US Politics Mega-thread - Page 4383

On September 11 2024 11:11 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:

Harris vs. Trump Debate 9-10-24

Issue #1: Economy – Are we better off now than 4 years ago?
Harris: Talks about her plans to improve our economy (mentions child tax credit, opportunity economy, tax deduction for small businesses) and contrasts that with Trump’s “plan” which includes a higher sales tax that will hurt American families while cutting taxes on billionaires.
Trump: Says he does not want a higher sales tax, says he wants to push tariffs as president, says that everything is more expensive today than they used to be, that illegals are stealing jobs and destroying our towns, and that he created the best economy.
Harris: Says that Trump actually left us the worst unemployment and public health crisis in a century, mentions Project 2025, and says she’ll be a president for all Americans.
Trump: Says that he has nothing to do with Project 2025, that he had the greatest economy, that he had the best stock market, and that he did a great job with handling the covid pandemic.
Harris: Repeats that Trump has no plan, repeats her “opportunity economy” plan, points out that economists and Nobel laureates agree that her plan would be good for America and that Trump’s ideas would be bad for America.
Trump: Repeats that he has a great plan for America and claims that Harris is stealing Biden’s plan.

Follow-up Economy Question – Tariffs are detrimental, Trump, what say you?
Trump: Tariffs are great, and they must be great if Biden and Harris didn’t remove all of them. People can’t buy bacon and eggs because the economy is destroyed. Polls say the Trump economy was great and that the Biden economy is terrible.
Harris: Trump had a trade deficit and lost the competition to China when it came to buying and selling and trading goods and technology (specifically mentioned microchips). Trump doesn’t care about workers’ rights, and cares more about cozying up to Chinese president Xi.
Trump: We don’t do microchips anymore. I’m going to send her a MAGA hat. She’s a Marxist. Illegals are flooding our country. [My note: this is the first time either candidate has completely gone off topic.]

Issue #2: Abortion – Trump, why do you keep changing your position on abortion bans?
Trump: Doctors are willing to “execute a baby after birth” and “after the 9th month”. Brags about ending Roe v. Wade when no one else could, and states that there should be exceptions for rape, incest, and health of the mother. Says abortion should be left up to the states, regardless of what the state decides (including a “no exception” abortion ban).
Moderator: There is actually no state in America where it is legal to abort/kill a baby after it’s born [My note: Hey! A fact check on Trump!]
Harris: Yep, Trump is lying, as expected. “The government, and Donald Trump, certainly have no right to tell women what to do with their body.” She also brings up that pregnant women are dying because of a lack of this medical care, and that doctors are forced to sit idly by while their patients are hurt. Says she would sign/enshrine abortion rights into law, while Trump would sign/enshrine a nationwide abortion ban.
Trump: Says he wouldn’t sign/enshrine a nationwide abortion ban and that he’s not in favor of it.
Moderator: Would you veto a nationwide abortion ban?
Trump: I wouldn’t need to, because it wouldn’t ever happen. Trump then criticizes Biden’s clearing of student loans, and says that Biden spends all his time on the beach.
Moderator: [repeats the question] Would you veto a nationwide abortion ban? Your runningmate, JD Vance, said you would.
Trump: I haven’t talked to JD Vance about this.
Moderator: [to Harris] Would you support any restrictions to abortion?
Harris: We need to be focused on how American families are suffering due to a lack of healthcare, including medical care regarding pregnancy and fertility, so let’s start with making sure these are available again.
Trump: “I have been a leader in IVF.” Then he asks Harris if she would allow abortion in the last trimester. Harris dismisses the question (although she should have pointed out how less than 1% of abortions are in the third trimester, and almost always due to pregnancy complications where the fetus isn’t viable and the mother’s health is at risk, so the very question is a red herring to the broader issue of abortion).

Issue #3: Immigration – Harris, why did you and Biden take so long to act?
Harris: Says that she cares deeply about families and that she and Biden wanted to pass bipartisan legislation but Trump killed the bill by telling Congressional Republicans to vote against their own bill (which is true). Says that Trump will ramble about windmills causing cancer and that he cares more about the fact that people get bored at his rallies than anything else.
Moderator: [to Trump] Why did you kill the border bill?
Trump: “People don’t leave my rallies!” “Illegals are eating people’s dogs and cats and pets” [LOL.]
Moderator: There is no evidence that illegal immigrants are eating people’s dogs and pets.
Trump: Doubled down on that nonsense. Harris laughed pretty hard.
Harris: I have the endorsement of hundreds of Republicans who also agree with me and my vision and disagree with Trump and his vision. Harris name drops specific Republicans who worked with Trump and quotes them as calling Trump unfit.
Trump: I fired those people, so of course they’re going to hate me. Biden should have fired the people who messed up the Afghanistan situation and whoever created the inflation. I got the most votes in presidential elections.

Follow-up Immigration Question – Trump, how would you deport 11 million illegal immigrants?
Trump: Biden and Harris allowed criminals and drug dealers into our country. Biden and Harris destroyed the fabric of our country. Crime is through the roof and higher than ever here.
Moderator: The FBI confirms that crime is actually down in this country.
Harris: That’s rich, coming from someone who’s been prosecuted for national security crimes, economic crimes, election interference, has been found liable for sexual assault, and his next big court appearance is in November at his own sentencing. Where is the respect for law enforcement and the rule of law when it applies to him? Anyway, we need to move forward on our housing shortage, small businesses, and bringing down the price of groceries.
Trump: All of the cases against me are the Democrats weaponizing the Justice Department.
Harris: The Supreme Court just ruled that Trump would have presidential immunity from some of his crimes, and could commit many more if he’s allowed back in the White House, so who’s actually being weaponized here?

Issue #4: Policy Consistency – Harris, why have you changed positions on things like fracking?
Harris: My values have not changed even if my positions have. She then lists her general values and lists the work she’s accomplished both before and during her political career. She ends it with pointing out that one of her values is lifting people up, and not beating people down.
Trump: She’s against fracking and she supports Defund The Police. Harris shakes her head and says that’s not true; Trump says “I’m talking now” to Harris. “Now she wants to do transgender operations on illegal aliens that are in prison.” [What?] Trump then rambled about types of energy and prices of energy, incoherently.

Issue #5: Peaceful Transfer Of Power – Trump, is there anything you regret about how you handled January 6th?
Trump: I said people should be peaceful and patriotic. The cop who killed Ashli Babbitt was out of control. What about all the illegal immigrants? She’s the border czar. What about that?
Moderator: You were the president. Again, is there anything you regret about what you did, on that day?
Trump: I had nothing to do with that. All I did was show up and give a speech. It’s Nancy Pelosi’s fault.
Moderator: The question was about you, not Nancy Pelosi. Harris, care to respond?
Harris: I was at the capitol on January 6th, and Trump incited a violent mob, where hundreds of law enforcement officers were injured, and people were killed. Trump was rightfully impeached over this. We need to turn the page and end this kind of chaos. Let’s not go back.
Trump: They keep bringing up Charlottesville and Project 2025, but what about the border crisis? Wake up Joe Biden and make him close the border.

Issue #6: Telling The Truth – Trump, after you lost the 2020 election, you repeatedly insisted you won; are you now willing to acknowledge that you lost the election?
Trump: I didn’t lose. I never lost. There’s so much proof that I won. I got the most votes. I can’t be beaten. The election was fraudulent. We need walls and good elections. These illegals are going to vote against me.
Moderator: Dozens of your lawsuits and cases were thrown out in the courts, due to a lack of evidence of election fraud.
Trump: That was a technicality. I’ll show you Georgia and Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. The problem that we have right now is a nation in decline.
Moderator: Harris, it’s clear that Trump still believes that he won the election that he lost. He says he'll prosecute people who stood against him. Do you think Trump is trying to intimidate people to help him suppress the vote and rig the 2024 election?
Harris: Trump was fired by 81 million people, and he’s clearly having a difficult time processing that. We can’t allow Trump to upend a free and fair election. (she turns to face Trump) World leaders are laughing at you. Military leaders who worked with you think you’re a disgrace. You don’t have the temperament and you lack the ability to not be confused about facts. The American people deserve better.
Trump: Viktor Orban says the world needs me because China and North Korea and Russia are afraid of me. I’m the most feared, most respected person. Biden is weak and pathetic. Biden hates Harris.

Issue #7: Israel-Palestine – Harris, how would you break through the stalemate?
Harris: Israel has a right to defend itself *and* too many Palestinians are being slaughtered. We need a ceasefire and a two-state solution where there’s security for both sides. We need to rebuild Gaza and make sure both Gaza and Israel are safe.
Moderator: Trump?
Trump: If I were president, this would have never happened. Harris hates Israel. Israel is in danger because of Harris. Iran had no money or resources but now they do.
Moderator: Harris, do you hate Israel?
Harris: Of course not. He’s just trying to divide us again. It is well known that Trump is weak and wrong on national security and foreign policy. He admires dictators and wants to be a dictator on day one – his own words. Autocrats are rooting for him to become president again because they can manipulate him with flattery and favors.
Trump: No, she’s the weak one. That’s why we have so much immigration. Why does Biden go in and kill the Keystone Pipeline and help the Russians? Biden gets paid a lot of money.

[Commercial #1]

On September 11 2024 11:50 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:


Issue #8: War In Ukraine – Trump, do you want Ukraine to win this war?
Trump: I want the war to stop. Europe needs to do more to help stop the war, and Harris and Biden are weak on getting allies to help out. Nobody respects Biden. I’ll end the war even before I become president. Where is our president? We have a president that doesn’t know he’s alive.
Moderator: Trump, do you believe it’s in the United States’s best interest for Ukraine to win this war?
Trump: We need to get this war done.
Moderator: Harris, how would you deal with Putin?
Harris: First, it’s important to remind Trump that he’s running against me, not Joe Biden. Second, the reason why Trump says he’d be able to end the war is because Trump would just give up and let Russia win. Third, I’ve met with Zelenskyy and shared American intelligence to help Ukraine against Russia. Fourth, I went to NATO’s eastern flank and we brought 50 countries together to aid Ukraine against Russia, which is why Ukraine is standing up to Russia so well.
Trump: Putin has nuclear weapons and maybe he’ll use them. Nobody likes to talk about them. Putin is attacking Ukraine because Harris is weak and stupid and a bad negotiator. She’s worse than Biden. She is a horrible negotiator.
Moderator: Harris, have you met Putin?
Harris: When I met with Zelenskyy, I met with him five times. We need to stand up for our principles and not sell them for the benefit of personal flattery.
Trump: The head of NATO said I did the most amazing thing ever, making all the other countries to pay up.

Issue #9: Afghanistan – Harris, do you believe you bear any responsibility for the way that withdrawal played out?
Harris: Well, I agree with Biden’s decision to withdraw. Biden got it done when previous presidents couldn’t. Our endless war there is finally over. There is not one member of the US military in combat zones around the world. Trump doesn’t understand the role and respect of the presidency, especially when it comes to how much he gave in to the Taliban.
Trump: I negotiated with the Taliban and if I had done the Afghanistan withdrawal, I would have done it better. And the botched Afghanistan withdrawal is the reason why Putin invaded Ukraine.

Issue #10: Race – Trump, why do you believe it’s appropriate to weigh in on the racial identity of your opponent?
Trump: I don’t, and I don’t care. I couldn’t care less.
Harris: I think it’s a tragedy that we have someone who wants to be president, who has consistently attempted to use race to divide the American people. We have so much more in common than what separates us. We shouldn’t be divided like this. This has been going on for years with Trump, where he wouldn’t rent property to black families, where he called for the execution of innocent Black and Latino boys (The Central Park Five), and where he spread birther lies about Obama. We need to be compassionate and neighborly, regardless of the color of our skin or the language we speak.
Trump: This is the most divisive presidency ever. I built the greatest economy ever. She is Biden. Worst inflation ever.
Harris: Clearly, I am not Joe Biden, nor am I Donald Trump. I offer a new generation of leadership for our country, one of optimism instead of disparaging the American people. I want to compare my presidential plans to Trump’s presidential plans.
Trump: She wants to defund the police and confiscate people’s guns.

Issue #11: Obamacare – Trump, you kept trying and failing to repeal Obamacare, so are you keeping it and/or what is your healthcare plan?
Trump: Obamacare is terrible, but I saved it.
Moderator: So you don’t have a healthcare plan?
Trump: I have concepts of a plan. You’ll hear about them in the not-too-distant future.
Moderator: Harris, what’ your plan?
Harris: First, Tim Walz and I are both gun owners, so Trump needs to stop with the lying about us wanting to take away people’s guns. In regards to the Affordable Care Act, Trump tried and failed 60 times to remove the ACA, so we can’t trust Trump to keep it if he becomes president again. John McCain and others helped to foil Trump’s attempts. We can’t go back to before the ACA, and we’ve been strengthening the ACA. As an example, we’ve been negotiating and capping medical costs.
Trump: McCain fought Obamacare. Harris wants everyone to be on government insurance.

Issue #12: Climate Change – What would each of you do to fight climate change?
Harris: Trump called climate change a hoax. Anyway, we’ve invested a trillion dollars in a clean energy economy, created jobs when Trump lost jobs, and investing in manufacturing.
Trump: They’re actually losing jobs and giving everything to China. We need more of my tariffs. China paid Biden and Ukraine paid Biden millions of dollars. This is a crooked administration.

[Commercial #2]

On September 11 2024 12:22 Introvert wrote:
Didn't hear the end, but it seems like no one will learn anything new and the moderators were terrible. Trump was angry and takes every piece of bait, while Kamala dodges her record and tries to cover it up by promising to give people money. They both failed.

Trump's a known quantity, but seems to me the way Kamala has campaigned I think she had more to prove, but spent most of her time dodging or repeating resist lib fantasies like dooming about project 2025. Both lived down to my expectations. But like Clinton v Trump, they'll say she ran away with it. But it didn't matter. Everyone will say their person did their job.