EPTIs my shit fucked.
Ask and answer stupid questions here! - Page 297
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
Is my shit fucked. | ||
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Yoav
United States1874 Posts
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
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Oshuy
Netherlands529 Posts
On June 29 2015 11:09 Alabasern wrote: What European countries accept immigrants that are unemployed, don't speak the native language, and intend to work as a non-citizen? To apply for a long stay visa, you have to provide the name of a prospective employer which needs to register his intent to employ you; I believe this is the case in all european countries. You can also apply based on your intent to be self employed, provided you can prove your business to be sustainable. I have a few friends that moved with a student visa, found a job while studying and applied for a work visa, then a resident card from there. To do so you need to prove your enrollment in a university or equivalent and to prove that you have sufficient income to live in Europe during your stay. | ||
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VelJa
France1109 Posts
On June 29 2015 11:09 Alabasern wrote: What European countries accept immigrants that are unemployed, don't speak the native language, and intend to work as a non-citizen? All of them. Cuz they decide to accept 60 000 immigrants on the 2 years coming splitted equally between all European country. | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On June 29 2015 17:08 VelJa wrote: All of them. Cuz they decide to accept 60 000 immigrants on the 2 years coming splitted equally between all European country. That's not really true... | ||
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Oshuy
Netherlands529 Posts
On June 29 2015 17:08 VelJa wrote: All of them. Cuz they decide to accept 60 000 immigrants on the 2 years coming splitted equally between all European country. Those 60 000 have refugee status. That supposes you can prove you had to flee your country to save your life though. So your goal is not to work as a non-citizeen, it is to save your skin  | ||
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VelJa
France1109 Posts
Yeah you are right, this is not economic immigrants... They are Refugees and asking for asylum. On June 29 2015 17:28 Oshuy wrote: Those 60 000 have refugee status. That supposes you can prove you had to flee your country to save your life though. So your goal is not to work as a non-citizeen, it is to save your skin The problem is to split thos guys beween refugees & economic immigration | ||
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SoSexy
Italy3725 Posts
Italy unemployement rate for young people: 47%... surely unskilled, untrained, uneducated people who dont speak the language will meet a bright future here | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On June 29 2015 20:41 SoSexy wrote: Yep and Europe is taking them in because we are swimming in gold and can provide work for everyone! Italy unemployement rate for young people: 47%... surely unskilled, untrained, uneducated people who dont speak the language will meet a bright future here Europe is taking them because Europe is based on time-transcending principles that claim that no one should be threatened in his country because of his/her opinions, political or religious views. A bright future isn't awaiting them, but a brighter future for sure. And I'm sorry if that takes some comfort from your rich, technology-filled and government-assisted life. | ||
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VelJa
France1109 Posts
On June 29 2015 20:41 SoSexy wrote: Yep and Europe is taking them in because we are swimming in gold and can provide work for everyone! Italy unemployement rate for young people: 47%... surely unskilled, untrained, uneducated people who dont speak the language will meet a bright future here SoSexy & SoSelfish Your attitude is exactly what we can expect from a pure&simple racist. "THEY COME TO RAPE OUR GIRLS & STEAL OUR JOBS" | ||
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Cascade
Australia5405 Posts
On June 29 2015 20:41 SoSexy wrote: Yep and Europe is taking them in because we are swimming in gold and can provide work for everyone! Italy unemployement rate for young people: 47%... surely unskilled, untrained, uneducated people who dont speak the language will meet a bright future here Sorry, I think I got a bit mad here, as that's some scary Italian right wing approach you have there... Yes, Europe is swimming in gold and can take in a lot more refugees than that, if you compare to where many of the refugees come from. Also Italy. And what makes you think the refugees are unskilled? I'm trying hard to interpret that in a non racist way... A lot are not untrained and uneducated. But good luck getting a doctors position with an Afghan doctors licence, so you drive a taxi at best. Italy no doubt got some problems, but refugees are not the reason, and kicking them out will not solve them, despite what berlusconi tries to tell people. I'm afraid the Italians (not least berlusconi himself...) did that mess all by themselves, and have to sort it out by themselves. | ||
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SoSexy
Italy3725 Posts
Also, LOL at the racist remarks. Is this the new trend? When someone asks for legality, is it being racist? Really? I've travelled all around the world and I am friend with many people - from Finland to Japan, passing from Turkey and Morocco. If you really think that denying uncontrolled, senseless immigration is racist, you are free to do so. To me it's just common sense. We are taking in people without any information at all - do you think this is safe? My solution is simple - help the local governments. Send them money, help them build their economies and remove threats like terrorism. This is the only way that could work. Do we seriously expect Europe to keep taking in every refugee from all over the world? It's not a question of mercy - it is simply unpratical and impossible. You are writing from Australia, a country with a good immigration system. Italian (and European) politicians prefer to say 'we're gonna rescue them', then they will not do a shit about foreign politics (see Sarkozy bombing of Lybia and closing of the border from Italy to France - urr durr). Then they will throw a magnificient funeral when a boat sink. This is hypocrisy. But yeah, I'm probably just a racist right? | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10882 Posts
Stabilize the Region, improve their economies... Yeah, if you can come up with a working way to implement such a policy you probably get multiple nobel peace prices... That italy gets hit the hardest by it is unfortunate and that the european countries can't agree on a binding way to actually place these People is another (very sad) Story... | ||
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ThomasjServo
15244 Posts
This has been playing out in the states in a similar fashion with Mexico specifically and the Coyotes (people paid to help sneak people into the US) for years and years. That being said, we obviously don't have the same social safety nets that make the EU or at least certain EU countries a more appealing destination (beyond the geographic considerations) Is Spain in a similar boat? I've not heard about similar issues crossing the straight into Southern Spain. | ||
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VelJa
France1109 Posts
On June 29 2015 23:29 SoSexy wrote: Cascade, Berlusconi has no power anymore (his party would collect around 11% and he's 80). Also, LOL at the racist remarks. Is this the new trend? When someone asks for legality, is it being racist? Really? I've travelled all around the world and I am friend with many people - from Finland to Japan, passing from Turkey and Morocco. If you really think that denying uncontrolled, senseless immigration is racist, you are free to do so. To me it's just common sense. We are taking in people without any information at all - do you think this is safe? My solution is simple - help the local governments. Send them money, help them build their economies and remove threats like terrorism. This is the only way that could work. Do we seriously expect Europe to keep taking in every refugee from all over the world? It's not a question of mercy - it is simply unpratical and impossible. You are writing from Australia, a country with a good immigration system. Italian (and European) politicians prefer to say 'we're gonna rescue them', then they will not do a shit about foreign politics (see Sarkozy bombing of Lybia and closing of the border from Italy to France - urr durr). Then they will throw a magnificient funeral when a boat sink. This is hypocrisy. But yeah, I'm probably just a racist right? Dude, now i mostly agreed with you. But your 1st post was not representatig what u write here, admiti it. In France we have a big programm for Afreeca : We try to give them electricity by creating facilities and network....Electricity is a huge problem in africa. This is by helping them to create their own infrastructure that we can help them better. With electricity you can solves alot of issue and start building a real economy. 20y ago we send rice to africa to counter starvation. 10y ago we have explain to the people how to plant rice, now they produce their own rice | ||
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Oshuy
Netherlands529 Posts
Sending money to local government often isn't a solution: In a lot of cases, the local government is part of the issue itself. To remove migration, you would need to change local governments to ones that would follow your economic development model. Not exactly the foreign policy we have, probably not the one we want. Removing threats like terrorism ... an easy one I guess. I would agree that aiming for stable democratic government that make a fair and intelligent use of foreign funding in a world where war and hate no longer exist sounds fine. Until we reach that goal, there will always be people fleeing persecution, war and other slightly annoying local issues. We can expect Europe to take people in as long as necessary, or at least as long as Europe is seen as a refuge. There is a question regarding the funding and repartition of migration management when most people land in Italy, that is true. Another question altogether though. | ||
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fruity.
England1711 Posts
On June 29 2015 04:43 The_Templar wrote: Depends on how much he's been working out. Probably about as far as he could trust him. My spidey senses are tingling, I sense a story to be shared here. Do tell. | ||
The_Templar
your Country52797 Posts
On June 30 2015 00:52 fruity. wrote: My spidey senses are tingling, I sense a story to be shared here. Do tell. Oh, I was just joking. | ||
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OtherWorld
France17333 Posts
On June 29 2015 23:29 SoSexy wrote: Cascade, Berlusconi has no power anymore (his party would collect around 11% and he's 80). Also, LOL at the racist remarks. Is this the new trend? When someone asks for legality, is it being racist? Really? I've travelled all around the world and I am friend with many people - from Finland to Japan, passing from Turkey and Morocco. If you really think that denying uncontrolled, senseless immigration is racist, you are free to do so. To me it's just common sense. We are taking in people without any information at all - do you think this is safe? My solution is simple - help the local governments. Send them money, help them build their economies and remove threats like terrorism. This is the only way that could work. Do we seriously expect Europe to keep taking in every refugee from all over the world? It's not a question of mercy - it is simply unpratical and impossible. You are writing from Australia, a country with a good immigration system. Italian (and European) politicians prefer to say 'we're gonna rescue them', then they will not do a shit about foreign politics (see Sarkozy bombing of Lybia and closing of the border from Italy to France - urr durr). Then they will throw a magnificient funeral when a boat sink. This is hypocrisy. But yeah, I'm probably just a racist right? You realize that your post here is in no way similar to the one you did before right? Saying "they take our money and jobs" (when most of these refugees are not even fleeing because of money and unemployment but because of civil war and its troubled aftermath) is not the same as saying "there are better policies possible". Your solution is not a solution - at least not in itself, not alone. There're two major issues with it : (1) governments are most of the time part of the issue, and don't give a flying fuck about developing their country and making their citizens wealthier (why would you educate the people you rule when, with education, there's a high chance that they'll start to ask for democratic reform and overthrow you? See how shit turned out in Egypt and Tunisia, which were two of the most education-focused countries in North Africa). If you give these governments money, except for a very small group of African countries who are legit trying to be democratic and open, they'll just put it in their pocket and use it to buy more weapons and shit. And (2) European countries have little interest to develop the economy of African/Middle-East countries, because this means more indigenous businesses competing with European businesses. And even on the political level, when you see how people react when a European brand is bought by a Chinese or Qatari group, or how people react currently to the Euro crisis, can you imagine how they would react if Europe announced that they'll give a big sum to support the North African economy? That'd be giving far-right parties the sword with which they'd kill tolerance and democracy. I agree that it would be the ideal solution (additionally, their economies no longer relying on tourism would be a huge huge blow to terrorism), but it seems very hard if not impossible to put in place in practice. Additionally, I'd like to point out that the Australian immigration policy is imo not good. When people are at sea on a boat that's not reliable, there's a direct risk for their lives. I agree that the immigration waves should be controlled - even for their own good, because right now all the deaths that happen between NAfrica and Italy are just plain stupid and sad -, but when there's a risk to the lives of the refugees, yes, they should be taken onto the European soil instead of turning the boat back only for it to sink. However, what should be done are important actions directly in the countries from which these boats originate, to prevent them from taking the see. Obviously that would require an important commitment, and the European countries are clearly not ready to do that, sadly. And yeah Sarkozy did a lot of dumb shit, we can agree on that. And don't be too happy, there's a decent chance (I'd say ~20%) that he'll come back to presidency in 2017. On June 29 2015 23:50 ThomasjServo wrote: It is interesting to see the immigration debate in the EU. As far as refugee's go, we've been seeing a lot about the Italian issues with I think it was Libyan specifically boats sailing to Italian shores, or more commonly, not making it. This has been playing out in the states in a similar fashion with Mexico specifically and the Coyotes (people paid to help sneak people into the US) for years and years. That being said, we obviously don't have the same social safety nets that make the EU or at least certain EU countries a more appealing destination (beyond the geographic considerations) Is Spain in a similar boat? I've not heard about similar issues crossing the straight into Southern Spain. Spain is another kind of thing afaik. The people you hear about who try to go to Italy these days are mainly coming from Libya, which means that they are either fleeing the post-Kadhafi Libya, or from the rest of Africa. To Spain, there are immigrants who come from the rest of Africa too, but they have to cross the Sahara ; and Libya is much more "central" compared to Morocco, thus way closer for most immigrants than Morocco. But some immigrants try the Moroccan/Spanish route, although they are mainly lone wolves and not big group of people in boats. | ||
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