Yeah I'm not saying support Nautilus is bad, if he can keep pretty much all his mana to spam E and peel, it's not as bad.
It also means you free the jungle spot for a stronger frontliner (Naut is really weak at it until he gets items now, in the midgame his shield is still level 1 so the %HP ratio is low), or a "true" initiator (Naut's ult doesn't have the range for this in the standard situation), so you can focus on protecting people and your lack of tankiness and mobility is less of an issue.

But I liked him in the jungle so yeah it sucks.
And Sejuani's just busted atm so she's not nearly as satisfying to do well with (also permabanned). She's weaker at peeling, though she's actually tanky and her ult is really good initiation.
Not sure what to play, people go too tanky atm that Vi would be a fine choice (and they never QoL'd her bugs), no idea how J4 fares after his nerfs and the meta shifts (I assume he does alright with Cinderhulk but full tank J4 isn't as tanky as "real" tanks, and also doess less damage than most of them).
I know Maokai is jungle-able, picked him a couple times on my smurf (it's him, Shaco or Nunu so... ) but clearly not at the others' level and the short range on W is tricky. I don't think I'd manage to have the necessary impact as Malphite either. I like Udyr but with the current state of the game he probably gets outscaled way too hard by the popular champions once the 2nd item is reached.
I own Rek'Sai but didn't find her fun in the coops I tried her on. She's banned most of the time, and I'd need to train a bunch first, it seems like apart from E->W being really strong for ganks her usefulness depends on being played a certain way that I don't quite grasp yet.

I saw a Shyvana do well, but the kind of "well" that gets summed up by "we have Jayce top, or (bad) last pick chooses Zed when they have Shyvana/Yorick to welcome the full physical comp with open arms" and "Nautilus gets invaded, Shyvana gets away with less than 20 HP twice because his auto animation is too bad to complete before she presses W".

Man, my jungle champion pool has been a mess for over a year now. ~_~

RagequitBM

Canada2270 Posts

March 28 2015 20:52 GMT

#287

Personally Naut is my least favorite support to play against. It feels like he just 1v2s me and my support 24/7. Not sure what a good pick against him would be

Alaric

France45622 Posts

March 28 2015 21:01 GMT

#288

He's not any worse than Thresh or Blitzcrank in lane in terms of damage. He needs longer trades so he can use E multiple times (and he runs oom fast if you've got sustain and can avoid making every trade an all-in), and he's less tanky than them (Blitz's passive, Thresh's W+good stats when he gets souls), you can poke him, shove him, etc.

The "worst" part, aside from him having a hook (and the gank assist that comes with it) is his passive, since it's like a point'n'click root follow-up (kinda like Blitz's E).
It's also very easy to dodge his Q with minions because the hitbox is wider (at the end and pretty flat) than theirs, so it can't fit in between 2 minions at all, and between his base MS and big model he can't waddle through a minion wave at all either, he'll just get stuck over and over.

Do people max E or Q on support Naut btw? Q's base damage doesn't justify it compared to maxing E for the damage+slow imo, but I can get how a lower cd seems critical.

NeoIllusions

United States37500 Posts

March 28 2015 21:03 GMT

#289

On March 29 2015 05:52 RagequitBM wrote:
Personally Naut is my least favorite support to play against. It feels like he just 1v2s me and my support 24/7. Not sure what a good pick against him would be

Morg.

TheHumanSensation

Canada1210 Posts

March 28 2015 21:12 GMT

#290

On March 29 2015 04:57 Ansibled wrote:
You should play Jungle Shen. It's fun.

Could you share your route and such? I imagine you back for cinderhulk asap, but maybe you do an early gank or invade or something weird. It's far too slow to work from my experience but I could always be missing something.

On March 29 2015 06:03 NeoIllusions wrote:

Show nested quote +

Morg.

That's really mean.

Also back in bronze I used to like Naut as a "counterpick" to Blitz because Blitz players didn't know how to deal with getting hooked, and Naut could always just walk or Q out of being grabbed (also junglers were basically as poor as supports back then so it didn't change my itemization too much). I don't think this actually makes sense, but it was always fun.

Goumindong

United States3529 Posts

March 28 2015 21:42 GMT

#291

Zyra. You can body block his a with a plant(ideally you have a plant between him and you and e along his q path when you see it). You can harass strong through creeps.

Slusher

United States19143 Posts

March 28 2015 21:58 GMT

#292

Elementz confirmed for timelord?

Ansibled

United Kingdom9872 Posts

March 28 2015 21:59 GMT

#293

Leblanc support is my favourite support.

cLutZ

United States19574 Posts

March 28 2015 22:33 GMT

#294

On March 29 2015 06:58 Slusher wrote:
Elementz confirmed for timelord?

Time lord genja will rule one again when s7 is manamune zephyr varus is meta.

Alaric

France45622 Posts

March 28 2015 23:01 GMT

#295

Urgh. Playing Lissandra, her ult kept cancelling when I tried to cast it at max range, the way Ryze does with Rune Prison. Hadn't had that happen to me before, it's so infuriating with her base MS. x_x

Not directly related, but I was playing against Darius, and I kept barely whiffing my Q against him then he'd just Apprehend and catch me. The wiki says I have an almost 200 range advantage on him for these spells, is it me screwing up on the kiting or is it normal that I seemed unable to Q him without automatically being in pull range (Liss' W has less range so point considering that one)?

I thought Liss would have the advantage if I can harass him enough in the early levels, but it just pushes for free, with his base stats I take more damage than him if I try to auto harass him (also if we end up under tower it's too dangerous risking a pull), and I didn't seem to do enough damage to ever threaten him (esp. considering one blade-Q is nearly 2 of mine damage-wise). Bad match-up for her, or I really need to work on my levels 1-4 harass against melee champs?

ShaLLoW[baY]

Canada12499 Posts

March 29 2015 00:07 GMT

#296

So why is everyone playing Vladimir mid now?

sob3k

United States7572 Posts

March 29 2015 00:37 GMT

#297

I still don't really understand what nautilus's advantage is over Leona. I was a huge Naut fan and tried him support ages ago and he just felt like a squishier and less reliable leona with way longer CD's. Not that he's bad, he just didn't offer anything over leona.

FinestHour

United States18466 Posts

March 29 2015 00:39 GMT

#298

why woudl u not play #1 pun dude

Slayer91

Ireland23460 Posts

March 29 2015 00:52 GMT

#299

nauts hook is something leona can't do at all also his engage is point and click
nauts hook is the same as leona e if not worse for 1v1ing but in terms of helping your team out the hook is big