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General Discussion - Page 1518

Forum Index > Dota 2 General
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IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2

Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads.
buddahbrot
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany47 Posts
November 19 2012 18:36 GMT
#30341
And just now in Na'Vi vs MYM XBOCT shows up as Na'Vi Sasha Grey...
teapoted
Profile Joined August 2012
United Kingdom24425 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-19 18:38:18
November 19 2012 18:37 GMT
#30342
Well the one thing The Defense II did well is that they were very strict on names. I personally don't care if the name are offensive, but when the caster doesn't even know who's playing it's annoying as shit.
Once you Goblak...
dfs
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Russian Federation4050 Posts
November 19 2012 18:37 GMT
#30343
On November 20 2012 03:36 buddahbrot wrote:
And just now in Na'Vi vs MYM XBOCT shows up as Na'Vi Sasha Grey...

Lets call the sponsors!
Writerhttp://i.imgur.com/Q1jSb9X.jpg (c) Shiro; http://i.imgur.com/lSDLLKb.png (c) drav
Attakijing
Profile Joined June 2011
United States693 Posts
November 19 2012 18:38 GMT
#30344
On November 20 2012 02:59 canikizu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 20 2012 01:56 r.Evo wrote:
On November 20 2012 01:23 NB wrote:
On November 19 2012 23:51 r.Evo wrote:
On November 19 2012 23:42 NB wrote:
On November 19 2012 23:34 r.Evo wrote:
On November 19 2012 21:17 rob.au wrote:
The low priority system seems like the worst out of all three moba games for dealing with leavers. It basically is the worst punishment out of all three yet you are not really tied to your account in dota2, so it's easy to just play on a smurf or just not at all for a day and you basically feel no effects of the punishment. Add in to this that it doesn't take into account your actual leaver %, you can have a couple of games of issues (beta game) and get put in low priority for over a day.

Compare this to LoL where they have it so you can't play until the game you left finishes and then just straight up ban your account if you leave too much (where your account is actually valuable due to level up + unlock system).

Or compare it to hon where if you go over a certain % you have to go basically play practice games until you lower your %, you can't just go smurf for a day and come back no problem.

Honestly, I'm not entirely sure yet. In theory the whole leaver queue -> go smurf -> repeat sounds like a horrible idea for a leaver system, I guess the only reason it still works is because the total playerbase is still pretty low and until a few weeks ago pretty much everyone in there had something invested (invites at 3-4 keys).

Keep in mind that e.g. the League system encourages leaving, coming back and helping the enemy team to win since there is no other mechanic possible to get into the next game. That also doesn't seem ideal.

Just based on the way DotA 2 is set up it will be literally impossible to deal with smurfs, the whole unlock mechanic in League is much more discouraging to smurfs for example. Either Valve starts doing the leaver queue thing via e.g. IP (increasing the barrier it takes to get "normal" games with your smurfs) or something similar or they find another way of punishing people that makes games go smoother but doesn't punish so hard that people are more willing to invest in smurfs.

As it is, I can't see the current system working when the game gets officially released as FTP (unless that implies not a lot of growth, which would be also pretty damn stupid).

In a way, the level system of LoL somewhat make sense for a F2P model and limiting smurf. But such thing cant be transfer to dota2 bc there isnt a lot that are being attached on an account: no pay to win, no pay for heroes etc.. I guess a barrier could be set for 'F2P accounts' and 'paid account' (similar to tf2) but where would you draw the line? sever? mmr barrier? Nothing really make sense unless you want to break some of the game unique selling points.

Imo, the only way to solve this is implementing somesort of Inhouse circle system in-game. F2P cannot be vouched and can only access the game via match making. This will shift the main playing platform for high level games onto inhouse leagues. These leagues will not fail like all the past IRC system bc:
1/In-game implemented: more convenience.
2/Item drop beneficial: could always inject the dropping rate or some unique items with seasonal bonuses.

Now that you mention it, I can see a reverse system working that rewards you for having lots of games with low amount of leaves:
Nerf normal droprate and give bonus for x games you have with less than y leaves. Suddenly an account with 150 wins and 1 leave gets much more valuable over one with 5 wins and 0 leaves.

TADAAAA HATS MAKE FOR AWESOME GAMES ONCE AGAIN. Hats solve everything. While I can see the inhouse stuff implemented into ingame work I think it's not the way Valve does things and it's not needed. People who desperately DO want inhouses like that can find vouched Leagues and I can't see the developer supporting small circles which, in the end, help making normal solo queue games a much more horrible place. You just can't introduce mechanics that shut out new players via design opposed to mmr/skill level.

dropping is actually more complicated than you might think. We are talking about rarity of items in a system that has no crafting aka. no item dispenser. This means that with the current drop rate, across all sever we could have a rate X rares drop per minutes and that X determine how rare the item will be valued. Increasing the drop inside a global trading system also mean that you are increasing the item quantity therefore decreasing the item demand which ultimately defeat the F2P model.

Just like match making, i believe Valve is taking their time to test out the business model that they will be using in the future.

Oh, that wasn't what I meant. Use the current normal droprate (+ a small percentage) as the default droprate for the people with no or almost no leaves/reports. The more leaves/low priority smackdowns you have the lower your droprate sinks.

Just sell it as "Less leaves = more items!" insead of "More leaves = less items!" and have a certain number of games played treshhold which you need to qualify for the increased droprate.

That's what I've been saying in the Surrender thread. Valve can put the Surrender option in, as long as it has some penalty on it, for example, when you call Concede vote, something like "By conceding the game, you'll only have 25% exp gain, item drop rate and rare item top compared to normal. Do you want to concede?" or/and "You already conceded one/two game today, you are not allowed call/vote for concede anymore (only 4 other players can vote to decide)"

Let's face it, the game is gonna be free, with the way dota2 account is right now, stuffs like smurf accounts are gonna happen a lot. In stead of fighting against the concede function, people should try to find a way to limit its use or something.
I'm just a humble noob but I want this discussion limited to its thread if its ok with you
Slardar
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada7596 Posts
November 19 2012 18:40 GMT
#30345
I can at least stand behind them for taking the initiative, enforcing professionalism has always been lackluster in Dota 2 so far.
crms
Profile Joined February 2010
United States11933 Posts
November 19 2012 18:40 GMT
#30346
On November 20 2012 03:19 cilinder007 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 20 2012 02:59 Yoshi- wrote:
Maybe valve is giving bad players a reason to continue playing even though they obv suck?

Also wtf are the joindota staff smoking? http://www.joindota.com/en/news/4919-introducing-the-pro-rating

wow this is such bullshit, reducing prize money wtf kind of monopoly is this



I used to think severe consequences needed to be done because standin usage and no-shows were farm to common in dota.

I've since wised up about the subject and this initiative from jD is really, really stupid and naive. Unfortunately for us fans, sometimes, teams use stand-ins or are unable to field a team. Is this wrong, yes but you have to understand the dota climate.

Little to no players earn enough money to play dota professionally. We want to think dota and sc2 are both esports but from an infrastructure standpoint, dota2 is way behind. Most all 'pro' players in NA/EU have jobs, school etc., because they simply can't rely on dota. I think taking away what little prize money they can hope to earn because of some of the things jD want to penalize for is quite absurd.

Behavior penalties I don't have a problem with. You shouldn't be in live streamed games called team faggots, niggers, etc., etc., You should be professional in real matches, save your trolling for the pubs and in houses.

Anyway, my 2c.
http://i.imgur.com/fAUOr2c.png | Fighting games are great
Yoshi-
Profile Joined October 2008
Germany10227 Posts
November 19 2012 18:41 GMT
#30347
On November 20 2012 03:40 Slardar wrote:
I can at least stand behind them for taking the initiative, enforcing professionalism has always been lackluster in Dota 2 so far.


Maybe they should start with themselves first?
JD had like more issues with professionalism than any other team
teapoted
Profile Joined August 2012
United Kingdom24425 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-19 18:43:37
November 19 2012 18:42 GMT
#30348
On November 20 2012 03:40 crms wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 20 2012 03:19 cilinder007 wrote:
On November 20 2012 02:59 Yoshi- wrote:
Maybe valve is giving bad players a reason to continue playing even though they obv suck?

Also wtf are the joindota staff smoking? http://www.joindota.com/en/news/4919-introducing-the-pro-rating

wow this is such bullshit, reducing prize money wtf kind of monopoly is this



I used to think severe consequences needed to be done because standin usage and no-shows were farm to common in dota.

I've since wised up about the subject and this initiative from jD is really, really stupid and naive. Unfortunately for us fans, sometimes, teams use stand-ins or are unable to field a team. Is this wrong, yes but you have to understand the dota climate.

Little to no players earn enough money to play dota professionally. We want to think dota and sc2 are both esports but from an infrastructure standpoint, dota2 is way behind. Most all 'pro' players in NA/EU have jobs, school etc., because they simply can't rely on dota. I think taking away what little prize money they can hope to earn because of some of the things jD want to penalize for is quite absurd.

Behavior penalties I don't have a problem with. You shouldn't be in live streamed games called team faggots, niggers, etc., etc., You should be professional in real matches, save your trolling for the pubs and in houses.

Anyway, my 2c.
Well especially in The Defense. Which now has 32 teams. Multiple games per day. Lots of amateur teams.

If we were talking about something like D2L where it's only 1 match per day and only 8 teams. Different story.
Once you Goblak...
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
November 19 2012 19:01 GMT
#30349
i remember when i thought the defense was a pretty good tournament
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
Dattish
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Sweden6297 Posts
November 19 2012 19:03 GMT
#30350
--- Nuked ---
Yoshi-
Profile Joined October 2008
Germany10227 Posts
November 19 2012 19:06 GMT
#30351
Holymaster was an admin for the rgc lod room, and made rules like "no roshan".
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15846 Posts
November 19 2012 19:10 GMT
#30352
Stupid question : how can I find the cd to rebuy without being dead?
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
Qbek
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Poland12923 Posts
November 19 2012 19:10 GMT
#30353
On November 20 2012 04:10 nojok wrote:
Stupid question : how can I find the cd to rebuy without being dead?

Mouse over your gold
This space left intentionally dank /)3(\ http://i.imgur.com/RmeEUcF.png
Dattish
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Sweden6297 Posts
November 19 2012 19:36 GMT
#30354
--- Nuked ---
Asha
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom38257 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-19 19:44:23
November 19 2012 19:44 GMT
#30355
and if not shall I make one? (+ a thread I guess)
nojok
Profile Joined May 2011
France15846 Posts
November 19 2012 19:46 GMT
#30356
On November 20 2012 04:10 Qbek wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 20 2012 04:10 nojok wrote:
Stupid question : how can I find the cd to rebuy without being dead?

Mouse over your gold

ty
"Back then teams that won were credited, now it's called throw. I think it's sad." - Kuroky - Flap Flap Wings!
Dattish
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Sweden6297 Posts
November 19 2012 19:50 GMT
#30357
--- Nuked ---
Asha
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom38257 Posts
November 19 2012 19:52 GMT
#30358
Will set one up later tonight if nobody says they've made one already then ^^
Spicy_Curry
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States10573 Posts
November 19 2012 19:59 GMT
#30359
I really think friendly banter should be allowed even if it is slightly bm.
(Xboct during DH winter finals against mTw)
High Risk Low Reward
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-11-19 20:01:59
November 19 2012 20:01 GMT
#30360
Some of the initiative I get, like getting on time and using proper names, I like that part(although sometimes shit happens and as such teams should get some leeway)

I don't understand the Standins rule though, Sometimes people simply have personal committements and a lot of the time this is related to studying(as there are many teams who have studies right now). Are you going to deduct rating because someone had an exam?

Also I actually like the fact that people can communicate a bit between teams. Demon's :D occasionally lightens up the mood a bit.
WriterXiao8~~
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