|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On January 28 2018 11:52 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2018 11:22 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 10:59 zlefin wrote:On January 28 2018 08:15 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 08:10 NewSunshine wrote:On January 28 2018 07:24 Danglars wrote:
This forum isn't famous for a spectrum of ideological diversity. It's more the place where you accuse opponents of hating brown people and loving Trump. Utter hogwash. The fact that the majority of people here disagree with you doesn't make them all far leftists. Plenty of people hold plenty of different opinions, and for different reasons. I regularly find things I disagree on between myself and regular posters such as P6 or GH, even Kwark. The difference is I find them (largely) reasonable. If you feel like the world is out to get you, perhaps try examining the way you interact with people, or the positions you hold. Didn't this forum use to be pretty much 50-50 left/right before Trump? I think that speaks volumes in and of itself. Trump and the republican party just isn't reasonable any more. There is zero worth in there. It's an "opposition party" whose only values are to be opposed of the other party (and, as it turns out, to be opposed of any reason and intelligence). Also, as a quote has been going around states: "Everything is left when you're to the right of Mussolini" the forum has always been left-leaning iirc; though if you count just american posters i'm less sure, though it probably still was somewhat. it is true that the republicans have been getting crazier and crazier; and have gone full loco with trump, and this has afflicted many who post on that side (to varying degrees). also partisanship (plus people in general bein stupid) causes many right-leaning posters to defend other right-leaning posters even when they shouldn't be. Kind of ironic, but ...whether you're left or right-leaning doesn't actually matter. Because this system will always cater for its owners, the rich fat cats. They don't care who wins the 'dog race' because every single dog, that's running on that track is actually running for them. I'm the only one in my family who doesn't vote and whenever, they leave the house to 'place their bets'... I remind them: "Whoever you've chosen won't matter, the house always wins!" (edit: I used animal references, not because I loathe them, I love animals (I only hate politicians). Never understood the dog/ cat person thing though, both are awesome so why choose?  ) Unlike Zlefin I'm going to come out and say that this is entirely wrong. Yes, the US political system is completely fucked, maybe beyond repair, due to its "donations" (Which everywhere else in the world would be called corruption), first past the post, gerrymandering and electoral college to name a few. It's a system which caters to the rich so they can get their way. This does not(!) however mean that every party/president/senator is the same. There are wide differences, and some do actually try to fight for your interests along side those of his donors, to a varying degree. Some people do actually become politicians because they want to make a difference, and they are fighting their own system to attempt to fight for you. To pretend that Hillary would be the same as Trump is laughable. With Hillary you might not have felt a huge difference in your daily life, much like with Obama, but there's a good chance she would have steered the country in the right direction in the long run while simultaneously catering to her own interests. Trump on the other hand is hellbent on tearing the country apart. He gives no shits about your interests. He only cares about himself and how his rich friends view him, and he is willing to lie and attack every liberty you might think you have to do it. Even if you think Hillary would have been a bad president, you still should have voted for her as the lesser evil. This "my vote doesn't matter anyways" is a common misconception I hear a lot, but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it.
I think we can make his description and yours work if we just consider "the fat cats" not one uniformed group, but a group of many individuals (few hundred or thousand depending on your perspective) with overlapping interest and different sales techniques.
but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it.
Remember there are only a few states where this would have mattered. I also find it fascinating that people steadfastly promote the idea that being less bad than the alternative is the only criteria for someones vote regardless of how bad the choices get.
|
On January 28 2018 11:52 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2018 11:22 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 10:59 zlefin wrote:On January 28 2018 08:15 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 08:10 NewSunshine wrote:On January 28 2018 07:24 Danglars wrote:
This forum isn't famous for a spectrum of ideological diversity. It's more the place where you accuse opponents of hating brown people and loving Trump. Utter hogwash. The fact that the majority of people here disagree with you doesn't make them all far leftists. Plenty of people hold plenty of different opinions, and for different reasons. I regularly find things I disagree on between myself and regular posters such as P6 or GH, even Kwark. The difference is I find them (largely) reasonable. If you feel like the world is out to get you, perhaps try examining the way you interact with people, or the positions you hold. Didn't this forum use to be pretty much 50-50 left/right before Trump? I think that speaks volumes in and of itself. Trump and the republican party just isn't reasonable any more. There is zero worth in there. It's an "opposition party" whose only values are to be opposed of the other party (and, as it turns out, to be opposed of any reason and intelligence). Also, as a quote has been going around states: "Everything is left when you're to the right of Mussolini" the forum has always been left-leaning iirc; though if you count just american posters i'm less sure, though it probably still was somewhat. it is true that the republicans have been getting crazier and crazier; and have gone full loco with trump, and this has afflicted many who post on that side (to varying degrees). also partisanship (plus people in general bein stupid) causes many right-leaning posters to defend other right-leaning posters even when they shouldn't be. Kind of ironic, but ...whether you're left or right-leaning doesn't actually matter. Because this system will always cater for its owners, the rich fat cats. They don't care who wins the 'dog race' because every single dog, that's running on that track is actually running for them. I'm the only one in my family who doesn't vote and whenever, they leave the house to 'place their bets'... I remind them: "Whoever you've chosen won't matter, the house always wins!" (edit: I used animal references, not because I loathe them, I love animals (I only hate politicians). Never understood the dog/ cat person thing though, both are awesome so why choose? ) Unlike Zlefin I'm going to come out and say that this is entirely wrong. Yes, the US political system is completely fucked, maybe beyond repair, due to its "donations" (Which everywhere else in the world would be called corruption), first past the post, gerrymandering and electoral college to name a few. It's a system which caters to the rich so they can get their way. This does not(!) however mean that every party/president/senator is the same. There are wide differences, and some do actually try to fight for your interests along side those of his donors, to a varying degree. Some people do actually become politicians because they want to make a difference, and they are fighting their own system to attempt to fight for you. To pretend that Hillary would be the same as Trump is laughable. With Hillary you might not have felt a huge difference in your daily life, much like with Obama, but there's a good chance she would have steered the country in the right direction in the long run while simultaneously catering to her own interests. Trump on the other hand is hellbent on tearing the country apart. He gives no shits about your interests. He only cares about himself and how his rich friends view him, and he is willing to lie and attack every liberty you might think you have to do it. Even if you think Hillary would have been a bad president, you still should have voted for her as the lesser evil. This "my vote doesn't matter anyways" is a common misconception I hear a lot, but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it. The 2 misconceptions here are, that the U.S. is a democracy and that every vote matters. It is not, it's a republic with an electoral college. The electoral college was established for a reason, for the very same reason I've mentioned above, to keep the rich in power.
|
On January 28 2018 12:05 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
So a terrorist training camp in Texas and little to no media coverage.
Can't be a terrorist if you're white..! /s if not obvious
|
On January 28 2018 12:08 thePunGun wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2018 11:52 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 11:22 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 10:59 zlefin wrote:On January 28 2018 08:15 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 08:10 NewSunshine wrote:On January 28 2018 07:24 Danglars wrote:
This forum isn't famous for a spectrum of ideological diversity. It's more the place where you accuse opponents of hating brown people and loving Trump. Utter hogwash. The fact that the majority of people here disagree with you doesn't make them all far leftists. Plenty of people hold plenty of different opinions, and for different reasons. I regularly find things I disagree on between myself and regular posters such as P6 or GH, even Kwark. The difference is I find them (largely) reasonable. If you feel like the world is out to get you, perhaps try examining the way you interact with people, or the positions you hold. Didn't this forum use to be pretty much 50-50 left/right before Trump? I think that speaks volumes in and of itself. Trump and the republican party just isn't reasonable any more. There is zero worth in there. It's an "opposition party" whose only values are to be opposed of the other party (and, as it turns out, to be opposed of any reason and intelligence). Also, as a quote has been going around states: "Everything is left when you're to the right of Mussolini" the forum has always been left-leaning iirc; though if you count just american posters i'm less sure, though it probably still was somewhat. it is true that the republicans have been getting crazier and crazier; and have gone full loco with trump, and this has afflicted many who post on that side (to varying degrees). also partisanship (plus people in general bein stupid) causes many right-leaning posters to defend other right-leaning posters even when they shouldn't be. Kind of ironic, but ...whether you're left or right-leaning doesn't actually matter. Because this system will always cater for its owners, the rich fat cats. They don't care who wins the 'dog race' because every single dog, that's running on that track is actually running for them. I'm the only one in my family who doesn't vote and whenever, they leave the house to 'place their bets'... I remind them: "Whoever you've chosen won't matter, the house always wins!" (edit: I used animal references, not because I loathe them, I love animals (I only hate politicians). Never understood the dog/ cat person thing though, both are awesome so why choose? ) Unlike Zlefin I'm going to come out and say that this is entirely wrong. Yes, the US political system is completely fucked, maybe beyond repair, due to its "donations" (Which everywhere else in the world would be called corruption), first past the post, gerrymandering and electoral college to name a few. It's a system which caters to the rich so they can get their way. This does not(!) however mean that every party/president/senator is the same. There are wide differences, and some do actually try to fight for your interests along side those of his donors, to a varying degree. Some people do actually become politicians because they want to make a difference, and they are fighting their own system to attempt to fight for you. To pretend that Hillary would be the same as Trump is laughable. With Hillary you might not have felt a huge difference in your daily life, much like with Obama, but there's a good chance she would have steered the country in the right direction in the long run while simultaneously catering to her own interests. Trump on the other hand is hellbent on tearing the country apart. He gives no shits about your interests. He only cares about himself and how his rich friends view him, and he is willing to lie and attack every liberty you might think you have to do it. Even if you think Hillary would have been a bad president, you still should have voted for her as the lesser evil. This "my vote doesn't matter anyways" is a common misconception I hear a lot, but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it. The 2 misconceptions here are, that the U.S. is a democracy and that every vote matters. It is not, it's a republic with an electoral college. The electoral college was established for a reason, for the very same reason I've mentioned above, to keep the rich in power.
"Republic" means "representative democracy", which is a form of democracy. Your vote matters, just to a varying degree depending on your location. The electoral college was established for a variety of no longer valid reasons, but not because "the rich wanted power". This is history book material you can google so I won't repeat it here (tl;dr: long distances with long travel times, + wanted the president to govern the states more than the people directly). I know we all like to hate on the rich for greedily grabbing too much political power, but they're not some kind of Illuminati either.
The misconceptions are all in your own view I'm afraid. Like I said this is a common one I've heard a lot, but it doesn't make it true. Certain elections have come down to just a handful of people, and more importantly you are not alone in thinking like you. If everyone who did actually went and voted instead, it would be enough to push every single election. So while you're sitting there smirking to yourself for being so wise, you are literally fulfilling your own prophecy of your vote not mattering because it's not cast in the first place.
|
On January 28 2018 12:19 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2018 12:08 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 11:52 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 11:22 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 10:59 zlefin wrote:On January 28 2018 08:15 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 08:10 NewSunshine wrote:On January 28 2018 07:24 Danglars wrote:
This forum isn't famous for a spectrum of ideological diversity. It's more the place where you accuse opponents of hating brown people and loving Trump. Utter hogwash. The fact that the majority of people here disagree with you doesn't make them all far leftists. Plenty of people hold plenty of different opinions, and for different reasons. I regularly find things I disagree on between myself and regular posters such as P6 or GH, even Kwark. The difference is I find them (largely) reasonable. If you feel like the world is out to get you, perhaps try examining the way you interact with people, or the positions you hold. Didn't this forum use to be pretty much 50-50 left/right before Trump? I think that speaks volumes in and of itself. Trump and the republican party just isn't reasonable any more. There is zero worth in there. It's an "opposition party" whose only values are to be opposed of the other party (and, as it turns out, to be opposed of any reason and intelligence). Also, as a quote has been going around states: "Everything is left when you're to the right of Mussolini" the forum has always been left-leaning iirc; though if you count just american posters i'm less sure, though it probably still was somewhat. it is true that the republicans have been getting crazier and crazier; and have gone full loco with trump, and this has afflicted many who post on that side (to varying degrees). also partisanship (plus people in general bein stupid) causes many right-leaning posters to defend other right-leaning posters even when they shouldn't be. Kind of ironic, but ...whether you're left or right-leaning doesn't actually matter. Because this system will always cater for its owners, the rich fat cats. They don't care who wins the 'dog race' because every single dog, that's running on that track is actually running for them. I'm the only one in my family who doesn't vote and whenever, they leave the house to 'place their bets'... I remind them: "Whoever you've chosen won't matter, the house always wins!" (edit: I used animal references, not because I loathe them, I love animals (I only hate politicians). Never understood the dog/ cat person thing though, both are awesome so why choose? ) Unlike Zlefin I'm going to come out and say that this is entirely wrong. Yes, the US political system is completely fucked, maybe beyond repair, due to its "donations" (Which everywhere else in the world would be called corruption), first past the post, gerrymandering and electoral college to name a few. It's a system which caters to the rich so they can get their way. This does not(!) however mean that every party/president/senator is the same. There are wide differences, and some do actually try to fight for your interests along side those of his donors, to a varying degree. Some people do actually become politicians because they want to make a difference, and they are fighting their own system to attempt to fight for you. To pretend that Hillary would be the same as Trump is laughable. With Hillary you might not have felt a huge difference in your daily life, much like with Obama, but there's a good chance she would have steered the country in the right direction in the long run while simultaneously catering to her own interests. Trump on the other hand is hellbent on tearing the country apart. He gives no shits about your interests. He only cares about himself and how his rich friends view him, and he is willing to lie and attack every liberty you might think you have to do it. Even if you think Hillary would have been a bad president, you still should have voted for her as the lesser evil. This "my vote doesn't matter anyways" is a common misconception I hear a lot, but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it. The 2 misconceptions here are, that the U.S. is a democracy and that every vote matters. It is not, it's a republic with an electoral college. The electoral college was established for a reason, for the very same reason I've mentioned above, to keep the rich in power. "Republic" means "representative democracy", which is a form of democracy. Your vote matters, just to a varying degree depending on your location. The electoral college was established for a variety of no longer valid reasons, but not because "the rich wanted power". This is history book material you can google so I won't repeat it here (tl;dr: long distances with long travel times, + wanted the president to govern the states more than the people directly). I know we all like to hate on the rich for greedily grabbing too much political power, but they're not some kind of Illuminati either. The misconceptions are all in your own view I'm afraid. Like I said this is a common one I've heard a lot, but it doesn't make it true. Certain elections have come down to just a handful of people, and more importantly you are not alone in thinking like you. If everyone who did actually went and voted instead, it would be enough to push every single election. So while you're sitting there smirking to yourself for being so wise, you are literally fulfilling your own prophecy of your vote not mattering because it's not cast in the first place.
Who are some of the politicians that you think would trade a life of wealth, power, and job security for helping people less fortunate?
|
So no mention of $23mil for two fridges on a fucking plane? Like, seriously?
|
|
|
United Kingdom13775 Posts
On January 28 2018 13:15 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
So no mention of $23mil for two fridges on a fucking plane? Like, seriously?
Nah, it's pretty much par for the course.
|
On January 28 2018 13:15 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
So no mention of $23mil for two fridges on a fucking plane? Like, seriously?
I mean it seems absurd but this is one of those things where it would have been the same if Hillary won.
"Although serviced on a regular basis, reliability has decreased with failures increasing, especially in hot/humid environments. The units are unable to effectively support mission requirements for food storage,"
Source
I can only imagine the Hillary supporters on Twitter if this was Bernie instead of Hillary
|
Put the shit in coolers! Hahaha. And LL I know, but this is just extravagant waste of money. Those fridges better be nitro cooled with AI.
|
United Kingdom13775 Posts
I wouldn't worry - after all, Trump's tirade at the beginning of his presidency did force AF1's contractors to massively reduce the price as a means of reducing waste. So it's still a net savings.
|
United States24673 Posts
Do you know the breakdown of those costs for the cooling units on air force one? It's not simply the purchase price of the units. Adding new technology to first-of-a-kind airplanes including FAA sign-off is always a big deal. I'm not saying the price is necessarily appropriate but the situation is being exaggerated.
|
On January 28 2018 12:47 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2018 12:19 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 12:08 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 11:52 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 11:22 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 10:59 zlefin wrote:On January 28 2018 08:15 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 08:10 NewSunshine wrote:On January 28 2018 07:24 Danglars wrote:
This forum isn't famous for a spectrum of ideological diversity. It's more the place where you accuse opponents of hating brown people and loving Trump. Utter hogwash. The fact that the majority of people here disagree with you doesn't make them all far leftists. Plenty of people hold plenty of different opinions, and for different reasons. I regularly find things I disagree on between myself and regular posters such as P6 or GH, even Kwark. The difference is I find them (largely) reasonable. If you feel like the world is out to get you, perhaps try examining the way you interact with people, or the positions you hold. Didn't this forum use to be pretty much 50-50 left/right before Trump? I think that speaks volumes in and of itself. Trump and the republican party just isn't reasonable any more. There is zero worth in there. It's an "opposition party" whose only values are to be opposed of the other party (and, as it turns out, to be opposed of any reason and intelligence). Also, as a quote has been going around states: "Everything is left when you're to the right of Mussolini" the forum has always been left-leaning iirc; though if you count just american posters i'm less sure, though it probably still was somewhat. it is true that the republicans have been getting crazier and crazier; and have gone full loco with trump, and this has afflicted many who post on that side (to varying degrees). also partisanship (plus people in general bein stupid) causes many right-leaning posters to defend other right-leaning posters even when they shouldn't be. Kind of ironic, but ...whether you're left or right-leaning doesn't actually matter. Because this system will always cater for its owners, the rich fat cats. They don't care who wins the 'dog race' because every single dog, that's running on that track is actually running for them. I'm the only one in my family who doesn't vote and whenever, they leave the house to 'place their bets'... I remind them: "Whoever you've chosen won't matter, the house always wins!" (edit: I used animal references, not because I loathe them, I love animals (I only hate politicians). Never understood the dog/ cat person thing though, both are awesome so why choose? ) Unlike Zlefin I'm going to come out and say that this is entirely wrong. Yes, the US political system is completely fucked, maybe beyond repair, due to its "donations" (Which everywhere else in the world would be called corruption), first past the post, gerrymandering and electoral college to name a few. It's a system which caters to the rich so they can get their way. This does not(!) however mean that every party/president/senator is the same. There are wide differences, and some do actually try to fight for your interests along side those of his donors, to a varying degree. Some people do actually become politicians because they want to make a difference, and they are fighting their own system to attempt to fight for you. To pretend that Hillary would be the same as Trump is laughable. With Hillary you might not have felt a huge difference in your daily life, much like with Obama, but there's a good chance she would have steered the country in the right direction in the long run while simultaneously catering to her own interests. Trump on the other hand is hellbent on tearing the country apart. He gives no shits about your interests. He only cares about himself and how his rich friends view him, and he is willing to lie and attack every liberty you might think you have to do it. Even if you think Hillary would have been a bad president, you still should have voted for her as the lesser evil. This "my vote doesn't matter anyways" is a common misconception I hear a lot, but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it. The 2 misconceptions here are, that the U.S. is a democracy and that every vote matters. It is not, it's a republic with an electoral college. The electoral college was established for a reason, for the very same reason I've mentioned above, to keep the rich in power. "Republic" means "representative democracy", which is a form of democracy. Your vote matters, just to a varying degree depending on your location. The electoral college was established for a variety of no longer valid reasons, but not because "the rich wanted power". This is history book material you can google so I won't repeat it here (tl;dr: long distances with long travel times, + wanted the president to govern the states more than the people directly). I know we all like to hate on the rich for greedily grabbing too much political power, but they're not some kind of Illuminati either. The misconceptions are all in your own view I'm afraid. Like I said this is a common one I've heard a lot, but it doesn't make it true. Certain elections have come down to just a handful of people, and more importantly you are not alone in thinking like you. If everyone who did actually went and voted instead, it would be enough to push every single election. So while you're sitting there smirking to yourself for being so wise, you are literally fulfilling your own prophecy of your vote not mattering because it's not cast in the first place. Who are some of the politicians that you think would trade a life of wealth, power, and job security for helping people less fortunate?
Some of them can actually do both rather than have to trade off. President Obama helped the less fortunate, but still became extremely powerful and gained a lot of wealth and will continue to gain wealth after his presidency.
I don't expect too many politicians to live a life of poverty. I do expect them to help the less fortunate along the way.
|
I think this reporter might have some mental issues...
|
Jesus Fox, get a new obsession. Just like the Times and Post finish her off.
|
On January 28 2018 13:41 micronesia wrote:
Do you know the breakdown of those costs for the cooling units on air force one? It's not simply the purchase price of the units. Adding new technology to first-of-a-kind airplanes including FAA sign-off is always a big deal. I'm not saying the price is necessarily appropriate but the situation is being exaggerated.
Yeah I'm not necessarily sure that it's particularly excessive considering the fridges needing to be replaced is a given. The old ones need to be torn out, and new ones tested, installed, certified, etc.
A couple fridges of that size would be 6 digits even for a land based one that is off the shelf. Needing to custom build one to meet AF1 standards, using premium materials so save weight etc. would easily increase costs by an order of magnitude.
I'm not saying that it should cost 23 million, but just for the work involved, it'd be easily a multi-million dollar project, and it's not exactly being wasted.
|
They could also easily just eat canned meals but a presidents gotta eat good I guess
Saying it's expensive because it needs to meet high requirements is a bit silly, because then the question becomes is it really necessary to have such high requirements. Wanting a scrapnel/biohazard proof cooling cell for meals (or whatever requirements makes it so expensive) is still a choice, not a necessity.
Did he scrap the new AF1 being built like he said during elections?
|
But he is not brown and not muslim, it’s not real terrorism.
Plus some very fine people train in that camp.
Trolling aside, I would love to see republican reactiô if they had discovered an islamist terrorist training camp in Texas. But hey, it was never about actual threats.
|
On January 28 2018 19:31 Biff The Understudy wrote:But he is not brown and not muslim, it’s not real terrorism. Plus some very fine people train in that camp. Trolling aside, I would love to see republican reactiô if they had discovered an islamist terrorist training camp in Texas. But hey, it was never about actual threats.
Shit would be flipped so fast that it would induce nuclear fusion in their brains.
And a flurry of bills aimed at preventing terrorism in the most comically authoritarian ways would be brought to the floor while Trump pushed for an n-th travel ban.
Also from the article:
Experts who study right-wing extremist movements believe Atomwaffen’s commitment to violence has made it one of the more dangerous groups to emerge from the new wave of white supremacists.
This crap is very squarely on Trump and the modern Republican's heads. They have emboldened this, obviously, in the sphere of public perception. But that's not where it stops, he is also turning counter-extremism programs to counter-islam-extremism programs. Such a dangerous dotard.
|
On January 28 2018 12:47 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2018 12:19 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 12:08 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 11:52 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 11:22 thePunGun wrote:On January 28 2018 10:59 zlefin wrote:On January 28 2018 08:15 Excludos wrote:On January 28 2018 08:10 NewSunshine wrote:On January 28 2018 07:24 Danglars wrote:
This forum isn't famous for a spectrum of ideological diversity. It's more the place where you accuse opponents of hating brown people and loving Trump. Utter hogwash. The fact that the majority of people here disagree with you doesn't make them all far leftists. Plenty of people hold plenty of different opinions, and for different reasons. I regularly find things I disagree on between myself and regular posters such as P6 or GH, even Kwark. The difference is I find them (largely) reasonable. If you feel like the world is out to get you, perhaps try examining the way you interact with people, or the positions you hold. Didn't this forum use to be pretty much 50-50 left/right before Trump? I think that speaks volumes in and of itself. Trump and the republican party just isn't reasonable any more. There is zero worth in there. It's an "opposition party" whose only values are to be opposed of the other party (and, as it turns out, to be opposed of any reason and intelligence). Also, as a quote has been going around states: "Everything is left when you're to the right of Mussolini" the forum has always been left-leaning iirc; though if you count just american posters i'm less sure, though it probably still was somewhat. it is true that the republicans have been getting crazier and crazier; and have gone full loco with trump, and this has afflicted many who post on that side (to varying degrees). also partisanship (plus people in general bein stupid) causes many right-leaning posters to defend other right-leaning posters even when they shouldn't be. Kind of ironic, but ...whether you're left or right-leaning doesn't actually matter. Because this system will always cater for its owners, the rich fat cats. They don't care who wins the 'dog race' because every single dog, that's running on that track is actually running for them. I'm the only one in my family who doesn't vote and whenever, they leave the house to 'place their bets'... I remind them: "Whoever you've chosen won't matter, the house always wins!" (edit: I used animal references, not because I loathe them, I love animals (I only hate politicians). Never understood the dog/ cat person thing though, both are awesome so why choose? ) Unlike Zlefin I'm going to come out and say that this is entirely wrong. Yes, the US political system is completely fucked, maybe beyond repair, due to its "donations" (Which everywhere else in the world would be called corruption), first past the post, gerrymandering and electoral college to name a few. It's a system which caters to the rich so they can get their way. This does not(!) however mean that every party/president/senator is the same. There are wide differences, and some do actually try to fight for your interests along side those of his donors, to a varying degree. Some people do actually become politicians because they want to make a difference, and they are fighting their own system to attempt to fight for you. To pretend that Hillary would be the same as Trump is laughable. With Hillary you might not have felt a huge difference in your daily life, much like with Obama, but there's a good chance she would have steered the country in the right direction in the long run while simultaneously catering to her own interests. Trump on the other hand is hellbent on tearing the country apart. He gives no shits about your interests. He only cares about himself and how his rich friends view him, and he is willing to lie and attack every liberty you might think you have to do it. Even if you think Hillary would have been a bad president, you still should have voted for her as the lesser evil. This "my vote doesn't matter anyways" is a common misconception I hear a lot, but you not voting is literally why Trump is president right now, and your life and those around you either is or will be actively worse because of it. The 2 misconceptions here are, that the U.S. is a democracy and that every vote matters. It is not, it's a republic with an electoral college. The electoral college was established for a reason, for the very same reason I've mentioned above, to keep the rich in power. "Republic" means "representative democracy", which is a form of democracy. Your vote matters, just to a varying degree depending on your location. The electoral college was established for a variety of no longer valid reasons, but not because "the rich wanted power". This is history book material you can google so I won't repeat it here (tl;dr: long distances with long travel times, + wanted the president to govern the states more than the people directly). I know we all like to hate on the rich for greedily grabbing too much political power, but they're not some kind of Illuminati either. The misconceptions are all in your own view I'm afraid. Like I said this is a common one I've heard a lot, but it doesn't make it true. Certain elections have come down to just a handful of people, and more importantly you are not alone in thinking like you. If everyone who did actually went and voted instead, it would be enough to push every single election. So while you're sitting there smirking to yourself for being so wise, you are literally fulfilling your own prophecy of your vote not mattering because it's not cast in the first place. Who are some of the politicians that you think would trade a life of wealth, power, and job security for helping people less fortunate?
None, but this also proves you didn't read what I actually said. It's entierly possible to work several interests at the same time. Unlike a certain few politicians who will only work for their own at the cost of everyone else.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
