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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please. In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:36 LegalLord wrote: What difference does it really make if the RNC was hacked or not? Are we trying to prove politically motivated leakage or something? They were hacked by the same group that hacked the DNC. So, for some reason, they did not release the RNC’s emails. Maybe the emails were really boring? | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom10025 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:41 Plansix wrote: They were hacked by the same group that hacked the DNC. So, for some reason, they did not release the RNC’s emails. Maybe the emails were really boring? I think they probably just got distracted half way through leaking the whole thing. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24492 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:37 Doodsmack wrote: It's clever of The Intercept to try to use this to throw you guys off their trail as Wikileaks/Russian plants. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:41 Plansix wrote: They were hacked by the same group that hacked the DNC. So, for some reason, they did not release the RNC’s emails. Maybe the emails were really boring? So... what of it? Maybe they were in Reince Priebus's pockets and didn't want to force him to be relegated to the position of honorary campaign chairman. Maybe the expected reaction would've been less notable. Maybe they decided they just couldn't outdo pussygate. Maybe they just didn't get as much to work with. Or maybe absolutely definitely 100% it was a quid pro quo collusion arranged between the hackers and Donald J Trump himself. I suppose we should just pick whichever of those narratives is most politically convenient and roll with it. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24492 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:49 LegalLord wrote: So... what of it? Maybe they were in Reince Priebus's pockets and didn't want to force him to be relegated to the position of honorary campaign chairman. Maybe the expected reaction would've been less notable. Maybe they decided they just couldn't outdo pussygate. Maybe they just didn't get as much to work with. Or maybe absolutely definitely 100% it was a quid pro quo collusion arranged between the hackers and Donald J Trump himself. I suppose we should just pick whichever of those narratives is most politically convenient and roll with it. What get's me is they still don't realize that even if it's the bold, they can't do anything about it. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:49 LegalLord wrote: So... what of it? Maybe they were in Reince Priebus's pockets and didn't want to force him to be relegated to the position of honorary campaign chairman. Maybe the expected reaction would've been less notable. Maybe they decided they just couldn't outdo pussygate. Maybe they just didn't get as much to work with. Or maybe absolutely definitely 100% it was a quid pro quo collusion arranged between the hackers and Donald J Trump himself. I suppose we should just pick whichever of those narratives is most politically convenient and roll with it. I just assume whoever hacked both of them, which is reported to be Russia, leaked what they felt would be in their best interest. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:52 Plansix wrote: I just assume whoever hacked both of them, which is reported to be Russia, leaked what they felt would be in their best interest. Breaking news: leakers act in their own self interest? | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom10025 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:59 LegalLord wrote: Breaking news: leakers act in their own self interest? I think the point he was making is that it is in Russia's interest to have Trump in office. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:59 LegalLord wrote: Breaking news: leakers act in their own self interest? Most of the time, yes. Or what they feel is in their best interest. But this isn’t a member of the US government providing details of a meeting to the press. This is a foreign nation that hacked into our political parties computers and selectively released the information they found. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
On February 15 2018 04:59 LegalLord wrote: Breaking news: leakers act in their own self interest? Why would Trump winning be in Russia's self interest? Oh wait... And don't say their goal was just to sow discord because releasing both would have done that better. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:02 Jockmcplop wrote: I think the point he was making is that it is in Russia's interest to have Trump in office. Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t. That doesn’t get proven by the selective leakage of DNC stupidity. Consider an alternative where the goal of the communist hackers is known to be to sow dissent without favoring any specific target. Does leaking RNC info contribute more to that end than not doing it? How do you imagine that plays out? | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24492 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:03 On_Slaught wrote: Why would Trump winning be in Russia's self interest? Oh wait... And don't say their goal was just to sow discord because releasing both would have done that better. I think I know someone who may disagree with that... They don’t give a shit who wins so long as both parties hate each other. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
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{CC}StealthBlue
United States41117 Posts
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:13 On_Slaught wrote: I disagree with Plansix on that point. Sure having discord is great, but even better is having discord and a president who will do good things for you. If Hillary wins Russia gets zero concessions. They had every reason to prefer Trump who already showed his willingness to cooperate with the Republican Platform Crimea thing and his business ties to them. I don't think there was a grand scheme to get a Russian plant into the presidency. More like Trump and his team were fairly easily compromised, and whether they were incompetent idiots that got caught, or actually managed to get concessions, the result would more favourable. I'm sure Russia is just fine with Trump's presidency collapsing as it is. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:03 On_Slaught wrote: And don't say their goal was just to sow discord because releasing both would have done that better. How? How do you imagine that would actually play out? | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24492 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:13 On_Slaught wrote: I disagree with Plansix on that point. Sure having discord is great, but even better is having discord and a president who will do good things for you. If Hillary wins Russia gets zero concessions. They had every reason to prefer Trump who already showed his willingness to cooperate with the Republican Platform Crimea thing and his business ties to them. I'm with plansix on this one. It's not as if they didn't end up with what they wanted more or less out of Obama's/Hillary's Reset and Libya and a US boogie man helps domestically as much or more than a dolt who was elected on your masterful manipulation of the US public, media, and political bodies. Mostly because Russians won't sincerely buy the latter and generic anti-Russian sentiments and support of military conflict are up among the people who used to be the "peaceniks" of the US. Russian leaders want a nebulous and unrealistic threat from the US to prod their people, they don't actually want a conflict (other than profitable proxies) where the Republicans are the ones arguing for restraint. | ||
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On_Slaught
United States12190 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:22 LegalLord wrote: How? How do you imagine that would actually play out? You saw the reaction to the DNC leaks. Seems obvious that releasing RNC leaks would get a similar reaction and add to the cacophony. Paints the whole system as corrupt as opposed to just one side. To answer Wolf, I have never thought that he was a plant. Rather, they saw him as someone they could work with/get concessions from as opposed to a Hillary who wouldn't work with them. | ||
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GreenHorizons
United States24492 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:28 On_Slaught wrote: You saw the reaction to the DNC leaks. Seems obvious that releasing RNC leaks would get a similar reaction and add to the cacophony. Paints the whole system as corrupt as opposed to just one side. To answer Wolf, I have never thought that he was a plant. Rather, they saw him as someone they would work with/get concessions from as opposed to a Hillary who wouldn't work with them. Who do you think doesn't know/believe the RNC was doing everything they could legitimately and then some to stop Trump? The biggest argument about this would probably come from introvert for them not doing more/trying harder to stop him if he saw the emails. If I had to wager I'd say he's not too happy about Reince being inordinately fair and ending up visiting Trumps cabinet. | ||
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WolfintheSheep
Canada14127 Posts
On February 15 2018 05:28 On_Slaught wrote: You saw the reaction to the DNC leaks. Seems obvious that releasing RNC leaks would get a similar reaction and add to the cacophony. Paints the whole system as corrupt as opposed to just one side. To answer Wolf, I have never thought that he was a plant. Rather, they saw him as someone they could work with/get concessions from as opposed to a Hillary who wouldn't work with them. I'm just saying concessions or pro-Russia US would be the best case scenario, but not a reasonable goal. But once Trump's team was compromised, him winning was more favourable regardless of what happened after. | ||
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