Ogre's a pretty mediocre laning hero in general. He can bottle-crow mid acceptably, but most of the time he's played as a roaming support that can get early kills in other lanes.

Qbek

Poland12923 Posts

April 17 2014 19:52 GMT

#16682

Tread switching has most impact while bottling, if you are a mid hero that goes treads+bottle and don't tread switch you are missing on a LOT of regen. In other situations switching treads to agi before using stick is the other one you should always do. The third important one is while using spells to jungle(it while casting, main attribute while attacking). In other situations it's ok to not bother. I personally default treads to int on most of my treads heroes as I use it mostly as a mana fix

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

April 17 2014 19:56 GMT

#16683

Being on Agi treads also slightly increases the effectiveness of your natural regen for both HP and mana.

Which is sort of funny because even among very experienced and pro players there's a misconception of "switch to Int treads to regen mana"

Qbek

Poland12923 Posts

April 17 2014 20:01 GMT

#16684

Wouldn't you get more mana on int if you had some +% mana reg items thou? I'm sure there is a point where it does, but is it above 50%?

Sn0_Man

Tebellong44238 Posts

April 17 2014 20:03 GMT

#16685

On April 18 2014 05:01 Qbek wrote:
Wouldn't you get more mana on int if you had some +% mana reg items thou? I'm sure there is a point where it does, but is it above 50%?

No because the regen you get from INT scales at the same pace as the max mana you get from it.

Some guy mathcrafted it and its NEVER better for regen to be on int treads. Sometimes its the same, sometimes worse, never better.

PS: mana % regen items modify the base regen you get from int.

Logo

United States7542 Posts

April 17 2014 20:21 GMT

#16686

Is there any level up considerations with treads? As in do you gain any benefit from being on AGI when leveling up then switching to STR/INT?

I actually can't really remember if DotA keeps your health and mana at it's current % when you level (I think it does?) in which cause the answer would be no.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

April 17 2014 20:25 GMT

#16687

On April 18 2014 05:03 Sn0_Man wrote:

Show nested quote +

Well, it's better to be on Int treads to regen if you have flat +Mana from items/abilities, but the only way you get that is from Energy Booster or the Essence Aura passive. The former generally means you got Arcane Boots rather than Treads, and the latter is on a hero that has basically zero mana issues regardless.

On April 18 2014 05:21 Logo wrote:
Is there any level up considerations with treads? As in do you gain any benefit from being on AGI when leveling up then switching to STR/INT?

I actually can't really remember if DotA keeps your health and mana at it's current % when you level (I think it does?) in which cause the answer would be no.

In DotA 1, leveling up adds to your base Int/Str, which means you gain the corresponding amount of HP to your current AND maximum HP/mana, so leveling up on Agi then switching to Str/Int would give you slightly more HP/mana.

In DotA 2, there's no base/bonus stat distinction, so it preserves percentage regardless.

Sn0_Man

Tebellong44238 Posts

April 17 2014 20:29 GMT

#16688

Well, bloodstone, aghs, etc give flat mana. I didn't think about them.

PS: everybody knows the secret to ogre's laning effectiveness is a fast Orb of Venom.

Laserist

Turkey4269 Posts

April 17 2014 20:33 GMT

#16689

On April 18 2014 04:48 LeeDawg wrote:
super vague question, but does anyone have any thoughts on how to lane as ogre-magi? I keep having terrible laning phases no matter what other heroes i'm with/against and it puts me so far behind going into the midgame.

Safe lane, protect carry and pull. If the lane is safe is carry to farm, like 1v1 favored the carry, gank mid with smoke or naked. Sometimes I go help hard lane to hinder the enemy carry's farm.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

April 17 2014 20:33 GMT

#16690

Bloodstone also gives flat regen though, and the relative benefit of the flat mana regen from charges is very large compared to the mana boost unless you start losing charges.

iokke

United States1179 Posts

April 18 2014 04:34 GMT

#16691

if you report a member of your own party, does it count? QQ below, plz ignore, but i had to

+ Show Spoiler +

My brother suggested that I invite this kid that was the whiniest person I've been in a party with. Looking for excuses everywhere. He played well at the start, but dies mid as TA to a gank that someone brought sentries to for detection. After death his response was: noob supports do not deward mid. So I bought him a set of sentries and dropped from stash for him, pinged it plenty. He never picked em up, but kept calling us bad for not dewarding mid for him. Similar shit followed after every death. Anywho, I remembered something about party reports not stacking, but if you report a member of your own party does it register? took my chances cause it was worth it
bonus points for his ridiculousness: our cpt'n botched the picks a bit, but when he picked dazzle the whiner said "ok dazzle decent pick". End of the game he says "noob captain picked dazzle, cptn reported".... wtf lol. that guy really confused me

ReignSupreme.

Australia4123 Posts

April 18 2014 07:43 GMT

#16692

Yes your report will count, what that "party reports don't stack" means is that if everyone from a 4 stack reports the poor solo player, it will only count as 1 report.

Andre

Slovenia3523 Posts

April 18 2014 13:49 GMT

#16693

On April 18 2014 05:25 TheYango wrote:

Show nested quote +

I hope this is considered a bug. Many big plays being cut because of the change otherwise.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

April 18 2014 15:07 GMT

#16694

It is, but its a core change that's the source of a lot of different bugs because the DotA 2 engine doesn't distinguish base vs. bonus stats at a core level.

Logo

United States7542 Posts

April 18 2014 15:30 GMT

#16695

The hp gained change is sort of nice too though isn't it? Well it was never as big of a deal in DotA to me, but LoL used to do what DotA1 does (you get the full hp bonus when you level up) and it was annoying as hell when enemy heroes would just constantly erase your harassment by leveling up and regaining the hp. The % gain is interesting to me, because it puts a little more into something like level 1 harassment because that lost hp will affect the hp gained when leveling. Of course on the downside you reduce the opportunities for sick plays where a level up gives someone the mana to cast a spell or survive a hit.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

April 18 2014 16:26 GMT

#16696

It's actually more noticeable in relation to stat-stealing spells (Astral Imprisonment, Essence Shift). Astral was hard-coded to work the way it does in DotA 1 on the enemy's stat loss/re-gain, but still incorrectly gives/loses % mana for OD when he gains/loses the Astral Imprisonment buff (it also can steal itemized Intelligence--again because DotA 2 doesn't distinguish base and bonus stats). Likewise, Slark's Essence Shift is actually supposed to cause the enemy to lose the full 19 HP/13 mana when they get 1 of each stat stolen (and regain the same amount when the debuff falls off), but instead just preserves their % HP/mana.

Logo

United States7542 Posts

April 18 2014 18:04 GMT

#16697

Fascinating! Sort of scary to think of Slark getting a full 19hp per hit on his low hp targets.

sch0n

Norway81 Posts

April 20 2014 06:49 GMT

#16698

Does denying yourself give xp to the other team? i.e Pudge suiciding by rot, or someone denying a hero under Doom's ultimate.

synapse

China13814 Posts

April 20 2014 07:34 GMT

#16699

On April 20 2014 15:49 sch0n wrote:
Does denying yourself give xp to the other team? i.e Pudge suiciding by rot, or someone denying a hero under Doom's ultimate.

denying yourself / allied hero (including suiciding to creeps) gives enemies 0 gold and 0 exp

llIH

Norway2147 Posts

April 20 2014 13:43 GMT

#16700

If you have taken all t2 towers. And have Aegis. But can't push T4 since enemy has very good turtle team, and you are playing against a radiance naga. What is the way to play it?