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On March 10 2010 07:15 JeeJee wrote:Show nested quote +On March 10 2010 06:44 Incognito wrote:On March 10 2010 06:22 Foolishness wrote:
Sign me up.
Questions:
Will bus driver be notified if anything happened to the people he switched? (this was mentioned before but you didn't answer)
I assume if a bus driver switches someone who was going to be killed onto someone who was medic protected, that person won't die correct?
If a mad hatter places a bomb on person A, and bus driver switches persons A and B, will B now have a bomb? If so will the mad hatter be notified of this?
If a mad hatter has a bomb on person A and dies during the night (thus person A should die) yet bus driver switches person A and B, will A still die or will B die? No, the bus driver is not notified. If a bus driver switches A, who is being killed, and B, who is being medic protected, then yes, A won't die. But B will. That is correct, B will now have a bomb. I'm not sure if the mad hatter is notified. I'll get back to you on that. All actions happen at the same time. So the switch still happens. B dies instead of A. Whoa, back up there I planned on asking this but thought it through and came to a.. totally different conclusion? Consider A who has medic protection and B who is being hit if you swap A and B, sure you swap the hit, but you also swap the medic protection, so A still dies n'est pas?
i would think that the only thing that switches are the people, and that the actions are stationary.
IE) person A is protected. person B is hit.
bus driver hits the switch.
now person A is hit, and person B is protected.
i could be wrong though, the mod(s) can clarify.
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ermm. make that, people are stationary, actions are fluid.
whatever makes the most sense in each of your individual brains.
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one thing i've noticed in these games is that there's always someone/ multiple people calling for someone to be lynch because of said person's performance in another game.
each game is different, and while someone may just really be a dumbass, i really don't see the point of deciding who to lynch before we've even had elections based on their actions in another game.
let's lynch people playing stupidly and scummy in THIS game.
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On March 11 2010 03:36 Vivi57 wrote:
ok, with this format the detective should roleclaim and get elected as mayor. The second dt can check him on n1 to make sure he's legit. Yes, this leaves some possibility of gf getting mayor as a dt, but we should be able to see through fake role checks soon enough.
With a dt as mayor, we can amass a large group of confirmed townies and use that to win. Ignore anything ace says about lynching all claimers, this move is too powerful to ignore.
yes, the DT who we can't confirm should step up and claim it so we can elect him mayor.
and ace is not playing.
i can never decide if players who play this stupid are just that stupid or mafia who are just that bad.
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yes, but we don't know if we have two DTs, and since we don't know, how do you verify the 2nd DT?
ie) GF claims DT.
gets elected mayor.
DT confirms him as "innocent".
and then mafia member steps up as "2nd DT". only person who can confirm him is the other DT, and by then it's day 2 and the mafia could have hit him, or maybe he decides to use his rolecheck on someone else. so you've got 2 mafia parading around as innocents, and one of them has 3 votes.
i'm just saying, there are too many holes, and it's too risky to elect someone based on just their roleclaim.
and personally, i just wouldn't trust a roleclaim that early, especially from a blue.
if it were me, i'd try to get elected, and if i did, THEN i'd come out and say, "AHA! gotchu hoes. i'm a DT/medic/etc".
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that should say, a supposed "blue".
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On March 11 2010 04:40 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
A fake DT is going to get spotted rather quickly. Thats the issue the gf has is if he claims it, and doesn't perform insanellllly well. He dies. Not a good move for them.
I do agree rcing can be risky, but its not the worst idea we could be using.
how do you spot a fake DT? this guy could just claim that he invested person A and person A is a townie. i'm willing to bet there's 10+ townies, including the miller possibility. the GF would have a 50/50 chance of guessing a townie and being right and "proving himself". i understand your point, but my point is, why even put ourselves in the position of trying to determine that? i think that using this DT roleclaim plan lends itself to a greater possibility of a GF mayor.
we need plans. we need to elect the person with the best idea of how to win this game, not the guy who roleclaims the fastest.
screw all the idiotic, supposedly entertaining bids for mayor, with all the pictures and nonsense. someone who wants to lead should step up with a viable plan to win this game for the town, and the best/ smartest plan should be implemented, hopefully by the person who suggested it.
ie) if there were elected officials in the last game (and i were playing), i would have voted for 789.
even with all of that said, there is still the chance of the GF being our mayor. i'm just in favor taking the route that gives us a) the best chance of NOT having a GF mayor, and b) if we do have a mafia mayor, identifying him as quickly as possible by anti-town behavior.
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the only reason that post isn't completely useless is because of the corleone quote.
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On March 11 2010 08:25 Fulgrim wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On March 11 2010 05:12 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
As for mayoral elections.
I, BloodyC0bbler, am running for office.
With the setup of this game, and the fact elected positions can be RC'd, the elected positions are far more likely to end up in townie hands. This is a good thing, and I believe it is in our best interests to make sure town can get in.
I believe that I would be a good candidate because I have many games worth of experience, a few as an elected official, and others where I have have helped in the pinning of reds. I believe that from this experience I will be able to help the town quickly and hopefully bring about a swift end to the mafia.
The Plan:
The plan is simple. Whoever is elected (in this case I would love it to be me), but regardless, whoever is elected. The dt or dt's will both check the elected officials. I would say if your a dt and numbered 1-12 on the list, check the mayor, 13-25 check the pardoner. Instantly we have information. If they are a blue role you write it down. If they are red, speak up to someone (possibly wait a day to find a green person in a check). Reveal the findings, person dies.
If they are green, keep them on a seperate list.
Soon as you get two greens, RC them, and tell them who you checked and start a circle.
If you get blues. Keep that info to yourself until you need it proved. If you find a dt, make them check someone (most likely one you've checked to confirm), medic prot someone, vig hit someone, etc...
Anyone who flips red dies.
For all those who are not a dt. Constantly update your posts in the archive thread, and carefully analyze peoples posting behaviours. If you think something is a tell, or feel they are scummy, rather than just point a finger, really sit down and prove it. But be aware that if you cause the death of an important player and they flip town, you will prob quickly follow.
Medics, protect the bgs with your life. We will randomly pick one from the list of two, and then tell you to prot them.
Past protecting the bgs, no one talk to them in PM's, IM's, or IRC, period. They are not confirmable, do not associate with them. They can talk via thread, feel free to respond to them here, do not tell them anything.
Conclusion:
This game can be won very easily if we play it smart. I believe outside of my general plan to play, the reason I should be elected is I believe I will represent a threat to the mafia, which means they will have to actively try to remove me, which will give themselves away. If they don't I will continue to strengthen the town, and effectively force them to GG. Looking over the rules for the game, it looks like pardoner isn't going to play that much of an important role this game, its more of the mayor that we have to worry about. The mafia want to have the mayor role, and the only way they are going to get it safely is through their godfather. I think its probably safe to say that no "ordinary" mafia are going to be running for office. I propose that we check the mayor on night one, (1-12), and then the other DT(s) 13-25 check town members, because Its important to check the mayor just to be safe, but I think checking the sheriff on the first night (potential gf risk), alot more information and more possiblities to set up town circles. Especially since its not critical if we lose the sheriff role to a godfather, because even if we do there would be no way to tell by simple DT chekcs.
quote for future reference. carry on.
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On March 11 2010 09:44 L wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 09:00 Incognito wrote:
Mayor elections. I am announcing my candidacy for office.
Rolechecks: There's 1/25 GFs. But there's two known BGs who are pointless to rolecheck, so its really a 1/23 chance. Since 5 mafia can run for office and the GF can be picked after the mafia knows if they will get office, there is little point to rolechecking the mayor/pardoner. If there was one office and elections were determined randomly, there is a 20% chance of having a mafia mayor. Add another office, and your chance increases. Add a mafia busdriver, and you can't really do that. So in the end, BC's contention that elected officials have a greater chance of falling into town hands because false because the GF is picked. Which means that any mafia elected has the possibility of becoming the GF.
BG protection. As BC said, BGs should get protection if we are to have invincible elected officials. In order for us to determine impartially who the medic should protect, we need to make it random. If I announce in the thread however, it may encourage flamewheel to alter the results to screw us over (or not?!). Since we don't know who the bodyguards are yet, as long as we determine now who the medics will protect, it doesn't matter who chooses. So right now, I'm sending pms to 4 people. All four of them will contain the same information, either first or last. After elections, everybody who got a pm reveals it and medics protect which either the first or last BG based on the BG's positions on the signup list. Questions? Objections?
Vigilantes. Stay secret. Mafia bus drivers means you can't announce your hit in thread to confirm yourself.
Town-aligned Bus Driver strategies. You may think that you need to be gosu to use this role effectively. But you don't. You don't even need to know the actions to use this role. The mere threat of Bus Drivers will cause the mafia to second guess any attempts to kill prominent players. One way to use Bus Drivers effectively: Swap a prominent player with some random player who you think won't be targetted. This effectively makes the prominent player invincible for one night. If you are a bus driver, do not reveal whether or not you have used up your 2 actions. To be effective, you need to keep the mafia unaware that you could switch out prominent players at any point in the game. This means that medic lists are not necessary. Medics are free to protect the chosen BG.
Archives. For the sake of the town, please use it. It will help us sort through the inactives and will help us when you die.
About newer players getting elected: Its a nice democratic idea. But its only worked once in the past. And that was with SemiOldGuy. Other than that, the benefits of the Mayor/Pardoner positions are that you are almost impossible to kill by the mafia. The town would benefit the most if the Mayor/Pardoner were strong pro-town players. An invincible pro-town Ver or MBH is more scary than an invincible DT. Especially with this format with bus drivers. If we could get a strong player who happens to be a DT, well, then that's even better. But strong players that the mafia will be afraid of > blue roles. Over the past many games I've realized that the person who first starts pushing the GF as a method of destabilizing town is probably the GF himself. Last game, for instance, Ace made repeated reference to the fact that he wanted to 'prove himself' through shooting. It was a pretty obvious self reference. When I asked called to be put back in, without even seeing the game I told him I was killing Ace, but the game was fucked and over by that point.
ermm, ace was innocent last game so that example actually goes against your argument.
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all this talk about checking the mayor and pardoner is useless.
DTs: you need to decide who you think is most scummy when the election is over; mayor or pardoner. then you need to look @ the vote lists, and decide who you believe to be most scummiest there. the mafia will most likely run their GF, and at least 1 or 2 of them will vote for the GF and they'll show up as red.
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On March 11 2010 10:30 Incognito wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 10:26 Versatile wrote:On March 11 2010 09:44 L wrote:On March 11 2010 09:00 Incognito wrote:
Mayor elections. I am announcing my candidacy for office.
Rolechecks: There's 1/25 GFs. But there's two known BGs who are pointless to rolecheck, so its really a 1/23 chance. Since 5 mafia can run for office and the GF can be picked after the mafia knows if they will get office, there is little point to rolechecking the mayor/pardoner. If there was one office and elections were determined randomly, there is a 20% chance of having a mafia mayor. Add another office, and your chance increases. Add a mafia busdriver, and you can't really do that. So in the end, BC's contention that elected officials have a greater chance of falling into town hands because false because the GF is picked. Which means that any mafia elected has the possibility of becoming the GF.
BG protection. As BC said, BGs should get protection if we are to have invincible elected officials. In order for us to determine impartially who the medic should protect, we need to make it random. If I announce in the thread however, it may encourage flamewheel to alter the results to screw us over (or not?!). Since we don't know who the bodyguards are yet, as long as we determine now who the medics will protect, it doesn't matter who chooses. So right now, I'm sending pms to 4 people. All four of them will contain the same information, either first or last. After elections, everybody who got a pm reveals it and medics protect which either the first or last BG based on the BG's positions on the signup list. Questions? Objections?
Vigilantes. Stay secret. Mafia bus drivers means you can't announce your hit in thread to confirm yourself.
Town-aligned Bus Driver strategies. You may think that you need to be gosu to use this role effectively. But you don't. You don't even need to know the actions to use this role. The mere threat of Bus Drivers will cause the mafia to second guess any attempts to kill prominent players. One way to use Bus Drivers effectively: Swap a prominent player with some random player who you think won't be targetted. This effectively makes the prominent player invincible for one night. If you are a bus driver, do not reveal whether or not you have used up your 2 actions. To be effective, you need to keep the mafia unaware that you could switch out prominent players at any point in the game. This means that medic lists are not necessary. Medics are free to protect the chosen BG.
Archives. For the sake of the town, please use it. It will help us sort through the inactives and will help us when you die.
About newer players getting elected: Its a nice democratic idea. But its only worked once in the past. And that was with SemiOldGuy. Other than that, the benefits of the Mayor/Pardoner positions are that you are almost impossible to kill by the mafia. The town would benefit the most if the Mayor/Pardoner were strong pro-town players. An invincible pro-town Ver or MBH is more scary than an invincible DT. Especially with this format with bus drivers. If we could get a strong player who happens to be a DT, well, then that's even better. But strong players that the mafia will be afraid of > blue roles. Over the past many games I've realized that the person who first starts pushing the GF as a method of destabilizing town is probably the GF himself. Last game, for instance, Ace made repeated reference to the fact that he wanted to 'prove himself' through shooting. It was a pretty obvious self reference. When I asked called to be put back in, without even seeing the game I told him I was killing Ace, but the game was fucked and over by that point. ermm, ace was innocent last game so that example actually goes against your argument. Ah so you must understand? What does "pushing the GF" mean?
no idea, i just saw that his supporting example was incorrect and pointed it out.
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On March 11 2010 10:32 Incognito wrote:Show nested quote +On March 11 2010 10:30 Versatile wrote:
all this talk about checking the mayor and pardoner is useless.
DTs: you need to decide who you think is most scummy when the election is over; mayor or pardoner. then you need to look @ the vote lists, and decide who you believe to be most scummiest there. the mafia will most likely run their GF, and at least 1 or 2 of them will vote for the GF and they'll show up as red. all of this talk about checking is useless. Maybe we should save it until after the election is over so we don't tell the mafia what to do.
agreed. we're getting ahead of ourselves.
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sorry folks, just got caught up with the thread, haven't had much free time lately. and i knew that might happen, which is why i got my vote in early.
at the time i voted, it was L and incog who were the top candidates and incog read as more pro-town to me, hence my vote.
a couple of things: incog stated he expected more form me in this game. this in itself is not strange, because i'm pretty sure incog is familiar with my playing on another site. however, he called out malongo and foolishness as well. i don't believe malongo has addressed this accusation yet.
however, foolishness not only didn't bother to defend himself to incog or any other player, but went as far as defending incog's post and went back and forth with zona.
this struck me because if zona's not town, who the hell is? check his posts, if i had been around, that's who i would i have changed my vote to.
in any case, i also received an incog PM stating "first". however, i believe the medics need to be protecting zona, and i hope that's what they decide to do.
as i stated earlier, DTs ought to be checking the vote lists. if we have a mafia member in office, it's likely a mafia member or two voted for them, especially with a last minute vote swing, if i read correctly.
i also don't think anyone without protection should be claiming a damn thing to anyone right now. DTs should be investigating and building up their circle in the most secure and legitimate way they can, and it's far too early to be trusting anyone.
going to update my archives now.
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ps: i'm usually quiet in the beginning of a game so that argument is useless.
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On March 12 2010 16:25 Malongo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 12 2010 16 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 12 2010 16 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:12 L wrote:
Oh hey, good of you to join the party.
Did you finally get picked for the mafia team? If not, are you claiming blue by running? Who would you kill if voted mayor and who would you like to get voted in if you can't get in?
Sleep time, but I EXPECT ANSWERS. Yeah L i know u like to get people accounted for. -Not mafia. -Not claimming. But i let you search my rol list from previous games and let you think. -I have 2 people in mind: versatile and one of the people running. Ill post tomorrow my reasons if you like to know. Lynching an inactive/spammer is another chance but i think we can get more info from a more strong lynch at first. There has been some back and forth up to now in the thread. -Im voting you. I know i can spot you doing your weird mafia stuff and i also know you are valuable if town. Honeslty id really want to be there, i hope i dont end up kicking you away from a spot but as i said at this point im a very good player to get in.
i don't think you came back and posted your reasons and who your second lynch candidate was like you said you would? did they make it into office? unless i missed it, and if i did, my apologies. please point it out to me if you wouldn't mind. thanks.
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whoa whoa whoa....where in the US of A does a bar close @ midnight?
let me know so i know never to go there.
partypartypartyletsallgetwasted.
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On March 14 2010 10:50 Vivi57 wrote:
I'd be fine with an L lynch tomorrow. I've been suspicious of him from the start and was actually considering arranging a voteswitch off L to make him not pardoner myself.
Now L is going OMGUS towards bill over a clearly town intended wagon. He's either scum pushing for a mislynch to delay the town or he's town still butthurt about being killed last game and trying to get revenge.
But even though I wasn't there, I will stand behind keeping L out of office as a pro town play. He refused to claim as a dt, even denying being a dt completely, all the while talking about the "other" dt. Now he's pushing towards a townie's lynch. Seriously, don't let L get away with this so easily.
talk about last words...lmao.
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On March 15 2010 02:42 L wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2010 01:07 Bill Murray wrote:
It's possible the mafia felt L would be medic protected. More like L knew he was going to be bus driven because we even made it clear in the thread that we had the driver claim to us. As for tomorrow night, I have no idea, I'd rather the driver save his drivin' juice and have the medic focused on the BGs. If the mafia kill me, they'll be proving me legit, which will make a lot of the zero content L-haters on mafia look bad. Either way, the best target for killing tonight is still bill murray. One does not simply walk into vote swings.
i don't care about BM, but are you done bitching about not getting mayor/pardoner?
jeejee (a townie) was leading the charge for the vote-swing so you wouldn't be in office. wow, he was successful, and then he got killed for it. whatevs.
but the fact that he showed up town should at least make people pause about killing everyone he was able to convince.
i know you already wanted to kill BM because of the last game, but that's not a good enough reason. fcuk this revenge shyt and play the game.
ps all: drunk posting = no bueno. unless it's entertaining. which it wasn't.
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and for the record, there's a difference between discussing, and crying like little girls.
if you're still trying to get L claim something, you should already have your answer. he's written a freakin' novel in here already and if he was going to do what you wanted-- guess what, he would have already done it.
no one is changing anyone's mind, you all are just going around in circles and it's ridiculous. vote according to what you have taken from reading the thread.
also, don't randomly call out players as potential lynch candidates and then not respond when they address your allegations. if you couldn't be bothered to follow up, it reads like you were trying to get a bandwagon going on someone who wouldn't be around to defend themselves.
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On March 15 2010 17:11 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
swapping my vote off abenson, as people have given almost no reason why they are following my vote on him, let alone the fact my case wasn't strong. Moving to malongo with incog
wtf is this shyt. you get a bandwagon going on someone and then change your vote without calling for others to change their vote as well? when you're the reason many of them are voting that way?
we should be lynching you for being the most worthless mayor.
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On March 15 2010 23:24 Abenson wrote:
Hello, I am back and have gotten caught up with the whole thing.
I have realized that I am to be lynched if this goes on, but I think this is wrong.
This is because:
a) I have shown no obvious signs of being mafia so far, other than inactivity. I am still in high school and it's currently march break, so I'm generally off somewhere or playing Starcraft with my friends.
b) I, as myself, would not like to be lynched.
c) As someone have said, nobody has come to defend me yet, this means that the mafia or anyone isn't trying hard to save me. Therefore I think this is sufficient proof that I have nobody working with me.
d) As for the "dt's post their results" is because I think that it is perfectly logical; And also I really have nothing better to post at the time and wanted to contribute.
Finally, I would like to say that lynching someone simply because of lack of candidate is generally a bad idea. It is wasting valuable lynches and plus I haven't really done anything that is suspicious.
the only time a DT should step forward is if they found a red. if they didn't, then there is no reason for them to put themselves in the limelight.
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On March 16 2010 02:31 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Let's have a look how many people are attacking BC. Is he really that suspicious, or should we be taking a look at two people that have taken to trying to say he is worthless. That's bad for unity people.
who else said he's worthless? don't be grouping me up with anyone else, yo.
and fcuk unity, wth is this the special olympics? are we in a queen latifah video? you don't get points just for trying, this isn't high school phys ed. loser.
i think BC is playing shady, i think it's shady he was the last viable candidate in the pool for mayor and he somehow won with a convenient DT claim, and i think it's shady he still hasn't posted concrete info to prove he is in a fact a DT. all in all, there's quite a bit of trees in here, and i'm looking for the sunlight.
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oh, and, i wasn't TRYING to say he was worthless. i said it. bada bing.
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also abenson, he's the other major lynch candidate (besides yourself) so pointing a finger in his direction is good for you.
makes sense, just don't pretend that that's not a factor.
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umm, i've already voted, asswipe.
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On March 16 2010 06:37 L wrote:I wanted to see if you were around. Look at that. You are.
next time you want my attention, just lift your skirt up a bit. that always does the trick 
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wait, L's a girl? that makes my joke not as much fun : (
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On March 16 2010 08:18 Incognito wrote:
Back. So Versatile doesn't want to talk in pms, and she doesn't want to offer anything substantial in the thread too. Whats up? If you want to talk in thread here you have it. Its probably too late to talk about lynch candidates, so what do you think of BC? I am personally suspicious of his list he posted. Where most of the targets seem to lack any substantial reasoning. What do you think?
ah, good job. i wanted you to state publicly that you are suspicious of BC, instead of "trying to collect intel" behind the scenes. the more of the game that is in the open, the better for the town. hoarding information isn't useful, and it's important to keep everyone as involved in the game as possible, among the many other benefits.
my top suspect is BC, and that's who i think the town should lynch.
my reasoning being, he's playing horribly as not only a vet, but a vet who is also our mayor. no vet runs for mayor and is this inactive and this unhelpful if they're unless they've got some serious IRL things going on, and BC has said nothing of the sort yet.
in my book, being a retarded player is enough to get you lynched in most cases. being a retarded mayor is enough to get you lynched each and every time.
i also think that are seriously weak cases for every one of the people up for lynching this round. i wouldn't vote to lynch any of them, as i'm sure they're going to pop up green. i would rather not have a lynch than kill a townie.
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On March 16 2010 08:34 ~OpZ~ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 04:08 citi.zen wrote:On March 16 2010 03:58 Versatile wrote:On March 16 2010 02:31 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Let's have a look how many people are attacking BC. Is he really that suspicious, or should we be taking a look at two people that have taken to trying to say he is worthless. That's bad for unity people.
who else said he's worthless? don't be grouping me up with anyone else, yo. and fcuk unity, wth is this the special olympics? are we in a queen latifah video? you don't get points just for trying, this isn't high school phys ed. loser. i think BC is playing shady, i think it's shady he was the last viable candidate in the pool for mayor and he somehow won with a convenient DT claim, and i think it's shady he still hasn't posted concrete info to prove he is in a fact a DT. all in all, there's quite a bit of trees in here, and i'm looking for the sunlight. Yeah, the ~Opz~ post was weird. "Unity" and too much shared information among unproven people is a bad thing. Everyone needs to play carefully until we get a breakthrough of some sort, either by catching a red or from the DT(s). When 4 people come a long and instantly pick shit with one person it just seems like they are trying to incite the mob of inactive townies to go after him. If Versatile and Foolishness equal mob, and go after BC by just saying he isn't doing anything, I think that's suspicious. Why not just pick some other random townie that ran for mayor to make a plan? Why put it on the guy that claimed dt? If he's truthful about dt it would make sense for the mob to want to attempt to get him distrusted. Kk? Get it now? Their are other suspicious people on here, let's look at them.
*looks up and sees "united states" besides opz*
learn the difference between they're, their, and there before you type my name again, please and thanks. you're a disgrace to the american school system.
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On March 16 2010 09:01 ~OpZ~ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 08:39 Incognito wrote:On March 16 2010 08:34 ~OpZ~ wrote:On March 16 2010 04:08 citi.zen wrote:On March 16 2010 03:58 Versatile wrote:On March 16 2010 02:31 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Let's have a look how many people are attacking BC. Is he really that suspicious, or should we be taking a look at two people that have taken to trying to say he is worthless. That's bad for unity people.
who else said he's worthless? don't be grouping me up with anyone else, yo. and fcuk unity, wth is this the special olympics? are we in a queen latifah video? you don't get points just for trying, this isn't high school phys ed. loser. i think BC is playing shady, i think it's shady he was the last viable candidate in the pool for mayor and he somehow won with a convenient DT claim, and i think it's shady he still hasn't posted concrete info to prove he is in a fact a DT. all in all, there's quite a bit of trees in here, and i'm looking for the sunlight. Yeah, the ~Opz~ post was weird. "Unity" and too much shared information among unproven people is a bad thing. Everyone needs to play carefully until we get a breakthrough of some sort, either by catching a red or from the DT(s). When 4 people come a long and instantly pick shit with one person it just seems like they are trying to incite the mob of inactive townies to go after him. If Versatile and Foolishness equal mob, and go after BC by just saying he isn't doing anything, I think that's suspicious. Why not just pick some other random townie that ran for mayor to make a plan? Why put it on the guy that claimed dt? If he's truthful about dt it would make sense for the mob to want to attempt to get him distrusted. Kk? Get it now? Their are other suspicious people on here, let's look at them. So who exactly are these "suspicious people"? I've done said how I felt about BC getting assailed. While Zona is right, his first goal should be to find a red. He has a point. Cobbler doesn't need to build a town circle. He's the fucking mayor. And protected. He is his own mouth, so he should be checking and speaking, not the other way around. I just found that Versatile and Foolishness, attempting to incite doubt this early was suspicious. BC's own list was rather suspicious, as I was the only person on the list that he went all out on trying to pin as mafia. He's wrong, but I can't prove that myself. Well I suppose him trying to pin me as mafia would make since for him to check me then right? Lol. Why didn't he check me if he already thought I was the most suspicious looking person. Now that I'm thinking about it...If I was suspicious to you (which like I said, BC went all out trying to implicate me), and you are fully protected so you can post if you find a red yourself, why wouldn't you check me. I would never have been voted as GF. -_-...Anyway...No. I just found versatile and foolishness trying to start a riot that early into the day at Cobbler suspicious. Versatile's disappearance after the first day was another big thing to me. But she doesn't post much, right? Lol.
here's the thing, dumbass. i'm a pretty smart person. i don't think you know that, so i figured i'd tell you. anywho, even if i were half as smart as i really am, let's say, at the same intelligence level as you for example, i still would not doing ANYTHING in concert with a member of my mafioso family. dur.
and what is this disappearance thing you keep bringing up? i was gone for a little bit but i've been pretty damn active ever since, more active than you in fact. i'm making a genuine attempt to be here for the town. in any case, stop trying to misrepresent my posting style.
also, i've been attacked by 4-5 people already this game-- now, how likely is it 4-5 separate townies all decided to focus some of their energy on me? maybe 2-3, sure. but more than that is very unlikely.
lastly, i'm glad to see your finally questioning your allegiance to BC. i've already outlines why i think BC is shady, feel free to ask me some more about it if you like.
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On March 16 2010 09:28 Zona wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 09:15 Versatile wrote:
my top suspect is BC, and that's who i think the town should lynch.
my reasoning being, he's playing horribly as not only a vet, but a vet who is also our mayor. no vet runs for mayor and is this inactive and this unhelpful if they're unless they've got some serious IRL things going on, and BC has said nothing of the sort yet.
in my book, being a retarded player is enough to get you lynched in most cases. being a retarded mayor is enough to get you lynched each and every time.
While I agree with you in part, you forgot to mention that he claimed DT: lynching a claimed DT this early in the game is a really bad idea, and I do not like that you suggested it. Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 09:15 Versatile wrote:
i also think that are seriously weak cases for every one of the people up for lynching this round. i wouldn't vote to lynch any of them, as i'm sure they're going to pop up green. i would rather not have a lynch than kill a townie. I do agree the cases right now are pretty weak, but this is day 2. But it's almost always better to have a lynch even if we lynch wrong, because lynching gains information with which the town can use to evaluate how people have accused and voted in the past. I also don't like when people say "I'm afraid we'll lynch a townie" because it's something mafia might say, as they know before the lynch whether or not it's a good one for the town. Of course newbie town members will often be unhappy/worry about lynching town members, but apparently you're a respected player here so perhaps more should be expected of you?
part 1: how do you feel about lynch a supposed DT mayor who has not been active? seriously, think about it. if you were DT and mayor, what would you be doing? he is not being active. he is not leading. he isn't doing anything DT mayor would do, at least not from what i've seen in thread. you're talking about expecting more from me, how about expecting more from the head of the town?
part 2: true we learn information, and that's useful, but imo, it's pretty clear we're not lynching a mafia member. there hasn't been any push to save anyone or change up votes. there hasn't been anything to even hint that the mafia is worried about losing a member, unless incog follows through on the pardon, which he should NOT. the town's decision should go through, no matter how much anyone may disagree with it. in any case, there will be a lynch and we'll get this information you want.
and i don't know about being a respected player, i mostly just make fun of people and call them politically incorrect names. but thanks ^_^
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zona, you should hurry up and vote so you're not modkilled.
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malongo has been pretty inactive, but i just assumed he was still dealing with things because of the earthquake. i think he was planning on being active, why else would he run for mayor?
oh well, post should be up soon-ish.
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lmao. the relationship between L and BM is that of the drunkard and abused significant other. BM just won't stop going back for more.
ps: ace is not black, has never been to NYC, and can't even spell caribbean.
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zona- do the math. if BC (plus town) doesn't find a mafia member by day 4, worse case scenario, where the medics don't prevent any hits and we lynch a town member every day, we're 11 v 5. that's 6 successful mafia hits in 3 nights, and 3 towny lynches. now imagine BC is mafia. a DT who hasn't found a red for 3 days, that's not completely impossible, right? that's 11 vs 7 votes, and since when has the town ever voted to together as one?
also, note that this doesn't take possible vigi hits into count, against town or mafia.
we need action way before day 4, and this next day is going to be an important one.
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ummm, no @ BM.
i agree with whoever said malongo being red was luck. he wasn't even playing.
as for our next lynch target: town, if you don't recognize that someone between BC, L and incog is mafia, i will once again have to refer to the collective as a bunch of dingbats.
clearly, something is not adding up. at least one of them is mafia. and if we lynch one of them, we're guaranteed a red popping up.
my suggestion would be BC. and if incog threatens to pardon, we should kill incog first.
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also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town.
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note: i was saying "umm no, BM" to his post about people RC to him in PMs.
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On March 16 2010 10:39 l10f wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 10:31 Versatile wrote:
ummm, no @ BM.
i agree with whoever said malongo being red was luck. he wasn't even playing.
as for our next lynch target: town, if you don't recognize that someone between BC, L and incog is mafia, i will once again have to refer to the collective as a bunch of dingbats.
clearly, something is not adding up. at least one of them is mafia. and if we lynch one of them, we're guaranteed a red popping up.
my suggestion would be BC. and if incog threatens to pardon, we should kill incog first. Are you serious? BC and incog are the two of the last people I would suspect to be mafia. they both suspected Malongo, and even got a lot of people to vote for him. I would suspect those who voted for abenson after BC changed his vote to Malongo. That means they were trying to make sure Abenson gets lynched so Malongo could be saved.
lmao. is this your first time playing? or are you that slow? way to paint yourself.
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On March 16 2010 10:45 ~OpZ~ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 10:34 Versatile wrote:
also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town. -_-...I don't think BC would vote for someone he RC'd green. Do you? It'd be pretty obvious, and I can almost guarantee he would come to that persons defense. So let's not worry about him posting his RC, yet. I'd imagine the person he checked could step forth without BC anyway.
oh really? so, let's say i don't trust BC. or even if i do, let's say i want to vote for someone different than who he voted for and i happen to vote for someone he "checked" and is towny; what's going to happen then? is he going to quote me and say, "oh...i wouldn't do that if i were youuuuuuuuuuuuuu!". and at that point, shouldn't he have come out and just told us any darn way?
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On March 16 2010 15:40 Incognito wrote:
Early game, Bill seems innocent.
End of Day 1, he sounds more fishy. Especially after the "drunk" posts. And repeatedly emphasizing his greenness.
Day 2 lynch final moments, even more fishy. I like L's analysis. Now that I go back to it, yeah, its funny how Bill is pre-emptively trying to show his support in favor of Malongo's lynch before Malongo flips red. While also voting to lynch Abenson. If Bill wasn't suspicious before now, he sure is now.
Other thoughts: I find it interesting how Versatile brings up an ultimatum on BC. Then proceeds to viciously attack the fact that BC isn't announcing people he's checked. Then, when BC responds, Versatile disappears. Something is not right here. The way they're going at each other, I'm guessing one of BC/Versatile are mafia. The question right now is, which one? Good question. Atm BC can be tested more than Versatile given BC's claim.
Zona's strongly pro-town posts seem to make him a good target for the mafia. Plus, Zona is also a BG, so double the goodies for the mafia. This, in my eyes, makes Zona a strong target for BD or medic protection. Good job Zona for making yourself a clear pro-town BG. That just makes it harder for the mafia to decide who to hit.
uh, i went to bed. and now i'm checking the thread while getting ready for work. am i supposed to be reading this thread 24/7? you've been coming @ me in a very slick way all game long. you seem to love typing my name. remember when you asked me for my opinion on BC and asked me to post in here? well, i did. i don't remember you responding. were you planning to? are you going to elaborate on your suspicions of BC, especially since you've been "collecting intel" on him through PMs? you set that trap yet,buddy?
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On March 16 2010 22:27 madnessman wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 09:49 L wrote:Hi, do you still feel the same way about madnessman?
First, volunteering to be killed is a gambit that can be played by both town and mafia members. And I must have missed where you used your blue abilities to prove your alignment. Mang, good quoting skills. 1) He PM'd me afterwards, like I said in the thread and made an emotional "OH FUCK I SCREWED UP SORRY  (((((((((((((((((((((((" post. Generally, I've found these scummy in the past, but Ver's a better player than I am when it comes to looking at individuals and thinks this is a typical town reaction to a bad situation. Given that a policy lynch on being a douchebag vote swinger could go to BM or MM, I'd rather it goes to BM, hence my vote. Which is going to stay there. oh gawd. I pm'd you saying: Show nested quote +ahh shit. sorry you got screwed over, and that it was partly my fault. do you think that you'll get killed tonight? L, plz don't be such a drama queen. With that said, I am back! Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 10:31 Versatile wrote:
ummm, no @ BM.
i agree with whoever said malongo being red was luck. he wasn't even playing.
as for our next lynch target: town, if you don't recognize that someone between BC, L and incog is mafia, i will once again have to refer to the collective as a bunch of dingbats.
clearly, something is not adding up. at least one of them is mafia. and if we lynch one of them, we're guaranteed a red popping up.
my suggestion would be BC. and if incog threatens to pardon, we should kill incog first. LOL wtf is this post. It's definitely likely that one of them is mafia, but we shouldn't try to discern which one of them is by the process of elimination, especially when ALL THREE of them are claiming blue, and as such, there is so much at stake. Surely there's a better way to do this then going "inny minny miney mo" and pointing at one of them? Lol.
so what's your suggestion? it seems to me that numerous players agree on the premises that at least one of BC, incog, and L are very likely mafia. it's making it especially difficult to determine who because of the blue claims and the appearance that all three of them, or at least BC and L, are working together right now.
how do we determine which one is mafia? do you have a plan? i would love to hear it, as it would help the town.
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On March 16 2010 10:55 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 10:34 Versatile wrote:
also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town. The moment you go to lynch them I WILL TELL YOU SO. At the moment all I've cleared sadly for you are blues. I am not telling you who they are, and I have already confirmed I am in contact with a driver. You at the moment don't need to know more than that. You don't need to know who I am talking to at the moment either. This debate happened pages ago. It seems very interesting that the same people are pushing to get information on who I have cleared. If this was three days from now, when I have a larger list of people and takes time for the mafia to kill them all, possibly not a bad idea. Early on however means they can kill them faster than I can check. If they are green or blue is irrelevant. Soon as their name is down, mafia knows they are cleared. The fact you keep pushing this same idea is baffling. I get that you want me to prove my role, I do get it. By releasing a list of names for mafia to off however is insanely stupid. Your actions while challenging me are great. I do encourage the town to do so till I am proven, however, you constantly pushing for my death + publically giving all the information I have more implies that your not playing with the towns best interests at heart. Get off your high horse and stop demanding shit. DT info is fed via mouths, or in the case they get elected and proven (yes you can claim I'm not proven yet), they give what they can safely to town, and can give the rest to trusted confirms.
first of all, stop crying. if you didn't want to be pushed or questioned, you should have never signed up for mayor. it's what comes with the territory.
and it's not about me. it's also not about you. it's about what's best for the town, and you're sadly mistaken if you think you're doing what's best for the town. it's about to be day 3, and you haven't shown the town, in the thread, any definitive leadership.
i understand that you don't want the mafia killing confirmed townies. however, if you were to announce player A and player B are townies to the town, and the mafia proceeds to kill them, guess what? the mafia just confirmed your innocence for the town. don't you get that? i mean, they're going to kill townies any way, they know who their own are. i think sacrificing 1 or 2 greens is worth achieving a confirmed DT mayor.
at the moment that we know we can trust you BC, the game is over. you can get role claims from all of us, and end this. i cannot comprehend why it is almost day 3 and you have not made more movement on this.
so, i apologize if it seems like i am "viciously attacking" you. that's not my intention. i just want answers from our leader.
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On March 17 2010 02:07 Incognito wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 01:19 Versatile wrote:On March 15 2010 23:24 Abenson wrote:
Hello, I am back and have gotten caught up with the whole thing.
I have realized that I am to be lynched if this goes on, but I think this is wrong.
This is because:
a) I have shown no obvious signs of being mafia so far, other than inactivity. I am still in high school and it's currently march break, so I'm generally off somewhere or playing Starcraft with my friends.
b) I, as myself, would not like to be lynched.
c) As someone have said, nobody has come to defend me yet, this means that the mafia or anyone isn't trying hard to save me. Therefore I think this is sufficient proof that I have nobody working with me.
d) As for the "dt's post their results" is because I think that it is perfectly logical; And also I really have nothing better to post at the time and wanted to contribute.
Finally, I would like to say that lynching someone simply because of lack of candidate is generally a bad idea. It is wasting valuable lynches and plus I haven't really done anything that is suspicious. the only time a DT should step forward is if they found a red. if they didn't, then there is no reason for them to put themselves in the limelight. Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 10:34 Versatile wrote:
also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town. Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 00:50 Versatile wrote:On March 16 2010 10:55 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On March 16 2010 10:34 Versatile wrote:
also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town. The moment you go to lynch them I WILL TELL YOU SO. At the moment all I've cleared sadly for you are blues. I am not telling you who they are, and I have already confirmed I am in contact with a driver. You at the moment don't need to know more than that. You don't need to know who I am talking to at the moment either. This debate happened pages ago. It seems very interesting that the same people are pushing to get information on who I have cleared. If this was three days from now, when I have a larger list of people and takes time for the mafia to kill them all, possibly not a bad idea. Early on however means they can kill them faster than I can check. If they are green or blue is irrelevant. Soon as their name is down, mafia knows they are cleared. The fact you keep pushing this same idea is baffling. I get that you want me to prove my role, I do get it. By releasing a list of names for mafia to off however is insanely stupid. Your actions while challenging me are great. I do encourage the town to do so till I am proven, however, you constantly pushing for my death + publically giving all the information I have more implies that your not playing with the towns best interests at heart. Get off your high horse and stop demanding shit. DT info is fed via mouths, or in the case they get elected and proven (yes you can claim I'm not proven yet), they give what they can safely to town, and can give the rest to trusted confirms. first of all, stop crying. if you didn't want to be pushed or questioned, you should have never signed up for mayor. it's what comes with the territory. and it's not about me. it's also not about you. it's about what's best for the town, and you're sadly mistaken if you think you're doing what's best for the town. it's about to be day 3, and you haven't shown the town, in the thread, any definitive leadership. i understand that you don't want the mafia killing confirmed townies. however, if you were to announce player A and player B are townies to the town, and the mafia proceeds to kill them, guess what? the mafia just confirmed your innocence for the town. don't you get that? i mean, they're going to kill townies any way, they know who their own are. i think sacrificing 1 or 2 greens is worth achieving a confirmed DT mayor.at the moment that we know we can trust you BC, the game is over. you can get role claims from all of us, and end this. i cannot comprehend why it is almost day 3 and you have not made more movement on this. so, i apologize if it seems like i am "viciously attacking" you. that's not my intention. i just want answers from our leader. Lets take a look at these three posts from Versatile. First, she agrees with BC's idea that DTs should only announce red checks. Second post, she decides that BC is pulling BS here when he decides to follow the plan that she agreed with. Third post, I guess she figures that her previous attempt to get BC to spit out the confirmed townies didn't work and is desperate to find another way? Her plan is flawed for obvious reasons stated above. I dont know, but why do you keep switching your views on things that seem like they should be policy no matter what your role? Something doesn't add up here. Care to explain? Also, who do you suggest we lynch tomorrow? Did you read L's analysis of Bill Murray? On another note, Show nested quote +On March 16 2010 10:31 Versatile wrote:
ummm, no @ BM.
i agree with whoever said malongo being red was luck. he wasn't even playing.
as for our next lynch target: town, if you don't recognize that someone between BC, L and incog is mafia, i will once again have to refer to the collective as a bunch of dingbats.
clearly, something is not adding up. at least one of them is mafia. and if we lynch one of them, we're guaranteed a red popping up.
my suggestion would be BC. and if incog threatens to pardon, we should kill incog first. Downplaying Malongo's lynch. Which fine, it wasn't some awesome convincing analysis. But it was a successful guess. Would the mafia really risk starting a train on Malongo when he hadn't been previously discussed? Sure, he was inactive and a good target to gain credibility, but at this point, they have more issues to worry about then gaining credibility from lynches. Either way, you've mentioned repeatedly that it is self-evident that one of BC/me/L are mafia. In fact you keep saying this as if you're 100% sure that this is true seemingly out of nowhere. Stirring up the town based on a percieved false consensus here? BC's alignment can be tested severely. Yours unfortunately is a bit more difficult. But I guess I'll wait to comment further until you answer this post.
1. that post was referring to an UNPROTECTED DT. i never agreed that BC should keep his checks secretly. not once. go read my posts. once again, stop misrepresenting my what i wrote. this is the same shyt people were doing to L. i have used to the same policy the entire time. i haven't changed my mind. so that point is null and void.
2. lol, are you serious? downplaying malongo's lynch? if i were mafia, what would i gain from doing this? and how was it a successful guess? NO ONE could have voted for malongo and he STILL would have died. that's not a towny victory. that's just bad luck for the mafia. further, citi.zen and L both said the same thing. but it only matters to you that i said it right?
3. i don't understand how you can say that i am "stirring up the town based on perceived false consensus". i am not the only towny who has said this, so there is no perceived false consensus. fact is, it is very unlikely that that all three of you are blue/green. that's what i think, and if you don't like, go cry to someone else about it.
now, instead of riding my jock, maybe you'd like to actually post something substantial. cut the "all will be made clear in the morning's dawn when God whispers in your ear" bullshit. you're also an elected official and i don't see you doing much either.
in fact, i find it suspicious that you're taking all the heat for BC when you claim to be suspicious of him yourself. what's up with that, boss?
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incog, you're so sweet to think of me when you're PMing other players too!
you loooooooooooooove me, you wanna kisssssssssssss me, you wanna huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuug me a la gracie lou freebush.
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i don't know what to think about this L and BM thing.
BM did mess with two votes, so i think L's suspicion is justified. however, L was out for BM before the game even began, so i feel like his judgment might be clouded.
if neither one of them is hit tonight, i'm inclined to think that they're just two townies going at one another and mafia wants them alive to distract. but it's equal possible that if one is mafia, the other won't be hit due to drawing attention to himself.
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i can see the town is hesitant to lynch BC, and if that's not what the town wants, i will go with that.
so for lynch candidates for day 3, what does everyone think of putting the L/BM thing to rest. i highly doubt that either one of them will be killed during the night. as i stated before, if they're both townies, the mafia will want them @ each others' throats as a distraction, and if either is mafia, the death of one during the night would draw too much attention to the other. unless they're just that diabolical.
thoughts?
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On March 17 2010 03:55 Zona wrote:
Another thing I want the town to think about is the pardoner power.
I think the pardoner MECHANISM as a whole brings NOTHING good to the town. When players die, the rest of the town gains CONCRETE INFORMATION. However, with mafia nightkills, the mafia decides what information to reveal, so the information from a lynch is much more valuable, because it is not totally driven by the mafia. As well, vote history is very valuable when combined with lynch results. So when the pardoner ever pardons, the town is deprived of information is needs to get.
Okay, so the pardoner shouldn't pardon. But therein lies the problem. When we reach lategame, the pardoner power becomes EVEN MORE DANGEROUS to the town, when in the hands of a mafia member. By that point in the game, the pardon can simply be used to cancel a town's lynch, and allow the mafia to continue whittling down the town with their nightkill. So we as a town want to reach lategame without the pardoner having his or her power. But if the pardoner ever uses his or her power...it's a bad thing.
I have no easy answer to this dilemma. However, if we force the pardoner to use up pardons earlier in the game to remove the risk of mafia pardoning late game, the town falls behind and loses two lynches. If we kill the pardoner with a lynch, we fall behind in ONE lynch, but we also lose one town member.
The only alternative is we somehow have to prove the pardoner is definitely town, so we can avoid using pardons and also go into the lategame without worrying about mafia pardoning.
i think there is only one way to deal with this. the two tells the pardoner (incog in this game) that we do not want any lynches. and if he goes against the town's wishes so blantantly, that's cause for immediate lynching.
of course, this should have been done in the beginning of the game, but we can just keep it in mind for future games as well.
obviously there some problems with this, for example, it counts on the pardoner keeping their word so it is not full proof.
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On March 17 2010 04:07 Zona wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 04:02 Versatile wrote:On March 17 2010 03:55 Zona wrote:
Another thing I want the town to think about is the pardoner power.
I think the pardoner MECHANISM as a whole brings NOTHING good to the town. When players die, the rest of the town gains CONCRETE INFORMATION. However, with mafia nightkills, the mafia decides what information to reveal, so the information from a lynch is much more valuable, because it is not totally driven by the mafia. As well, vote history is very valuable when combined with lynch results. So when the pardoner ever pardons, the town is deprived of information is needs to get.
Okay, so the pardoner shouldn't pardon. But therein lies the problem. When we reach lategame, the pardoner power becomes EVEN MORE DANGEROUS to the town, when in the hands of a mafia member. By that point in the game, the pardon can simply be used to cancel a town's lynch, and allow the mafia to continue whittling down the town with their nightkill. So we as a town want to reach lategame without the pardoner having his or her power. But if the pardoner ever uses his or her power...it's a bad thing.
I have no easy answer to this dilemma. However, if we force the pardoner to use up pardons earlier in the game to remove the risk of mafia pardoning late game, the town falls behind and loses two lynches. If we kill the pardoner with a lynch, we fall behind in ONE lynch, but we also lose one town member.
The only alternative is we somehow have to prove the pardoner is definitely town, so we can avoid using pardons and also go into the lategame without worrying about mafia pardoning. i think there is only one way to deal with this. the two tells the pardoner (incog in this game) that we do not want any lynches. and if he goes against the town's wishes so blantantly, that's cause for immediate lynching. of course, this should have been done in the beginning of the game, but we can just keep it in mind for future games as well. obviously there some problems with this, for example, it counts on the pardoner keeping their word so it is not full proof. The thing is, the pardoner obeying the town in using up pardons in the first two days does nothing to prove how town-aligned they are. The mafia would be happy to have a monopoly on kills for two days. They then control what information the town has. Actually the first town lynch vote is probably one of the most important in the game, because it provides the first voting record for the town to examine. I'd definitely be against pardoning that one... That's why the mechanic of having the mayor decide the first lynch actually sets the town back, because there's no voting history to examine day 2.
no, maybe i wasn't clear. i'm saying the town should tell the pardoner NOT to use ANY lynches, period. this doesn't address the late game issue, but it prevents a mafia pardoner from saving his buddies without making it obvious he's red as well.
i'm not sure what to do with the late game problem, i'll keep brainstorming.
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On March 17 2010 04:17 ~OpZ~ wrote:
Although Incog did have a point when Versatile agreed to BC's plan, then decided he should release the names...
It could just be the want for information, but you did say they shouldn't be released earlier.
no monkeybreath, he didn't have a point because it's not true. i already addressed that. stop blatantly lying about me.
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On March 17 2010 04:19 Bill Murray wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 03:59 Versatile wrote:
i can see the town is hesitant to lynch BC, and if that's not what the town wants, i will go with that.
so for lynch candidates for day 3, what does everyone think of putting the L/BM thing to rest. i highly doubt that either one of them will be killed during the night. as i stated before, if they're both townies, the mafia will want them @ each others' throats as a distraction, and if either is mafia, the death of one during the night would draw too much attention to the other. unless they're just that diabolical.
thoughts? I would love to put it to rest. I like L. I believe he is town.
you do realize "put to rest" means one of you should be lynched.
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umm, the idea would be to lynch you since L agreed to be lynched if you are green.
what is wrong with you?
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have you been drinking again? it's the middle of the day.
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lol, why are you behaving as if this is the first time you've been accused all game?
you've been a lynch candidate for ages. i'm promoting discussion to get more people involved in the discussion so we can get a better idea of where the town stands.
and if you are mafia like L has stated over and over again, lynching you would benefit the town.
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On March 17 2010 04:43 Bill Murray wrote:
I've gotten 2 votes all game. Real lynch candidate there. You want to lynch our mayor and you want to lynch an obvious green? I say we lynch you.
then lynch me, hoe.
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to whoever went crying to the mod about my language....fuck you, hoe. cry some more. this isn't day camp.
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On March 17 2010 05:25 Abenson wrote:
I went to mafiascum.net and I've just realized that Incog is scummer himself and won the IC award :O
aren't you dead? stop trying to influence the game from the grave, it isn't fair to the players and the mod.
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that's completely inappropriate, xelin. seriously.
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On March 17 2010 10:22 johnnyspazz wrote:
we lost both bodyguards? wtf where the medics doing?
exactly. wtf.
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well, it's day 3. it's seriously, seriously sucks that zona is gone.
patiently waiting for the big reveals promised by BC and incog.
@ BM: i can't say what i want to 'cuz i promised flame i'd be nicer so i'm just going to say i keep getting sucked into spamming because i respond to you. i'm acknowledge your vote for me here and leaving it at that.
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On March 17 2010 12:19 Incognito wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 02:32 Versatile wrote:On March 17 2010 02:07 Incognito wrote:On March 16 2010 01:19 Versatile wrote:On March 15 2010 23:24 Abenson wrote:
Hello, I am back and have gotten caught up with the whole thing.
I have realized that I am to be lynched if this goes on, but I think this is wrong.
This is because:
a) I have shown no obvious signs of being mafia so far, other than inactivity. I am still in high school and it's currently march break, so I'm generally off somewhere or playing Starcraft with my friends.
b) I, as myself, would not like to be lynched.
c) As someone have said, nobody has come to defend me yet, this means that the mafia or anyone isn't trying hard to save me. Therefore I think this is sufficient proof that I have nobody working with me.
d) As for the "dt's post their results" is because I think that it is perfectly logical; And also I really have nothing better to post at the time and wanted to contribute.
Finally, I would like to say that lynching someone simply because of lack of candidate is generally a bad idea. It is wasting valuable lynches and plus I haven't really done anything that is suspicious. the only time a DT should step forward is if they found a red. if they didn't, then there is no reason for them to put themselves in the limelight. On March 16 2010 10:34 Versatile wrote:
also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town. On March 17 2010 00:50 Versatile wrote:On March 16 2010 10:55 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On March 16 2010 10:34 Versatile wrote:
also BC. wth is this trash about, "oh i found a townie, but i'm not releasing their name"?
that's bullshit. guess what? the mafia already knows who is town and who is mafia. this is not new information to them, but it is to us, the town. if you are a DT, and you found a green person, let us know so we don't, among other things, LYNCH THEM BY ACCIDENT.
mafia's weakness: numbers.
our weakness: information. so keeping things a secret is not useful to the town. The moment you go to lynch them I WILL TELL YOU SO. At the moment all I've cleared sadly for you are blues. I am not telling you who they are, and I have already confirmed I am in contact with a driver. You at the moment don't need to know more than that. You don't need to know who I am talking to at the moment either. This debate happened pages ago. It seems very interesting that the same people are pushing to get information on who I have cleared. If this was three days from now, when I have a larger list of people and takes time for the mafia to kill them all, possibly not a bad idea. Early on however means they can kill them faster than I can check. If they are green or blue is irrelevant. Soon as their name is down, mafia knows they are cleared. The fact you keep pushing this same idea is baffling. I get that you want me to prove my role, I do get it. By releasing a list of names for mafia to off however is insanely stupid. Your actions while challenging me are great. I do encourage the town to do so till I am proven, however, you constantly pushing for my death + publically giving all the information I have more implies that your not playing with the towns best interests at heart. Get off your high horse and stop demanding shit. DT info is fed via mouths, or in the case they get elected and proven (yes you can claim I'm not proven yet), they give what they can safely to town, and can give the rest to trusted confirms. first of all, stop crying. if you didn't want to be pushed or questioned, you should have never signed up for mayor. it's what comes with the territory. and it's not about me. it's also not about you. it's about what's best for the town, and you're sadly mistaken if you think you're doing what's best for the town. it's about to be day 3, and you haven't shown the town, in the thread, any definitive leadership. i understand that you don't want the mafia killing confirmed townies. however, if you were to announce player A and player B are townies to the town, and the mafia proceeds to kill them, guess what? the mafia just confirmed your innocence for the town. don't you get that? i mean, they're going to kill townies any way, they know who their own are. i think sacrificing 1 or 2 greens is worth achieving a confirmed DT mayor.at the moment that we know we can trust you BC, the game is over. you can get role claims from all of us, and end this. i cannot comprehend why it is almost day 3 and you have not made more movement on this. so, i apologize if it seems like i am "viciously attacking" you. that's not my intention. i just want answers from our leader. Lets take a look at these three posts from Versatile. First, she agrees with BC's idea that DTs should only announce red checks. Second post, she decides that BC is pulling BS here when he decides to follow the plan that she agreed with. Third post, I guess she figures that her previous attempt to get BC to spit out the confirmed townies didn't work and is desperate to find another way? Her plan is flawed for obvious reasons stated above. I dont know, but why do you keep switching your views on things that seem like they should be policy no matter what your role? Something doesn't add up here. Care to explain? Also, who do you suggest we lynch tomorrow? Did you read L's analysis of Bill Murray? On another note, On March 16 2010 10:31 Versatile wrote:
ummm, no @ BM.
i agree with whoever said malongo being red was luck. he wasn't even playing.
as for our next lynch target: town, if you don't recognize that someone between BC, L and incog is mafia, i will once again have to refer to the collective as a bunch of dingbats.
clearly, something is not adding up. at least one of them is mafia. and if we lynch one of them, we're guaranteed a red popping up.
my suggestion would be BC. and if incog threatens to pardon, we should kill incog first. Downplaying Malongo's lynch. Which fine, it wasn't some awesome convincing analysis. But it was a successful guess. Would the mafia really risk starting a train on Malongo when he hadn't been previously discussed? Sure, he was inactive and a good target to gain credibility, but at this point, they have more issues to worry about then gaining credibility from lynches. Either way, you've mentioned repeatedly that it is self-evident that one of BC/me/L are mafia. In fact you keep saying this as if you're 100% sure that this is true seemingly out of nowhere. Stirring up the town based on a percieved false consensus here? BC's alignment can be tested severely. Yours unfortunately is a bit more difficult. But I guess I'll wait to comment further until you answer this post. 1. that post was referring to an UNPROTECTED DT. i never agreed that BC should keep his checks secretly. not once. go read my posts. once again, stop misrepresenting my what i wrote. this is the same shyt people were doing to L. i have used to the same policy the entire time. i haven't changed my mind. so that point is null and void. 2. lol, are you serious? downplaying malongo's lynch? if i were mafia, what would i gain from doing this? and how was it a successful guess? NO ONE could have voted for malongo and he STILL would have died. that's not a towny victory. that's just bad luck for the mafia. further, citi.zen and L both said the same thing. but it only matters to you that i said it right? 3. i don't understand how you can say that i am "stirring up the town based on perceived false consensus". i am not the only towny who has said this, so there is no perceived false consensus. fact is, it is very unlikely that that all three of you are blue/green. that's what i think, and if you don't like, go cry to someone else about it. now, instead of riding my jock, maybe you'd like to actually post something substantial. cut the "all will be made clear in the morning's dawn when God whispers in your ear" bullshit. you're also an elected official and i don't see you doing much either. in fact, i find it suspicious that you're taking all the heat for BC when you claim to be suspicious of him yourself. what's up with that, boss? Thank you for the nonsense garbage reply that ignores half of my statements. Again, "the only time a DT should step forward is if they found a red". I think everyone would agree that I'm not taking your posts out of context here. Only is a pretty strong word. And even if I look at the post you're replying to, Abenson doesn't mention unprotected DTs specifically. Oops and you decide not to respond to my comments on your second and third pms. Trying to cover that up? "NO ONE could have voted for malongo and he STILL would have died." This is true. But why are you trying to deny the fact that BC and I started the move against Malongo? Sure, it wasn't the most solid analysis, but it still counts for something. Regardless of what the outcome was, its the actions and the motives that are important here. Yes, you are downplaying Malongo's lynch, perhaps because as mafia, you fear that BC and I will become too trusted by the town. There's no logical reason why BC and I would start a train against our own mafia teammate when we didn't have to. Everyone seemed perfectly happy bandwagoning Abenson. Mafia didn't need to break the status quo. And now you're saying they did. I now have proof that BC and I are either BOTH mafia or both town, which I'll bring up later. I'm taking the heat for BC because you are doing something incredibly narrow minded, short sighted, and misguided. As for you, I'd appreciate if you didn't spam the thread with all that vulgar and useless language. Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 05:25 Abenson wrote:
I went to mafiascum.net and I've just realized that Incog is scummer himself and won the IC award :O I don't play on mafiascum. Show nested quote +Quote from sidesprang: Which brings us to other candidates. Quite frankly, there's a lot. We can never be sure, but at the moment, I'm not comfortable at all with Abenson as a candidate. I would suggest Malongo and Sidesprang as alternatives. Both of whom have very few posts. Malongo has also gone mysteriously missing after his bid for office. Soon after posting, he was called out, and never responded. Which is always unsettling. Furthermore, he usually posts more material. Sometimes its not very useful material, but he always has some material. Either way, this is different for Malongo. No this is a quote from me. Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 07:45 Bill Murray wrote:
sorry for misquoting you sidesprang, seemed suspicious though.
i guess ill ask you, then, incognito. why were you so worried about malongo's inactivity? I wasn't even aware he was inactive, I was bloody f5ing the voting thread ready to switch my vote on him if he showed up. This has been stated several times. Inactive + ran for mayor then disappeared. He's also known for posting a lot more. And Abenson was a worse lynch target because nobody defended him and he was acting like he was every game. Show nested quote +On March 17 2010 07:46 Bill Murray wrote:
Also, Incognito, why have you been a lot less active in organizing the town this game as compared with the last? Because I haven't. More to come. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Page 53. An interesting page that has a handful of people spamming "that sucks" posts all over. Yes it does suck. But Versatile, I thought you wanted us to die anyway? On to business. And roleclaims. And clearing BC of guilt. First off, I am the Bus Driver. If you guys haven't figured it out yet, the reason why we all had figured out blues was because we were all blue. Durr. And the reason why I didn't claim driver after my election was so that the mafia/mafia driver wouldnt mess up our checks. So, on to confirmations. Night 1, BC checks sidesprang. I bus sidesprang and L. L is rolechecked and comes up as a Mad Hatter, which is all fine and dandy. While this confirms L and me to BC, it did nothing to confirm BC to me. Day 2, I receive a pm from a claimed DT. Now I get hella suspicious of BC, guessing that the balance would be terribly off if we had 2 DTs and only 5 mafia. So fearing that I had wasted my first bus to a manipulative GF, I decided to end this once and for all. BC would be tested by bus. Simple, really. I ask BC to check player X. Then, I use my powers to swap player X with any of the other remaining 19 players on the field. BC now has to guess who I swapped with, in addition to the role. 1/19 is pretty slim for a fake DT. Fortunately, BC passed the test. So either we are both mafia, or we are both town. Any questions? Will post more about lynch targets in a short while.
1. since you're trying to use my quotes against me, here's one from earlier on in the game that clarifies my feelings on people claiming. i can admit i could have been clearer in the post you quoted, but hopefully this will put it to rest.
On March 14 2010 02:00 Versatile wrote:
sorry folks, just got caught up with the thread, haven't had much free time lately. and i knew that might happen, which is why i got my vote in early.
at the time i voted, it was L and incog who were the top candidates and incog read as more pro-town to me, hence my vote.
a couple of things: incog stated he expected more form me in this game. this in itself is not strange, because i'm pretty sure incog is familiar with my playing on another site. however, he called out malongo and foolishness as well. i don't believe malongo has addressed this accusation yet.
however, foolishness not only didn't bother to defend himself to incog or any other player, but went as far as defending incog's post and went back and forth with zona.
this struck me because if zona's not town, who the hell is? check his posts, if i had been around, that's who i would i have changed my vote to.
in any case, i also received an incog PM stating "first". however, i believe the medics need to be protecting zona, and i hope that's what they decide to do.
as i stated earlier, DTs ought to be checking the vote lists. if we have a mafia member in office, it's likely a mafia member or two voted for them, especially with a last minute vote swing, if i read correctly.
i also don't think anyone without protection should be claiming a damn thing to anyone right now. DTs should be investigating and building up their circle in the most secure and legitimate way they can, and it's far too early to be trusting anyone.
going to update my archives now.
2. what did you say about your PMs? what would i have to cover up? here are my PMs with incog for all who are interested. i have nothing to hide. read bottom up, bolded is me:
+ Show Spoiler +sure, if you promise to choke on a dick sometime within the next couple of hours
once again, i don't play behind the scenes so stop PMing me. play in the thread.
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Original Message:
Well if you don't play behind the scenes, I'm sure you're willing to post more in the thread? At the moment I don't think I've heard much from you, especially in the past few days.
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Original Message:
well, i have no intel other than what i posted in the thread. i don't play the game behind the scenes. so i'll look for your info in there, if ever you post it.
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Original Message:
What will catch our mayor is if he slips up a DT check. That doesn't require thread information. I just don't BC to have the bus driver excuse when I press him for a specific role check, if you know what I mean. Right now I'm just trying to gather intel from others on him. When/if I catch him I will post everything.
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Original Message:
i think you should be posting in the thread if you suspect our mayor, because that's what will help the town.
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Original Message:
Knowing that you are a responsible player, I would like to know your thoughts about the current situation. I have received some information that makes me doubt BC's legitimacy. What do you think?
3. i wasn't downplaying malongo's death, get over yourself. all i said was that it wasn't based on some fantastic move from the town. the guy was inactive, and he was modkilled. that took no skill from anyone. period.
4. i said it seriously, seriously sucks that zona is gone. nothing to do with you, friend.
5. i could give a damn what you think about my language. seriously. feel free not to read my posts. getting your panties in a bunch over some jokes and sarcasm. it's not personal, so why so sensitive.
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if both elected officials are blue, rofl.
i hate when ace is right.
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as far as inactive mafia, I10f and d3 are good targets, imo.
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voting BM just so he'll STFU.
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someone wanna explain the push for the dbl lynch?
oh grand town leaders, with brains the size of peas....ermm, eggplants, uhhh, cantaloupes...yeah.... who are the two suspects you hope to lynch with a dbl lynch? hmmmmmm?
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On March 18 2010 02:29 Incognito wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2010 02:27 Versatile wrote:
someone wanna explain the push for the dbl lynch?
oh grand town leaders, with brains the size of peas....ermm, eggplants, uhhh, cantaloupes...yeah.... who are the two suspects you hope to lynch with a dbl lynch? hmmmmmm? Before answering this question, who are your top suspects? Don't you think that given that we get 2 DT checks tonight and have a bunch of fishy inactives we'll find someone to lynch? Did you run out of suspects to lynch now that you can't attack BC anymore?
will you stop being an idiot for two seconds?
listen. any decent player with half a mind would seriously question BC and how he's decided to play this game. you might not like my methods, but the intent is there.
BC is an invincible DT and has played this whole thing scared. he's a freaking invincible DT! do you know what the means? he can take risks. he can act more freely. he could have sown this thing up so long ago it's ridiculous. he played vague, he was uncooperative, and he did not lead the town in the thread. i cannot believe you're surprised at how much i questioned him. a supposed DT mayor who has done nothing to prove it to the town out in public? gtfo. i don't trust all willy nilly. that's how you get screwed, and he didn't prove shyt in the thread.
secondly, you're exceedingly narrow-minded for not understand why i have seriously questioned BC. you guys have played this entire thing behind the scenes. that's fine. that was your strategy. however, when you come in the thread and come at me because i'm not on the same page as you, please realize you're being ridiculous. it's like, the equation is (2+4) * (5+6) in the thread so here i am thinking the answer is 66, but there's another part of the equation in PMs that says divide by 2, and i'm supposed to know the real answer is 33? well, dumbass, i don't get where you're coming from because i don't have the all the information you do. so don't expect me to magically come to same conclusions as you. and no, i'm not going to sit back and just trust you know what you're doing because i'm not a sheep.
and as a general comment, i don't know how many times this can be said: playing the game in PMs ruins it in so many ways. sure, it's useful in moderation. but seriously. take a look at this thread. this game has been incredibly slow. when information is shared with the town the game is more exciting and more fun for everyone involved. it also gives the mafia a fairer chance, especially in a game that is this much towny favored. it's not about the cool kids table. it's about making this enjoyable for everyone involved, and giving everyone the chance to get better at it.
seriously, if you keep writing off some players as stupid or worthless, and don't bother to try to help them learn, the quality of these games will never improve. i've been here for three games and it's the same idiots being tricked by the same idiots and leading the town down the road to hell regardless of what anyone's role is in any given game.
oh, and i guess i'll take this moment to sincerely apologize to anyone whose feelings i may have hurt. it's just a game. i attack people's posts and logic because that's what you do in this game. i don't care who's name is attached to the post, so don't take my jabs and jokes seriously, it's all in good fun.
now i'm going to go back to trying to find a way out of this game that doesn't get me banned.
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On March 18 2010 02:29 johnnyspazz wrote:probably you and foolishness jk but i think the fact that BM's first lynch would've been a red makes him probably green
that would be welcomed, lol.
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ps: my top suspect is me, myself, i. and also, this versatile character who also goes by verse, vers, and versa-million. let's get a 7-way lynch going.
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BM if you PM me one more fcukin' time, i swuurtagawd i will come through this cpu and chop your balls off.
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EPT
