In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!
NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
Why do you think Mattis disagrees? What do you know that he doesn't?
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
Why do you think Mattis disagrees? What do you know that he doesn't?
Or every other person who has ever looked at the deal? What inside info do you have Danglars? Are you CIA?
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
I don't get this. You're voluntarily giving up influence of the US in the world for no apparent reason. The IAEA says that Iran is in full compliance. In light of this other nations will not abandon the deal or positively view antagonistic US behaviour, and unilateral US sanctions are meaningless. Just like withdrawing from the TPP weakened Americas influence in Asia this weakens US influence in the ME, the world will simply move on. I don't understand this, it is completely unenforced behaviour.
Withdrawing from the TPP was a great move for good governance and not surrendering our sovereignty for minuscule increases in trade.
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
Why do you think Mattis disagrees? What do you know that he doesn't?
Go ask Mattis to argue with me if you're really that interested in a confrontation I don't see a productive end. Mohdoo, why are you disagreeing with the President's top advisers that assured him Iran had violated the deal? Pointless.
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
Why do you think Mattis disagrees? What do you know that he doesn't?
Go ask Mattis to argue with me if you're really that interested in a confrontation I don't see a productive end. Mohdoo, why are you disagreeing with the President's top advisers that assured him Iran had violated the deal? Pointless.
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
Why do you think Mattis disagrees? What do you know that he doesn't?
Go ask Mattis to argue with me if you're really that interested in a confrontation I don't see a productive end. Mohdoo, why are you disagreeing with the President's top advisers that assured him Iran had violated the deal? Pointless.
Mattis says Iran is complying. Mattis says to stay in the deal. You disagree. My point is that you are choosing to consider yourself a better judge than mattis. Why? Who do you.trust above mattis, specifically?
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
I don't get this. You're voluntarily giving up influence of the US in the world for no apparent reason. The IAEA says that Iran is in full compliance. In light of this other nations will not abandon the deal or positively view antagonistic US behaviour, and unilateral US sanctions are meaningless. Just like withdrawing from the TPP weakened Americas influence in Asia this weakens US influence in the ME, the world will simply move on. I don't understand this, it is completely unenforced behaviour.
Withdrawing from the TPP was a great move for good governance and not surrendering our sovereignty for minuscule increases in trade.
I've heard pros and cons to TPP and obviously for Trump and his supporters, there were far more negatives than positives. So that said, was withdrawing from TPP enough to make the livelihood of his supporters that much better? Afaik, there wasn't a new trade negotiated in place of TPP, so what's your take on China entering the vacuum left by Trump after pulling the US out of TPP without a new plan in place?
U.S. President Donald Trump will not certify that Iran is complying with the terms of a nuclear deal forged in 2015.
...
Under U.S. law, Trump faced a Sunday deadline to notify Congress whether Iran is complying with the accord that was painstakingly negotiated over 18 months by the Obama administration and determine if it remains a national security priority.
Although Trump allowed that Iran is living up to the letter of the agreement, he said it was not following the agreement's "spirit" of the regional stability it was intended to encourage.
...
But Trump's decision also faced criticism, with European Union foreign policy chief Federica Mogherini saying the deal is a robust agreement that is working and cannot be terminated by any one leader.
Mogherini said the accord "is a robust deal that provides guarantees and a strong monitoring mechanism so that Iran's nuclear program is, and will remain, exclusively for civilian purposes only."
Great job Trump /s
This is going to have some implications for security in the region.
Good speech/speechwriter. Very presidential. And go Trump! this is a move I hoped he would do. He has a habit of immediately doing something bad right after good, so we'll see how long this lasts.
So why are you excited that trump pulled out of the treaty? Everyone says they were following it and there is no way trump gets a better deal.
all this seems to be is the US losing ground on the world stage and Iran getting closer to a nuke
Iran has provably not been following it. We set limits, they exceeded limits, among others. They continue to violate their word on the testing of ballistic missiles (UN agreement). The inspection mechanism is weak. So only the uninformed or those that want to make political hay pretend they are abiding by it.
Why do you think Mattis disagrees? What do you know that he doesn't?
Go ask Mattis to argue with me if you're really that interested in a confrontation I don't see a productive end. Mohdoo, why are you disagreeing with the President's top advisers that assured him Iran had violated the deal? Pointless.
Who are these people saying they are in violation?
The institution doing the inspecting says they are compliant.
On October 14 2017 05:26 Mohdoo wrote: So aren't other countries able to just continue to enforce the Iran deal? What actually changes from Trump no longer respecting the deal? Isn't Iran still getting inspected and whatnot? I'm not seeing what this does other than stick his tongue out at Obama.
This is my take on it aswell
The deal will keep going, inspections will keep going. Nothing changes except for Trump throwing a short fit and 'winning'.
(Assuming he isn't stupid enough to go for military action)
The US imposing sanctions does nothing but open room for more goods from all other nations instead.
There was definitely a wide swath of people opposed to the TPP from both sides of the political spectrum. It was a poorly conceived attempt to try to shore up China's influence in the area by pushing American business (at the cost of American workers) so its death is something I will not mourn. If that helps China, so be it.
it's not as if the "Presidents" "advisers" are doing a good job at all. It's at least as likely that they told him Iran adheres to the deal compared to the other option.
On October 14 2017 06:32 Artisreal wrote: it's not as if the "Presidents" "advisers" are doing a good job at all. It's at least as likely that they told him Iran adheres to the deal compared to the other option.
Danglars is dealing in some alternative facts right now.
The contingent in the White House that the country is depending on, Mattis/Tillerson/McMaster/Kelly all think we should stay in the deal. Donald Trump thinks we shouldn't. Take your pick.
You'd probably do pretty well in terms of logic and reason if you chose what you thought on a subject just by picking the opposite of Trump. Like, if I was Mattis and I didn't know much about a subject, I would probably go "So, what does Trump think we should do? Ok, let's not do that."
EPT
I don't see a productive end. Mohdoo, why are you disagreeing with the President's top advisers that assured him Iran had violated the deal? Pointless.
