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President Obama Re-Elected - Page 1430

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Hey guys! We'll be closing this thread shortly, but we will make an American politics megathread where we can continue the discussions in here.

The new thread can be found here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=383301
DoubleReed
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4130 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 17:39:51
November 10 2012 17:38 GMT
#28581
On November 11 2012 02:36 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:31 DoubleReed wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:23 SayGen wrote:
It's really upsetting to see how people sell themselves short, I was really hoping America would start climbing back on the educational ladder to success. Now I fear only our private schools will offer any shelter.
Under Obama Americans have scored lower than any time since Bush Senior. Our high schools are nothing but daycares, too many 'graduate' without having the basic skills of reading and writing. If you want to make something of yourself you are all but forced into college- which costs thousands of dollars. Less money in our classrooms are spent on learning instead we will just hire more unqualified teachers who can't even obtain a 4 year degree.

American truly is under decline.

Average homeowner makes more than ~2000$ less under an Obama Admin and soon that 2000 is going to be ~2200 soon as Obamacare takes effect.

I won't go as far as saying Obama is ruining our country, we were already headed down before he took office--but Obama sure does like speeding the process us.

In a world where knowledge is power, America is fucked.

Shame Ron Paul didn't win.


You know, I wonder why you blame Obama and not Bush Junior. Do you really think No Child Left Behind was a good thing?


I do blame him, and yet Obama did nothing to correct no child left behind. He had 4 years to do something about it and nothing got done. Also according to his website he has no plans for it in the future.


What do you mean? Obama basically got rid of No Child Left Behind (He gave out exceptions to like 50% of states or something). He basically scrapped it because it was terrible.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/06/education/no-child-left-behind-whittled-down-under-obama.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

What exactly would you like to see happen in terms of Education at the Federal Level? What are you looking for?
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24799 Posts
November 10 2012 17:39 GMT
#28582
On November 11 2012 02:36 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:31 DoubleReed wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:23 SayGen wrote:
It's really upsetting to see how people sell themselves short, I was really hoping America would start climbing back on the educational ladder to success. Now I fear only our private schools will offer any shelter.
Under Obama Americans have scored lower than any time since Bush Senior. Our high schools are nothing but daycares, too many 'graduate' without having the basic skills of reading and writing. If you want to make something of yourself you are all but forced into college- which costs thousands of dollars. Less money in our classrooms are spent on learning instead we will just hire more unqualified teachers who can't even obtain a 4 year degree.

American truly is under decline.

Average homeowner makes more than ~2000$ less under an Obama Admin and soon that 2000 is going to be ~2200 soon as Obamacare takes effect.

I won't go as far as saying Obama is ruining our country, we were already headed down before he took office--but Obama sure does like speeding the process us.

In a world where knowledge is power, America is fucked.

Shame Ron Paul didn't win.


You know, I wonder why you blame Obama and not Bush Junior. Do you really think No Child Left Behind was a good thing?

I do blame him, and yet Obama did nothing to correct no child left behind. He had 4 years to do something about it and nothing got done. Also according to his website he has no plans for it in the future.

I think it can be argued that education was Obama's biggest failure of the first term. He failed to learn from the mistakes of the previous administration. His appointment of education secretary Arne Duncan was also an embarrasment in my opinion.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Sanctimonius
Profile Joined October 2010
United Kingdom861 Posts
November 10 2012 17:41 GMT
#28583
On November 11 2012 02:23 SayGen wrote:
It's really upsetting to see how people sell themselves short, I was really hoping America would start climbing back on the educational ladder to success. Now I fear only our private schools will offer any shelter.
Under Obama Americans have scored lower than any time since Bush Senior. Our high schools are nothing but daycares, too many 'graduate' without having the basic skills of reading and writing. If you want to make something of yourself you are all but forced into college- which costs thousands of dollars. Less money in our classrooms are spent on learning instead we will just hire more unqualified teachers who can't even obtain a 4 year degree.

American truly is under decline.

Average homeowner makes more than ~2000$ less under an Obama Admin and soon that 2000 is going to be ~2200 soon as Obamacare takes effect.

I won't go as far as saying Obama is ruining our country, we were already headed down before he took office--but Obama sure does like speeding the process us.

In a world where knowledge is power, America is fucked.

Shame Ron Paul didn't win.


I agree about the schools, but it seems to me that the blame entirely lies with NCLB and those that decided to enforce it - teachers are entirely judged on test scores and nothing else, funding is pulled from struggling schools (because that makes sense...) and teachers can find themselves having to teach from a script - finding themselves in the wonderful position of simultaneously being blamed for failing in the classroom while having no control over what is taught and how.

I have a teacher friend in Cali who has kids in her class who cannot read or write, and in some cases English is a second language barely understood. Yet, as a 4th grade teacher she has to teach 4th grade English in class, regardless of whether these kids have the ability of third-, second- or even first-grade. Then she is judged for their failures.

NCLB has some good points, but the bad points far outweigh them and is holding back a generation of kids in this country. Just wait until they enter the work force.
You live the life you choose.
SayGen
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1209 Posts
November 10 2012 17:42 GMT
#28584
On November 11 2012 02:32 mememolly wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:29 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:26 mememolly wrote:
Obama won the nobel, he is the hope for the world, so glad he is back in power


What did he win the nobel for? What accomplishment did he achieve?
Nobel prizes used to mean something, now they are bought and paid for. Shame.


he won it for peace, he's provided hope for everybody, he managed to get the country back on its feet after the financial crisis and has kept us safe from terrorists for the last 4 years, he deserves a second term


Peace.......and yet Iran is closer than ever to a Nuclear missile which will very likely break the shallow regional stalemate in the ME.

hope...America has 4X the debt than just 4 years ago.... what hope are you talking about?
Country back on our feet? 7.8% unemployment is a good thing? Are you serious?
what hope.....I've already pulled all my money out of the market--glad I did cause the Dow went down nearly 300 points day after the election.. The worst is yet to come. Obama is more interested in helping his friends than the country. He isn't the president of the world- he is president of America--and perhaps he should be focusing on helping us by lower taxes, removing harmful regulations, giving small businesses incentives. Yet none of these things are on his to do list. Instead despite the fact I'm in the lowest bracket in America my taxes have gone up. Which means less money is being spent in my local town which hurts the economy.
Please tell me about this hope.... I don't see it. I see dark clouds a'comming.

Safe from terrorist in the last 4 years..... of course there hasn't been an attack- Bush (not that I have any love for that moron) put in place some hardcore security infustricture that is acting as a serious deterrent.


User was warned for this post
We Live to Die
sam!zdat
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5559 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 17:45:59
November 10 2012 17:44 GMT
#28585
what education needs is more 1-on-1 interaction between teacher and student. Teachers at this level should not lecture - we should use all this new video education stuff for that part. No more of this writing things on the blackboard, etc - we can harness economy of scale with media on this front, and students will get higher quality lectures anyway.

edit: also you can create lots of jobs by decreasing student-teacher ratio
shikata ga nai
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
November 10 2012 17:46 GMT
#28586
tutoring for especially underprivileged kids is just hugely important, but the schools that need to provide this are precisely the most underfunded.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
radiatoren
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Denmark1907 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 17:50:02
November 10 2012 17:47 GMT
#28587
On November 11 2012 02:23 SayGen wrote:
It's really upsetting to see how people sell themselves short, I was really hoping America would start climbing back on the educational ladder to success. Now I fear only our private schools will offer any shelter.
Under Obama Americans have scored lower than any time since Bush Senior. Our high schools are nothing but daycares, too many 'graduate' without having the basic skills of reading and writing. If you want to make something of yourself you are all but forced into college- which costs thousands of dollars. Less money in our classrooms are spent on learning instead we will just hire more unqualified teachers who can't even obtain a 4 year degree.

American truly is under decline.

Average homeowner makes more than ~2000$ less under an Obama Admin and soon that 2000 is going to be ~2200 soon as Obamacare takes effect.

I won't go as far as saying Obama is ruining our country, we were already headed down before he took office--but Obama sure does like speeding the process us.

In a world where knowledge is power, America is fucked.

Shame Ron Paul didn't win.

To be honest, the lack of an overall strategy in USA and letting it be a specific problem with a specific school and keeping private pay on higher education, combined with very hefty investments in europe and common wealth in particular is a good part of why USA is falling from grace in international tests.

As for wages... It is nothing even close to relevant to education unless you correct the numbers for unemployment and general economy in the country. That people get a lower wage is something most conservatives would clap their hands in joy about, since it is assuring the possibility of more low paying jobs and it is a sign that having no minimum wages is working out fine!
Repeat before me
sam!zdat
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States5559 Posts
November 10 2012 17:47 GMT
#28588
On November 11 2012 02:46 oneofthem wrote:
tutoring for especially underprivileged kids is just hugely important, but the schools that need to provide this are precisely the most underfunded.


yes, that's why I've maintained that education is going to need both more money and drastic structural reform
shikata ga nai
DoubleReed
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4130 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 17:48:53
November 10 2012 17:47 GMT
#28589
On November 11 2012 02:42 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:32 mememolly wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:29 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:26 mememolly wrote:
Obama won the nobel, he is the hope for the world, so glad he is back in power


What did he win the nobel for? What accomplishment did he achieve?
Nobel prizes used to mean something, now they are bought and paid for. Shame.


he won it for peace, he's provided hope for everybody, he managed to get the country back on its feet after the financial crisis and has kept us safe from terrorists for the last 4 years, he deserves a second term


Peace.......and yet Iran is closer than ever to a Nuclear missile which will very likely break the shallow regional stalemate in the ME.

hope...America has 4X the debt than just 4 years ago.... what hope are you talking about?
Country back on our feet? 7.8% unemployment is a good thing? Are you serious?
what hope.....I've already pulled all my money out of the market--glad I did cause the Dow went down nearly 300 points day after the election.. The worst is yet to come. Obama is more interested in helping his friends than the country. He isn't the president of the world- he is president of America--and perhaps he should be focusing on helping us by lower taxes, removing harmful regulations, giving small businesses incentives. Yet none of these things are on his to do list. Instead despite the fact I'm in the lowest bracket in America my taxes have gone up. Which means less money is being spent in my local town which hurts the economy.
Please tell me about this hope.... I don't see it. I see dark clouds a'comming.

Safe from terrorist in the last 4 years..... of course there hasn't been an attack- Bush (not that I have any love for that moron) put in place some hardcore security infustricture that is acting as a serious deterrent.


America has 4x the debt just 4 years ago? 10 trillion -> 16 trillion = 4X???

Which, by the way, was almost entirely Bush's fault, considering it was under his watch that we had a financial crisis and somehow he was running up a deficit during economically good times. Financial crises are different from normal recessions in that one of the issues is that they bring about long periods of unemployment. So how exactly do you fault Obama with this?

I'm serious. The massive financial situation occurred because of terrible neocon policy, which Romney wanted us to go back to. Obama is actually righting the economy somewhat, and you wanted to go back to those terrible policies that screwed us over in the first place?
SayGen
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1209 Posts
November 10 2012 17:49 GMT
#28590
On November 11 2012 02:41 Sanctimonius wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:23 SayGen wrote:
It's really upsetting to see how people sell themselves short, I was really hoping America would start climbing back on the educational ladder to success. Now I fear only our private schools will offer any shelter.
Under Obama Americans have scored lower than any time since Bush Senior. Our high schools are nothing but daycares, too many 'graduate' without having the basic skills of reading and writing. If you want to make something of yourself you are all but forced into college- which costs thousands of dollars. Less money in our classrooms are spent on learning instead we will just hire more unqualified teachers who can't even obtain a 4 year degree.

American truly is under decline.

Average homeowner makes more than ~2000$ less under an Obama Admin and soon that 2000 is going to be ~2200 soon as Obamacare takes effect.

I won't go as far as saying Obama is ruining our country, we were already headed down before he took office--but Obama sure does like speeding the process us.

In a world where knowledge is power, America is fucked.

Shame Ron Paul didn't win.


I agree about the schools, but it seems to me that the blame entirely lies with NCLB and those that decided to enforce it - teachers are entirely judged on test scores and nothing else, funding is pulled from struggling schools (because that makes sense...) and teachers can find themselves having to teach from a script - finding themselves in the wonderful position of simultaneously being blamed for failing in the classroom while having no control over what is taught and how.

I have a teacher friend in Cali who has kids in her class who cannot read or write, and in some cases English is a second language barely understood. Yet, as a 4th grade teacher she has to teach 4th grade English in class, regardless of whether these kids have the ability of third-, second- or even first-grade. Then she is judged for their failures.

NCLB has some good points, but the bad points far outweigh them and is holding back a generation of kids in this country. Just wait until they enter the work force.


NCLB is one part of a bigger issue, which is to accept that kids are less intelgent.
fact is, we have lower IQ kids cause poor/minorities tend to have more kids.
Those poor/minorities (no hate to them because of race or class-- just calling a flower a flower)
Until we can stop giving tax cuts for having more children, people will see bringing another child into this world as a financial move. We need to also introduce a merrit based school plan.

What I would propose. Take all the money that goes to schools right now (including the teachers union fund) and take 90% of it and give it out EVENLY to all schools located in the US. which ever schools do the best gets a bonus from the remaining 10%. This way you offer an incentive to do well, while not harming schools that do poorly. Break the teachers union. Demand all teachers have a4 year degree from an accrediated school. Stop hiring excess teachers, no reason to have more than 1 teacher per 20 students.

User was temp banned for this post.
We Live to Die
SayGen
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1209 Posts
November 10 2012 17:51 GMT
#28591
On November 11 2012 02:47 DoubleReed wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:42 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:32 mememolly wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:29 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:26 mememolly wrote:
Obama won the nobel, he is the hope for the world, so glad he is back in power


What did he win the nobel for? What accomplishment did he achieve?
Nobel prizes used to mean something, now they are bought and paid for. Shame.


he won it for peace, he's provided hope for everybody, he managed to get the country back on its feet after the financial crisis and has kept us safe from terrorists for the last 4 years, he deserves a second term


Peace.......and yet Iran is closer than ever to a Nuclear missile which will very likely break the shallow regional stalemate in the ME.

hope...America has 4X the debt than just 4 years ago.... what hope are you talking about?
Country back on our feet? 7.8% unemployment is a good thing? Are you serious?
what hope.....I've already pulled all my money out of the market--glad I did cause the Dow went down nearly 300 points day after the election.. The worst is yet to come. Obama is more interested in helping his friends than the country. He isn't the president of the world- he is president of America--and perhaps he should be focusing on helping us by lower taxes, removing harmful regulations, giving small businesses incentives. Yet none of these things are on his to do list. Instead despite the fact I'm in the lowest bracket in America my taxes have gone up. Which means less money is being spent in my local town which hurts the economy.
Please tell me about this hope.... I don't see it. I see dark clouds a'comming.

Safe from terrorist in the last 4 years..... of course there hasn't been an attack- Bush (not that I have any love for that moron) put in place some hardcore security infustricture that is acting as a serious deterrent.


America has 4x the debt just 4 years ago? 10 trillion -> 16 trillion = 4X???

Which, by the way, was almost entirely Bush's fault, considering it was under his watch that we had a financial crisis and somehow he was running up a deficit during economically good times. Financial crises are different from normal recessions in that one of the issues is that they bring about long periods of unemployment. So how exactly do you fault Obama with this?

I'm serious. The massive financial situation occurred because of terrible neocon policy, which Romney wanted us to go back to. Obama is actually righting the economy somewhat, and you wanted to go back to those terrible policies that screwed us over in the first place?


Where in my post did I ever endorse mitt?
Please don't put words into my mouth--thanks.

When you are capable of having a fair/honest discussion, I'll be happy to entertain your ideas/points.
We Live to Die
DoubleReed
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States4130 Posts
November 10 2012 17:53 GMT
#28592
On November 11 2012 02:51 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:47 DoubleReed wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:42 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:32 mememolly wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:29 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:26 mememolly wrote:
Obama won the nobel, he is the hope for the world, so glad he is back in power


What did he win the nobel for? What accomplishment did he achieve?
Nobel prizes used to mean something, now they are bought and paid for. Shame.


he won it for peace, he's provided hope for everybody, he managed to get the country back on its feet after the financial crisis and has kept us safe from terrorists for the last 4 years, he deserves a second term


Peace.......and yet Iran is closer than ever to a Nuclear missile which will very likely break the shallow regional stalemate in the ME.

hope...America has 4X the debt than just 4 years ago.... what hope are you talking about?
Country back on our feet? 7.8% unemployment is a good thing? Are you serious?
what hope.....I've already pulled all my money out of the market--glad I did cause the Dow went down nearly 300 points day after the election.. The worst is yet to come. Obama is more interested in helping his friends than the country. He isn't the president of the world- he is president of America--and perhaps he should be focusing on helping us by lower taxes, removing harmful regulations, giving small businesses incentives. Yet none of these things are on his to do list. Instead despite the fact I'm in the lowest bracket in America my taxes have gone up. Which means less money is being spent in my local town which hurts the economy.
Please tell me about this hope.... I don't see it. I see dark clouds a'comming.

Safe from terrorist in the last 4 years..... of course there hasn't been an attack- Bush (not that I have any love for that moron) put in place some hardcore security infustricture that is acting as a serious deterrent.


America has 4x the debt just 4 years ago? 10 trillion -> 16 trillion = 4X???

Which, by the way, was almost entirely Bush's fault, considering it was under his watch that we had a financial crisis and somehow he was running up a deficit during economically good times. Financial crises are different from normal recessions in that one of the issues is that they bring about long periods of unemployment. So how exactly do you fault Obama with this?

I'm serious. The massive financial situation occurred because of terrible neocon policy, which Romney wanted us to go back to. Obama is actually righting the economy somewhat, and you wanted to go back to those terrible policies that screwed us over in the first place?


Where in my post did I ever endorse mitt?
Please don't put words into my mouth--thanks.

When you are capable of having a fair/honest discussion, I'll be happy to entertain your ideas/points.


Oh sorry, I thought you were. Nevermind.
SayGen
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1209 Posts
November 10 2012 17:54 GMT
#28593
On November 11 2012 02:47 sam!zdat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:46 oneofthem wrote:
tutoring for especially underprivileged kids is just hugely important, but the schools that need to provide this are precisely the most underfunded.


yes, that's why I've maintained that education is going to need both more money and drastic structural reform


No need to add money to the pot. Take it from the teachers union. Break the union.
Look at charter schools- cost less money, yet have more teachers, better results, higher college/trade school acceptance rates.

We need massive reform, not more money. We need to look at private/charter schools and see how they are running.
The ability to fire bad teachers on demand instead of taking years to remove them. Giving the principal more power and control over his school. Those 2 things would be a great start.
We Live to Die
XoXiDe
Profile Joined September 2006
United States620 Posts
November 10 2012 17:56 GMT
#28594
On November 11 2012 02:42 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:32 mememolly wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:29 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:26 mememolly wrote:
Obama won the nobel, he is the hope for the world, so glad he is back in power


What did he win the nobel for? What accomplishment did he achieve?
Nobel prizes used to mean something, now they are bought and paid for. Shame.


he won it for peace, he's provided hope for everybody, he managed to get the country back on its feet after the financial crisis and has kept us safe from terrorists for the last 4 years, he deserves a second term


Peace.......and yet Iran is closer than ever to a Nuclear missile which will very likely break the shallow regional stalemate in the ME.

hope...America has 4X the debt than just 4 years ago.... what hope are you talking about?
Country back on our feet? 7.8% unemployment is a good thing? Are you serious?
what hope.....I've already pulled all my money out of the market--glad I did cause the Dow went down nearly 300 points day after the election.. The worst is yet to come. Obama is more interested in helping his friends than the country. He isn't the president of the world- he is president of America--and perhaps he should be focusing on helping us by lower taxes, removing harmful regulations, giving small businesses incentives. Yet none of these things are on his to do list. Instead despite the fact I'm in the lowest bracket in America my taxes have gone up. Which means less money is being spent in my local town which hurts the economy.
Please tell me about this hope.... I don't see it. I see dark clouds a'comming.

Safe from terrorist in the last 4 years..... of course there hasn't been an attack- Bush (not that I have any love for that moron) put in place some hardcore security infustricture that is acting as a serious deterrent.


I'm interested to know, where have, or how much have your taxes gone up since 2009?
TEXAN
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 18:07:10
November 10 2012 17:57 GMT
#28595
saygen, you cannot have this lurid dream of dumb minorities having more kids and taking control yet say you are not in some way harboring prejudiced beliefs. this stuff is like a 9 on the scale of racist beliefs.

intelligence has been rising in whites for generations, and that's because of a steady accumulation of social and environmental conditions conducive to childhood learning and education. for those without this resource they will obviously lag behind.
http://www.indiana.edu/~intell/flynneffect.shtml#what

school funding is not only a teacher's union problem. teachers on the whole are underpaid for the work they do. it is an efficiency problem with pay and unions. the more serious funding problem is the draining of resources from the school system because of the abysmal political support for public school funding and the property tax based system for district funding. draining further resources from the system will only leave the most underfunded schools out in the cold.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24799 Posts
November 10 2012 18:00 GMT
#28596
On November 11 2012 02:54 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:47 sam!zdat wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:46 oneofthem wrote:
tutoring for especially underprivileged kids is just hugely important, but the schools that need to provide this are precisely the most underfunded.


yes, that's why I've maintained that education is going to need both more money and drastic structural reform


No need to add money to the pot. Take it from the teachers union. Break the union.
Look at charter schools- cost less money, yet have more teachers, better results, higher college/trade school acceptance rates.

We need massive reform, not more money. We need to look at private/charter schools and see how they are running.
The ability to fire bad teachers on demand instead of taking years to remove them. Giving the principal more power and control over his school. Those 2 things would be a great start.

Unfortunately the evidence, when inspected in an impartial manner, does not suggest that switching to any current educational model (charter, private, whatever) will improve education overall. We do in my opinion need some major education reform, but we haven't found what will work yet. The solution isn't staring us in the face.

"Taking" money from the teachers unions, whatever that means, is not a viable plan by itself. Improving education is rather difficult, and these oversimplified proposed solutions won't solve the real problems that currently exist.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Picklebread
Profile Joined June 2011
808 Posts
November 10 2012 18:02 GMT
#28597
On November 11 2012 02:42 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:32 mememolly wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:29 SayGen wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:26 mememolly wrote:
Obama won the nobel, he is the hope for the world, so glad he is back in power


What did he win the nobel for? What accomplishment did he achieve?
Nobel prizes used to mean something, now they are bought and paid for. Shame.


he won it for peace, he's provided hope for everybody, he managed to get the country back on its feet after the financial crisis and has kept us safe from terrorists for the last 4 years, he deserves a second term


Peace.......and yet Iran is closer than ever to a Nuclear missile which will very likely break the shallow regional stalemate in the ME.

hope...America has 4X the debt than just 4 years ago.... what hope are you talking about?
Country back on our feet? 7.8% unemployment is a good thing? Are you serious?
what hope.....I've already pulled all my money out of the market--glad I did cause the Dow went down nearly 300 points day after the election.. The worst is yet to come. Obama is more interested in helping his friends than the country. He isn't the president of the world- he is president of America--and perhaps he should be focusing on helping us by lower taxes, removing harmful regulations, giving small businesses incentives. Yet none of these things are on his to do list. Instead despite the fact I'm in the lowest bracket in America my taxes have gone up. Which means less money is being spent in my local town which hurts the economy.
Please tell me about this hope.... I don't see it. I see dark clouds a'comming.

Safe from terrorist in the last 4 years..... of course there hasn't been an attack- Bush (not that I have any love for that moron) put in place some hardcore security infustricture that is acting as a serious deterrent.

My understanding (from the various debates) is that the U.S. is on Iran's balls and they KNOW the progress of their nuclear missile, and as soon as they get even halfway to finishing the missile, then Iran is going to be destroyed by nearly every nation. Its unlikely they will even finish a missile because everybody cut off their trade with Iran and Iran is currently being starved out. They are using war as a last resort not as the first resort, which is imo the correct decision. This is just what i picked up from the various debates so CORRECT ME IF IM WRONG please.

Also for the debt, (which i learned from debate and that amazing Clinton speach, again CORRECT ME IF IM WRONG) the U.S. was so F'd by wallstreet that without borrowing money from China a recovery would not be possible. That's what gives the U.S. hope. Also over 10million jobs are projected to be created over the next 4 years.
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 19:14:33
November 10 2012 18:11 GMT
#28598
the u.s. is not exactly banging on china's doors to borrow money. they sell these things called t-bonds, and the lower the yield they can manage to sell, the better. these rates are locked in at the time you sell them too, so it's like free money at least right now. (the holders can resell and that makes it harder to sell new tbonds)

barring a collapse of the real american economy (unlikely and in all likelihood would mean everyone else is hugely fucked too), there will be buyers. the tea party worry of debt collapse is not being reflected in the bond market.

the private household sector is loaded with debt right now, a large portion of which is pushed onto them. some inflation and even debt jubilee is not the worst thign that can happen.

btw, that a lot of companies are sitting on mountains of cash whether in the u.s. or in offshore accounts should tell you that they don't think the dollar is in any danger of falling dead.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
-Cyrus-
Profile Joined June 2011
United States318 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-10 18:13:40
November 10 2012 18:13 GMT
#28599
Why did you put spoilers in the title? I haven't watched the VOD yet.
ZapRoffo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5544 Posts
November 10 2012 18:16 GMT
#28600
On November 11 2012 02:49 SayGen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 11 2012 02:41 Sanctimonius wrote:
On November 11 2012 02:23 SayGen wrote:
It's really upsetting to see how people sell themselves short, I was really hoping America would start climbing back on the educational ladder to success. Now I fear only our private schools will offer any shelter.
Under Obama Americans have scored lower than any time since Bush Senior. Our high schools are nothing but daycares, too many 'graduate' without having the basic skills of reading and writing. If you want to make something of yourself you are all but forced into college- which costs thousands of dollars. Less money in our classrooms are spent on learning instead we will just hire more unqualified teachers who can't even obtain a 4 year degree.

American truly is under decline.

Average homeowner makes more than ~2000$ less under an Obama Admin and soon that 2000 is going to be ~2200 soon as Obamacare takes effect.

I won't go as far as saying Obama is ruining our country, we were already headed down before he took office--but Obama sure does like speeding the process us.

In a world where knowledge is power, America is fucked.

Shame Ron Paul didn't win.


I agree about the schools, but it seems to me that the blame entirely lies with NCLB and those that decided to enforce it - teachers are entirely judged on test scores and nothing else, funding is pulled from struggling schools (because that makes sense...) and teachers can find themselves having to teach from a script - finding themselves in the wonderful position of simultaneously being blamed for failing in the classroom while having no control over what is taught and how.

I have a teacher friend in Cali who has kids in her class who cannot read or write, and in some cases English is a second language barely understood. Yet, as a 4th grade teacher she has to teach 4th grade English in class, regardless of whether these kids have the ability of third-, second- or even first-grade. Then she is judged for their failures.

NCLB has some good points, but the bad points far outweigh them and is holding back a generation of kids in this country. Just wait until they enter the work force.


NCLB is one part of a bigger issue, which is to accept that kids are less intelgent.
fact is, we have lower IQ kids cause poor/minorities tend to have more kids.
Those poor/minorities (no hate to them because of race or class-- just calling a flower a flower)
Until we can stop giving tax cuts for having more children, people will see bringing another child into this world as a financial move. We need to also introduce a merrit based school plan.


Are you serious? Aside from the obvious laughable ironies here, poor families seeing having another child as a positive financial move? The ignorance of thinking that might be the case is astounding.

Also citing IQ and its limited measure of intelligence is the kind of old fashioned thinking that kills education.
Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion man
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