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On March 25 2010 06:48 Zona wrote:
I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days.
And the way we resolve this is generally, we lynch one. First day roleclaims are the shittiest thing ever as they detract discussion.
If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? The claims can be tested later yeah, but what if we simply don't have time later due to future complications? It'd be better to get rid of one now and then now where the other stands.
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and then know where the other stands*
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On March 25 2010 06:49 Zona wrote:
As to elaborate on why I'm willing to overlook an anti-town statement. Players on TL are on average, pretty bad. Looking through past games, you see townies all over the place making horrible statements with very bad ideas. It's something you have to keep in mind, playing here. Otherwise most of the players in most games would be instant lynch targets.
But at least the ones who want to absolve themselves of suspicion will at least make some attempt at replying rather than letting it slide by. This type of behavior doesn't go unnoticed and makes people look scummy as it looks like they're trying to dodge the question, especially when somebody else has brought it up and it still hasn't been replied to.
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On March 25 2010 06:53 Nikon wrote:
Assuming, they're masons, can we be sure that they're only 2? There probably is a third person in the circle. Just saying...
Would you like to roleclaim too so we can have this discussion about you the next day?
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On March 25 2010 07:10 ~OpZ~ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:51 Elemenope wrote:On March 25 2010 06:48 Zona wrote:
I didn't assume that his role was entirely just a Mason. I clarified with my subsequent post that his claim involved a role with mason abilities.
Of course anyone can lie. But I'm willing to put of lynching those who role claim right away as:
- the claims can be tested easily later
- there's still a fuckton of other inactive players that are as much deadweight as Abenson was.
I do agree Abenson needs to confirm that the spoke with each other. But it would be pretty silly for OpZ to throw himself out there for Abenson if they weren't on the same team.
I totally agree how his earlier post to use nukes if he was lynched was an anti-town declaration. Still, I think the claim, once confirmed by Abenson, is enough to put me off voting for them day 1. Of course we should keep a very close eye on them for the coming days. And the way we resolve this is generally, we lynch one. First day roleclaims are the shittiest thing ever as they detract discussion. If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? The claims can be tested later yeah, but what if we simply don't have time later due to future complications? It'd be better to get rid of one now and then now where the other stands. Because the mafia will just kill the other confirmed townie at night time? It really doesn't matter, I suppose. But you are highly suspect to me right now.
With their super pro KP of 1 when we most likely have medics?
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On March 25 2010 07:20 Zona wrote:Show nested quote +On March 25 2010 06:51 Elemenope wrote:
If Abenson and OpZ are on the same side as you imply, why not lynch one and we get the validity of the other? This is a TERRIBLE idea from the POV of the town. If you lynch one just to test their claim and it turns out they were indeed masons, you just removed their beneficial power, as the remaining mason is effectively just a normal town member afterwards. Or if there were more than 2, removing one from their circle removes a tremendous amount of benefit that they could have derived from an extra person in the discussion. And if you retort that having 3 people in a circle is almost the same as 2, all I can do is shake my head. The mason advantage is often dismissed too easily, but it's really the same advantage that mafia typically have, on a smaller scale (other than the nightkill). The big mafia advantage is information (they know their team) and coordination, contrasting directly with the town disadvantage of LACK of information, and lack of coordination. A mason group grants a small group of town members this advantage, which can be powerful if used correctly. Also, this is DAY 1. It's not too late to wait to test things, and it's far too early to lynch claimed roles. I don't like how you've totally developed tunnel vision on the two and won't consider anything else, especially on day 1. If you want to talk about anti-town or scummy behavior, there's some right here.
Tunnel vision? Who are we going to lynch? Highest votes are L and Abenson. I don't feel we should lynch L as he may have some information from all this when he comes back.
Who else am I supposed to focus on when OpZ has been making such contradictory claims and dodging posts that call him out? Especially considering if OpZ and Abenson are in fact masons: Abenson replied what....twice? three times? He may not even roleclaim as Mason either. Some great advantage we have. I only call out behavior that seems anti, and other than people not posting at all, OpZ has been making contradictions in his posts that needs to be called upon. I'd do the same to anybody else if I catch it, it's just that OpZ has been making glaringly huge ones which others have noticed as well. It's not tunnel vision at all, it's just pointing out OpZ stupidity and wanting other people's opinions on it.
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On March 25 2010 07:27 Zona wrote:
I am suggesting RebirthOfLegend, since he is the next best lurker. However, with less than 6 hours to go, I do think it will have to be Abenson (or L), which is against my wishes.
How about this - if you are online, reading, and willing to change your vote, post! Quote this post and reply if you must.
We need to consider if we have enough town members to change who the majority will be, or else we have to settle for Abenson or L.
I'm perfectly fine with lynching an inactive if you truly believe Abenson can make a difference in this supposed mason circle.
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On March 25 2010 07:28 XeliN wrote:
I'm going to ##vote Elemenope . He has contributed alot and from what I have read I don't see how it is possible that he would argue for lynching one of OpZ and Abenson, now we know they are confirmed, from a pro-town perspective.
Other than that I would switch to voting for the least active poster if it means getting a majority.
Because we don't know they're confirmed town.
Wow, that was easy.
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I'll be around tonight, so if it's needed to get a majority, I'll do so as I feel a first day lynch is the most important thing.
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On March 25 2010 07:54 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Dodge posts that call me out? I'm in biology right now. I'm assuming Abenson is in Highschool, because he isn't on late, and never posts before 3p.m.
What haven't I responded to thats been logical? I've defended myself plenty vs you. You just seem to want me dead. Tunnel Vision was a good tearm?
When I first talked about your anti-town revenge nuke sentiment.
On March 24 2010 12:32 Elemenope wrote:
When Zona also pointed this out.
On March 24 2010 12:45 Zona wrote:
Your first reply back.
On March 24 2010 15:35 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Your vote on L
On March 25 2010 02:22 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Your post saying Abenson is townie.
On March 25 2010 06:15 ~OpZ~ wrote:
In none of these did you even address the issue of revenge nuking due to a lynch nor addressing the point that waiting a day to lynch a second nuker is an idiotic plan that doesn't do anything meaningful for ToD. Dodging was a good term? Unless of course you take bio classes that last almost 24 hours. In that case, let me commend your school for having such diligent students.
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On March 25 2010 07:56 Iaaan wrote:
I propose that, in order to extend the day, someone without nukes could launch a fake nuke. Thoughts? I was going to write a bit more, but I figured I should bring up the idea for discussion first.
There's a whole set of problems with this.
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On March 25 2010 08:29 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Revenge nuking due to lynching me? I'm sure someone voting for me will be mafia, so taking one out will make me feel better. More information for the town right? You said that yourself. Death=information. I'm not arguing this point further. Those are my sentiments. I know I'm town, just because you want me dead does not make me mafia.
Waiting a day to nuke? Okay, What I meant here is simple, I just didn't fully express the idea. After they launch the nuke and it hits, we will see how much the ToD increases. I hadn't further elaborated, because I was more concerned with my own pending possible lynch.
Not so subtle sarcasm is sexy, do it some more baby, ooooh yea.
The problem with the revenge-nuke that I have is that it's faulty, since if we knew who a scum was, we'd by lynching that person. Do you understand? Making anti-town sentiments is exactly the opposite of what we need. It's not that I necessarily want you dead, but if you post something anti-town and don't follow up or clarify what you mean if it's ambiguous, it poses problems.
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Actually, you don't die before the nuke lands.
Read the rules? Jesus christ.
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[/quote]However, since no one can be lynched until any nukes have landed you will have a chance to change votes before it strikes.[/quote]
Yeah, you are missing something.
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The lynch doesn't happen until after the nuke blows up.
Are you that blind?
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I'm sure glad you had fully read the rules when you had launched the nuke against Caller.
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On March 25 2010 09:42 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Abenson....Can you please post something...Atleast ACKNOWLE my defense of you?
This.
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On March 25 2010 11:23 iNfuNdiBuLuM wrote:
There's nothing we should do about Opz and Abenson right now except take Opz's word for it
Abenson seems to be entirely worthless no matter what team he is on, might as well just leave him as another body in the way of the mafia. Who knows, maybe he will actually help out Opz a bit.
I'd at least like a 'yes' though. It does seem that they are both masons, but a simple confirmation is enough. Though I suppose that the lack of a disagreement between the two can be a sign of confirmation and one that I will apparently have to accept for now =\
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On March 25 2010 11:57 Zona wrote:
What I suggest is that we as a town place 10 or 11 votes on RoL. Then the moment the nuke is resolved, we can finish the lynch by placing the last 1 or 2 votes, or shift the votes away, in the slim chance that the nuke lands and Caller is mafia.
Just glanced through as I'm about to play more D2 right now, but if the nuke lands, it goes to night with a no lynch if we don't have majority.
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EPT
