Note: This is my second editorial/column about ProGaming. Check out my first, Top 10 Moments from Shinhan3 OSL, here.
ProGaming needs more personality, the bigger the better. It needs less robot players and cookie-cutter interview answers. How exciting would matches be if they all had the energy and subplots of Savior calling out the entire OGN team, or when TT threw his headphones off and stormed out of the room after go.go used the c-bug? Nobody gets excited about Ever)P(TT and random ugly Terran go.go, but how much would you love to watch that rematch? The quality of a crazy emotional game doesn’t matter at all. We want to see TT get his revenge, or angrily explode after a loss. That’s even better than a great game of BW.
That’s why my favorite players are Chalrenge and Savior, and my least favorite are Midas and Bifrost. Never mind that pressure and big situations bring the best out of the first two and the last two are world-class choke artists. Chalrenge and Savior have personality. They give interesting answers, they are confident, they are guys you’d want to go out and get a drink with. Who would want to hang out with Midas other than to have him do your math homework, teach you a TvP build order, or cook you dinner? In fact, Bifrost should call Midas up, as he undoubtedly has consumed all editable materials in the OGN house. Judging by his growing waistline, it’s like he’s trying to apply his gaming strategy to real life—his diet is literally the BW equivalent of triple cc’ing.
But I digress. What I really want to talk is an increasing trend: player ceremonies. Before, we’d get a fist pump, or a neck roll, or something equally discreet, but now we have NaDa pointing to a ghost fourth badge or Boxer doing this:
Just when you thought he couldn’t be more pimp, Boxer cleverly uses a prop and a pun.
We even have ProGamers responding to each other with ceremonies after feeling disrespected. Savior’s JJu-neckroll was the only the start, check out the back and forth between Chalrenge and Midas.
Chalrenge looks smooth and badass after an MSL Survivor win.
Midas awkwardly attempts to respond by duplicating the ceremony. Note that Midas is not alive in either Starleague. Yes, I realize that has nothing to do with the vid.
Will these ceremonies escalate? Can we expect to see even more bravado, creativity, and personality in the upcoming StarLeagues? More Chalrengish, less socially challenged ProGamers would attract a ton more fans and hype. Here are my suggestions of how to make player ceremonies even more badass.
The Costume ProGamers should embrace their IDs and nicknames and become self promoters. I had suggested before that Shark should come out with a big cardboard fin on his head, and just start uncontrollably biting people to the “Jaws” music. Imagine after a win, Savior dresses up like Jesus and screams “THOU SHALT NOT BEAT MA JAE!!!” or Boxer punches his opponent in the face. Imagine iloveoov coming out in a gorilla suit and throwing bananas everywhere. Or a Much/Foru 2v2 team that after a victory always yells "TOO MUCH... FOR U!?!" Or even crazier, imagine July dying his hair red and dressing up like a giant watermelon—oh wait.
The Prophecy Shirt Brood originally suggested this idea. A player, after a win, would rip off their uniform to reveal a message written on a t-shirt underneath. Imagine, after Bisu’s remarkable win versus Savior in the GomTV MSL Finals, if he ripped of his HERO uniform and underneath was a shirt that said “3-0’d NOOB”? Bisu would be a king for an entire generation. Taking this a step further, ProGamers can reveal “REAVER DROP” or “MY PROXY” or "UR 4 POOL SUXOR" on their shirts after successfully executing or defeating a strategy.
The Gloat Charades Okay picture a Terran player who is about to wraith rush. His first two wraiths pop out, and as they arrive at his opponent’s unprepared base, HE also arrives at his opponents computer, with perfect timing, his arms spread out like an airplane. He makes little guns with his hands and says “pew pew!!!” as his wraiths slaughter workers. Other examples include throwing a large black blanket over someone as his cloaked wraiths kill carriers, or handcuffing someone to their seat as his BC’s are being locked down, or even throwing radioactive waste at someone as his units are irradiated. How can any StarCraft player successfully respond to that sort of psychological warfare? It’s not only entertaining, it’s a foolproof strategy.
The Kill Bill Taunt If there’s sufficient hate between players, they should take the taunting one step further. Anything is fair game here, team, family, etc. Imagine in Bisu and Savior’s rematch, after Savior gets revenge, he throws his computer monitor through the booth, into the crowd, knocking Bisu’s father unconscious. Savior calls it the “Generational Hydra Rush.” Or even better, instead of just happily accepting his trophy over GoodFriend at the end of EVER2 OSL, July wades into the stands and physically consumes GoodFriend’s sister, much like a defiler would. Who wouldn’t watch that?
So the next time you watch a match, don’t cheer for the nice, boring guy. Cheer for gamers like Chalrenge, because more wins for him mean more ceremonies for all of us, and one step closer to seeing someone’s sister being devoured on a live stream.
Edit: Amazingly, two of the ceremonies I've described have actually happened after I wrote this:
Upmagic's Fire Palm
Samsung KHAN's 2v2 shirts
Edit2: From now on, I urge everyone to never actually write "Chalrenge". Instead, use this gif:
If I had to list a third favorite player after Chalrenge and Savior it'd be oov. If I had to list a third hated player after Midas and Bifrost it'd be Yellow, but he barely qualifies as a BW player anymore.
edit: And someone has just informed me that Zeus did the shirt thing before, something like "C U @ PUSAN" or whatever (Pusan, I'm guessing, is where the finals were scheduled to be held?) Therefore Zeus is now in my favorite players list.
On May 11 2007 23:10 Hot_Bid wrote: If I had to list a third favorite player after Chalrenge and Savior it'd be oov. If I had to list a third hated player after Midas and Bifrost it'd be Yellow, but he barely qualifies as a BW player anymore.
edit: And someone has just informed me that Zeus did the shirt thing before, something like "C U @ PUSAN" or whatever (Pusan, I'm guessing, is where the finals were scheduled to be held?) Therefore Zeus is now in my favorite players list.
yeah i heard that zeus was famous for his ceremonies before they got very popular
Awesome article. Ironically I liked Midas even moreso after showing his pussy-whipped-sans-the-pussy attitude and lack of finesse in anything moderately social or vocal.
i like TT after beating midas, he's clearly embarrased doing it, but he knows what the crowd wants.
another favorite is Silver/Rock after beating MBC. while it's not really a ceremony, they're so pumped up it's redicilous. the fact that they both suck (except for this one game) only makes it better =)
On May 12 2007 08:57 Aepplet wrote: i like TT after beating midas, he's clearly embarrased doing it, but he knows what the crowd wants.
another favorite is Silver/Rock after beating MBC. while it's not really a ceremony, they're so pumped up it's redicilous. the fact that they both suck (except for this one game) only makes it better =)
Yeah TTs neckroll was cool. I guess it was because of Midas history of picking JJu in his group all the time. And the Rock Silver thing I was like "WTF ? They practiced on Rock jumping on Silver like that or what ? Gayness "
Chalrenge is hilarious.
But yeah the coolest thus far is UpMagics Magic-trick What did he do anyway ? Fill his hand with lighter gas, put fire on, and then burn a napkin ?
Although it might be funny, this reminds me all too much of the World Poker Tour. There\'s always some Dominican or somebody who does something in this manner, and when I saw it, I felt pretty weird (I have no idea how to explain this in English T_T)
On May 11 2007 23:10 Hot_Bid wrote: If I had to list a third favorite player after Chalrenge and Savior it'd be oov. If I had to list a third hated player after Midas and Bifrost it'd be Yellow, but he barely qualifies as a BW player anymore.
edit: And someone has just informed me that Zeus did the shirt thing before, something like "C U @ PUSAN" or whatever (Pusan, I'm guessing, is where the finals were scheduled to be held?) Therefore Zeus is now in my favorite players list.
Or even better, instead of just happily accepting his trophy over GoodFriend at the end of EVER2 OSL, July wades into the stands and physically consumes GoodFriend’s sister, much like a defiler would. Who wouldn’t watch that?
Why do you guys always pick on poor GooDFrienD? On another note. I'd hit it. I'd consume it. I'd harass it. Etc etc.
On May 12 2007 19:36 Hot_Bid wrote: because goodfriend is amazingly mediocre and boring, and never wins anything major
how different would things be if he won that EVER2 final vs July?
But didn't july dress like a watermelon during that finals? Which means it's an automatic win for July XD
nah July had his watermelon outfit against Reach in 2004 Gillette OSL finals (which he won 3-1). He had the standard uniform for EVER 2.
I think that although Chalrenge is definitely a hilarious and entertaining character, if everyone acted in a similar manner then the fun of watching him would be diminished. But that somewhat goes without saying, I guess.
I personally can't blame Midas for doing such ridiculous ceremonies because they look like exactly what I would do if I were a progamer, given my dorky nervousness.
Am I the only one that's against all of these pre-made ceremonies? It seems a bit over the top to me, taking away from the essence of progaming. Don't get me wrong, I think that progaming as a whole needs more charisma and emotion, but doing a magic trick? Boxer's fist pump after making the most ridiculous comeback in BW history against Pusan is what I like to see. Having a team win in a proleague match and just jump with pure passion and fury is worth more than any "hump-the-air" motion a player can make. Raw, unrefined actions.
On May 12 2007 22:25 Evilmonkey. wrote: Am I the only one that's against all of these pre-made ceremonies?
Nah, I don't like them, either. I just think that they look stupid and immature, though. Nobody applauds professional athletes when they act like jackasses and take cheap shots at their competitors. I don't see why gamers should be any different.
Put it this way: Nobody (with a brain) says that the NFL needs more people like Terrell Owens. Nobody saw him run to midfield, dance around on the Cowboys' logo, and said, "Man, that's what we need more of. People stirring up controversy and animosity, making better television and getting the fans riled up."
It isn't that hard to show people a little respect and be civil. Really. This isn't to say that people shouldn't celebrate; of course they should. That's what you do when you win. But you don't have to rub it in the face of the people you just beat. There are plenty of ways to win, celebrate, and not act like a dick.
No one complains about football (soccer) celebrations and sometimes fans are on the player's side when they are penalised for going over the top. Players like Peter Crouch are famous for their 'ceremonies'. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goal_celebration
It's not like Chalrenge is walking over and laughing at Midas in his face after he lost. He is celebrating and acknowledging his fans.
On May 12 2007 22:25 Evilmonkey. wrote: Am I the only one that's against all of these pre-made ceremonies?
Nah, I don't like them, either. I just think that they look stupid and immature, though. Nobody applauds professional athletes when they act like jackasses and take cheap shots at their competitors. I don't see why gamers should be any different.
Put it this way: Nobody (with a brain) says that the NFL needs more people like Terrell Owens. Nobody saw him run to midfield, dance around on the Cowboys' logo, and said, "Man, that's what we need more of. People stirring up controversy and animosity, making better television and getting the fans riled up."
It isn't that hard to show people a little respect and be civil. Really. This isn't to say that people shouldn't celebrate; of course they should. That's what you do when you win. But you don't have to rub it in the face of the people you just beat. There are plenty of ways to win, celebrate, and not act like a dick.
Try not to speak for everyone please because the more dickish a ceremony the better for me. And when I see Terrell Owens doing funny shit I say to myself, dear god I want more of that (not really but if I actually watched football I probably would).
"People stirring up controversy and animosity, making better television and getting the fans riled up." Controversy isn't boring like civility is (people don't watch Canadian parliament, they watch Jerry Springer), I don't care about animosity because it's just a fucking game and the losers are getting paid to play it too, and the key phrase here is better television which is one of the only things I care about when I'm watching TV.
There's one ceremony that i HATE : This is what Chal_renge did to midas. And no i don't like midas but what chalrenge did to him was utterly awful. One of the worst immature ceremony i've ever seen in my life. If for some reason i was in midas' place i'd definitely punch him on his face. Hell i'd even do it if i was a spectator T_T
Seriously chal_renge go to f*cking hell and stop acting childish... I mean com'on how shameful it is...
Chalrenge's ceremony was fucking badass. I don't know if anyone else would have pulled it better. Yeah it might have been a bit cocky but that's what made it so good, can't see anything childish in it. I think you're mistaking him with Midas there.
No i'm not mistaking, what chal_renge did was as you say REALLY cocky and has NOTHING to do with victory pose. If you don't see it's childish then u've watched way too many pokemon sir.
I don't see anything childish, it's just a victory ceremony. Even Midas tried to respond to that but failed miserably, now that's childish. You pay too much attention. And I've never watched pokemon.
Seriously watching him doing this awful ceremony, is like seeing a child saying : "man did you see that ? I'm just too strong for you, you can't do anything against me just give up."
Edit : And i've NEVER seen that on any professional sport. Even Guillermo coria when he was toying at Rolland Garros is like nothing compared to his.
On May 13 2007 10:05 RaiZ wrote: Seriously watching him doing this awful ceremony, is like seeing a child saying : "man did you see that ? I'm just too strong for you, you can't do anything against me just give up."
Edit : And i've NEVER seen that on any professional sport. Even Guillermo coria when he was toying at Rolland Garros is like nothing compared to his.
lol are you kidding? chalrenge just makes a hand gesture and walks off, and thats suddenly like insulting midas' ancestors or something. he beat one of the best tvp players in the world, makes a grand gesture, and somehow it's awful and childish? its fucking AWESOME is what it is, when i saw that it instantly made chalrenge one of my favorite players.
you're actually comparing it to tennis, where the crowd has to be quiet and the players have to wear certain clothes. tennis is more like golf, where the fans have to behave a certain way and be quiet while the match is being played. when you look at other more crowd-intense sports like soccer, football, etc, you have the crowd chanting if victoria beckham does anal, holding signs that kobe is a rapist, etc. terrell owens pulled out sharpie and signed a ball he caught for a TD. if chalrenge's hand gesture is the worst thing you've seen you havent watched enough sports.
someone post a vid of the samsung 2v2 team.
and who was dissing on terrell owens? yes hes a dick and a bad player to have on your team, but him and chad johnson and steve smith's endzone celebrations are absolutely great for their fans.
fans and progamers are forgetting that if they hate someone's ceremonies, theres a very easy way to stop them from doing it: BEAT THEM.
Anyone know what Chalrenge's ceremony means by the way? Some people seem to think it was really offensive towards Midas but I don't even know what he is doing ... it just looks cool with his cocky smile. Also the commentators laughing always makes me laugh too.
edit: Hot Bid just posted right before me saying it was just a simple hand gesture. I was wondering why people like RaiZ thought this ceremony was so bad, if there's more to it, but if there's not then stop overreacting -.-
Anyone know what Chalrenge's ceremony means by the way? Some people seem to think it was really offensive towards Midas but I don't even know what he is doing ... it just looks cool with his cocky smile. Also the commentators laughing always makes me laugh too.
edit: Hot Bid just posted right before me saying it was just a simple hand gesture. I was wondering why people like RaiZ thought this ceremony was so bad, if there's more to it, but if there's not then stop overreacting -.-
My thoughts exactly. The ceremony was something like: He tapped his chest, kissed his fist, then it seemed like he striked his arm to the left and pointed at the monitor. I don't see what's the big deal here.
Anyone know what Chalrenge's ceremony means by the way? Some people seem to think it was really offensive towards Midas but I don't even know what he is doing ... it just looks cool with his cocky smile. Also the commentators laughing always makes me laugh too.
edit: Hot Bid just posted right before me saying it was just a simple hand gesture. I was wondering why people like RaiZ thought this ceremony was so bad, if there's more to it, but if there's not then stop overreacting -.-
My thoughts exactly. The ceremony was something like: He tapped his chest, kissed his fist, then it seemed like he striked his arm to the left and pointed at the monitor. I don't see what's the big deal here.
It was a sacred Korean taunt that means "Demons shall dine on the souls of your ancestors and all that is good and honorable in your family name shall be disgraced and I shall burn your fields and hear the lamentations of your women."
OMG i didn't know midas' attempt would be that embarrasing. Damn i feel bad for him. Dude, c'mon, get some pride here. And i used to think he was cool. What a dumbass i was.
first: people stop with the ass kissing; yes the writting was good but the ideea is completely futile. Hot_bid your perspective is wrong: a ceremony does not make a progamer have a personality (and it does not enhance his bw skills), it's the other way arround. Ones progamer personality dictates his ceremony or the lack of. To demand a ceremony from a progamer just for entertaining purpose it's demeaning and to see them differently because they choose not to do a ceremony is discriminatory. As an individual it's fair to have such thoughts, ideeas but when you try to make them rules that needed to be followed it's wrong, egoisthic. The game itself should be entertaining for you but i guess if you want more you can have the booth girls wear pompoms and shake their asses on a M. Bolton song.
On May 13 2007 15:00 xM(Z wrote: first: people stop with the ass kissing; yes the writting was good but the ideea is completely futile. Hot_bid your perspective is wrong: a ceremony does not make a progamer have a personality (and it does not enhance his bw skills), it's the other way arround. Ones progamer personality dictates his ceremony or the lack of. To demand a ceremony from a progamer just for entertaining purpose it's demeaning and to see them differently because they choose not to do a ceremony is discriminatory. As an individual it's fair to have such thoughts, ideeas but when you try to make them rules that needed to be followed it's wrong, egoisthic. The game itself should be entertaining for you but i guess if you want more you can have the booth girls wear pompoms and shake their asses on a M. Bolton song.
When is the last time you wrote anything original and interesting to contribute to the site?
On May 13 2007 15:00 xM(Z wrote: first: people stop with the ass kissing; yes the writting was good but the ideea is completely futile. Hot_bid your perspective is wrong: a ceremony does not make a progamer have a personality (and it does not enhance his bw skills), it's the other way arround. Ones progamer personality dictates his ceremony or the lack of. To demand a ceremony from a progamer just for entertaining purpose it's demeaning and to see them differently because they choose not to do a ceremony is discriminatory. As an individual it's fair to have such thoughts, ideeas but when you try to make them rules that needed to be followed it's wrong, egoisthic. The game itself should be entertaining for you but i guess if you want more you can have the booth girls wear pompoms and shake their asses on a M. Bolton song.
did i say i looked down upon progamers who didn't do a ceremony? i said i didn't like progamers who were boring, had no personality, and choked during pressure situations.
nowhere did i make set rules for progamers to follow. the four bullet points were even made in a joking way, you really think i want july to actually go out and be a cannibal? where is the egotism? have you ever read an article written with an opinion? what is wrong with what i said?
i'm not demanding all progamers have a ceremony, i'm just cheering for those that have good, non-boring personalities (good ceremonies add to this).
i do find the game itself entertaining (just read the first article i wrote) but player rivalries and ceremonies make it even more emotional, which is good because it sparks even more interest.
regardless of whether my views are "right" or not (its an opinion) i'm just going to have to disagree with you such an idea is "completely futile" and "wrong, egoisthic" because there's no there's no "discrimination, egotism, or demeanging stuff". i'm just having fun writing about progaming, i suggest you lighten up and do the same.
On May 13 2007 15:00 xM(Z wrote: first: people stop with the ass kissing; yes the writting was good but the ideea is completely futile. Hot_bid your perspective is wrong: a ceremony does not make a progamer have a personality (and it does not enhance his bw skills), it's the other way arround. Ones progamer personality dictates his ceremony or the lack of. To demand a ceremony from a progamer just for entertaining purpose it's demeaning and to see them differently because they choose not to do a ceremony is discriminatory. As an individual it's fair to have such thoughts, ideeas but when you try to make them rules that needed to be followed it's wrong, egoisthic. The game itself should be entertaining for you but i guess if you want more you can have the booth girls wear pompoms and shake their asses on a M. Bolton song.
When is the last time you wrote anything original and interesting to contribute to the site?
I see your point and i agree with you but that means i should bow my head and silence my writting just because Hot_bid had an ideea? That is not disrespect, and some constructive criticism didn't hurt nobody.
To me it sounded like you wanted to transforme a live match in a progamer drama competition.
ProGaming needs more personality, the bigger the better. It needs less robot players and cookie-cutter interview answers. ... We want to see TT get his revenge, or angrily explode after a loss. That’s even better than a great game of BW.
You should have personalise the post to make it funny. My mistake was probably seing to much in to the future: goodfriend doing a raindance, oov- scratching like a monkey with a banana in his mouth and other circus stuff like that. If i've missed-getting it, i do apologise.
-_- where does it, in the part you quote, imply that i want to transform it into a drama competition?
like you actually think oov is going to come out in a gorilla suit and throw bananas? or that savior is going to throw a monitor at bisu's father?
edit: oh i see, where i write "even better than a great game of BW"
i thought it was implied that it would make it even better in addition to a great game of BW. im saying rivalries and personalities make boring games worth watching and great games even greater
now i feel really shitty that you have to explain your post to me. i just like to add this: when you use "we want" it's tricky, it feels like you put words, ideeas in to peoples minds, you override theirs and the vanity gets the best of them (they start bitchin'). But when you use "i want" you are the leader and people will follow you, in joke or w/e; also when you use the third person "he does", as in "a story about a protoss user" people will identify with your writing and again they will follow, embrace your ideea.
On May 13 2007 16:18 xM(Z wrote: now i feel really shitty that you have to explain your post to me. i just like to add this: when you use "we want" it's tricky, it feels like you put words, ideeas in to peoples minds, you override theirs and the vanity gets the best of them (they start bitchin'). But when you use "i want" you are the leader and people will follow you, in joke or w/e; also when you use the third person "he does", as in "a story about a protoss user" people will identify with your writing and again they will follow, embrace your ideea.
oh, i think then you are just misinterpreting it.
i mean when someone posts "we love you savior!!!" in a savior hype thread i don't think its intended to mean that all people should love savior and that the poster is trying to project his love for savior into everyone else's brain.
just like when i write "we want more personality!" means "we" as in everyone who agrees with me. it's not an aggressive "we" that tries to impress opinions into fact or force views onto others. if you read any opinion writing, they write in absolutes, like "ceremonies are great!" rather than "i believe ceremonies are great!" because since its my writing, its assumed that it's my opinion. i'm not writing facts in a dictionary or encyclopedia but rather just what i think.
Honesttea wrote "Birds fly, dogs die, people fuck, and Savior wins." in his blog entry about perfection, but clearly not all birds fly and savior doesn't always win. Writing "In my humble opinion, all non-ostrich birds fly, dogs die, non virgins fuck, and savior wins most of the time." kind of kills the effect of the writing right?
i wouldn't be offended so much by my wording. if you disagree with me, that's fine, we can talk about it on the forum, but you're just reading way too much into a "we want".
not everyone is going to agree with me, and i don't expect them to. thats why stuff like the power rankings and this article are fun to discuss--they provide a very direct, opinionated view, rather than boring lists of statistics and facts.
Boxer putting one hand in the air after his amazing comeback vs pusan was plenty. Nowadays its getting really stupid. Back in the day only the very best would have any sort of emotion shown, and only after doing something truly epic.
Nada's im a little teacup right after he 3-2ed anytime winning with a fac port was plenty, Pusan throwing his jacket off was a little off of the top, but a fucking magic trick, you have to be shitting me.
I personally don't know how anyone could think that any celebration is over the top. These people are not just being paid to play starcraft, they are also being used for advertising and other things. The more personality that these people have the better they are going to sell.
Although arrogance can be a turn off if used all the time, these people get like 10 seconds of fame after they win a game. The camera focuses on them, and instead of being the boring progamer who wins time after time - give us something worthwhile to watch!
So, all in all, I like the revolution of the ceremonies. Hopefully they continue to get better as the gamers don't just compete for winning matches but also pulling off the best ceremony.
On May 13 2007 18:01 oshibori_probe wrote: Boxer putting one hand in the air after his amazing comeback vs pusan was plenty. Nowadays its getting really stupid. Back in the day only the very best would have any sort of emotion shown, and only after doing something truly epic.
Nada's im a little teacup right after he 3-2ed anytime winning with a fac port was plenty, Pusan throwing his jacket off was a little off of the top, but a fucking magic trick, you have to be shitting me.
i don't think you fully understood it. his ID is "up.magic" so he did a magic trick. now you understand and can appreciate just how deep the celebration was.
On May 13 2007 10:05 RaiZ wrote: Seriously watching him doing this awful ceremony, is like seeing a child saying : "man did you see that ? I'm just too strong for you, you can't do anything against me just give up."
Edit : And i've NEVER seen that on any professional sport. Even Guillermo coria when he was toying at Rolland Garros is like nothing compared to his.
lol are you kidding? chalrenge just makes a hand gesture and walks off, and thats suddenly like insulting midas' ancestors or something. he beat one of the best tvp players in the world, makes a grand gesture, and somehow it's awful and childish? its fucking AWESOME is what it is, when i saw that it instantly made chalrenge one of my favorite players.
Awesome ? Tell me where it's awesome. All i see is that chalrenge is way to arrogant and what he did with the hand gesture was worse :X I mean for all the vods i've watched for a very long time, the chalrenge's ceremony was one of the worst i could ever think of. It is insulting not only midas' ancestors but also midas himself. I don't like midas but i don't hate him either, now Chalrenge is just a retard for doing this ceremony. That's what i think of him, and i'm pretty sure i'd not be the only one to think of that. It wasn't awesome, it was simply disturbing. And when you know the chalrenge's past you'd not be surprised that his nickname is 18 toss and with this .gif someone gave us where chalrenge was really immature, what else could i think ? If i was his father or mother especially with an asian culture i'd be really embarrassed. Seriously i don't fucking see where it is aweseome... If you want an awesome ceremony, i suggest you to watch Boxer vs Joyo again and again and again, this sir, is a very handsome gesture. And i don't think joyo felt offended by seeing boxer doing this since he clearly deserved it. Chalrenge ? Oh yeah he just won 1 game against him. Yeah now he really need to show us wtf how good he is. I don't say that he's not good whatsoever but did he really needed to show this fucking gesture ? Come'on he's just arrogant.
fans and progamers are forgetting that if they hate someone's ceremonies, theres a very easy way to stop them from doing it: BEAT THEM.
That sounds a little immature but that's what public want, i agree. It's just simply sad that nowadays nobody respects the others players.
On May 14 2007 07:39 RaiZ wrote: Awesome ? Tell me where it's awesome. All i see is that chalrenge is way to arrogant and what he did with the hand gesture was worse :X I mean for all the vods i've watched for a very long time, the chalrenge's ceremony was one of the worst i could ever think of. It is insulting not only midas' ancestors but also midas himself. I don't like midas but i don't hate him either, now Chalrenge is just a retard for doing this ceremony. That's what i think of him, and i'm pretty sure i'd not be the only one to think of that. It wasn't awesome, it was simply disturbing. And when you know the chalrenge's past you'd not be surprised that his nickname is 18 toss and with this .gif someone gave us where chalrenge was really immature, what else could i think ?
Again, you have not given a real reason other than that you somehow believe ProGamers should act like golf players. So he gloated and was arrogant, and I believe that is awesome compared to the boring, personality-less others. Where is there a code that states that he has to behave a certain way after a match? It seems that you just simply are very conservative when it comes to things like this. Some people will be like you and think it is immature and 'disturbing' while others will celebrate it and think it is awesome.
If i was his father or mother especially with an asian culture i'd be really embarrassed.
why? what do you mean "especially with asian culture?" i don't see how chalrenge being asian has anything to do with it.
Seriously i don't fucking see where it is aweseome... If you want an awesome ceremony, i suggest you to watch Boxer vs Joyo again and again and again, this sir, is a very handsome gesture. And i don't think joyo felt offended by seeing boxer doing this since he clearly deserved it. Chalrenge ? Oh yeah he just won 1 game against him. Yeah now he really need to show us wtf how good he is. I don't say that he's not good whatsoever but did he really needed to show this fucking gesture ? Come'on he's just arrogant.
so you're saying if chalrenge beat joyo he can do that gesture? or is only boxer's type of fist pump ok? maybe you should start a committee that evaluates the ceremonies and punishes players if the gesture is too arrogant or offensive to you, or if it doesn't occur after a match you think is "important" enough. i don't care if chalrenge does a crazy ceremony after every single practice game win. until Kespa bans them, ceremonies are legal and injects fun into matches. there's no special etiquette that has to be followed.
let me let you in on a secret: all progamers are amazingly arrogant. all of them, every single one. just because they don't show it on tv doesn't mean they are nice, humble guys. to get where they are, at the top of the mountain, you have to be ridiculously confident and cocky in your abilities or you'll never get there. just ask rekrul, or uhjoo, or anyone who is close those top gamers. sure some are more cocky than others (chalrenge) but don't just assume he's some special crazy case.
That sounds a little immature but that's what public want, i agree. It's just simply sad that nowadays nobody respects the others players.
there's two ways to see this. 1. player loses to chalrenge, sees his ceremony, and says "he is so arrogant and disrespected me, he is immature!!!" and cries and whines and acts like a pussy.
OR
2. player loses to chalrenge, sees his ceremony, gets pissed, practices harder, and the next time he plays chalrenge he fucking owns him, and then goes "fuck you chalrenge" and does his own badass ceremony to get revenge.
now which one, as a fan, would you like to see? which one as a player would you respect more?
Which part of the ceremony was so offensive? You seem to think he pointed at Midas at the end but he pointed at the monitor. Pointing at Midas would have deffinately been offensive. If his ceremony was so "offensive" he would have gotten a warning or something and the commentators wouldn't have laughed about it.
maybe you should start a committee that evaluates the ceremonies and punishes players if the gesture is too arrogant or offensive to you, or if it doesn't occur after a match you think is "important" enough.
I think we should start a committee to rate the ceremonies. And since none are offensive, the worse they are the more points they get right?
On May 14 2007 11:49 bErAtEd- wrote: I think we should start a committee to rate the ceremonies. And since none are offensive, the worse they are the more points they get right?
you are right. none have been offensive so far. however i disagree with you that bad ceremonies should get more points. good ceremonies should get more points. that is how ratings should work.
hence i would rate boxer and chalrenge's ceremonies over midas'. why don't you start the thread and the committee? that would be fun to rate them.
why would you want to give the worse ones like midas' more points? thats dumb.
On May 14 2007 11:49 bErAtEd- wrote: I think we should start a committee to rate the ceremonies. And since none are offensive, the worse they are the more points they get right?
you are right. none have been offensive so far. however i disagree with you that bad ceremonies should get more points. good ceremonies should get more points. that is how ratings should work.
hence i would rate boxer and chalrenge's ceremonies over midas'. why don't you start the thread and the committee? that would be fun to rate them.
why would you want to give the worse ones like midas' more points? thats dumb.
by worse I mean more offensive...it was half joking Shitty Ceremonies actually should receive negative points, i.e. midas
which ones do you think are offensive? honestly none of them have been. the 3-0 is kind of pushing it, and had chalrenge pointed at midas instead of his monitor it would've been kind of insulting. but so far none really.
in fact, if i was an opponent, i'd be more offended if they did that stupid heart shit on top of their head or made some dumb facial hand signals than if they did that upmagic magic trick.
I agree. I don't see any of them being offensive by my own judgment. Over the course of the past couple years though and learning about the Korean culture though, a young arrogant player could easily cross the bounds by their standards.
My own thoughts: the more offensive the better. It can only help competition as you've already stated. If you don't want to get tourismed, you quit early. If you don't wanna get Chalrenged, you beat him
on some level it dumbs down rivalries when the players like each other.
like we see savior and nal_ra or boxer and yellow hanging out at some random progamer gathering, does that diminish their competition? i think it does a bit.
if they never spoke to each other and hated each others guts would we enjoy the rivalry even more? ie if progaming was less of a brotherhood and more of a cutthroat player vs player?
for example, if they had a tournament where the final winner gets a contract to CJ, and the finals were like draco vs testie or idra vs smuft or some random rivalry with lots of anger/hate/whatever behind it and something big at stake, wouldn't you love to watch that on TV? even if the quality wasn't that great?
And nothing would be better than Savior getting ready to play an OGN Member in Starleague walking out on stage with an OGN shirt on and he turns around and on the back it says Who's Next?
or bisu dressing up like a ninja and when they show his booth, there's nobody there, and then they cut to the zerg's booth and bisu's already inside, killing drones
On May 14 2007 12:22 bErAtEd- wrote: And nothing would be better than Savior getting ready to play an OGN Member in Starleague walking out on stage with an OGN shirt on and he turns around and on the back it says Who's Next?
Now THAT would be over the top hahaha, I think we would see some fists thrown.
On May 14 2007 12:22 bErAtEd- wrote: And nothing would be better than Savior getting ready to play an OGN Member in Starleague walking out on stage with an OGN shirt on and he turns around and on the back it says Who's Next?
Now THAT would be over the top hahaha, I think we would see some fists thrown.
But isn't that all for the greater good of the sport. Creating drama and bringing people closer together (even if it is only so they could take a better shot at you). I guess this is just the American side of me, no boundaries
I mean seriously how funny would it be during a live broadcast of starcraft to hear the commentators: *Quotes Espn Commentators* And We've got dram-a
Nah it doesn't have to go that far. I mainly just like it because you don't have to understand korean to appreciate the ceremonies. Makes the broadcasts even more enjoyable to a non-korean speaker.
On May 14 2007 12:24 Hot_Bid wrote: or bisu dressing up like a ninja and when they show his booth, there's nobody there, and then they cut to the zerg's booth and bisu's already inside, killing drones
On May 13 2007 10:05 RaiZ wrote: Seriously watching him doing this awful ceremony, is like seeing a child saying : "man did you see that ? I'm just too strong for you, you can't do anything against me just give up."
Edit : And i've NEVER seen that on any professional sport. Even Guillermo coria when he was toying at Rolland Garros is like nothing compared to his.
lol are you kidding? chalrenge just makes a hand gesture and walks off, and thats suddenly like insulting midas' ancestors or something. he beat one of the best tvp players in the world, makes a grand gesture, and somehow it's awful and childish? its fucking AWESOME is what it is, when i saw that it instantly made chalrenge one of my favorite players.
Awesome ? Tell me where it's awesome. All i see is that chalrenge is way to arrogant and what he did with the hand gesture was worse :X I mean for all the vods i've watched for a very long time, the chalrenge's ceremony was one of the worst i could ever think of. It is insulting not only midas' ancestors but also midas himself. I don't like midas but i don't hate him either, now Chalrenge is just a retard for doing this ceremony. That's what i think of him, and i'm pretty sure i'd not be the only one to think of that. It wasn't awesome, it was simply disturbing. And when you know the chalrenge's past you'd not be surprised that his nickname is 18 toss and with this .gif someone gave us where chalrenge was really immature, what else could i think ? If i was his father or mother especially with an asian culture i'd be really embarrassed. Seriously i don't fucking see where it is aweseome... If you want an awesome ceremony, i suggest you to watch Boxer vs Joyo again and again and again, this sir, is a very handsome gesture. And i don't think joyo felt offended by seeing boxer doing this since he clearly deserved it. Chalrenge ? Oh yeah he just won 1 game against him. Yeah now he really need to show us wtf how good he is. I don't say that he's not good whatsoever but did he really needed to show this fucking gesture ? Come'on he's just arrogant.
Either RaiZ is trying to be satirically funny (hopefully) or he is utterly insane. So if I beat you at a GAME and make some random hand gesture showing victory I am not only insulting you but your ancestors and you are deeply disturbed by it. Just wow.
On May 13 2007 10:05 RaiZ wrote: ...If i was his father or mother especially with an asian culture i'd be really embarrassed.
and apparently its even worse because chalrenge is asian, i mean omfg, asians are supposed to be passive and submissive, how dare he show pride in his victory, leave that for the white people to do, whose parents are understandably proud when their white children do gestures like chalrenge did.
I felt like Midas before, you do something kinda showing off for girls and then you get this 'I'm a retard" look and just kinda stand there with no expression. The commentators were saying he's smiling, not smiling, smiling again, etc. He was nervous, very obvious, I feel bad for him.
I like that costume ceremony, but I think that would piss the other player off and it might not even work, like the wraiths could not be controlled and just die. He would also see what the guys up to by looking at his screen
Fine. What the fuck i'm talking about is Chalrenge need to get punched because of this arrogant gesture he did against midas. And NO no and no it's not even a victory gesture. Man just look at him and tell me how awesome it is. I don't see anything "wow omg this guys has some balls, he's showing to us on this monitor : Victory and a GG from midas, i must respect him so well that he'll become the next progamers we'll hear for a long time".
My god on all my entire life watching vods, i've NEVER seen anything like it. Seriously that was just disturbing and i really hope midas will respond him with a big F*CK YOU when he'll win it. I agree that midas ceremony was even more childish, but man i can't stand Chalrenge.
On May 15 2007 15:27 RaiZ wrote: Fine. What the fuck i'm talking about is Chalrenge need to get punched because of this arrogant gesture he did against midas. And NO no and no it's not even a victory gesture. Man just look at him and tell me how awesome it is. I don't see anything "wow omg this guys has some balls, he's showing to us on this monitor : Victory and a GG from midas, i must respect him so well that he'll become the next progamers we'll hear for a long time".
My god on all my entire life watching vods, i've NEVER seen anything like it. Seriously that was just disturbing and i really hope midas will respond him with a big F*CK YOU when he'll win it. I agree that midas ceremony was even more childish, but man i can't stand Chalrenge.
You really need to get a grip on reality. The game of starcraft is becoming even more competitive these days. It takes extreme amounts of talent to even get close to the top let alone beat the best people. If someone is happy over a celebration and wishes to show some joy, then what is the big deal? He didn't say fuck you midas or flip him the bird or say he wished his mom died.
The next time Mantoss rapes another terran, he should come out of his booth, hold up a bottle of lube, and point to his opponent. That would be so fucking awesome.
On May 15 2007 15:52 Jyvblamo wrote: The next time Mantoss rapes another terran, he should come out of his booth, hold up a bottle of lube, and point to his opponent. That would be so fucking awesome.
lol, ky for the dubb
I would personally be intimidated, that is a lot of man coming at you.
On May 15 2007 15:25 il0seonpurpose wrote: I like that costume ceremony, but I think that would piss the other player off and it might not even work, like the wraiths could not be controlled and just die. He would also see what the guys up to by looking at his screen
i don't know if you for real but you are acting as if the stuff i suggested is serious? it's very clearly just fun joking, i mean you really think i actually want savior to throw a computer monitor at someone's dad and get arrested for assault, or julyzerg to physically cannibalize someone's sister and be charged with murder?
On May 15 2007 15:52 Jyvblamo wrote: The next time Mantoss rapes another terran, he should come out of his booth, hold up a bottle of lube, and point to his opponent. That would be so fucking awesome.
Or he could go into his opponents booth, remove the fan-picture they always have beside their monitor, and replace it with bottles of lube, then give his opponent a clap on the shoulder, go out of the booth, do the chalrenge hipmove, give a wink to the crowd, and go behind the curtains with three hot model chicks fighting to give him a blowjob.
On May 15 2007 15:52 Jyvblamo wrote: The next time Mantoss rapes another terran, he should come out of his booth, hold up a bottle of lube, and point to his opponent. That would be so fucking awesome.
Or he could go into his opponents booth, remove the fan-picture they always have beside their monitor, and replace it with bottles of lube, then give his opponent a clap on the shoulder, go out of the booth, do the chalrenge hipmove, give a wink to the crowd, and go behind the curtains with three hot model chicks fighting to give him a blowjob.
My god you seem to not understand that i've NOTHING wrong with winning ceremony, but was it really a winning ceremony about what chalrenge did ? No. No fucking way. Just look closely at chalrenge before the ceremony : seems like he really wanted to intimidate midas by saying something before doing his ceremony. I'd really like to know what he said at this moment. That's why i'd not be suprised if that was something that would make everyone more upset when being defeated. Even this image prove that he's a retard.
Omg i'm tired of it. I'll stop it now because obviously i'm wasting my time here. :[
On May 15 2007 22:22 RaiZ wrote: My god you seem to not understand that i've NOTHING wrong with winning ceremony, but was it really a winning ceremony about what chalrenge did ? No. No fucking way. Just look closely at chalrenge before the ceremony : seems like he really wanted to intimidate midas by saying something before doing his ceremony.
i honestly don't see why you think what he did after that midas game was so bad, its not a matter of understanding, just many people simply disagree with what you consider an "acceptable" winning ceremony. you are conservative and you want nice gentle happy progamers, while i want strong manly in your face cocky ones. you like midas, while i like chalrenge. its just a difference of preference.
raiz it's players like chalrenge that make a sport fun to watch, i mean, take nada's pointing to his OSL badges. that was clearly saying 'i'm going to win this tournament and get my fourth badge' before he was even in the finals (ironically he lost ), as you said you dont like chalrenge which im sure has more to do with why you hate his ceremonies more then the ceremonie itself . i would much prefer to see ceremonies like chalrenges, nadas and boxers then see the progamer get up, walk out, bow, pack up and leave... wouldn't you?
I agree with RaiZ. What chalrenge shouldve done was give midas a friendly nod to acknowledge it was a good game, and leave the booth. If fact, all players should do that, so that the only way to stand out is by numbers and statistics, because thats what real games are about!
there needs to be a massive progamer that has no team wearing a wife beater doing pushups before matches sweating like a mother fucker and threatening to beat people up mid game if they defeat him
On May 15 2007 22:22 RaiZ wrote: My god you seem to not understand that i've NOTHING wrong with winning ceremony, but was it really a winning ceremony about what chalrenge did ? No. No fucking way. Just look closely at chalrenge before the ceremony : seems like he really wanted to intimidate midas by saying something before doing his ceremony. I'd really like to know what he said at this moment. That's why i'd not be suprised if that was something that would make everyone more upset when being defeated. Even this image prove that he's a retard.
Omg i'm tired of it. I'll stop it now because obviously i'm wasting my time here. :[
I don't think that image shows that he's retard.
He's just copied korean comedian's dance and it was requested by "Sung Jun Mo(Former Progamer and now working as a reporter)"
The cememony he did when he beated midas was same.
How many are out there? Look at him. He's the self confident, never-seem-to-be serious progamer. I don't say we need more types like him, but there is definitly room for one or two of his kind. That gives him a personality beside his playstyle. And if it entertains people he's done half his job for the industry.
If other players get offended by him and pressure themself with a must-win because of his cockiness, well then good for chalrenge. But don't even assume that any of these great players will even blink with an eye when they see him, well besides nada and maybe midas hehe. But players like boxer, nal_ra, reach or oov would just steemroll such a player and leave the player booth.
btw i think nada and midas because they seem to put pressure on themself when it's clearly not necessary.
-.- i would also like more interesting ceremonies, but there has 2 be a limit, cuz things could become totally out of control. like actual brutal fighting
On May 16 2007 20:15 NaDazpwnz3r wrote: -.- i would also like more interesting ceremonies, but there has 2 be a limit, cuz things could become totally out of control. like actual brutal fighting
On May 16 2007 20:15 NaDazpwnz3r wrote: -.- i would also like more interesting ceremonies, but there has 2 be a limit, cuz things could become totally out of control. like actual brutal fighting
people getting strangled with cords and whacked with keyboards.
I don't have any problems with ceremonies, although they should only allow them if the progamers already have their ceremonies planned. No more Midas' please.
On May 16 2007 04:49 Rekrul wrote: there needs to be a massive progamer that has no team wearing a wife beater doing pushups before matches sweating like a mother fucker and threatening to beat people up mid game if they defeat him
It would be like a korean hovz.
i agree tho. wish more dudes would just go nutz. still waiting for someone to break their keyboard in rage.
On May 16 2007 21:52 bErAtEd- wrote: No comments yet ;;
Any one else enjoy the dancing from Khan ??
The minute I saw dude start dancing I shut the fucking video window out of embarassment for the dude. Kinda wish I saw the rest but what I saw was enough. Surprised no one posted a gif in this thread.
On May 16 2007 21:52 bErAtEd- wrote: No comments yet ;;
Any one else enjoy the dancing from Khan ??
The minute I saw dude start dancing I shut the fucking video window out of embarassment for the dude. Kinda wish I saw the rest but what I saw was enough. Surprised no one posted a gif in this thread.
it was more of the same.
his teammate was like "dude, you're embarrassing me", so he stopped.
On May 14 2007 12:24 Hot_Bid wrote: or bisu dressing up like a ninja and when they show his booth, there's nobody there, and then they cut to the zerg's booth and bisu's already inside, killing drones
Haha
Personally I'm for anything that shows more of each progamer's personality. Celebrations, whether stupid, lame, cocky, etc., are all fine by me because they tell you something about that player. Midas had a lame attempt at a celebration, but it showed us a bit of his personality, the shy, self-conscious guy who isn't really comfortable in the spotlight. Chalrenge, whether you liked it or not, showed that he has a bit of showmanship and confidence in him with his celebration.
We identify and nickname progamers based on their their styles of play (their flaws even?) because it gives them a sort of identity and personality beyond their screennames. It makes them more interesting and fun to watch, which is definitely a good thing for the gamers, the fans, and the people running the leagues/tournaments. I think it'd be fine even if a progamer were to do something offensive if they wanted to, they'd just have to be ready for the backlash from the public and other players. With the way the game has developed and how it's becoming harder and harder for gamers to distinguish themselves, I welcome anything that could allow progamers to stand out amongst the crowd and be more than "just another Terran/Zerg/Protoss".
P.S. I'm sorry but Raiz needs to remove the stick up his ass.
On May 16 2007 05:47 Jayson X wrote: How many are out there? Look at him. He's the self confident, never-seem-to-be serious progamer. I don't say we need more types like him, but there is definitly room for one or two of his kind. That gives him a personality beside his playstyle. And if it entertains people he's done half his job for the industry.
If other players get offended by him and pressure themself with a must-win because of his cockiness, well then good for chalrenge. But don't even assume that any of these great players will even blink with an eye when they see him, well besides nada and maybe midas hehe. But players like boxer, nal_ra, reach or oov would just steemroll such a player and leave the player booth.
btw i think nada and midas because they seem to put pressure on themself when it's clearly not necessary.
With how much time they devote to the game, all the interviews where progamers say "i dont have time for a girlfriend", and all the poor practice partners chained to their computers, I say give em a chance to celebrate their wins.
I don't mind the victory dances so long as they don't put down their opponent too much. I don't want progaming to digress into trash talk, taunting, etc... If we are going to consider e-sports as a legitimate sport, then there should be some form of "sportsmanship"
On June 01 2007 00:30 Broken.Mind wrote: I don't mind the victory dances so long as they don't put down their opponent too much. I don't want progaming to digress into trash talk, taunting, etc... If we are going to consider e-sports as a legitimate sport, then there should be some form of "sportsmanship"
you realize that in the NFL, NBA, and other "legitimate sports" there's ridiculous amounts of trash talking and celebration right? there was so much that the leagues had to make rules to limit the amount of celebrating athletes could do
if they ever have an NFL or NBA player with a microphone all game it'd be like constant, demeaning trash talking for the entire time
just look at soccer. after every goal the entire team goes nuts and chases after the goal scoarer. he may even decide to do something crazy like the aeroplane or a flip haha
I think ceremonies are fun and I'm all for them but I also like the fact that the KTF players just do a simple bow when they win. Its like they made a collective decision to go that way and I think it works for them well. A ceremony just wouldn't suit a classy guy like Nal ra. As for that Midas ceremony I actually thought maybe he was trying to satirise ceremonies as being lame by doing a very lame ceremony. But on second thoughts, yeah, it was probably him just being his dorky self.
God I love this thread, the whiners need to just get the fuck out. This is the absolutely best stuff and then wrapped in some candy paper by Hot_Bid himself, like wth <3.
This is the stuff that makes it so much more interesting to actually watch instead of just checking the game results. This and some cool ingame stuff makes me actually wanna watch as many games as I can.
Chalrenge is so my kinda guy haha, best guy :D. Savior's smirk every game is just so damn classic when he beats someone. It's so patronizing, and after that OGN stunt he totally became my hero :p.
Btw mani he so needs to pull that shirt stunt and going whos next haha, it'd all be worth it :D.
This is an excellent thread. I think Hot_Bid does a great job subtly and not-so-subtly highlighting two important things that not everyone may have noticed.
1. Professional SC has many of the elements of professional sports, from both a competitive and an ENTERTAINMENT perspective.
2. Professional SC has many elements NOT found in professional sports, from both a competitive and an entertainment perspective.
Allow me to elaborate. As an ardent fan of the major American sports (basketball, baseball, and football), there is absolutely no question that the following three things attract fans:
1. Stars, Superstars, and Super-Super-Mega-Stars.
In SC we have this right now, in the form of the current kings of the game, Savior and Bisu, as well as a variety of older stars who are still near the top, such as Nal_Ra, Nada, Oov, and much more. Then there's the super-super-mega-star in Boxer, who is (in some, though certainly not all, ways) analogous to Michael Jordan in SC. So SC doesn't have to worry too much about this, at least in my opinion.
2. Rivalries, preferably fueled by contempt, being "dissed", even downright hatred, etc.
Ah, so here SC slips a bit. There are some nice rivalries, whether they be classics like Boxer and Nal_Ra, or newfound like Savior and Bisu, but they lack that extra pizazz. Not every rivalry should be one of mutual respect and admiration like Federer-Nadal, or Bird-Magic. There needs to be a little Bulls-Pistons (of the late 80's), a little bad blood a la Yankees-Red Sox (before it turned into a money war...). A little showboating like Hot_Bid said with Chalrenge, or some of the more recent displays. That's why it was so cool when Savior called out sparkyz for a perceived "diss". Stuff like that is what made MJ the greatest basketball player of all time ... even if you were complimenting him, if you did it in the wrong way like by saying "MJ's so great he doesn't even need to be able to do <blank> to dominate", you'd better believe Jordan was going to come out and do exactly that the next game and rub it in your face, even though you weren't even dissing him.
Are such rivalries "necessary"? Not technically. But they are nice. Why? Because people like winners. But they LOVE winners that back up the talk with the walk. And, people also HATE winners that talk, that have that smirk, that confidence, that arrogance. Either way, polarization, because one way or another you had better believe people will be tuning in, just as people tune in now to revel in seeing Savior dominate (as I do) or to revel in seeing him be crushed and embarrassed (a la Bisu 3-0) as many other fans do. This is what competition is all about! That's why Hot_Bid hit it right on the head in several places when he suggested that players add a little personality to their victory dances. Not EVERY player has to do this, but if some do, you get a little bad blood, a little "I don't just want to beat this guy, I want to humiliate him!"
3. The Show This is where SC and sports can and should diverge a bit. Not to say there isn't plenty of showmanship, showboating, and so on in sports, but there's a reason why those things are frowned upon in competitive sports. Competitive sports are mainstream, they are things kids grow up watching, playing, and they develop work ethic, discipline, character, and many other things. Major professional sports have an obligation to an extent not to condone the taunting, the showboating, the humiliation. It still happens though. But come on, this is SC. As big as it is in Korea, it is still closer to say, pro wrestling (not that it's fake of course) than the NBA. This is ENTERTAINMENT. Every successful sport is successful for the same dark dirty secret reason: it's a BUSINESS. Having guys take off their jackets to reveal 3-0, that's just good business. Having a little personality, a little rivalry, a little venom, that's just good business. If we really want to see SC grow, especially outside of Korea, and especially with the advent of SC2, then people must remember that it needs to be treated with elements of being a business. And this isn't pro sports. You can go that extra step, add that bit of silliness, add that bit of debauchery even to spice it up. This doesn't take away from the fact that people still have to PLAY the game, and that if they want to be known they still have to be GOOD and still have to WIN, but it will attract more fans, more attention, and more good things.
All in all, I have no problem with some guys continuing to play the role of "good guy", and other guys like Savior with their cocky smirk at the end of games. Keep it up.
On June 11 2007 09:10 tomatriedes wrote: I think ceremonies are fun and I'm all for them but I also like the fact that the KTF players just do a simple bow when they win. Its like they made a collective decision to go that way and I think it works for them well. A ceremony just wouldn't suit a classy guy like Nal ra. As for that Midas ceremony I actually thought maybe he was trying to satirise ceremonies as being lame by doing a very lame ceremony. But on second thoughts, yeah, it was probably him just being his dorky self.
Agreed, but I always thought it was just Midas being awkward rather than trying to parody it. :p
Ceremonies are good for some, are better without for others. As for the FBH dance, it was funny, though lacking in a respect that I think sets Chal and Zeus apart from all the others thus far. Chal and Zeus don't hesitate when they do theirs. Thus, they seem to naturally be ready to put themselves out there and celebrate when they feel like it, not for some other reason, as hesitation is showing of. They have the confidence and the urge, which scores them far more attitude points. :D
On May 15 2007 22:22 RaiZ wrote: My god you seem to not understand that i've NOTHING wrong with winning ceremony, but was it really a winning ceremony about what chalrenge did ? No. No fucking way. Just look closely at chalrenge before the ceremony : seems like he really wanted to intimidate midas by saying something before doing his ceremony. I'd really like to know what he said at this moment. That's why i'd not be suprised if that was something that would make everyone more upset when being defeated. Even this image prove that he's a retard.
Omg i'm tired of it. I'll stop it now because obviously i'm wasting my time here. :[
RaiZ go suck cock and balls ur probably gay like midas
Whatever. Nobody forces you to think who i am but I'm glad that i'm not alone at least.
By watching most of his ceremony, he's really a dickhead. They may be for entertainment, but all i can see is Arrogance. I don't care what you think but that's what I think.
That was so arrogant and immature. It is insulting not only Canata's ancestors but also Canata himself.
what a dickhead.
Omg stop with the ancestor's thing, because that wasn't really what i meant : simply that i believe if you were living with parents that doesn't like their sons/daughters to be desobeing them then you would not have your childrens doing any arrogant gestures right ? If i was chalrenge's father what would i think of him ? I'd be embarrassed only because "my" son did something like "I pwn your ass noob". Get it ? I'll edit all my msg if you continue to think that chalrenge need to be respected or whatever else you think. Firebathero's gesture is arrogant as well oO But that was entertaining though because i really laught at the very last ceremony )
That was so arrogant and immature. It is insulting not only Canata's ancestors but also Canata himself.
what a dickhead.
Omg stop with the ancestor's thing, because that wasn't really what i meant : simply that i believe if you were living with parents that doesn't like their sons/daughters to be desobeing them then you would not have your childrens doing any arrogant gestures right ? If i was chalrenge's father what would i think of him ? I'd be embarrassed only because "my" son did something like "I pwn your ass noob". Get it ? I'll edit all my msg if you continue to think that chalrenge need to be respected or whatever else you think. Firebathero's gesture is arrogant as well oO But that was entertaining though because i really laught at the very last ceremony )
dude i dont see ur point :S...
chalrenge makes the pro scene funnier and wit more personality... just like other players that do alot of gestures when they win or lose...
wat is ur reaction when u win a match on bnet that u feel is important ? u prolly jump out of ur chair and start screaming "yes Yes yes" or "GG NO RE NOOB", u dance, etc... Why cant pro gamers do watever the fuck they want, Do u know how hard they practice for those games ?
chalrenge makes the pro scene funnier and wit more personality... just like other players that do alot of gestures when they win or lose...
I don't find it funny at all. The FBH's one is way more funny.
wat is ur reaction when u win a match o bnet that u feel is important ? u prolly jump out of ur chair and start screaming "yes Yes yes" or "GG NO RE NOOB", u dance, etc... Why cant pro gamers do watever the fuck they want, Do u know how hard they practice for those games ?
Probably but not everyone is like it. In Lans i just shake hands and nothing more.
On May 15 2007 22:22 RaiZ wrote: My god you seem to not understand that i've NOTHING wrong with winning ceremony, but was it really a winning ceremony about what chalrenge did ? No. No fucking way. Just look closely at chalrenge before the ceremony : seems like he really wanted to intimidate midas by saying something before doing his ceremony. I'd really like to know what he said at this moment. That's why i'd not be suprised if that was something that would make everyone more upset when being defeated. Even this image prove that he's a retard.
Omg i'm tired of it. I'll stop it now because obviously i'm wasting my time here. :[
RaiZ go suck cock and balls ur probably gay like midas
Some people need to manner up in this thread, or they are going to get banned.
There is nothing wrong with having a different opinion. I agree with RaiZ as much as I agree with Hot_Bid. I think we will see many of the ceremonies die out... it will just be a fad. However the emotional ones will always be here.
i was thinking in having tl.net-members ceremonies but it's hard to define the terms under that could take place. it will stop bitching about how it is/how it feels when someone else is doing it or someone else is getting it (a ceremony). upon personalisation people will see things from a diferent perspective.
it could be something (liqui)bet related, or if someone pwns another one in a topic, on iirc, maybe even in real life. the 'winne'r should make a ceremony. it will be at least a challenge if not something really hard.(skill needed, programs needed, original ideeas needed). one could use the looser picture (from tl.net gallery) or quotes and make .gifs, funny banners or maybe even small .avi movies.
His Ceremony was a bit .. "western" (read "not asia like") if you ask me. It's not often that you see players "let themselves go" in that way but it's a nice "trend" to follow.
I'm actually starting to like Chalrenge more and more now, like Hot_Bid said i think it's obvious he knows that he's not MSL Hall of Fame material, it was just a fun thing to do.
I also think it's cool that some people do let themselves go like that, instead of just unplugging their stuff and high fiving their team with not so much as a smirk on their face.
On June 20 2007 07:09 Hot_Bid wrote: he beat one of the hottest zergs around right now to win the match for his team
and his ceremony was pretty funny, and clearly not serious
i don't think he honestly believes he belongs on the msl hall of fame, he never actually qualified for one yet haha
It was half funny, half serious, i'd say. If you watch it again, he puts himself not just after Bisu, but just under Gorush. Like "i can't be the champion this time, so there will be someone here, but then i'll qualify and i'll come to kick your ass!"
You can find it funny or arrogant, it's hard to know if this is all for the show and for fun or if he's a bit overconfident. Maybe it's a little bit of both.
Btw, I'm completely with Hot Bid... when I saw Chalrenge do the fist pump to chest, shoot, and point at computer screen, I was an INSTANT fan. I haven't seen this level of cockiness and arrogance since OOV first showed up on the scene, and I *LOVE* it.
I gotta hand it to ya Hot_Bid, you are a very funny guy. I literarly laughed out loud while reading some passages in this post. I wonder how come I never saw it before...
"ProGamers should embrace their IDs and nicknames and become self promoters. I had suggested before that Shark should come out with a big cardboard fin on his head, and just start uncontrollably biting people to the “Jaws” music. Imagine after a win, Savior dresses up like Jesus and screams “THOU SHALT NOT BEAT MA JAE!!!” or Boxer punches his opponent in the face. Imagine iloveoov coming out in a gorilla suit and throwing bananas everywhere. Or a Much/Foru 2v2 team that after a victory always yells "TOO MUCH... FOR U!?!" Or even crazier, imagine July dying his hair red and dressing up like a giant watermelon—oh wait."
Thought process: "Gonna do a ceremony... *bigass twitch* K-SPAZ! Aw dammit. Next time. Okay, Rock, pretend it was on purpose. That's right. Manly pose. Yeah, that's right."
I reread the article again, and on that Much/Foru team, I remember in Proleague H.O.T and Foru were a 2v2 team... so 2HOT4U actually seemed viable. I thought about this and laughed. >_> I'm weird.
The victory lap around Savior from FBH made me hate him.. did you like that ceremony Hot_Bid? ^^ I thought it was homosexual... -.- embarrassing to watch
There's a "limit" where ceremonies gets stupid imo.. cool/funny/fancy ones are fun to watch but those who are just outdrawn (like zeus high-fiving crowd.. or maybe that's just because he beat Boxer that I didn't like it ^^) or those who focuses on humiliating their opponent (like the victory lap) just makes the players look childish and retarded...
On July 24 2007 06:22 uppTagg wrote: The victory lap around Savior from FBH made me hate him.. did you like that ceremony Hot_Bid? ^^ I thought it was homosexual... -.- embarrassing to watch
There's a "limit" where ceremonies gets stupid imo.. cool/funny/fancy ones are fun to watch but those who are just outdrawn (like zeus high-fiving crowd.. or maybe that's just because he beat Boxer that I didn't like it ^^) or those who focuses on humiliating their opponent (like the victory lap) just makes the players look childish and retarded...
i speak on the behalf of hot_bid and TL when i say yes, we collectively hated FBH's fag dance
Holy crap this thread is equivalent to opening a sixer of whoop-ass. Thumb uo HB
Greatest C ? Chalrenge, Zeus, Rock, Box (Whatever happened to Zeus anyway?) Gayest C? FBH..no brainer. can't think of any others even nearly as gay as him
Dang FireBatHero's ceremonies are never that good, but he's performing so well, he does the ceremonies with so much confidence it matters little. FBH is really starting to become a dominant Terran.
On July 27 2007 08:14 Bub wrote: Holy crap this thread is equivalent to opening a sixer of whoop-ass. Thumb uo HB
Greatest C ? Chalrenge, Zeus, Rock, Box (Whatever happened to Zeus anyway?) Gayest C? FBH..no brainer. can't think of any others even nearly as gay as him
Midas after he tried to redeem himself after loosing to Chalrenge
Its wierd how after FBH hopped around like a jacakss all homosexual ceremonies stopped. The proleague is all about art and baptism, and the StarLeagues have less offensive in your face things.
On July 29 2007 03:04 oshibori_probe wrote: Its wierd how after FBH hopped around like a jacakss all homosexual ceremonies stopped. The proleague is all about art and baptism, and the StarLeagues have less offensive in your face things.
On July 29 2007 03:04 oshibori_probe wrote: Its wierd how after FBH hopped around like a jacakss all homosexual ceremonies stopped. The proleague is all about art and baptism, and the StarLeagues have less offensive in your face things.
Maybe they disciplined him.
Did you see the Final today? I guess they did not .. or failed (:
haha is it really that arrogant and insulting? it seems to me he's just making himself look more like a douche than anything to flaunt his victory. good attention-grabber for samsung (kinda)
FBH's dances were paradies of some dances from korean hit TV shows. (in case you guys don't know that). They are very popular dances and of course I don't think he pulled that off very well . but it was funny enough. And also, I wanna say unlike Chalrenge he is always very polite and cool guy. Chalrenge seems he does want to have a badass image a bit . But I like him very much, too.
On July 29 2007 03:04 oshibori_probe wrote: Its wierd how after FBH hopped around like a jacakss all homosexual ceremonies stopped. The proleague is all about art and baptism, and the StarLeagues have less offensive in your face things.
Maybe they disciplined him.
Did you see the Final today? I guess they did not .. or failed (:
After the Final Kim gaul(head coach of Khan) said in her interview about that.
"이성은 선수 세리머니를 경기 시작 전에 물어봤다. 옷 벗는 부분은 체크하지 못했다. 죄송하게 생각한다(웃음)."
"I asked him about his ceremony plan before the game. I missed checking out the shirt-off part. I'm sorry(laughs)"
And TheMarine(commentator) also mentioned about that ceremony yesterday. He asked to khan members what they thought about FBH's shirt-off floater ceremony and they answered 'they feel embarassed'.
Come on guys, it's hilarious. I bet 50$ nobody in here wasn't at least smiling at the sight of FBH taking his shirt off and dancing around like that. Seriously.
On August 05 2007 01:42 Cpt Obvious wrote: Come on guys, it's hilarious. I bet 50$ nobody in here wasn't at least smiling at the sight of FBH taking his shirt off and dancing around like that. Seriously.
On August 05 2007 01:42 Cpt Obvious wrote: Come on guys, it's hilarious. I bet 50$ nobody in here wasn't at least smiling at the sight of FBH taking his shirt off and dancing around like that. Seriously.
On August 05 2007 01:42 Cpt Obvious wrote: Come on guys, it's hilarious. I bet 50$ nobody in here wasn't at least smiling at the sight of FBH taking his shirt off and dancing around like that. Seriously.
On August 06 2007 10:00 jkillashark wrote: Did sAviOr do the Easy Button ceremony at BlizzCon? That would be so sick if he did it in Korea and gave tribute to TL.net
On August 06 2007 10:00 jkillashark wrote: Did sAviOr do the Easy Button ceremony at BlizzCon? That would be so sick if he did it in Korea and gave tribute to TL.net
haha firebathero is such an awesome guy :-p its so pansy but hes got the biggest balls i can imagine one of the older bw gamers like reach or something to stand up and punch him after one of those
sorry for the bump (although it's not that big of a bump), but does anyone have any recent ceremonies that were funny/pimp that could be added to this thread, i really loved seeing them but noones updating this thread anymore
EPT
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he does good interviews 
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man no...
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