team 1 wouldn't have voted for their team mate on day 1, Team 2 wouldn't kill their lifeline (me) last night, so Team 3 is mafia? Doesn't make sense to me why you would agree that Team 1 is innocent from your point of view. I'm not arguing that Team 1 is mafia at this point. I'm arguing that Team 2 is equally unlikely. Although you don't seem to buy the idea that Team 2 doesn't want to hit me. Really, just think about it. From their point of view, I've been blasting Team 1 all game. You've been blasting them the last day. Killing me gives the very likely chance that you will follow through with your words and vote them the next day. Team 1 also is going to want to save themselves and vote Team 2, so Team 2 has much to fear from killing me, as that would mean they are likely to die. If you think about it, all 3 days someone who accused Team 1 died. Someone wants Team 1 dead. Team 2 doesn't have the arguing capabilities to make that happen. And you aren't doing that either. Which means someone is expecting me to kill them. This makes more sense from your point of view than Team 2's point of view since Team 2 has an interest in keeping themselves alive versus Team 1. You, on the other hand, don't if you are mafia. Yeah, Team 2 is normally more vocal and active when town. Pyrr is also more active and accusative when town. You also are sharper and more focused when town. Honestly given the day 1/2 events, mafia had little incentive to post unless Team 1 is mafia defending themselves. I can see how Team 2's posting has been utter garbage. I can also see how your posting is suspect. Its just that to me, the night kills don't make sense from Team 2's point of view. That's why I can't vote them. On September 30 2010 06:17 rastaban wrote: LOL, you discovered my favorite past time, framing Div. Hey to be fair you weren't innocent when I did it as town  I am really surprised that team i&i suspects my Foolishness and I. Foolishness has been working hardcore as town. The mafia obviously is between team 1 and 2 but it is hard to pinpoint which it is right now. Both have good arguments against them. I have to admit though, Foolishness' arguments towards team 2 seems pretty good. All the votes immediately on team 1 surprised me though as i thought most peopel agreed 2 should be next. This whole paragraph is just sketchy. Contradictions and sketchy generalizations everywhere. You're over exaggerating Foolishness' hard work. His contributions are quite superficial compared to previous games. His major contribution was stating he would be willing to kill Team 7 but not Team 1. His analysis is shoddy, and there isn't much of it. His vote on Team 6 was just too easy to be considered pro-town points for him. Mafia isn't "obviously" between Team 1 and 2. If you would like to back that up with evidence, please do so. You claim its hard to tell which of the two is mafia right now. Can you tell me WHY its hard to pinpoint which is which right now? You say both have good arguments, but seem to favor Team 2 right now. Why do you favor a Team 2 lynch? Why do you say its hard to pinpoint but seem to imply a (nonexistent) consensus against Team 2? Foolishness' arguments against Team 2 ignore my concerns about the night kill pattern. And that's the big issue in my book. The thing that's missing here is that this is sloppy play all around. A Team 3 as mafia isn't acting like a mafia that will go along with whichever mislynch occurs. Perhaps that's because they don't want to be scrutinized for easy lynching, especially since they've been "skeptical" of the arguments on Team 1 all along. Perhaps they expected me to die to make it an easy lynch on Team 2 today but don't want to look suspicious by jumping to Team 1. I don't know. It just seems that people just don't care. | ||
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On September 30 2010 12:32 LSB wrote: Seriously though. Why would Team 3 be supporting us if they were mafia? If they went after us, they easily could get a free kill and get the game almost ended. Put my position as Neutral for now Suddenly switching to supporting you after they've been opposing your lynch the whole time looks really sketchy and should make you very suspicious if you are indeed town. This would likely cause you to bring this fact to Team 2's attention, which could get Team 3 killed. The fact that I'm alive makes switching to you even a more sketchy move since he can't assume that I'm a sheeple. The fact that Foolishness's recent post shows that he doesn't really care possibly means that he knows hes doomed at this point. The Foolishness I know vigorously defends himself against shoddy (behavior) analysis, or vigorously pushes the lynch on someone scummy. It is possible that he just is unsure which of Team 1/2 is mafia given the poor play on all sides, but I find it more likely that he is mafia. | ||
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On September 30 2010 12:43 Pyrrhuloxia wrote: The chance of Incog faking medic is basically nil. No way they hold off on a hit just to do that. The medic is a huge threat to the mafia and they would love to have him dead. It's all wifom mind games since the mafia can think "incog will probably protect himself so we can freely kill someone else, but incog will know that and try to prot someone else since we know he claims to have tried that before, so we should hit incog." Doesn't implicate anyone. Team 2: I thought they were mafia for pushing all innocent lynches but they did help kill Team 6, although less than Team 3. That said, a bus at that point would have totally made sense given how many people were against Team 6. Team 3: If my intuition that one of Incog and Foolishness is mafia is correct, it would have to be Foolishness at this point rather than Incog as I had thought. I think Incog has this same gut feeling too, but the case he's pushing is all complicated wifom when Team 2 seems like the choice that follow Occam's Razor. Team 2 jumped the early bandwagon on us and now is following the confirmed innocent team onto another team. They also split up their votes the previous day. I agree Rastaban has been too inactive but Divinek admits he is doing the same thing. Both teams are making apologies I would deem suspicious except that Incog's team did the same thing the day before. Vote Team 2 Its not complicated WIFOM. Its simple WIFOM. The thing is, I don't think Team 2 is smart enough or active enough to pull it off in the event that I was dead. Arguing against Foolishness isn't easy. Especially when the case the case against Team 1 is sketchy with the Day 2 defense of YI/meeple and the out of the blue vote against Team 6 (mafia). Team 2 would have to be suicidal to want me dead, since I was stating my intention to lynch Team 1 the previous day. This is WIFOM, but I think the WIFOM isn't pure. Its weighted. The choice is, Team 2 is suicidal mafia, or Team 2 is trying to psych us out by thinking they're suicidal mafia. I don't think Team 2 is that smart to pull that trick off. Its also a risky move if nobody points this out, as I've explained above. I'm not inclined to believe that Team 2 is that suicidal. Foolishness doesn't have any redeeming values so far so I'm content lynching him. Rastaban's recent post is also super sketchy and doesn't help his case. As it is, I probably should've pressured Team 2 and said I was going to vote for them and see if they brought up this argument themselves, but alas it is too late for that. | ||
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On September 30 2010 14:17 rastaban wrote: I knew I would be busy so I stopped signing up for games, I signed up for this one a long time ago and kind of thought it was dead in the water, all of a sudden a lot of people show up and it was too late. I really owe Foolishness an apology as I am the one who asked him to play in the first place as my team mate but I haven't had the time to collaborate with him. That said he has done a good job on his own spearheading the last lynch on team 6 so I there is little reason to doubt him. Unless he changes his analysis I assume he still thinks Team 2 is the mafia so... [VOTE] Team 2 I've already explained why this doesn't give him the pro-townie points that you claim he has. | ||
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i.e. resign | ||
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On October 01 2010 12:45 Korynne wrote: Infundibulum also bleeds to death from a spike through the balls. On October 01 2010 14:41 Infundibulum wrote: sorry;; i havent been feeling well and fell asleep. woke up and saw this.. i really dropped the ball this time around On a spike? | ||
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[Vote]Team 1 Team 1 is 100% mafia because nobody died tonight. Mafia aren't allowed to no-hit and I protted Foolishness, so Team 1 is mafia. GG yo. I'll just quote my epicfail here for posterity: Pyrr/LSB have had bad activity and haven't been pro-town at all. Granted, I attacked them very close to the beginning of the game, so the townie-defense-mode kneejerk reaction might well be the case. Their recent (in)activity might just be disgust of my attacks. The night kills totally don't look good for them. However, I'm looking at the day 2 lynch. I linked Team 7 and Team 1. Why would Team 1 be so outraged at the connection if they were mafia? They would have known Team 7 is innocent. Since I was going for Team 7 for lynch instead of Team 1, Team 1 shouldn't have any worries about the Team 7 lynch because Team 7's death would discredit my connection. Pyrr has the idea that I know Pyrr is mafia, therefore YellowInk is mafia. Let's assume he believes that that was my actual argument. As mafia, why would he care if an Innocent YellowInk is lynched? He doesn't. YellowInk flipping green is good for his case. Pyrr has no reason to discredit the link there, especially since we're going after YI before Pyrr. As Foolishness also said, Team 1 accusing Team 6 day one doesn't make too much sense unless they were feeling really desperate. That bold part is a lie. From all the day 2 events, I must have mixed up people's posts and thought that Team 1 wrote this post. Should've been reading more carefully. If Foolishness should've pointed that out yesterday I would've so voted Team 1. Anyway, GG. | ||
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On October 02 2010 10:15 LSB wrote: Question: Can Mafia Withhold their night kill? No you can't, mafia. | ||
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