PSU students are giving college protestors a bad name :[
I can't believe there are people who think Paterno should keep his job/not be fired when he fucking covered up the rape of 8 kids and protected a child molester for what? almost 10 years? That's fucking ridiculous.
On November 11 2011 07:02 JinNJuice wrote: [quote]
And if I said I had an eyewitness who saw it happen? And then they charge you with sexual assault based on that eyewitness? And then the eyewitness recants their testimony? I had skipped a few steps but I'll spell it out for you if you want. Paterno had no idea to know if McQuerey's accusations were true or not. He simply had the word of a graduate assistant versus the word of a 30-year old friend. He reported what he was told and let the "investigation" play out. I don't understand how calling child services would've made a lick of difference.
a lick of difference? You don't see how calling in a 3rd party (who's #1 priority is not protecting PSU football) to investigate the claims made against Sandusky would have made a lick of difference? Seriously? Like seriously
I've held my tongue all day.... but this one completely deserves a
GTFO
Kids calm down and read my post on the previous page. School admins had a statutory obligation to report. Failure to report is a misdemeanor under state law. Reporters are given legal immunity from what you guys are yammering on about.
They have an obligation to report to their superiors under the law you linked... As Paterno received only reports from the GA and did not witness the event or receive the statement from the victim it is accepted that he only need pass on said information to his superior.
Nope.
Reporting Procedures
Individual Responsibility Citation: Cons. Stat. Tit. 23 §§ 6311; 6313 A mandated reporter who has reasonable cause to suspect that a child is an abused or neglected child shall make a report to the Department of Public Welfare.
An oral report shall be made immediately, to be followed by a written report within 48 hours.
Written reports shall be made to the appropriate county agency in a manner and on forms the department prescribes by regulation.
Content of Reports Citation: Cons. Stat. Tit. 23 § 6313 The written reports shall include the following information if available: [list][*]The names and addresses of the child and the child's parents or other persons responsible for the care of the child, if known [*]Where the suspected abuse occurred [*]The age and sex of subjects of the report [*]The nature and extent of the suspected abuse, including any evidence of prior abuse to the child or siblings of the child [*]The name and relationship of the person responsible for causing the suspected abuse, if known, and any evidence of prior abuse by that person [*]Family composition [*]The source of the report [*]The name and contact information of the person making the report [*]Any actions taken by the source
You're cute. Now accept the fact that a "distraught" witness who comes and reports the incident after going to sleep, and not going to police, is not considered enough to provide reasonable cause.
Guess you aren't a reasonable person. The legal standard for what determines reasonable cause is pretty low. As a prosecutor, I'd be willing to take your scenario and prosecute for willful neglect of reporting duty.
Still haven't answered how school admins there failed to report to the Department of Public Welfare, either.
You're late to the conversation, so I'll fill you in. I am fully supporting the prosecution of both the Athletic Director and the head of the police force. I am NOT for a mob lynching of Paterno based on pure speculation, and the reports of one man. Especially when that one man has only stood to gain from this whole situation, is the sole witness, and a victim has never been found.
Edit: If what you say is true, then why don't Pennsylvania's prosecutors charge Paterno as well? It looks to me like I am in the right here and you are in the wrong.
Once again, you still have no clue what you're talking about. 'a victim has never been found' lol? They have 6 victims already ready to testify for the prosecution (source espn), and that's considering not all the alleged victims have came forward.
You keep ranting about holding back judgement until the facts are out, but then ignore the ones that are clearly in existence right in front of you. It's probably pointless to even post anything in response to you because you're clearly just too incompetent for this discussion.
Victim #2 has never been found. Reading comprehension is tough.
Once again its you who have reading issues. In your own post, you type and I quote "a victim has never been found'. That implies that no victims have been found.
You're actually so incompetent you don't even know what the fuck you're saying lol.
a lick of difference? You don't see how calling in a 3rd party (who's #1 priority is not protecting PSU football) to investigate the claims made against Sandusky would have made a lick of difference? Seriously? Like seriously
I've held my tongue all day.... but this one completely deserves a
GTFO
Kids calm down and read my post on the previous page. School admins had a statutory obligation to report. Failure to report is a misdemeanor under state law. Reporters are given legal immunity from what you guys are yammering on about.
They have an obligation to report to their superiors under the law you linked... As Paterno received only reports from the GA and did not witness the event or receive the statement from the victim it is accepted that he only need pass on said information to his superior.
Nope.
Reporting Procedures
Individual Responsibility Citation: Cons. Stat. Tit. 23 §§ 6311; 6313 A mandated reporter who has reasonable cause to suspect that a child is an abused or neglected child shall make a report to the Department of Public Welfare.
An oral report shall be made immediately, to be followed by a written report within 48 hours.
Written reports shall be made to the appropriate county agency in a manner and on forms the department prescribes by regulation.
Content of Reports Citation: Cons. Stat. Tit. 23 § 6313 The written reports shall include the following information if available: [list][*]The names and addresses of the child and the child's parents or other persons responsible for the care of the child, if known [*]Where the suspected abuse occurred [*]The age and sex of subjects of the report [*]The nature and extent of the suspected abuse, including any evidence of prior abuse to the child or siblings of the child [*]The name and relationship of the person responsible for causing the suspected abuse, if known, and any evidence of prior abuse by that person [*]Family composition [*]The source of the report [*]The name and contact information of the person making the report [*]Any actions taken by the source
You're cute. Now accept the fact that a "distraught" witness who comes and reports the incident after going to sleep, and not going to police, is not considered enough to provide reasonable cause.
Guess you aren't a reasonable person. The legal standard for what determines reasonable cause is pretty low. As a prosecutor, I'd be willing to take your scenario and prosecute for willful neglect of reporting duty.
Still haven't answered how school admins there failed to report to the Department of Public Welfare, either.
You're late to the conversation, so I'll fill you in. I am fully supporting the prosecution of both the Athletic Director and the head of the police force. I am NOT for a mob lynching of Paterno based on pure speculation, and the reports of one man. Especially when that one man has only stood to gain from this whole situation, is the sole witness, and a victim has never been found.
Edit: If what you say is true, then why don't Pennsylvania's prosecutors charge Paterno as well? It looks to me like I am in the right here and you are in the wrong.
Once again, you still have no clue what you're talking about. 'a victim has never been found' lol? They have 6 victims already ready to testify for the prosecution (source espn), and that's considering not all the alleged victims have came forward.
You keep ranting about holding back judgement until the facts are out, but then ignore the ones that are clearly in existence right in front of you. It's probably pointless to even post anything in response to you because you're clearly just too incompetent for this discussion.
Victim #2 has never been found. Reading comprehension is tough.
Once again its you who have reading issues. In your own post, you type and I quote "a victim has never been found'. That implies that no victims have been found.
You're actually so incompetent you don't even know what the fuck you're saying lol.
He was very clearly referring to the 2002 allegations... Not whether "any victim ever" has been found.
I'm not expressing a view one way or another on this subject because I don't know enough about it, but this thread could certainly use less snarky little comments like yours.
On November 11 2011 09:24 Ryuu314 wrote: I can't believe there are people who think Paterno should keep his job/not be fired when he fucking covered up the rape of 8 kids and protected a child molester for what? almost 10 years? That's fucking ridiculous.
it was only 1 kid (victim #2) and whether or not he covered it up is up for debate.
more or less the entire administration and everyone to who the responsibility was passed to was at fault. sandusky assistant emeritus? get the fuck outta here.
the students probably feel that paterno has done way more good than harm for the community so they have the right to be angry. perhaps even moreso that the mcquerery passed the responsibility to paterno and is now the interim coach. that defies all logic to me.
On November 11 2011 10:16 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: So Paterno has hired a criminal defense attorney.
Probably just standard procedure, but an interesting development none the less
A civil litigator would be standard if you're in shit but not criminal. Something must be coming up the pipe
Considering my probably pretty reasonable assumption that this guy is quite well off financially, hiring a defence lawyer when there is so much shit going on around you is a pretty reasonable precaution to take... Even if nothing is coming. As a criminal defence lawyer myself my first impression was that this guy should be lawyering up and shutting up..
On November 11 2011 10:16 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: So Paterno has hired a criminal defense attorney.
Probably just standard procedure, but an interesting development none the less
A civil litigator would be standard if you're in shit but not criminal. Something must be coming up the pipe
Considering my probably pretty reasonable assumption that this guy is quite well off financially, hiring a defence lawyer when there is so much shit going on around you is a pretty reasonable precaution to take... Even if nothing is coming. As a criminal defence lawyer myself my first impression was that this guy should be lawyering up and shutting up..
Off topic: Is defenCe an Australian thing? I think it looks better than defense. I might start using it lol
I believe defenSe and offenSe is purely an American thing these days, with most English speaking nations of the world (Aus, NZ, countries in UK etc) using defenCe and offenCe.
I think I remember reading that the use of 'S' is the old spelling which America has retained where others have not.
On November 11 2011 11:11 Brett wrote: Considering my probably pretty reasonable assumption that this guy is quite well off financially, hiring a defence lawyer when there is so much shit going on around you is a pretty reasonable precaution to take... Even if nothing is coming. As a criminal defence lawyer myself my first impression was that this guy should be lawyering up and shutting up..
Off topic: Is defenCe an Australian thing? I think it looks better than defense. I might start using it lol
There's a pretty substantial number of ways that American English differs from British English. "Defen[sc]e" is one, the "-ize"/"-ise" suffix is another and "color"/"colour" et al. are a third. Those are just off the top of my head.
Most commonwealth or recent ex-commonwealth countries use the British spelling. Certainly AU and NZ and the UK.
On November 11 2011 11:54 kakaman wrote: The kid in the end sounds like an idiot...state school in America ftw
I don't know where people get this sentiment from, imo private school students have way crazier lifestyles unless we're talking top competitors. State school is just a ton of people who don't know/care for each other.
On November 11 2011 10:16 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: So Paterno has hired a criminal defense attorney.
Probably just standard procedure, but an interesting development none the less
A civil litigator would be standard if you're in shit but not criminal. Something must be coming up the pipe
Considering my probably pretty reasonable assumption that this guy is quite well off financially, hiring a defence lawyer when there is so much shit going on around you is a pretty reasonable precaution to take... Even if nothing is coming. As a criminal defence lawyer myself my first impression was that this guy should be lawyering up and shutting up..
The odd part is that, criminal defense lawyers are not meant to take on civil suit cases, and vice versa. Or at least that is my understanding from the many lawyer statements in other threads. So if he hires a criminal lawyer, he should be expecting something...
On November 11 2011 09:31 UndoneJin wrote: I don't think anyone outside of PSU understands how damaging this whole thing is....
It's kinda crushing honestly.
I think anyone considering sending a son or daughter to Penn State for ANYTHING has to think twice considering how the university brass reacted to this incident. If your daughter goes there and is raped, is the university going to cover shit up and protect their rep before they worry about the victim?
On November 11 2011 10:16 {CC}StealthBlue wrote: So Paterno has hired a criminal defense attorney.
Probably just standard procedure, but an interesting development none the less
A civil litigator would be standard if you're in shit but not criminal. Something must be coming up the pipe
Considering my probably pretty reasonable assumption that this guy is quite well off financially, hiring a defence lawyer when there is so much shit going on around you is a pretty reasonable precaution to take... Even if nothing is coming. As a criminal defence lawyer myself my first impression was that this guy should be lawyering up and shutting up..
The odd part is that, criminal defense lawyers are not meant to take on civil suit cases, and vice versa. Or at least that is my understanding from the many lawyer statements in other threads. So if he hires a criminal lawyer, he should be expecting something...
It's not a matter of whether a criminal defence lawyer would take a civil brief or not (generally we wouldn't because we are smart enough to know the limits of our expertise, not because we are precluded from doing so)... Presumably, given the amount of shit that has hit the fan, he is concerned about the possibility of criminal charges coming in the future, and has provided a retainer to the defence lawyer to obtain their advice as to how to proceed and minimize any future harm. It's quite possible that a prosecutor with a bone to pick with him could well start scraping the barrel for something to charge him with. It doesn't necessarily mean that he will be charged, it's just the smart thing to do....
First rule of being a lawyer: CYA... COVER YOUR ASS. He'd be well advised to do the same given the circumstances.
In any event there are some lawyers who will take both criminal and civil matters on board. There's also nothing stopping him from having another firm to deal with any civil suit.
EPT
