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On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together
I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead.
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mouzsports will no longer stream on twitch since they have now a contract with own3d. So cwm, singsing and black will be streaming on own3d.
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On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead.
Works both ways I think
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On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think
No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A.
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I'm sure you can get aggro by attacking an ally hero, did this all the time in dota1 and I think 2 or 3 times in dota2( I dive much less I think). don't know about the other one really
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On August 06 2012 09:42 AndyJay wrote:
Bloodseeker's strength is dominating the shit out of 1v1 mid laning. I'm not saying he can do this in pro games but at least at my MMR ( mid lvl pub games) a bs can last hit everything vs a low dmg solo ranged mid (and still do well and often win lane vs melee's as well) and get a huge gold/exp advantage which snowballs his ganking/carrying ability. So yes Night stalker is obviously a better ganker, but a NS can't regen form half hp back to full off one creep wave either. That may or may not be useful, and as a useful hero NS might be better overall, but they are not simply the same but NS better.
Winning your lane is pointless if you still aren't very useful to your team.
Honestly, i don't have any problem against BS mid, ever. Not even with heroes like rhasta.
Pub seeker works if your whole team can snowball out of control and have a huge advantage.
But the later the game goes against a real carry he'll just not really be worth it.
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On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A.
i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B
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On August 06 2012 21:53 Erasme wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A. i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B
I can confirm this too. Not sure if it works the other way.
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On August 06 2012 21:53 Erasme wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A. i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B
No, because the tower AI targets heroes ATTACKING heroes first and foremost. Attacking a friendly hero will draw aggro onto you, which is why you see professional players a-click their teammates if they're low and being attacked by a tower.
It goes like this:
Heroes attacking heroes > Creeps attacking heroes > Units hitting the tower > Units in range
The only way to get aggro off of yourself to another target is by attacking a creep. Attacking another hero will make the tower hit you.
EDIT: Just tested it, I had it backwards. If you're being attacked, and a-click a friendly hero it makes the tower re-evaluate its' target and makes it attack the nearest friendly unit to it, whether it be a creep or allied hero.
If there's an enemy hero nearby, you can a-click them to take the aggro off of your ally, to you.
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I'll try to test this in the game I'm playing right now.
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On August 06 2012 22:00 anonymitylol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 21:53 Erasme wrote:On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A. i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B No, because the tower AI targets heroes ATTACKING heroes first and foremost. Attacking a friendly hero will draw aggro onto you, which is why you see professional players a-click their teammates if they're low and being attacked by a tower.
It goes like this:
Heroes attacking heroes > Creeps attacking heroes > Units hitting the tower > Units in range
The only way to get aggro off of yourself to another target is by attacking a creep. Attacking another hero will make the tower hit you.EDIT: Just tested it, I had it backwards. If you're being attacked, and a-click a friendly hero it makes the tower re-evaluate its' target and makes it attack your ally.
you got it totally wrong and your edit is half-truth.
If you are getting attacked by a tower you can get the tower aggro of if you attack a target (creep or hero) on YOUR team. the new target will be randomly chosen among viable targets.
interesting would be if theres two heroes targetting each other which one would get hit.
Heroes attacking heroes > Creeps attacking heroes > Heroes/Creeps hitting the tower > Heroes/Creeps fighting enemy Creeps > Heroes/Creeps in tower range > Heroes attacking his teams Heroes/Creeps
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On August 06 2012 22:00 anonymitylol wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 21:53 Erasme wrote:On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A. i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B No, because the tower AI targets heroes ATTACKING heroes first and foremost. Attacking a friendly hero will draw aggro onto you, which is why you see professional players a-click their teammates if they're low and being attacked by a tower.
It goes like this:
Heroes attacking heroes > Creeps attacking heroes > Units hitting the tower > Units in range
The only way to get aggro off of yourself to another target is by attacking a creep. Attacking another hero will make the tower hit you.EDIT: Just tested it, I had it backwards. If you're being attacked, and a-click a friendly hero it makes the tower re-evaluate its' target and makes it attack the nearest friendly unit to it, whether it be a creep or allied hero. If there's an enemy hero nearby, you can a-click them to take the aggro off of your ally, to you.
that's not how it should work, does work in dota 1, and from memory does work in dota 2. If you attack a hero in dota 1, it bumps you up the aggro queue, both from towers and units - hence you can draw aggro as axe by doing an attack command on any hero on the map.
If that's how it works in dota 2 it is the exact opposite to dota 1, and should be reported as a bug. Attacking heroes (allied or enemy) should gain aggro in a 500 aoe.
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On August 06 2012 21:40 Unleashing wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 09:42 AndyJay wrote:
Bloodseeker's strength is dominating the shit out of 1v1 mid laning. I'm not saying he can do this in pro games but at least at my MMR ( mid lvl pub games) a bs can last hit everything vs a low dmg solo ranged mid (and still do well and often win lane vs melee's as well) and get a huge gold/exp advantage which snowballs his ganking/carrying ability. So yes Night stalker is obviously a better ganker, but a NS can't regen form half hp back to full off one creep wave either. That may or may not be useful, and as a useful hero NS might be better overall, but they are not simply the same but NS better. Winning your lane is pointless if you still aren't very useful to your team. Honestly, i don't have any problem against BS mid, ever. Not even with heroes like rhasta. Pub seeker works if your whole team can snowball out of control and have a huge advantage. But the later the game goes against a real carry he'll just not really be worth it.
that's cus he's not a hard carry and shouldn't be played as one lol
you could say the same thing about night stalker or any other hero that peaks midgame
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On August 06 2012 22:26 lozarian wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 22:00 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:53 Erasme wrote:On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A. i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B No, because the tower AI targets heroes ATTACKING heroes first and foremost. Attacking a friendly hero will draw aggro onto you, which is why you see professional players a-click their teammates if they're low and being attacked by a tower.
It goes like this:
Heroes attacking heroes > Creeps attacking heroes > Units hitting the tower > Units in range
The only way to get aggro off of yourself to another target is by attacking a creep. Attacking another hero will make the tower hit you.EDIT: Just tested it, I had it backwards. If you're being attacked, and a-click a friendly hero it makes the tower re-evaluate its' target and makes it attack the nearest friendly unit to it, whether it be a creep or allied hero. If there's an enemy hero nearby, you can a-click them to take the aggro off of your ally, to you. that's not how it should work, does work in dota 1, and from memory does work in dota 2. If you attack a hero in dota 1, it bumps you up the aggro queue, both from towers and units - hence you can draw aggro as axe by doing an attack command on any hero on the map. If that's how it works in dota 2 it is the exact opposite to dota 1, and should be reported as a bug. Attacking heroes (allied or enemy) should gain aggro in a 500 aoe.
i'm not sure how it used to be in wc3 dota since i haven't played for years. but afaik it always mattered if you attacked an enemy or a teammate and i never noticed getting aggroed while attacking a friendly hero.
but this is how it works in dota2:
you only get to the aggro top when attacking an enemy hero, you get the reverse effect when attacking a friendly hero and hence you lose aggro.
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On August 06 2012 22:26 lozarian wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 22:00 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:53 Erasme wrote:On August 06 2012 21:33 anonymitylol wrote:On August 06 2012 21:08 Qbek wrote:On August 06 2012 20:29 Oktyabr wrote:On August 06 2012 19:45 Qbek wrote:
If an ally is running from a tower and no creeps are in range, if you also are in range of the tower a click your ally and the tower will attack you instead. It has hardcoded to attack anybody who attacked the hero above anything else and this tricks it's ai. Can save your allies life quite often when diving together I think it's the reverse. If A and B are running from the tower and A is getting hit by the tower, A must a+click B to make the tower hit B instead. Works both ways I think No, I'm 90% sure it's only the first way. If A a+clicks B, the tower will attack A. i'm 100% sure if B a clicks A, tower will drop the aggro of B No, because the tower AI targets heroes ATTACKING heroes first and foremost. Attacking a friendly hero will draw aggro onto you, which is why you see professional players a-click their teammates if they're low and being attacked by a tower.
It goes like this:
Heroes attacking heroes > Creeps attacking heroes > Units hitting the tower > Units in range
The only way to get aggro off of yourself to another target is by attacking a creep. Attacking another hero will make the tower hit you.EDIT: Just tested it, I had it backwards. If you're being attacked, and a-click a friendly hero it makes the tower re-evaluate its' target and makes it attack the nearest friendly unit to it, whether it be a creep or allied hero. If there's an enemy hero nearby, you can a-click them to take the aggro off of your ally, to you. that's not how it should work, does work in dota 1, and from memory does work in dota 2. If you attack a hero in dota 1, it bumps you up the aggro queue, both from towers and units - hence you can draw aggro as axe by doing an attack command on any hero on the map. If that's how it works in dota 2 it is the exact opposite to dota 1, and should be reported as a bug. Attacking heroes (allied or enemy) should gain aggro in a 500 aoe.
That's what I thought and I remember doing that in Dota 2 and having it work. After I read their comments here I decided to test it, and it removes aggro from you as if you're attacking a friendly creep when you attack a friendly hero.
:shrug:
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On August 06 2012 22:34 Dead9 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 21:40 Unleashing wrote:On August 06 2012 09:42 AndyJay wrote:
Bloodseeker's strength is dominating the shit out of 1v1 mid laning. I'm not saying he can do this in pro games but at least at my MMR ( mid lvl pub games) a bs can last hit everything vs a low dmg solo ranged mid (and still do well and often win lane vs melee's as well) and get a huge gold/exp advantage which snowballs his ganking/carrying ability. So yes Night stalker is obviously a better ganker, but a NS can't regen form half hp back to full off one creep wave either. That may or may not be useful, and as a useful hero NS might be better overall, but they are not simply the same but NS better. Winning your lane is pointless if you still aren't very useful to your team. Honestly, i don't have any problem against BS mid, ever. Not even with heroes like rhasta. Pub seeker works if your whole team can snowball out of control and have a huge advantage. But the later the game goes against a real carry he'll just not really be worth it. that's cus he's not a hard carry and shouldn't be played as one lol you could say the same thing about night stalker or any other hero that peaks midgame
I didnt' say he was a hard carry at all, but blood seeker's mid-game isn't even that good, which was my point. Sure he can do decent in lane due to sustain, but outside of that he's really not a good hero.
For example,
he needs the enemy to be low hp to be able to chase.
he needs his ult to get kills as a ganker
Night stalker does everything he does better, as already stated.
And lategame NS is still pretty useful with aghanim and so on.
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On August 06 2012 22:42 Unleashing wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 22:34 Dead9 wrote:On August 06 2012 21:40 Unleashing wrote:On August 06 2012 09:42 AndyJay wrote:
Bloodseeker's strength is dominating the shit out of 1v1 mid laning. I'm not saying he can do this in pro games but at least at my MMR ( mid lvl pub games) a bs can last hit everything vs a low dmg solo ranged mid (and still do well and often win lane vs melee's as well) and get a huge gold/exp advantage which snowballs his ganking/carrying ability. So yes Night stalker is obviously a better ganker, but a NS can't regen form half hp back to full off one creep wave either. That may or may not be useful, and as a useful hero NS might be better overall, but they are not simply the same but NS better. Winning your lane is pointless if you still aren't very useful to your team. Honestly, i don't have any problem against BS mid, ever. Not even with heroes like rhasta. Pub seeker works if your whole team can snowball out of control and have a huge advantage. But the later the game goes against a real carry he'll just not really be worth it. that's cus he's not a hard carry and shouldn't be played as one lol you could say the same thing about night stalker or any other hero that peaks midgame I didnt' say he was a hard carry at all, but blood seeker's mid-game isn't even that good, which was my point. Sure he can do decent in lane due to sustain, but outside of that he's really not a good hero. For example, he needs the enemy to be low hp to be able to chase. he eneds his ult to get kills as a ganker Night stalker does everything he does better, as already stated. And lategame NS is still pretty useful with aghanim and so on.
he's stronger in lane than ns, his ulti is really good all game long, and a lot of the time silence can do some work
his midgame is pretty good, in particular he's one of the best countergankers in the game once he gets his ult
bs certainly isn't amazing but he's not that bad in pubs
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On August 06 2012 22:53 Dead9 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 06 2012 22:42 Unleashing wrote:On August 06 2012 22:34 Dead9 wrote:On August 06 2012 21:40 Unleashing wrote:On August 06 2012 09:42 AndyJay wrote:
Bloodseeker's strength is dominating the shit out of 1v1 mid laning. I'm not saying he can do this in pro games but at least at my MMR ( mid lvl pub games) a bs can last hit everything vs a low dmg solo ranged mid (and still do well and often win lane vs melee's as well) and get a huge gold/exp advantage which snowballs his ganking/carrying ability. So yes Night stalker is obviously a better ganker, but a NS can't regen form half hp back to full off one creep wave either. That may or may not be useful, and as a useful hero NS might be better overall, but they are not simply the same but NS better. Winning your lane is pointless if you still aren't very useful to your team. Honestly, i don't have any problem against BS mid, ever. Not even with heroes like rhasta. Pub seeker works if your whole team can snowball out of control and have a huge advantage. But the later the game goes against a real carry he'll just not really be worth it. that's cus he's not a hard carry and shouldn't be played as one lol you could say the same thing about night stalker or any other hero that peaks midgame I didnt' say he was a hard carry at all, but blood seeker's mid-game isn't even that good, which was my point. Sure he can do decent in lane due to sustain, but outside of that he's really not a good hero. For example, he needs the enemy to be low hp to be able to chase. he eneds his ult to get kills as a ganker Night stalker does everything he does better, as already stated. And lategame NS is still pretty useful with aghanim and so on. he's stronger in lane than ns, his ulti is really good all game long, and a lot of the time silence can do some work his midgame is pretty good, in particular he's one of the best countergankers in the game once he gets his ult bs certainly isn't amazing but he's not that bad in pubs
Him being stronger in lane depends entirely on his enemy.
And no his ulti has no real effect the second the enemies he need to target gets items that prevent him from touching them, like a bkb. And his silence is a double edged sword.
And i never said he was bad in pubs, i just said he's not a very good hero.
A lot of not so good heroes do fantastically in pubs.
I mean a night stalker with aghanim is 10 times more useful than a blood seeker in a game with good players.
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EPT
