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On October 06 2011 07:02 Synwave wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 06:58 farvacola wrote:On October 06 2011 06:30 Synwave wrote:On October 06 2011 06:24 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:On October 06 2011 05:58 Synwave wrote:
This reminds me of people that used to judge Marlyn Manson by their really horrible (generalizing here) following of goth wannabes.
ICP actually has a lot of intellectualism in their work but people see some dumbass spraying soda on an innocent passerby and judge the whole thing based on that.
I guess it would be sort of like judging SC2 based on the 'community' you see predominantly in an LR thread. Except Manson, in real life, is a super fucking down-to-earth, cool guy who does his best to calmly and rationally debunk the myths in interviews. If you have ever listened to ICP talk they're just fucking stupid. I am not a juggalo, I have never painted my face with clown stuff or sprayed soda on someone. Champagne yes but I was in drag so thats different... However I have sat down and talked with them at an after party, they are pretty smart guys. Manson was getting derailed by his fans, ICP raps about their fans specifically. The fact they are degenerate members of society that will eventually be judged. Not defending the culture, just saying a bit of education and lyric listenin might be in order. "I WANT A RUSTY AXE I WANNA KNOW VOODOO A FAT BITCH NAMED BRIDGETT And a little sip of Faygo, too 'TILL I GET MY SHIT, IN THIS MOTHERFUCKER I WON'T NEVER DIIIIEEE!"-song, "I Want my Shit" "Three little piggies just to make a piggy pie. There's nothing like the squeal when you hear a piggy die. I might use a gun, (No!) I might use an axe, (yes!) The carnival's in town, come and get your piggy snacks!"-song, "Piggy Pie" Both of those songs are off of ICP's best selling albums.......I'll let their lyrics speak for themselves. Do you know how many artists can be deconstructed in the manner you have done here? You don't like them and think their crap and I respect that opinion but please dont...just dont argue like this.
I agree you could pick something like that out from most artists.
Do you have a counter example of some deep, complex and intelligent lyrics from their music?
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On October 06 2011 07:14 Synwave wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 07:07 TangJuice wrote:On October 06 2011 07:02 Synwave wrote:On October 06 2011 06:58 farvacola wrote:On October 06 2011 06:30 Synwave wrote:On October 06 2011 06:24 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:On October 06 2011 05:58 Synwave wrote:
This reminds me of people that used to judge Marlyn Manson by their really horrible (generalizing here) following of goth wannabes.
ICP actually has a lot of intellectualism in their work but people see some dumbass spraying soda on an innocent passerby and judge the whole thing based on that.
I guess it would be sort of like judging SC2 based on the 'community' you see predominantly in an LR thread. Except Manson, in real life, is a super fucking down-to-earth, cool guy who does his best to calmly and rationally debunk the myths in interviews. If you have ever listened to ICP talk they're just fucking stupid. I am not a juggalo, I have never painted my face with clown stuff or sprayed soda on someone. Champagne yes but I was in drag so thats different... However I have sat down and talked with them at an after party, they are pretty smart guys. Manson was getting derailed by his fans, ICP raps about their fans specifically. The fact they are degenerate members of society that will eventually be judged. Not defending the culture, just saying a bit of education and lyric listenin might be in order. "I WANT A RUSTY AXE I WANNA KNOW VOODOO A FAT BITCH NAMED BRIDGETT And a little sip of Faygo, too 'TILL I GET MY SHIT, IN THIS MOTHERFUCKER I WON'T NEVER DIIIIEEE!"-song, "I Want my Shit" "Three little piggies just to make a piggy pie. There's nothing like the squeal when you hear a piggy die. I might use a gun, (No!) I might use an axe, (yes!) The carnival's in town, come and get your piggy snacks!"-song, "Piggy Pie" Both of those songs are off of ICP's best selling albums.......I'll let their lyrics speak for themselves. Do you know how many artists can be deconstructed in the manner you have done here? You don't like them and think their crap and I respect that opinion but please dont...just dont argue like this. Ha, you brought up their lyrics therefore its fair game, if you don't like it, then defend it with a reason not just saying your doing wrong. You might want to read what I wrote but I think this is a failed conversation. I was just trying to give a perspective which on some is lost I suppose.
Well you said they are actually pretty smart guys, to look at their lyrics, then some one posted snippets of their lyrics that quite frankly seem pretty bad and stupid to me, then you said kind of vaguely that he shouldn't argue like "this". I ask why not? you said look at lyrics, some one did. Say why he is wrong not just that he is wrong. like some one else above said, post some lyrics of them saying something intelligent and then maybe ill accept your perspective, maybe even change mine. I only know them from the meme of them saying magnets are miracles and, i think, that the scientific explanation is BS, which makes them retards in my eyes.
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On October 06 2011 07:14 Synwave wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2011 07:07 TangJuice wrote:On October 06 2011 07:02 Synwave wrote:On October 06 2011 06:58 farvacola wrote:On October 06 2011 06:30 Synwave wrote:On October 06 2011 06:24 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote:On October 06 2011 05:58 Synwave wrote:
This reminds me of people that used to judge Marlyn Manson by their really horrible (generalizing here) following of goth wannabes.
ICP actually has a lot of intellectualism in their work but people see some dumbass spraying soda on an innocent passerby and judge the whole thing based on that.
I guess it would be sort of like judging SC2 based on the 'community' you see predominantly in an LR thread. Except Manson, in real life, is a super fucking down-to-earth, cool guy who does his best to calmly and rationally debunk the myths in interviews. If you have ever listened to ICP talk they're just fucking stupid. I am not a juggalo, I have never painted my face with clown stuff or sprayed soda on someone. Champagne yes but I was in drag so thats different... However I have sat down and talked with them at an after party, they are pretty smart guys. Manson was getting derailed by his fans, ICP raps about their fans specifically. The fact they are degenerate members of society that will eventually be judged. Not defending the culture, just saying a bit of education and lyric listenin might be in order. "I WANT A RUSTY AXE I WANNA KNOW VOODOO A FAT BITCH NAMED BRIDGETT And a little sip of Faygo, too 'TILL I GET MY SHIT, IN THIS MOTHERFUCKER I WON'T NEVER DIIIIEEE!"-song, "I Want my Shit" "Three little piggies just to make a piggy pie. There's nothing like the squeal when you hear a piggy die. I might use a gun, (No!) I might use an axe, (yes!) The carnival's in town, come and get your piggy snacks!"-song, "Piggy Pie" Both of those songs are off of ICP's best selling albums.......I'll let their lyrics speak for themselves. Do you know how many artists can be deconstructed in the manner you have done here? You don't like them and think their crap and I respect that opinion but please dont...just dont argue like this. Ha, you brought up their lyrics therefore its fair game, if you don't like it, then defend it with a reason not just saying your doing wrong. You might want to read what I wrote but I think this is a failed conversation. I was just trying to give a perspective which on some is lost I suppose.
But he did read what you wrote and clearly disagrees with you strongly. Do you have any clips of them talking in real life or anything?
Like "education and lyric listenin", do you have any particular examples? Or are we just supposed to take your word for it?
He responded directly to what you were saying, so I don't understand how that's not fair game.
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Regardless of how offensive, vulgar, religious, etc. any of their lyrics are, the content is irrelevant. The writing is terrible. The rhymes are less sophisticated than a fucking Drake rhyme and less coherent than lil wayne.
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Wow...I'm going back to church.
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On October 06 2011 09:30 Eknoid4 wrote:
Regardless of how offensive, vulgar, religious, etc. any of their lyrics are, the content is irrelevant. The writing is terrible. The rhymes are less sophisticated than a fucking Drake rhyme and less coherent than lil wayne.
This is anecdotal at best, although all commentary on their writing is based on personal opinion. If you listened to more than the 4 songs that top the youtube search, you might find there are actually quite a few tracks that are well written, well timed, and well rhymed.
If you're mad that someone else is brazenly trumpeting their beliefs with ignorance, perhaps you should be mad that you are doing it too
Awesome signature by the way dude.
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Why would anyone celebrate that they're not optimal? Maybe we should make a group: "Us who rage in starcraft 2!"? We'll call ourselves "Idranians".
In all seriousness, Those facemasks looks kind of cool. I wonder how they did it..Must be a miracle!
Ok, ok. In real seriousness. I think its entirely ok to judge someone who basically admits to themselves that they're stupid. If not these people, who else? 
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On October 07 2011 00:19 Excludos wrote:Why would anyone celebrate that they're not optimal? Maybe we should make a group: "Us who rage in starcraft 2!"? We'll call ourselves "Idranians". In all seriousness, Those facemasks looks kind of cool. I wonder how they did it..Must be a miracle! Ok, ok. In real seriousness. I think its entirely ok to judge someone who basically admits to themselves that they're stupid. If not these people, who else?
Someone either didn't watch the video, or misinterpreted the concept behind the gathering.
They aren't "admitting to themselves that they're stupid". They aren't celebrating stupidity. It's a once a year thing where people with similar lifestyles and tastes in music can come together and be accepted regardless of looks, beliefs, etc.
Wanting acceptance doesn't make you stupid. Smoking and drinking while pregnant is stupid for a certainty, but I'm 99% sure that ICP and friends have never said or sang anything encouraging this.
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So it's like a whole festival full of Steve-O's?
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Society reject that wanna be ghetto?
I'm all for not following the norm, but this classifies as absurd.
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On October 07 2011 00:24 HackBenjamin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 00:19 Excludos wrote:Why would anyone celebrate that they're not optimal? Maybe we should make a group: "Us who rage in starcraft 2!"? We'll call ourselves "Idranians". In all seriousness, Those facemasks looks kind of cool. I wonder how they did it..Must be a miracle! Ok, ok. In real seriousness. I think its entirely ok to judge someone who basically admits to themselves that they're stupid. If not these people, who else? Someone either didn't watch the video, or misinterpreted the concept behind the gathering. They aren't "admitting to themselves that they're stupid". They aren't celebrating stupidity. It's a once a year thing where people with similar lifestyles and tastes in music can come together and be accepted regardless of looks, beliefs, etc. Wanting acceptance doesn't make you stupid. Smoking and drinking while pregnant is stupid for a certainty, but I'm 99% sure that ICP and friends have never said or sang anything encouraging this.
"Magnets, how do they work?! Miracle!" I'm sorry, if these are the lyrics you believe in, then you are admitting to yourself that you're stupid. (By "you" I mean these guys and not you personally, btw)
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This was Really well made. Great motion camera portraiture, beautifully edited and composed. Minimal, and not condescending or crudely judgmental. For What it is, this is a project that most people could Never undertake nor make it look as good . The subject, Which is being scrutinized is something else all together ... Sean Dunne has a great style and I look forward to his next projects.
woot-woot.
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On October 07 2011 00:32 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 00:24 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 07 2011 00:19 Excludos wrote:Why would anyone celebrate that they're not optimal? Maybe we should make a group: "Us who rage in starcraft 2!"? We'll call ourselves "Idranians". In all seriousness, Those facemasks looks kind of cool. I wonder how they did it..Must be a miracle! Ok, ok. In real seriousness. I think its entirely ok to judge someone who basically admits to themselves that they're stupid. If not these people, who else? Someone either didn't watch the video, or misinterpreted the concept behind the gathering. They aren't "admitting to themselves that they're stupid". They aren't celebrating stupidity. It's a once a year thing where people with similar lifestyles and tastes in music can come together and be accepted regardless of looks, beliefs, etc. Wanting acceptance doesn't make you stupid. Smoking and drinking while pregnant is stupid for a certainty, but I'm 99% sure that ICP and friends have never said or sang anything encouraging this. "Magnets, how do they work?! Miracle!" I'm sorry, if these are the lyrics you believe in, then you are admitting to yourself that you're stupid. (By "you" I mean these guys and not you personally, btw)
I've copied this from the wiki article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracles_(Insane_Clown_Posse_song)
Inspiration for the song's lyrics came via the Internet generation and group members Joseph Bruce and Joseph Utsler raising children. In response to both modern jadedness and their children experiencing wonders of the world for the first time, the group wanted to write a song about natural phenomena humans experience in life which often go unacknowledged. The closing lyrics encourage listeners to take time to look at the world and "appreciate the things that life has to offer". According to Bruce, "What's a shame is how people walk around blind to it all. They lost their spirit about everything. If you can’t even see the miracle in animals, then you must have never truly loved a pet." He believes that scientific explanations can sometimes kill the intriguing mysteries of the world, such has how ancient pyramids were made. Bruce admits that the song's lyrics discuss "things [... that] may not be actual miracles. They may have scientific facts explaining them [...] But nonetheless, these things are still incredible [...] and they should be appreciated." He added that the group's use of the word 'miracle' was intended to mean "something fuckin’ amazing and incredible, [... a] special, awesome event, [...] a great, wonderful thing."
The lyrics focus on introspective themes which critics considered to be uncommon in Insane Clown Posse's music; however, Bruce states that these themes are important in the duo's work, and reveal their depth. In response to accusations that the group has changed its style and gone soft, Bruce calls the song "classic ICP," noting that the group has always included one or two deep and meaningful songs on every album, and that this is just the first time that they've created a video for one of those songs. Several reviewers have suggested that the song contains an anti-science message. Bruce refutes the claim, explaining that "the [song's] concept is about appreciating everything in this world. It's not about God; [...] religion; [.. or] science."Joseph Laycock of Religion Dispatches suggests that rather than rejecting science, the song disapproves of disenchantment.
The fact that inspiration came from the internet generation kinda seems to indicate that we really only have ourselves to blame. The song is about more than just two apes trying to figure out a fucking magnet.
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The school I went to in ninth grade was dominated by juggalo's. To them: good sentence = generic musings * the word shit.
Juggalo culture revolves around giving pitiful friendless men a chance to be social, and slutty as shit girls a place where they can get a ton of attention.
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On October 07 2011 00:28 rel wrote:
So it's like a whole festival full of Steve-O's?
As much as that made me laugh I think Steve-O is smarter than them.
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On October 07 2011 00:37 HackBenjamin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 00:32 Excludos wrote:On October 07 2011 00:24 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 07 2011 00:19 Excludos wrote:Why would anyone celebrate that they're not optimal? Maybe we should make a group: "Us who rage in starcraft 2!"? We'll call ourselves "Idranians". In all seriousness, Those facemasks looks kind of cool. I wonder how they did it..Must be a miracle! Ok, ok. In real seriousness. I think its entirely ok to judge someone who basically admits to themselves that they're stupid. If not these people, who else? Someone either didn't watch the video, or misinterpreted the concept behind the gathering. They aren't "admitting to themselves that they're stupid". They aren't celebrating stupidity. It's a once a year thing where people with similar lifestyles and tastes in music can come together and be accepted regardless of looks, beliefs, etc. Wanting acceptance doesn't make you stupid. Smoking and drinking while pregnant is stupid for a certainty, but I'm 99% sure that ICP and friends have never said or sang anything encouraging this. "Magnets, how do they work?! Miracle!" I'm sorry, if these are the lyrics you believe in, then you are admitting to yourself that you're stupid. (By "you" I mean these guys and not you personally, btw) I've copied this from the wiki article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracles_(Insane_Clown_Posse_song)Show nested quote +
Inspiration for the song's lyrics came via the Internet generation and group members Joseph Bruce and Joseph Utsler raising children. In response to both modern jadedness and their children experiencing wonders of the world for the first time, the group wanted to write a song about natural phenomena humans experience in life which often go unacknowledged. The closing lyrics encourage listeners to take time to look at the world and "appreciate the things that life has to offer". According to Bruce, "What's a shame is how people walk around blind to it all. They lost their spirit about everything. If you can’t even see the miracle in animals, then you must have never truly loved a pet." He believes that scientific explanations can sometimes kill the intriguing mysteries of the world, such has how ancient pyramids were made. Bruce admits that the song's lyrics discuss "things [... that] may not be actual miracles. They may have scientific facts explaining them [...] But nonetheless, these things are still incredible [...] and they should be appreciated." He added that the group's use of the word 'miracle' was intended to mean "something fuckin’ amazing and incredible, [... a] special, awesome event, [...] a great, wonderful thing."
The lyrics focus on introspective themes which critics considered to be uncommon in Insane Clown Posse's music; however, Bruce states that these themes are important in the duo's work, and reveal their depth. In response to accusations that the group has changed its style and gone soft, Bruce calls the song "classic ICP," noting that the group has always included one or two deep and meaningful songs on every album, and that this is just the first time that they've created a video for one of those songs. Several reviewers have suggested that the song contains an anti-science message. Bruce refutes the claim, explaining that "the [song's] concept is about appreciating everything in this world. It's not about God; [...] religion; [.. or] science."Joseph Laycock of Religion Dispatches suggests that rather than rejecting science, the song disapproves of disenchantment.
The fact that inspiration came from the internet generation kinda seems to indicate that we really only have ourselves to blame. The song is about more than just two apes trying to figure out a fucking magnet.
So an author-centric interpretation of complete bullshit is the only option? A clown telling you his inspiration comes from something defensible and worthwhile hardly changes the listener and reader side of the equation, in which literally millions of intelligent people would react incredibly negatively. Furthermore, consider their target audience. If we ourselves had difficulty teasing out an intelligent meaning, than how are crackhead white trash clowns going to go about a deep analysis of a song that, on the surface, seems riddled with luddite notions.
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On October 07 2011 00:50 puppykiller wrote:
The school I went to in ninth grade was dominated by juggalo's. To them: good sentence = generic musings * the word shit.
Juggalo culture revolves around giving pitiful friendless men a chance to be social, and slutty as shit girls a place where they can get a ton of attention.
What is wrong with everyone in Society having a place where they can go and be accepted for who they are? I am not a juggalo although I do know their music and what they are about. I have watched this video for reference as well as having many close friends/ family that are part of this.
I feel that people today are quick to judge things that are not the norm they prescribe to. Do you not think that people judge you as some nerd that plays an internet game? Do you know they also think you are a virgin covered in acne? Do you know that they think you live in your moms basement? This is all just crap that people to do get around actually getting to know someone who may do things that are outside of their comfort range and they base it on appearance. In American society no one actually cares about each other nor do they want to try. It is so hard to find people who want to create true friendship that why not gather with people who share one single ideal even if it is something as small as music? I'm probably wasting my time with this but if people broaden their view they may actually find something interesting about themselves and the people that walk by them everyday.
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On October 07 2011 01:15 thane wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 00:50 puppykiller wrote:
The school I went to in ninth grade was dominated by juggalo's. To them: good sentence = generic musings * the word shit.
Juggalo culture revolves around giving pitiful friendless men a chance to be social, and slutty as shit girls a place where they can get a ton of attention. What is wrong with everyone in Society having a place where they can go and be accepted for who they are? I am not a juggalo although I do know their music and what they are about. I have watched this video for reference as well as having many close friends/ family that are part of this. I feel that people today are quick to judge things that are not the norm they prescribe to. Do you not think that people judge you as some nerd that plays an internet game? Do you know they also think you are a virgin covered in acne? Do you know that they think you live in your moms basement? This is all just crap that people to do get around actually getting to know someone who may do things that are outside of their comfort range and they base it on appearance. In American society no one actually cares about each other nor do they want to try. It is so hard to find people who want to create true friendship that why not gather with people who share one single ideal even if it is something as small as music? I'm probably wasting my time with this but if people broaden their view they may actually find something interesting about themselves and the people that walk by them everyday.
READ THE THREAD OMG, this is more than a simple social group, they are a criminal gang that predicates it's sense of self-worth on the hatred of others and a general lack of acceptance. Along those lines, and as can be found in an abundance of lyrics, they go out of their way to heckle, assault, and generally disrupt the lives of those around them. I'm all for community and the forsaken finding their place in society, but this is something entirely different.
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On October 07 2011 01:04 farvacola wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2011 00:37 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 07 2011 00:32 Excludos wrote:On October 07 2011 00:24 HackBenjamin wrote:On October 07 2011 00:19 Excludos wrote:Why would anyone celebrate that they're not optimal? Maybe we should make a group: "Us who rage in starcraft 2!"? We'll call ourselves "Idranians". In all seriousness, Those facemasks looks kind of cool. I wonder how they did it..Must be a miracle! Ok, ok. In real seriousness. I think its entirely ok to judge someone who basically admits to themselves that they're stupid. If not these people, who else? Someone either didn't watch the video, or misinterpreted the concept behind the gathering. They aren't "admitting to themselves that they're stupid". They aren't celebrating stupidity. It's a once a year thing where people with similar lifestyles and tastes in music can come together and be accepted regardless of looks, beliefs, etc. Wanting acceptance doesn't make you stupid. Smoking and drinking while pregnant is stupid for a certainty, but I'm 99% sure that ICP and friends have never said or sang anything encouraging this. "Magnets, how do they work?! Miracle!" I'm sorry, if these are the lyrics you believe in, then you are admitting to yourself that you're stupid. (By "you" I mean these guys and not you personally, btw) I've copied this from the wiki article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracles_(Insane_Clown_Posse_song)
Inspiration for the song's lyrics came via the Internet generation and group members Joseph Bruce and Joseph Utsler raising children. In response to both modern jadedness and their children experiencing wonders of the world for the first time, the group wanted to write a song about natural phenomena humans experience in life which often go unacknowledged. The closing lyrics encourage listeners to take time to look at the world and "appreciate the things that life has to offer". According to Bruce, "What's a shame is how people walk around blind to it all. They lost their spirit about everything. If you can’t even see the miracle in animals, then you must have never truly loved a pet." He believes that scientific explanations can sometimes kill the intriguing mysteries of the world, such has how ancient pyramids were made. Bruce admits that the song's lyrics discuss "things [... that] may not be actual miracles. They may have scientific facts explaining them [...] But nonetheless, these things are still incredible [...] and they should be appreciated." He added that the group's use of the word 'miracle' was intended to mean "something fuckin’ amazing and incredible, [... a] special, awesome event, [...] a great, wonderful thing."
The lyrics focus on introspective themes which critics considered to be uncommon in Insane Clown Posse's music; however, Bruce states that these themes are important in the duo's work, and reveal their depth. In response to accusations that the group has changed its style and gone soft, Bruce calls the song "classic ICP," noting that the group has always included one or two deep and meaningful songs on every album, and that this is just the first time that they've created a video for one of those songs. Several reviewers have suggested that the song contains an anti-science message. Bruce refutes the claim, explaining that "the [song's] concept is about appreciating everything in this world. It's not about God; [...] religion; [.. or] science."Joseph Laycock of Religion Dispatches suggests that rather than rejecting science, the song disapproves of disenchantment.
The fact that inspiration came from the internet generation kinda seems to indicate that we really only have ourselves to blame. The song is about more than just two apes trying to figure out a fucking magnet. So an author-centric interpretation of complete bullshit is the only option? A clown telling you his inspiration comes from something defensible and worthwhile hardly changes the listener and reader side of the equation, in which literally millions of intelligent people would react incredibly negatively. Furthermore, consider their target audience. If we ourselves had difficulty teasing out an intelligent meaning, than how are crackhead white trash clowns going to go about a deep analysis of a song that, on the surface, seems riddled with luddite notions.
The majority of regular fans of any music would be hard pressed to give you a detailed and accurate song meaning for every track they like. I agree with you in that the majority of ICP's fanbase probably aren't sitting somewhere trying to decipher the hidden meanings behind each song, but what I'm saying is that there is (slightly) more to what these guys rap about beyond axe-murdering and Faygo, and to label a whole sub-culture as stupid or crackheads based off of a 30 minute documentary in which a handful of people out of a hundred thousand were interviewed is pretty closed-minded.
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EPT
