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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message.
What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious?
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
Regardless of Chuck Schumer and Nancy Pelosi's titles—and to the comical dismay of corporate, establishment Democrats—Bernie Sanders has become the defacto leader of the Democratic Party.
Sunday in Warren, Michigan put an exclamation point on the sentence, as Sanders, alongside Schumer, brought out 8,000 people on a bitterly cold winter day to fight against Obamacare repeal.
Even the establishment media is waking up—granted a year too late.
"That's the future of the Democratic Party," Joe Scarborough, echoing Mika Brzezinski's sentiment, said on Morning Joe Monday. "He sounds just as relevant today as he did a year ago."
So, as the mainstream media opportunistically tries to Feel The Bern after ignoring Sanders when it mattered (both CNN and MSNBC recently held primetime town halls with him), you know who's become less relevant?
Senator Elizabeth Warren .
The one-time progressive rock star—who activists tried to summon to run in 2016 with hopes of bringing down Hillary Clinton—has already made moves that many inside the Beltway believe are a precursor to a run in 2020.
But, much to the shock of genius corporate journalists who continue to live in their alternate, elitist bubble and obsess over Donald Trump's tweets rather than the endless struggles of working people, the progressive movement has soured on one if its past heroes.
A majority of progressive voters and activists I spoke to during my campaign reporting were disgusted with Warren's cowardice during the Democratic Primary, where she dodged on endorsing the most progressive candidate to run since FDR.
The firebrand, anti-Wall Street Senator was wildly popular in her home-state of Massachusetts, but she decided not to endorse Sanders before the Super Tuesday primary. Sanders lost Massachusetts by less than two points, causing progressives to believe the state—and momentum—would have gone to Sanders had Warren endorsed and campaigned with him across the state.
Larger than her Massachusetts mistake, Warren's choice to passionately campaign for Clinton—the antithesis of all she proclaimed to stand against during her meteoric rise isn't a fact progressive Sanders aficionados will simply forgive and forget.
Furthermore, Warren—along with the corporate media—was inexplicably MIA during the fight against the Dakota Access Pipeline, saying nothing as thousands of unarmed, peaceful Native Americans and environmental activists were illegally arrested and shot at with tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, freezing water, and grenades by de facto oil police in North Dakota.
Like her decision to conveniently endorse Clinton when Sanders was mathematically eliminated, Warren finally chose to speak out against DAPL on the same day the Army Corps of Engineers denied a crucial permit for the pipeline's completion.
This kind of calculated, Johnny-Come-Lately progressivism doesn't cut it for the millions of progressives looking to rally behind a leader as the road to 2020 narrows.
So, the time for choosing is upon Warren. She must decide: what do I truly stand for? Right now, there's a large swath of the progressive movement that's no longer sure.
She must choose between being a strong progressive who largely ignores political calculations in favor of fighting for workers and minorities, or continue serving as a one-trick pony that steals the show by yelling at bankers during congressional hearings, but isn't trusted by the movement to do much more.
Warren must decide if she is going to stand out as a progressive leader on issues that go beyond Wall Street and the rigged economy—such as ensuring clean water and safety for the people instead of unfettered profits for the oil companies.
If Warren chooses the progressive path, she'll still need to explain her dubious choices during the 2016 election and beyond.
But if Sanders decides against running in four years, Warren—in a political climate with a jarring scarcity of true progressive leaders—could have a chance to climb back up the progressive ranks and possibly serve as the movement's best chance to finally take the White House.
The clock is ticking. Source
I honestly think she lost her charm simply because she turned out to be more flash than substance. Neither a "progressive realist" who could get the progressive strategies implemented nor a particularly good messenger like Bernie.
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On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll The reason he gets a platform is beacuse he's a professional troll. Traveling minstrels have been a thing for a while.
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China’s premier, Xi Jinping, has delivered a strong defence of globalisation, serving notice to Donald Trump that Beijing will seek to usurp America’s traditional role as the champion of free trade and open markets.
Xi used an hour-long address to the World Economic Forum (WEF) to take a number of sideswipes at the US president-elect, attacking Trump’s protectionist views without mentioning him by name.
After later meeting US vice-president Joe Biden on the sidelines of the Davos summit, Xi said that the world needed China and the United States to have a stable and cooperative relationship.
He added that links between the two countries had “weathered wind and rain, but generally have continued to forge ahead”, saying that under Barack Obama there had been a “correct” development in relations.
In the first speech by a Chinese president at the annual Davos meeting of global political and business leaders, Xi said China would keep its borders open, stressed that there would be no winners from a trade war, and urged that all countries continued to support the 2015 Paris climate change accord.
With Trump preparing for Friday’s inauguration in Washington, Xi used the opportunity to make clear that China was keen to take a bigger role on the global stage if the US lapsed into isolationism.
“Pursuing protectionism is like locking oneself in a dark room,” he said. “Wind and rain may be kept outside, but so is light and air.”
Trump campaigned on a strongly protectionist platform, pledging to protect US firms from unfair overseas competition and threatening tariffs on goods from China and Mexico.
“No one will emerge as a winner in a trade war,” Xi told a packed hall at the WEF.
Xi said originally globalisation had been seen as Ali Baba’s treasure trove but for many had become a “Pandora’s box”. He added, however, that the economic liberalisation of the past quarter or a century was not the root cause of the world’s many problems and that the financial crash of 2008 was the result of excessive pursuit of profit.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
Hooray, let's all rally behind China as the new leader of the free world!
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On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious? Would you take a minute and disclose to us, for example, how long you've ever spent sitting through university Milo talks?
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Canada11279 Posts
On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious? I don't particularly like the fellow, but I will say he does mean Jews run everything in a very different way than the white supremacists. Aka white supremacists- Jews are running everything and it's a massive conspiracy to control the white population. Milo- Yes, there sure are a lot of Jewish writers, media persons, and academics; there's no point in denying it, as I am one myself.
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On January 18 2017 13:05 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious? Would you take a minute and disclose to us, for example, how long you've ever spent sitting through university Milo talks?
About 30 minutes on youtube, couldn't take it any longer when he started to claim that lesbian women are basically just disappointed heterosexuals but don't know it
The guy is a college dropout who says provocative shit and makes crazy money because his adolescent internet fanbase gobbles it up. He's a worse con man than Alex Jones
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On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious?
he has never said anything even close to either of those two things.
as to manning i don't think her sentence should have been commuted, she is a traitor whose crimes involved leaking military information whose public dissemination has no doubt helped the enemy.
snowden is a traitor who sabotaged his own goals by running to russia. he gave the CIA / NSA / DIA / MI5 / MI6 / etc. just what they needed to neutralize any real push to end their various domestic intelligence gathering activities by fleeing. all the deep state had to do was point to moscow and the uproar over that helped drown out the uproar over western intelligence agencies being all up in their own citizenry's business.
principled standing up to alleged injustice has never before involved giving aid to foreign foes who certainly do not believe in or behave according to the principles the snowdens and mannings of the world believe in, and accomplished nothing towards the end of stopping the alleged violation of those principles by the united states. the public good done by the disclosure of the information does not excuse the consequences of the way these two decided to stand up to what they saw as injustice. the main practical effects of their actions have not been the end of spying by western intelligence agencies on their own people or an end to wars waged by western countries in third-world countries or the strategy and tactics whereby they have been fought, it has been to strengthen russia, the taliban/al-qaeda, and the islamic state and other jihadist groups. they should not be forgiven or escape punishment for that. and the punishment for such things should be severe.
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On January 18 2017 13:18 DeepElemBlues wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious? he has never said anything even close to either of those two things. as to manning i don't think her sentence should have been commuted, she is a traitor whose crimes involved leaking military information whose public dissemination has no doubt helped the enemy. snowden is a traitor who sabotaged his own goals by running to russia. he gave the CIA / NSA / DIA / MI5 / MI6 / etc. just what they needed to neutralize any real push to end their various domestic intelligence gathering activities by fleeing. all the deep state had to do was point to moscow and the uproar over that helped drown out the uproar over western intelligence agencies being all up in their own citizenry's business. principled standing up to alleged injustice has never before involved giving aid to foreign foes. the public good done by the disclosure of the information does not excuse the consequences of the way these two decided to stand up to what they saw as injustice. the main practical effects of their actions have not been the end of spying by western intelligence agencies on their own people or an end to wars waged by western countries in third-world countries, it has been to strengthen russia, the taliban/al-qaeda, and the islamic state and other jihadist groups. they should not be forgiven or escape punishment for that. and the punishment for such things should be severe.
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/17/gay-rights-have-made-us-dumber-its-time-to-get-back-in-the-closet/
It's the literal headline written by him. Because naturally if gay people have rights, we will be overrun by Muslims. If you think this actually makes sense you have completely lost your mind
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
Assange was talking about how he was coordinating Snowden's asylum matters. He noted that Snowden was really upset about the optics of staying in Russia.
Ultimately they decided to go with Russia because it was the only viable asylum option that would actually be able to protect him from a foreign extraction attempt.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
This is the full transcript of Donald Trump’s interview with Michael Gove and Kai Diekmann, former chief editor of the German newspaper Bild.
Mr President-elect, your grandfather is from Germany, your mother is from Scotland. As you know, Michael is Scottish, I am German. How will you manage relations with our countries?
Trump: Well, it’s similar. We have great love for both countries. These are great countries, great places. It’s very interesting how the UK broke away. I sort of, as you know, predicted it. I was in Turnberry and was doing a ribbon cutting because I bought Turnberry, which is doing unbelievably, and I’ll tell you, the fact that your pound sterling has gone down? Great. Because business is unbelievable in a lot of parts in the UK, as you know. I think Brexit is going to end up being a great thing.
So do you think we will be able to get a trade deal between the US and the UK quite quickly?
Absolutely, very quickly. I’m a big fan of the UK, uh, we’re gonna work very hard to get it done quickly and done properly — good for both sides. I will be meeting with [Theresa May] — in fact if you want you can see the letter, wherever the letter is, she just sent it.
She’s requesting a meeting and we’ll have a meeting right after I get into the White House and it’ll be, I think we’re gonna get something done very quickly.
Why do you think Brexit happened?
People don’t want to have other people coming in and destroying their country and you know in this country we’re gonna go very strong borders from the day I get in. One of the first orders I’m gonna sign – day one – which I will consider to be Monday as opposed to Friday or Saturday. Right? I mean my day one is gonna be Monday because I don’t want to be signing and get it mixed up with lots of celebration, but one of the first orders we’re gonna be signing is gonna be strong borders.
We don’t want people coming in from Syria who we don’t know who they are. You know there’s no way of vetting these people. I don’t want to do what Germany did.
And I’ve great respect for Merkel, by the way, I have to say. I have great respect for her. But, I, I think it was, I think it was very unfortunate what happened.
And you know I have a love for Germany because my father came from Germany and, I don’t want to be in that position. You know the way I look at it, we have enough problems. Full Transcript
I'll be honest, I think that if you're a European liberal you should probably be very frightened by what you have here.
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On January 18 2017 13:21 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 13:18 DeepElemBlues wrote:On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious? he has never said anything even close to either of those two things. as to manning i don't think her sentence should have been commuted, she is a traitor whose crimes involved leaking military information whose public dissemination has no doubt helped the enemy. snowden is a traitor who sabotaged his own goals by running to russia. he gave the CIA / NSA / DIA / MI5 / MI6 / etc. just what they needed to neutralize any real push to end their various domestic intelligence gathering activities by fleeing. all the deep state had to do was point to moscow and the uproar over that helped drown out the uproar over western intelligence agencies being all up in their own citizenry's business. principled standing up to alleged injustice has never before involved giving aid to foreign foes. the public good done by the disclosure of the information does not excuse the consequences of the way these two decided to stand up to what they saw as injustice. the main practical effects of their actions have not been the end of spying by western intelligence agencies on their own people or an end to wars waged by western countries in third-world countries, it has been to strengthen russia, the taliban/al-qaeda, and the islamic state and other jihadist groups. they should not be forgiven or escape punishment for that. and the punishment for such things should be severe. http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/06/17/gay-rights-have-made-us-dumber-its-time-to-get-back-in-the-closet/It's the literal headline written by him
it's also obviously tongue in cheek and even more obviously trolling. i've listened to hours and hours of his talks (as he's hilarious, the same reason ive listened to hours and hours of jim cornette's rantings and ravings on youtube) and he's never said anything like that. and he's spent a good portion of those hours lambasting 'the gay community' for dozens of different things. he has also made numerous remarks in those talks about being openly homosexual and how super awesome that is. so what am i supposed to believe is his true opinions, one article or his hundreds of comments that contradict it?
he also isn't jumping into bed with women himself to propagate his 'i'm smarter than everybody else and it's so fabulous that i'm so great' genes.
even in that article which is very silly and plain stupid if you read it straight he doesn't say there is anything wrong with being homosexual. he wants them to have children who are biologically their children and presents a weird left-handed argument as to why. although you could just say in response why not go the artificial insemination route for gay women and the artificial insemination / surrogacy route for gay men instead of saying they should actually have sex with the opposite gender.
On January 18 2017 13:23 LegalLord wrote: Assange was talking about how he was coordinating Snowden's asylum matters. He noted that Snowden was really upset about the optics of staying in Russia.
Ultimately they decided to go with Russia because it was the only viable asylum option that would actually be able to protect him from a foreign extraction attempt.
and? still doesn't excuse his decision or the consequences of it. he shot his own cause in the gut and strengthened a decidedly illiberal foreign great power. a power that has and still does spy on its own people far more than any western country is or ever has, and in syria has deliberately killed more innocent people and generally fought in a far more brutal fashion than the united states is or ever has since 2001.
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you can't just slap "just kidding" on anything. The people who like him on the far-right actually hold these views and are dead serious. Mike Pence has come out in favour of gay conversion therapy, that's the kind of people who go int the government.
The views are so abhorrent that you actually have to wrap them up in the Milo troll costume to sell them, that doesn't make them less serious.
If you want to know why Milo works listen to Zizek
+ Show Spoiler +
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Paul Ryan invited Donald Trump’s most senior advisers to Capitol Hill a week ago to head off a quiet tug-of-war between congressional Republicans and Trump officials over tax reform. For more than two hours, the speaker laid out his alternative to Trump’s plan to slap tariffs on companies that move jobs overseas, which he believed would encourage companies to stay in the U.S.
But not even a week later, Trump dismissed Ryan’s idea, calling it “too complicated.” And now Ryan is left with a potential trillion-dollar hole in his tax plan.
It was the latest instance of the president-elect big-footing Hill Republicans’ carefully laid policy plans. Trump hasn’t even set foot in the Oval Office, yet his tweets and offhand comments on everything from tax reform and Obamacare to prescription drug prices and a border wall have backed lawmakers into a corner over and over again — and in some cases sent them right back to the drawing board.
It’s a wake-up call for GOP leaders, many of whom hoped Trump would let them take the lead in writing legislation to carry out his campaign agenda, given his own lack of policy experience.
Trump clearly doesn’t see it that way.
His most recent dismissal of a cornerstone of Ryan’s tax plan is perhaps the most surprising yet, given the impossible position in which it puts the speaker. Ryan (R-Wis.) and Ways and Means Chairman Kevin Brady (R-Texas) had spent months crafting their so-called border adjustable business tax on imports, which they say would bring in $1 trillion over a decade. The duo needs that money to finance tax cuts for Americans and U.S. businesses. Remove it from the equation and it’s hard to see how tax reform — a top priority for Trump and Ryan — happens.
Ryan and Brady had pitched the tax changes to Trump as an antidote to a problem Trump railed about on the campaign trail: U.S. manufacturing jobs being shipped overseas. The idea, at its core, is more palatable to free-market Republicans than slapping a 35 percent or 45 percent tariff on companies that move jobs abroad.
But Trump’s team wasn’t sold, multiple Hill and transition sources told Politico. His pick for commerce secretary, Wilbur Ross, and the head of his new trade council, Peter Navarro, believe tariffs should be on the table. Other Trump officials — and the president-elect himself, apparently — worried Ryan’s plan was too complicated to sell to voters. And a third group of advisers fretted it would raise prices on consumers and hurt middle- and lower-class workers over the long run.
“Anytime I hear 'border adjustment,' I don’t love it,” Trump told The Wall Street Journal on Friday. “Because usually it means we’re going to get adjusted into a bad deal. That’s what happens.”
Republicans realized how quickly Trump could upset their plans when he told The New York Times earlier this month that Obamacare repeal should coincide with a vote on an alternative. GOP leadership just before the New Year had sketched out a plan to repeal Obamacare in the first 100 days of the new administration and pass replacement legislation by year’s end.
“Our legislating on Obamacare, our repealing and replacing and transitioning, the legislating will occur this year," Ryan told reporters at a Jan. 5 news conference.
Six days later, Trump disagreed. “It’ll be repeal and replace. It will be essentially, simultaneously.... the same day or the same week, but probably, the same day, could be the same hour," he said at his own news conference.
Now, House and Senate committees — some that settled on their membership for the new Congress just days ago — will have to quickly write both repeal and replacement proposals in a matter of weeks. They had thought they’d have months.
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On January 18 2017 13:47 Nyxisto wrote:you can't just slap "just kidding" on anything. The people who like him on the far-right actually hold these views and are dead serious. Mike Pence has come out in favour of gay conversion therapy, that's the kind of people who go int the government. The views are so abhorrent that you actually have to wrap them up in the Milo troll costume to sell them, that doesn't make them less serious. If you want to know why Milo works listen to Zizek + Show Spoiler +https://youtu.be/QeE4ZnRwVr8?t=50
actual homophobes don't want gays back in the closet, they want them to be not gay period or be dead period. or be in jail basically forever. being gay but hiding it and living their lives without punishment is not an acceptable life result for homosexuals to them.
if the best you got is conflating him with the views of others, that's a very weak tea.
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If trump somehow gets this GOP to pass single payer health care on accident I'm not sure how I'll feel about him.
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United Kingdom13775 Posts
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Nine Democratic senators asked President-elect Donald Trump's nominee to be U.S. attorney general, Senator Jeff Sessions, on Tuesday to recuse himself from any FBI or Justice Department investigation into Russia's efforts to interfere with the 2016 presidential election.
The request was signed by every Democrat on the Senate Judiciary Committee, the panel responsible for confirming Sessions' appointment. It comes amid growing concern in the U.S. Congress about what U.S. intelligence agencies have concluded was hacking and other actions by Russia during the election campaign aimed at tilting the November vote in Trump's favor, and about potential personal or financial connections between Trump associates and Moscow.
The letter also asked Sessions, who as attorney general would be the country's top law enforcement official and head of the Justice Department, to commit to not shutting down any investigation into Russia's activities. FBI Director James Comey last week declined to comment on whether or not the FBI might be investigating links between Russia and associates of Trump. The president-elect frequently called during the campaign for improved relations between Washington and Moscow.
A spokesman for Sessions, who is expected to be confirmed in the job by the Republican-controlled Congress, did not immediately respond to a request for comment about the letter.
On Friday the leaders of the Senate Intelligence Committee said their panel would investigate allegations Russia used cyber attacks to influence the U.S. presidential election, including any links between Russia and the political campaigns.
Classified documents that the heads of four U.S. intelligence agencies presented earlier this month to Trump included unsubstantiated information compiled by a private security firm suggesting Moscow had compromising personal and financial details about Trump.
Trump has called the dossier that contains salacious claims about him in Russia "fake news" and "phony stuff."
The Senate Judiciary Committee held a confirmation hearing last Tuesday for Sessions, a Republican and early backer of Trump's candidacy. He declined to comment on news reports that emerged late in the hearing about the dossier, saying he had no information about the matter at that time.
"We understand that you may have been unaware of this news report at the time, which is why we would like to give you another opportunity to respond," the senators wrote.
During his testimony, Sessions said he would recuse himself from investigations involving Trump's rival for the White House, Democrat Hillary Clinton, saying comments he made during the campaign about her email practices and charitable foundation would cloud the perception of impartiality at the Justice Department. He said he would instead favor a special prosecutor to carry out any future Clinton probes. Source
This is shaping up to be an interesting four years to look forward to.
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On January 18 2017 13:58 Nevuk wrote: If trump somehow gets this GOP to pass single payer health care on accident I'm not sure how I'll feel about him. Wouldn't he have to basically nuke his own country? The world has been laughing at US healthcare system for decades , fixing it would be huge
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On January 18 2017 12:37 Nyxisto wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2017 12:34 xDaunt wrote:On January 18 2017 12:22 Nyxisto wrote: I still don't understand why anybody gives this Milo guy a public platform, he is a troll Because he is smart, media-attractive, and has a compelling message. What compelling message? "The jews run everything and gay people should get back into the closet" is compelling to you? The guy is a walking version of 4chan, are you serious?
Gay people should get back in the closest? Milo? LOL. You know Milo is gay right? People don't like Milo because he's militantly anti-feminist and anti-PC. I actually find it sort of hilarious that the people who like Milo are the ones stereotyped as gay haters. The LBQT uber-alles crowd loathes him, yet he is "one of them" so to speak. It's interesting to me anyways.
Edit: Sort of like Camille Paglia. Other feminists can't stand her (she's not man-hating enough), and me, as someone who is not, agrees on many of her points. Go figure.
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