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United States47024 Posts
The problem with Weaver splitpushing is that you're still not going to enter the base that way unless you have a teamcomp specifically drafted to play that way (Orange's 3-lane split push strategies), and beyond that, just splitpushing and farming a game out with Weaver you still lose lategame to the majority of harder carries in the game.
Weaver's strength is in his midgame teamfighting ability. Splitpushing and farming him out just really isn't a good gameplan because if the enemy team has any semblance of how to deal with it properly (don't overcommit and happily trade farm between whoever their carry is and your Weaver), playing to the hero's powerful teamfighting ability is just a more reliable game plan.
Weaver splitpushing requires either big misplay from the other team or a specific teamcomp to actually end a game. Weaver just going to teamfights and abusing the hero's strong teamfight ability will snowball games based on your skill/understanding of the hero rather than requiring the enemy to play badly, have bad picks, or for your team to play around you correctly.
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The only reason for me (ever) going linken first weaver would has to be playing against a Doom but I'd still avoid getting that horrible item on weaver if i could. Even bfury is a better item for weaver when compared to Linken.
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Loading Dota 2 up again soon after a five months absence. Excited and a little scared. My mechanics will probably still be decent, since I've been idling away in hon when I got bored, but it'll be good to play again.
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On May 18 2013 18:24 BurningSera wrote:
The only reason for me (ever) going linken first weaver would has to be playing against a Doom but I'd still avoid getting that horrible item on weaver if i could. Even bfury is a better item for weaver when compared to Linken.
That's straight out bullshit, linkens is good for weaver as it makes alot of his hard counters (lion, silencer) make him loose worth and makes him a pain in the ass to lock down in teamfights, if you don't have linkens (or bkb, which I agree is better in the majority of the cases) there's very few times where you can actually run rampant.
Weaver doesn't need a damage dealing item as his first item to make impact on teamfights, he just needs to not get locked down and die and if he cannot do that he cannot do the job, linkens is more often choosed on weaver over bkb simply because ultimate orb is a really fucking good item on weaver and weaver in shukuichi often really gets 1 spell in the face before running away / time lapsing away.
Only thing about linkens is that I think it's completely wasted if you get it too late as the mana solving issue will be non relevant after you allready have drums, treads and aquila
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On May 18 2013 19:14 Iplaythings wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2013 18:24 BurningSera wrote:
The only reason for me (ever) going linken first weaver would has to be playing against a Doom but I'd still avoid getting that horrible item on weaver if i could. Even bfury is a better item for weaver when compared to Linken. That's straight out bullshit, linkens is good for weaver as it makes alot of his hard counters (lion, silencer) make him loose worth and makes him a pain in the ass to lock down in teamfights, if you don't have linkens (or bkb, which I agree is better in the majority of the cases) there's very few times where you can actually run rampant. Weaver doesn't need a damage dealing item as his first item to make impact on teamfights, he just needs to not get locked down and die and if he cannot do that he cannot do the job, linkens is more often choosed on weaver over bkb simply because ultimate orb is a really fucking good item on weaver and weaver in shukuichi often really gets 1 spell in the face before running away / time lapsing away. Only thing about linkens is that I think it's completely wasted if you get it too late as the mana solving issue will be non relevant after you allready have drums, treads and aquila
Even if you're against a lion how is linkens going to help? Mana drain > hex > stun > ult dead in team fights or hell, even in a gank with a blink dagger lion. You aren't getting away from that. BKB is the ONLY viable option in that scenario, and a linkens will not help you survive a team fight whatsoever.
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Linken can be a good item on weaver, no doubt, but almost never as a first item because it's very inefficently costed and a linken's sphere alone doesn't let you do that much. Most of the time you'd probably just want to go aquila into drum into manta or something like that, as that's going to give you the best midgame presence, which is something you're going to want almost every time as a weaver.
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On May 18 2013 19:22 Canas wrote:
Linken can be a good item on weaver, no doubt, but almost never as a first item because it's very inefficently costed and a linken's sphere alone doesn't let you do that much. Most of the time you'd probably just want to go aquila into drum into manta or something like that, as that's going to give you the best midgame presence, which is something you're going to want almost every time as a weaver.
Why would you go manta on Weaver early?
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On May 18 2013 19:26 Erandorr wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2013 19:22 Canas wrote:
Linken can be a good item on weaver, no doubt, but almost never as a first item because it's very inefficently costed and a linken's sphere alone doesn't let you do that much. Most of the time you'd probably just want to go aquila into drum into manta or something like that, as that's going to give you the best midgame presence, which is something you're going to want almost every time as a weaver. Why would you go manta on Weaver early?
Yasha and ultimate orb both offers alot of good stuff to weaver, manta helps you dispell dust without using ultimate which can kill you as it has a cast animation and manta is instant
On May 18 2013 19:19 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2013 19:14 Iplaythings wrote:On May 18 2013 18:24 BurningSera wrote:
The only reason for me (ever) going linken first weaver would has to be playing against a Doom but I'd still avoid getting that horrible item on weaver if i could. Even bfury is a better item for weaver when compared to Linken. That's straight out bullshit, linkens is good for weaver as it makes alot of his hard counters (lion, silencer) make him loose worth and makes him a pain in the ass to lock down in teamfights, if you don't have linkens (or bkb, which I agree is better in the majority of the cases) there's very few times where you can actually run rampant. Weaver doesn't need a damage dealing item as his first item to make impact on teamfights, he just needs to not get locked down and die and if he cannot do that he cannot do the job, linkens is more often choosed on weaver over bkb simply because ultimate orb is a really fucking good item on weaver and weaver in shukuichi often really gets 1 spell in the face before running away / time lapsing away. Only thing about linkens is that I think it's completely wasted if you get it too late as the mana solving issue will be non relevant after you allready have drums, treads and aquila Even if you're against a lion how is linkens going to help? Mana drain > hex > stun > ult dead in team fights or hell, even in a gank with a blink dagger lion. You aren't getting away from that. BKB is the ONLY viable option in that scenario, and a linkens will not help you survive a team fight whatsoever.
In that case your positioning is dead, if you're shukuiching he won't have time in casting animation to do the mana drain -> hex -> stun anyways and if you let him stand there you've poor positioning regardless
Unless ofc there's 2 of the lion ish stunners / linkenswasters, then I can't argue vs bkb
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On May 18 2013 19:14 Iplaythings wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2013 18:24 BurningSera wrote:
The only reason for me (ever) going linken first weaver would has to be playing against a Doom but I'd still avoid getting that horrible item on weaver if i could. Even bfury is a better item for weaver when compared to Linken. That's straight out bullshit, linkens is good for weaver as it makes alot of his hard counters (lion, silencer) make him loose worth and makes him a pain in the ass to lock down in teamfights, if you don't have linkens (or bkb, which I agree is better in the majority of the cases) there's very few times where you can actually run rampant. Weaver doesn't need a damage dealing item as his first item to make impact on teamfights, he just needs to not get locked down and die and if he cannot do that he cannot do the job, linkens is more often choosed on weaver over bkb simply because ultimate orb is a really fucking good item on weaver and weaver in shukuichi often really gets 1 spell in the face before running away / time lapsing away. Only thing about linkens is that I think it's completely wasted if you get it too late as the mana solving issue will be non relevant after you allready have drums, treads and aquila
Bkb 3900gold.
Or, people should actually think when they are playing weaver, how to positioning, how to engage/getting out of teamfight with shukuchi/ulti.
No, that wasn't bullshit, at all.
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On May 18 2013 19:26 Erandorr wrote:Show nested quote +On May 18 2013 19:22 Canas wrote:
Linken can be a good item on weaver, no doubt, but almost never as a first item because it's very inefficently costed and a linken's sphere alone doesn't let you do that much. Most of the time you'd probably just want to go aquila into drum into manta or something like that, as that's going to give you the best midgame presence, which is something you're going to want almost every time as a weaver. Why would you go manta on Weaver early?
Because there's not really anything better to get
Gives ok stats for the cost, some damage, some survivability, and the split can be very good to clear silences and such
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Am I the only one who likes an early Crystalas on Weaver? I think the early crit/dps increase makes it pretty damn strong.
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On May 18 2013 19:45 Sephyr wrote:
Am I the only one who likes an early Crystalas on Weaver? I think the early crit/dps increase makes it pretty damn strong.
Crystalis + Medallion is insanely cost-effective dmg
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Netherlands45349 Posts
Tranq>Urn>Wand>Drums>MKB>Crystalis
if you feel like you need it get an aquila and sell the wand for the MKB later on. Alternatively I transition from Tranq Urn Drums into Radiance if I have a really good game and can get it roughy around 25min(or if I skip the Drum). I only get Linkens against Doom basically.
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Seems to me like the Linken's is too innefficiently costed and too strangely dependent on their team misplaying after they know it is there.
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Treads + Urn + Medallion -> Crystalis -> into w/e fits the game best
This is my build, probably not the most optimized or w/e but it works
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Would you like to see a change to linkens? Maybe some such as ... when triggered it blocks singletarget spells/abilities for 2.5 sec? Maybe that would be op, but it could be pretty cool.
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idk but as it stands linkens is one of the worst items in the game
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Linkens is fine the way it is. No need to make random buff to make it op
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On May 18 2013 20:52 Dead9 wrote:
idk but as it stands linkens is one of the worst items in the game
On May 18 2013 20:52 Yoshi- wrote:
Linkens is fine the way it is. No need to make random buff to make it op
Clearly everyone doesn't think the same. I'd like to see a buff to the item, not necessarily one reminiscent of what I suggested, but something to make the item worth buying in a wider array of cases.
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Linkens is probably one of the worst items in the game... even worse than S&Y.
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EPT
