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ahswtini
Northern Ireland22213 Posts
On April 07 2013 07:24 duoform wrote: Fuck this DotA2/steam issues. I'm playing good old WC3 DotA until Valve comes back from his "well deserved" vacations.. Volvo one man | ||
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Shaella
United States14828 Posts
On April 07 2013 07:41 Itsmedudeman wrote: Phantom lancer has never had a month above 52% winrate and he's been going downhill recently. You can whine all you want about your pub games, but he is far and away from being the best carry. That would go to lone druid. Bloodseeker has 100% winrate pls nerf icefraud | ||
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aintz
Canada5624 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
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Teton
France1656 Posts
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Goldfish
2230 Posts
Funny thing I was trying to play a game during *Proleague downtime (so it was co-op) but you can get abandons in Co-op against bots >.>. If I didn't disconnect, I would have finished a game in time too >.>(Proleague is has about 15-20 minute downtime between games). Not sure if I'll get an abandon for that now (it says game is still in progress and I can't reconnect). | ||
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Itsmedudeman
United States19229 Posts
On April 07 2013 11:20 Kipsate wrote: Which is in its own skewed by bad (western) teams though. Still better then pubwinrates. He's arguably even worse in Asia. You won't see him in the first ban/first pick phase. And people saying winrate doesn't mean anything... It means a lot. Or at least more than your own perceived bias. Every time phantom lancer is picked and a team makes a comeback win they perceive that to be bullshit. It's just the nature of the hero to make comeback wins because it can put your team behind. If you don't deal with it correctly, you lose. That kind of perception is amplified by people's own pub games ofc, and witnessing things firsthand to then seeing it happen the same in a pro game can reinforce that kind of mentality. But facts are facts, and phantom lancer is a situational pick, not a dominant carry. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On April 07 2013 15:10 Itsmedudeman wrote: He's arguably even worse in Asia. You won't see him in the first ban/first pick phase. And people saying winrate doesn't mean anything... It means a lot. Or at least more than your own perceived bias. Every time phantom lancer is picked and a team makes a comeback win they perceive that to be bullshit. It's just the nature of the hero to make comeback wins because it can put your team behind. If you don't deal with it correctly, you lose. That kind of perception is amplified by people's own pub games ofc, and witnessing things firsthand to then seeing it happen the same in a pro game can reinforce that kind of mentality. But facts are facts, and phantom lancer is a situational pick, not a dominant carry. Completely agree. He's a bullshit hero because he puts the onus on the opposition to win while you just have to not lose but he's not at all the top carry in the game for pro play, especially at the highest level. | ||
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Shaella
United States14828 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:00 FuzzyJAM wrote: Completely agree. He's a bullshit hero because he puts the onus on the opposition to win while you just have to not lose but he's not at all the top carry in the game for pro play, especially at the highest level. There are plenty of hard carries like that, are all carries bullshit then? | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:00 FuzzyJAM wrote: Completely agree. He's a bullshit hero because he puts the onus on the opposition to win while you just have to not lose but he's not at all the top carry in the game for pro play, especially at the highest level. I would argue that makes him an even WORSE pub hero. Pub games snowball way harder than competitive games once you get past the point where players recognize when they're at an advantage and know not to let carry heroes farm a game out. | ||
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ChunderBoy
3242 Posts
And PL's the hardest carry to deal with in my pubs. | ||
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:07 Shaella wrote: There are plenty of hard carries like that, are all carries bullshit then? Most hard carries require the team to make openings and create space for farm. PL just requires the team to not let the opposition get mega creeps. Note: Slight exaggeration. <_< | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
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DrPandaPhD
5188 Posts
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FuzzyJAM
Scotland9300 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:32 TheYango wrote: What are you trying to say? If the enemy team is chain-taking all your towers, a PL isn't going to split-push better, farm faster, or be harder to gank than an AM in the same position unless the AM is so ridiculously behind as to have no shot at finishing BFury before you get high-grounded, in which case it doesn't matter which carry you're playing--you're fucked regardless if you're that behind. AM is a totally different proposition. He has strong push but he can't simultaneously push and stall out the opposition push without any risk to himself like a PL. His ability to hold high ground doesn't compare IMO. AM is (IMO) a stronger hero overall, but the AM clock isn't close to as hard as the PL clock - let an AM get six slotted and you can still win. Let a PL get six slotted? Eh. . . | ||
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:43 DrPandaPhD wrote: The day where Gem of Truesight actually has truesight and makes illusions blue, I wont hate PL as much. It wont even affect other Illu heroes that much tbh. the day medusa's mystic snake gets its CD dropped to like 5 seconds* xD | ||
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justinpal
United States3810 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:58 PrinceXizor wrote: the day medusa's mystic snake gets its CD dropped to like 5 seconds* xD the day hex is an aoe spell with 0 CD.* | ||
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Andre
Slovenia3523 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:55 FuzzyJAM wrote: AM is a totally different proposition. He has strong push but he can't simultaneously push and stall out the opposition push without any risk to himself like a PL. His ability to hold high ground doesn't compare IMO. AM is (IMO) a stronger hero overall, but the AM clock isn't close to as hard as the PL clock - let an AM get six slotted and you can still win. Let a PL get six slotted? Eh. . . AM's clock is different that in if he has a good start he will kill you at 30th minute. PL won't. PL will be stronger as time progresses but there is a timing where AM is stronger ( either for the purposes of AM vs PL or just AM/PL vs general teams). Also a six-slotted PL isn't impossible to deal with. There are heroes that if they have equal farm as PL will kill him easily.(tiny, sven, medusa, kunkka). Though some of those can deal with him easier than others. Aside from specific-hero "counters" aoe teams always have the advantage. | ||
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Itsmedudeman
United States19229 Posts
On April 07 2013 17:16 TheYango wrote: I would argue that makes him an even WORSE pub hero. Pub games snowball way harder than competitive games once you get past the point where players recognize when they're at an advantage and know not to let carry heroes farm a game out. Yes, but I think difficult to gank heroes along with strong split pushing makes PL pretty annoying to deal with in pubs. He doesn't need anything like a battlefury or radiance, and he's pretty okay in the early game. You have to be decisive and quick when dealing with a PL because otherwise you're gonna get ran around and lose the game. Also, PL is really dependent on the picks. If you don't have good heroes to deal with him then it might be impossible to deal with his illusions after a certain point. If you're playing something like all pick where most people don't really think about picks and counters, then you might put yourself into a bad position before the game even starts. Honestly, I don't think PL is even THAT good in pubs. But again, people perceive him as a bullshit hero because of the annoying stuff he can do, like split push without even fighting your team, making a billion illusions your team can't do anything about, etc. | ||
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