EPTAll we learned from that tournament is that while foreign players can compete the Koreans are clearly superior. Have the last Korean standing play the last foreigner standing.
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
All we learned from that tournament is that while foreign players can compete the Koreans are clearly superior. Have the last Korean standing play the last foreigner standing. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On August 06 2017 22:39 Rolltide wrote: The way I would have done the tournament is to have all Koreans face each other and all foreigners face each other guaranteeing a Korean vs foreigner final. I think Blizzcon should be done that way. No, just no. I'm not having a foreigner get $140K for blizzcon 2nd place when they're worse than the entire top 8 koreans. Blizzcon playoffs should be the best 8 players of the year, no exceptions. The fact foreigners get half the ro16 spots when most of them aren't better than top 16 koreans is lucky enough for them edit: and who wants the most hyped event of the year be painfully one sided? Imagine if Dark vs Elazer/Neeb/drogo was the final of 2016 | ||
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Mun_Su
France2063 Posts
On August 06 2017 22:39 Rolltide wrote: The way I would have done the tournament is to have all Koreans face each other and all foreigners face each other guaranteeing a Korean vs foreigner final. I think Blizzcon should be done that way. All we learned from that tournament is that while foreign players can compete the Koreans are clearly superior. Have the last Korean standing play the last foreigner standing. This is one of the worst idea i've ever seen. | ||
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Phredxor
New Zealand15076 Posts
On August 07 2017 00:58 Fango wrote: No, just no. I'm not having a foreigner get $140K for blizzcon 2nd place when they're worse than the entire top 8 koreans. Blizzcon playoffs should be the best 8 players of the year, no exceptions. The fact foreigners get half the ro16 spots when most of them aren't better than top 16 koreans is lucky enough for them edit: and who wants the most hyped event of the year be painfully one sided? Imagine if Dark vs Elazer/Neeb/drogo was the final of 2016 If Inno keeps up this level of play it's going to be terribly one sided no matter who gets there :p | ||
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Sakat
Croatia1599 Posts
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Lil_nooblet
United States459 Posts
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On August 07 2017 13:02 Sakat wrote: Well, you know Inno and form Inno, Zest, Life, and quite literally every other top-tier player ever. Form never lasts. If it did, we'd have a bonjwa. | ||
Olli
Austria24422 Posts
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
edit: and who wants the most hyped event of the year be painfully one sided? Imagine if Dark vs Elazer/Neeb/drogo was the final of 2016 You can start making an argument by being honest. Drogo did not make the final 8 so he hardly would ever make the final. If competitive matches are what matters they have failed. We just saw a tournament where Innovation beat Stats 3-0 and TY 4-0. So a foreign player would take fewer than 0 maps? Byun won his matches in the final 8 last year 3-1 over TY, 3-1 over Stats and 4-2 over Dark. Those were not one sided? If that is the primary goal. The big problem as far as these Korean players are concerned is the lame amount of money for winning the biggest tournaments in that country. $35,000 for winning GSL? $16K for 2nd and $8K for 3-4. That is not enough for how competitive those tournaments are. The Korean players need WESG and Blizzcon to make a decent living. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On August 07 2017 21:56 Rolltide wrote: You can start making an argument by being honest. Drogo did not make the final 8 so he hardly would ever make the final. If competitive matches are what matters they have failed. We just saw a tournament where Innovation beat Stats 3-0 and TY 4-0. So a foreign player would take fewer than 0 maps? Byun won his matches in the final 8 last year 3-1 over TY, 3-1 over Stats and 4-2 over Dark. Those were not one sided? If that is the primary goal. The big problem as far as these Korean players are concerned is the lame amount of money for winning the biggest tournaments in that country. $35,000 for winning GSL? $16K for 2nd and $8K for 3-4. That is not enough for how competitive those tournaments are. The Korean players need WESG and Blizzcon to make a decent living. You know what happens when we mix top foreigners and koreans in one tournament? We get Katowice/wesg/GSL S3/GSLvsTW. Aka the foreigners get stomped with only the odd win against koreans. None of them have a chance at reaching finals. And I'm sorry but no foreigner deserves to reach a final of any tournament outside Circuit right now. Even the very best like Major and Neeb can't get gsl ro16. Foreigners already are given an unfair advantage over koreans for blizzcon. They get access half the places, and they get them via easier tournaments with less competition. You're literally saying that 8 GSL ro32 players should compete for a blizzcon final spot. Which is the dream of any sc2 player...... Edit: btw, ByuN vs TY/Stats/Dark was a lot more competitive than Dark vs Neeb/Elazer. And Inno vs TY was a disappointment, but still more exiting than Inno vs any foreigner. Look at wesg ffs, we had nothing but roflstomps but TY and Maru against foreigners, but it gave us a decent final. Imagine how shit a Maru vs ShowTimE final would have been. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
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Vutalisk
United States680 Posts
I understand Blizzard tries to make sure Korean players not winning everything but at the same time but two separate systems don't really help with foreigners' skills given you can see how one-sided the GSL vs the World is. SC2 is a competitive game and to me at least it is anti-competition to exclude certain players because they are simply better. Don't get me started with WESG, one of the worst SC2 events ever. A crap load of prize pool going into the most underwhelming competition. A bunch of random foreign players vs some Korean players and the Koreans basically ran over the rest one-sidedly... The qualifying system for WESG is an absolute trash. I would use that prize pool to fund 2 Global IEM like Katowice. That would be a better use for the money. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On August 08 2017 01:52 Fango wrote: Why am I even writing this much over something stupid haha Countering stupidity always takes more effort than proposing stupidity. Being rational takes intellectual effort, which is how fools can spew so much stupid shit (not talking about anyone specific here, just IRL in general). | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On August 08 2017 02:35 Vutalisk wrote: I personally want the region-lock to get away. Combining all into one single ranking like 2015. If foreigners manage to make it to Top 16, then they have earned it fair and square. In the past, there were foreigners in Top 16 so it is not like the entire BlizzCon is Korean only. I understand Blizzard tries to make sure Korean players not winning everything but at the same time but two separate systems don't really help with foreigners' skills given you can see how one-sided the GSL vs the World is. SC2 is a competitive game and to me at least it is anti-competition to exclude certain players because they are simply better. Don't get me started with WESG, one of the worst SC2 events ever. A crap load of prize pool going into the most underwhelming competition. A bunch of random foreign players vs some Korean players and the Koreans basically ran over the rest one-sidedly... The qualifying system for WESG is an absolute trash. I would use that prize pool to fund 2 Global IEM like Katowice. That would be a better use for the money. I personally think that the region lock is kinda somewhat ok, but there should be more global cups and only a few foreigner-excusives. Blizzcon should be 12 KR/4 foreigner at the most, or maybe take top 16 KR and top 16 foreigner and make them duke it out for the 16 blizzcon spots. I do think it's helped with the skill level a lot. If GSL vs TW was in HoTS it would have been 100x more one sided (and 7-1 is hard to beat). But some foreigners are now GSL ro32 level which is ok. In HoTS we had maybe Snute or Scarlett at their peaks and even that would have been a stretch to get into Code S And WeSG is awful, but at the same time if China wants to mindlessly throw money at games I won't complain, although I do believe that money could be used much, much better. Also 2 koreans is just stupid, the qualifiers was basically just $100K minimum for whoever wins (IEM throwback lol). But seeing Maru and TY stomp every foreigner was entertaining at least | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
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Lil_nooblet
United States459 Posts
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Plopus
Switzerland112 Posts
On August 08 2017 12:55 Lil_nooblet wrote: He did crush Maru 2-0 though. Just got a bit unlucky in games 2 and 3 with his dt shrine and stargate getting scouted. I did not watch the games but based on the results I would say that there is no shame to lose 1-2 to Innovation just after beating Maru 2-0. It's quite agood results and we could have expected him to advance further in the tournament if he didn't met Innovation this early. | ||
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
Nothing is stopping any Korean for pursuing more lucrative opportunities in the USA or Europe. Fango does not believe we should have a world championship that is "mixed". Read his last post. You know how many Korean players were allowed to participate in the World cyber games? 3. 3! Oh my God how unfair! One of those 3 always won though. Blizzard's main objective is to maintain the maximum interest in the sport and for the best player to win. The best player would win. Korea is not supporting this sport enough. The biggest corporations in that country can't pony up enough cash to sponsor one team? Samsung, LG, KT and SK. A medium sized low cost air line(Jin Air) can sponsor a team but they can't? | ||
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
There is a company in the USA that is growing fast it is called Buffalo Wild wings. They are restaurants with a sports bar concept. Chicken wings are obviously their specialty and they do have good wings. Each store has about 30 big screen tvs. 30! What if they decided to show esports on one or two of those screens? What if they decided to become a major esports sponsor and have a Buffalo Wild wings LOL team, Dota 2 team, Counterstrike Go team and a SC2 team? There are 1200 of these. The idea is to expand our sport. | ||
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