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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him.
Telling the world to fuck off when you live in a global world is not always the best idea
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On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him.
do you have any actual plan to address the situation?
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On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him.
"Trump" and "bright" in the same sentence? I really have seen everything now
Like has been mentioned before: Telling the world to fuck off is an extremely bad plan of attack.. This is exactly what North Korea has been doing for quite a while now.
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On December 19 2017 05:51 Introvert wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:48 IyMoon wrote:On December 19 2017 05:42 Introvert wrote:On December 19 2017 05:29 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Tax cuts on the low income side are pretty much always renewed. What should be worrying to the Democrats is that 5% figure. That's super small, and prob a certain class of richer people. Also when Trump talked about infrastructure I'm pretty sure that Paul Ryan himself said that was on the agenda. I'm amused by people who think that Trump wouldn't support working with the Democrats on that. It's a portion of their own base that should be their concern. I have no doubt that Trump would work with democrats on this. That is not the point, the point is it is trumps job to start the conversation and he has not. He had choices on what to work on and he picked two things that said fuck you Dems I hear that Trump is mercurial, likes to make deals, would sign almost whatever came to his desk, and likes to be flattered. Sounds like there is room here!
there could be; but that's not what started this discussion chain;
what started it is the usual suspects spouting BS.
you're also ignorin the oft-repeated point that the Dems don' thave the power to bring it to his desk.
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I'm really curious where Danglars's passion for cooperation was when Republicans spent basically all of Obama's presidency blocking and delaying everything they could.
Probably the same place his passion for free speech goes to when it relates to journalists being arrested or black people protesting police shootings, I guess.
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On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation?
Yep, let Israel win.
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On December 19 2017 05:48 IyMoon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:42 Introvert wrote:Tax cuts on the low income side are pretty much always renewed. What should be worrying to the Democrats is that 5% figure. That's super small, and prob a certain class of richer people. Also when Trump talked about infrastructure I'm pretty sure that Paul Ryan himself said that was on the agenda. I'm amused by people who think that Trump wouldn't support working with the Democrats on that. It's a portion of their own base that should be their concern. I have no doubt that Trump would work with democrats on this. That is not the point, the point is it is trumps job to start the conversation and he has not. He had choices on what to work on and he picked two things that said fuck you Dems
The other option was to say fuck you to his voters, no? Even when I disagree with the Democrat's agenda, I'm not personally offended when they try to advance it when they gain control of Congress. That's the whole reason they got their job.
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On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him.
It depends on how you look at America's interests.
Some would say its in America's interest to work with the international community at a time where its influence is already waning and the whole world is laughing timidly at its moronic president.
On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win.
A quick note:
Israel will never really win. America doesn't just want Israel, it wants more and more influence in the ME. This means constant expansion of influence which will, at some point, meet resistance and Israel will be the first country in the firing line.
Israel shouldn't want to win, they should want things just as they are.
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On December 19 2017 05:52 IyMoon wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. Telling the world to fuck off when you live in a global world is not always the best idea
This is a situation where we can clearly do it. We have the leverage, so let’s unapologetically pursue our interests.
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On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win.
Take note of the more extreme views that trump supporters hold, which they probably didn’t hold before Trump, because the only way to square Trump with one’s world view is to adopt more extreme views on western civilization.
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On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win.
which would entail what exactly? what would you see israel do that they're not already doing?
we're already lettin them do pretty much whatever they want, so i'm not seeing a proposed difference.
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On December 19 2017 05:59 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win. Take note of the more extreme views that trump supporters hold, which they probably didn’t hold before Trump, because the only way to square Trump with one’s world view is to adopt more extreme views on western civilization.
This isn’t a new view of mine. I have explained it in detail over the years in this thread. The bottom line is that Israel and Palestine will never peacefully coexist, so we should unequivocally support Israel.
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On December 19 2017 05:56 mozoku wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:48 IyMoon wrote:On December 19 2017 05:42 Introvert wrote:Tax cuts on the low income side are pretty much always renewed. What should be worrying to the Democrats is that 5% figure. That's super small, and prob a certain class of richer people. Also when Trump talked about infrastructure I'm pretty sure that Paul Ryan himself said that was on the agenda. I'm amused by people who think that Trump wouldn't support working with the Democrats on that. It's a portion of their own base that should be their concern. I have no doubt that Trump would work with democrats on this. That is not the point, the point is it is trumps job to start the conversation and he has not. He had choices on what to work on and he picked two things that said fuck you Dems The other option was to say fuck you to his voters, no? Even when I disagree with the Democrat's agenda, I'm not personally offended when they try to advance it when they gain control of Congress. That's the whole reason they got their job.
there's this thing called being diplomatic, which helps you make deals; trump does not use it. trump does not actually make deals.
there's plenty of ways to advance an agenda without alienatin geverybody else (unless your agenda is in fact hateful and/or horrible)
it also helps if what you propose is actually sensible.
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On December 19 2017 05:56 mozoku wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:48 IyMoon wrote:On December 19 2017 05:42 Introvert wrote:Tax cuts on the low income side are pretty much always renewed. What should be worrying to the Democrats is that 5% figure. That's super small, and prob a certain class of richer people. Also when Trump talked about infrastructure I'm pretty sure that Paul Ryan himself said that was on the agenda. I'm amused by people who think that Trump wouldn't support working with the Democrats on that. It's a portion of their own base that should be their concern. I have no doubt that Trump would work with democrats on this. That is not the point, the point is it is trumps job to start the conversation and he has not. He had choices on what to work on and he picked two things that said fuck you Dems The other option was to say fuck you to his voters, no? Even when I disagree with the Democrat's agenda, I'm not personally offended when they try to advance it when they gain control of Congress. That's the whole reason they got their job.
That is not a fuck you to his voters if he went infrastructure first. Hell, you probably gain capital if you do it first because now you have shown you can work with the other side to get something everyone wanted done. Making it easier to go after ACA and taxes because you already have a big win that you didn't have to shove down peoples throats.
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On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win.
I personally don’t care who wins, but the plan of supporting Israel in its current path to victory is a long term problem for the US is the region. They are either going to go full trail of tears with 5 million people or the reverse Warsaw Ghetto system they are currently working on. It’s a fight we get nothing from supporting.
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On December 19 2017 06:02 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:59 Doodsmack wrote:On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win. Take note of the more extreme views that trump supporters hold, which they probably didn’t hold before Trump, because the only way to square Trump with one’s world view is to adopt more extreme views on western civilization. This isn’t a new view of mine. I have explained it in detail over the years in this thread. The bottom line is that Israel and Palestine will never peacefully coexist, so we should unequivocally support Israel.
And create thousands of terrorists in the process for the next centuries to come.
That sounds like a good plan. Just make sure they come after you and your families, rather than spreading worldwide again.
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On December 19 2017 05:55 zlefin wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:51 Introvert wrote:On December 19 2017 05:48 IyMoon wrote:On December 19 2017 05:42 Introvert wrote:Tax cuts on the low income side are pretty much always renewed. What should be worrying to the Democrats is that 5% figure. That's super small, and prob a certain class of richer people. Also when Trump talked about infrastructure I'm pretty sure that Paul Ryan himself said that was on the agenda. I'm amused by people who think that Trump wouldn't support working with the Democrats on that. It's a portion of their own base that should be their concern. I have no doubt that Trump would work with democrats on this. That is not the point, the point is it is trumps job to start the conversation and he has not. He had choices on what to work on and he picked two things that said fuck you Dems I hear that Trump is mercurial, likes to make deals, would sign almost whatever came to his desk, and likes to be flattered. Sounds like there is room here! there could be; but that's not what started this discussion chain; what started it is the usual suspects spouting BS. you're also ignorin the oft-repeated point that the Dems don' thave the power to bring it to his desk.
I didn't ignore It, I wrote that none other than Paul Ryan has said it's an agenda item. If Trump really wants it Ryan will accommodate.
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On December 19 2017 06:04 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win. I personally don’t care who wins, but the plan of supporting Israel in its current path to victory is a long term problem for the US is the region. They are either going to go full trail of tears with 5 million people or the reverse Warsaw Ghetto system they are currently working on. It’s a fight we get nothing from supporting.
Of course we get something. We get our own little pro-Western, modern version of Sparta in the region. Besides, it's not like we'd be giving up anything. The Palestinians are useless. The other major Arab states really don't give a shit despite their public proclamations as evidenced by the deepening strategic ties between Israel and the Saudis. The eunuchs at the UN can bitch all they want, but they clearly are powerless to do anything. Trump made the proclamation at the perfect time.
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On December 19 2017 06:05 m4ini wrote:Show nested quote +On December 19 2017 06:02 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:59 Doodsmack wrote:On December 19 2017 05:56 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:52 zlefin wrote:On December 19 2017 05:50 xDaunt wrote:On December 19 2017 05:40 Jockmcplop wrote:https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/dec/18/us-outnumbered-14-to-1-as-it-vetoes-un-vote-on-status-of-jerusalemA UN security council resolution calling for the withdrawal of Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital has been backed by every council member except the US, which used its veto.
The unanimity of the rest of the council was a stark rebuke to the Trump administration over its unilateral move earlier this month, which upended decades of international consensus.
The Egyptian-drafted resolution did not specifically mention the US or Trump but expressed “deep regret at recent decisions concerning the status of Jerusalem”.
A spokesman for the Palestinian president, Mahmoud Abbas, responded to the veto by saying it was “unacceptable and threatens the stability of the international community because it disrespects it”.
The UK and France had indicated in advance that they would would back the text, which demanded that all countries comply with pre-existing UNSC resolutions on Jerusalem, dating back to 1967, including requirements that the city’s final status be decided in direct negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians.
The resolution was denounced in furious language by the US ambassador to the UN, Nikki Haley, who described it as “an insult” that would not be forgotten. “The United States will not be told by any country where we can put our embassy,” she said.
“It’s scandalous to say we are putting back peace efforts,” she added. “The fact that this veto is being done in defence of American sovereignty and in defence of America’s role in the Middle East peace process is not a source of embarrassment for us; it should be an embarrassment to the remainder of the security council.”
The Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, tweeted: “Thank you, Ambassador Haley. On Hanukkah, you spoke like a Maccabi. You lit a candle of truth. You dispel the darkness. One defeated the many. Truth defeated lies. Thank you, President Trump.” If you're in the Trump administration, every country in the world can tell you you're wrong and you just have to shout FAKE NEWS at the top of your voice to make yourself right. Trump doesn't need to yell "FAKE NEWS." He just has to yell "FUCK OFF," which he very clearly is doing. He's the first president who is bright enough to realize that it is not in America's interest to placate Palestine and the Arab states on this. Kudos to him. do you have any actual plan to address the situation? Yep, let Israel win. Take note of the more extreme views that trump supporters hold, which they probably didn’t hold before Trump, because the only way to square Trump with one’s world view is to adopt more extreme views on western civilization. This isn’t a new view of mine. I have explained it in detail over the years in this thread. The bottom line is that Israel and Palestine will never peacefully coexist, so we should unequivocally support Israel. And create thousands of terrorists in the process for the next centuries to come. That sounds like a good plan. Just make sure they come after you and your families, rather than spreading worldwide again.
How is it different from the current status quo? I'd argue that it's not. Trump actually has the conviction and the balls to realize this and act on it as opposed to pursuing the aimless moral ambiguity of the prior administrations.
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EPT
