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Welcome to this patch's General Discussion thread for the League of Legends subforum. This thread is for discussion around League of Legends. Free feel to talk about anything LoL related here that does not already have its own thread.
Non-League of Legends discussion should go in the LiquidLegends Lounge.
Certain topics are blacklisted from LoL General Discussion and they include:- "Elo hell"
- The Tribunal
- Bans, either from TL.net or LoL
Additionally, the TL LoL Ten Commandments are available for you to reference if you have any questions about this subforum.
Use the LoL Strategy subforum if you have game or champion specific questions. Lastly, confine QQing and bragging to their respective threads.
Patch 8.14: Live on July. 18, 2018
+ Show Spoiler [Previous GD Threads & Patch Notes] +
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Rek'sai buffs! Poggers!
Gif undodgeable ult plz 
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"I found out how to fix funneling! We change jungle items in a way that hurts junglers!"
Fuck you, Riot.
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On July 18 2018 11:52 Gahlo wrote:
"I found out how to fix funneling! We change jungle items in a way that hurts junglers!"
Fuck you, Riot.
Does that change actually drastically affect jugglers though? Are jugglers often the highest gold on their team? Doesn’t it only affect their gold from lane minions?
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It could affect junglers who don't complete the jungle item later in the game. If they get fed and want to split.they'll be getting reduced gold still.
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On July 18 2018 11:52 Gahlo wrote:
"I found out how to fix funneling! We change jungle items in a way that hurts junglers!"
Fuck you, Riot.
Jungle items need to be removed. They were a mistake when introduced in S3, and remain so to this day.
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On July 18 2018 13:29 cLutZ wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2018 11:52 Gahlo wrote:
"I found out how to fix funneling! We change jungle items in a way that hurts junglers!"
Fuck you, Riot. Jungle items need to be removed. They were a mistake when introduced in S3, and remain so to this day.
I would not be against this if I was confident Riot wouldn't colossally fuck up their attempt to do so.
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Why exactly is funneling gold a bad thing? I still don't really understand that.
And if it is a horrible awful thing, say because it is too passive and / or boring, then bring back real carries that can play against it. You want to play a wet noodle mid and feed a Master Yi while you stall the game? Great, the free farmed Kog with a Janna laughs in your face.
Alternatively, you could get rid of everyone's free vision and let the other jungler take over the game.
Idk, I don't understand. They made changes because games were too fast and exciting and people didn't like not having control, now they mad that games not fast and exciting. Isn't this what you wanted?
Also, am I correct in noticing that Jinx and Twitch now have more HP than the average bruiser at level 1? Wtf? I'm old and dont play much these days, but that seems to be symptomatic of a game thats jumped the shark a bit.
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On July 18 2018 14:34 iCanada wrote:
Why exactly is funneling gold a bad thing? I still don't really understand that.
And if it is a horrible awful thing, say because it is too passive and / or boring, then bring back real carries that can play against it. You want to play a wet noodle mid and feed a Master Yi while you stall the game? Great, the free farmed Kog with a Janna laughs in your face.
Alternatively, you could get rid of everyone's free vision and let the other jungler take over the game.
Idk, I don't understand. They made changes because games were too fast and exciting and people didn't like not having control, now they mad that games not fast and exciting. Isn't this what you wanted?
Also, am I correct in noticing that Jinx and Twitch now have more HP than the average bruiser at level 1? Wtf?
Funneling is a problem because the game has been, for 5 years, balanced in a way that makes funneling a problem.
The most obvious example is Master Yi. This champion was intentionally balanced around the idea that it was very difficult for him to get ahead (or even stay even) of the enemy CC. Theoretically hes always been able to R-Alpha and wipe teams, but in most games that was not even a thought. Once it was able to occur it was an issue because the game was never balanced for a champ like Yi to get that much gold, because in the normal game, a Yi would get stomped if he went into either of the 3 lanes as a primary farmer. There have always been champs that would be OP if they got sick early farm without contest (for instance, playing Tryndamere) but the issue has been that sacrifices were never balanced for. Thus once there was a chance to sacrifice, there was a good chance that people would be affected.
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On July 18 2018 11:35 Seuss wrote:
The Akali rework looks okay except for the ult, it's needlessly complicated.
That's the only thing I'd have issue with too. I would have loved if they kept old ult, trim the dmg on it to make it fair w/ the new kit but keep all the functionality.
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The new ult is Riot Design™ to a tee. It can't just do one obvious thing, it has to do a dozen different things which don't really make it better. It doesn't need to stun, do two different types of damage, have two different dash speeds/animations, do AoE on one dash but only hit one target on the second, etc. Two dashes is fine, especially for interplay with her passive .Two dashes with a thousand bells and whistles dumped on top for no cohesive reason is silly.
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I think the real irony of the jungle item change is that it’s been “standard” for years on end for laners to steal jungle farm. But once it’s become standard for the reverse to be true then it’s something they’ve gotta address.
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Actually kind of a good point. Why do they just nerf the lane gold for junglers and not the jungle gold for people with a non-jungle item? Exp is already reduced for them, why not give it an extra incentive to not take it?
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but we want to take it
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On July 19 2018 03:52 Uldridge wrote:
Actually kind of a good point. Why do they just nerf the lane gold for junglers and not the jungle gold for people with a non-jungle item? Exp is already reduced for them, why not give it an extra incentive to not take it?
Because junglers aren't the problem.
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On July 19 2018 03:31 geript wrote:
I think the real irony of the jungle item change is that it’s been “standard” for years on end for laners to steal jungle farm. But once it’s become standard for the reverse to be true then it’s something they’ve gotta address.
I can't make sense of what you're saying. In pro play, it's mostly the "carrying" players that have taken the "jungle role" so they can farm both the jungle and the lane, so who gets farmed within the team is the same guy. In soloQ, laners steal camps but I wouldn't pretend junglers never take lane farm either.
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On July 18 2018 12:51 geript wrote:Show nested quote +On July 18 2018 11:52 Gahlo wrote:
"I found out how to fix funneling! We change jungle items in a way that hurts junglers!"
Fuck you, Riot. Does that change actually drastically affect jugglers though? Are jugglers often the highest gold on their team? Doesn’t it only affect their gold from lane minions?
well it depends on how you play but it's irritating if you're doing well having to juggle between either keeping your gold lower, not farming lane minions, or finishing a fast enchant
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On July 19 2018 03:52 Uldridge wrote:
Actually kind of a good point. Why do they just nerf the lane gold for junglers and not the jungle gold for people with a non-jungle item? Exp is already reduced for them, why not give it an extra incentive to not take it?
Because they don't want junglers to be a carry threat anymore. Riot Design right now thinks that carry junglers are "Bad Design" because it's passive play leading to massive power spikes faster than "Good Design" laning.
They want to turn junglers into the "position 4" role of Dota 2, where they are basically supports with slightly more gold. Riot Design right now wants to break up this notion of "tank top, mage mid, ADC bot" and turn things more into Dota 2's Position 5 - Position 1 role.
The problem behind that philosophy is that League's champions don't have nearly the same set of skills or items to allow for that to occur. The only buyable ward is a permanent, true-sight version that only one champion can place at a time. Items like Blink Dagger, BKB, MKB, Satanic, and Divine Rapier either don't exist or are so wildly different they can't be used in the same fashion. Battle Fury (the thing most akin to jungler items in Dota 2) also affects enemy heroes, where-as League's jungle items only work on a third of the things you can hit (jungle monsters vs. lane creeps and enemy champions).
Riot Design - in my eyes - is trying to emulate the success Dota 2 has had in the past few years, but League's fundamental game design doesn't allow it to occur without massive changes (see 8.11), and the only time these massive changes should occur is after Worlds.
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Even if they want to go in a more Dota-style (which I don't think is true) I don't see how this would get them there. Jungle has always been "position 4" in LOL and it was just for a few patches that jungle (which really was mid in many ways) became a position 1 thing. Position fluidity like jungle being 1 or 4 is very Dota, jungle always being 4 is very undota.
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On July 19 2018 04:47 Kinie wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2018 03:52 Uldridge wrote:
Actually kind of a good point. Why do they just nerf the lane gold for junglers and not the jungle gold for people with a non-jungle item? Exp is already reduced for them, why not give it an extra incentive to not take it? Because they don't want junglers to be a carry threat anymore. Riot Design right now thinks that carry junglers are "Bad Design" because it's passive play leading to massive power spikes faster than "Good Design" laning. They want to turn junglers into the "position 4" role of Dota 2, where they are basically supports with slightly more gold. Riot Design right now wants to break up this notion of "tank top, mage mid, ADC bot" and turn things more into Dota 2's Position 5 - Position 1 role. The problem behind that philosophy is that League's champions don't have nearly the same set of skills or items to allow for that to occur. The only buyable ward is a permanent, true-sight version that only one champion can place at a time. Items like Blink Dagger, BKB, MKB, Satanic, and Divine Rapier either don't exist or are so wildly different they can't be used in the same fashion. Battle Fury (the thing most akin to jungler items in Dota 2) also affects enemy heroes, where-as League's jungle items only work on a third of the things you can hit (jungle monsters vs. lane creeps and enemy champions). Riot Design - in my eyes - is trying to emulate the success Dota 2 has had in the past few years, but League's fundamental game design doesn't allow it to occur without massive changes (see 8.11), and the only time these massive changes should occur is after Worlds.
What are you talking about
this isnt about junglers being a carry threat
its about laners who can easily farm both mid and jungle with a support to get a huge gold/xp boost over everyone
yi was kind of an exception here but he's not much of a jungler anyway they just gave a bunch of free monster damage on his Q because his kit is too bad to lane
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EPT
