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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 4790

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
zlefin
Profile Blog Joined October 2012
United States7689 Posts
August 21 2016 14:47 GMT
#95781
On August 21 2016 23:42 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 22:25 zlefin wrote:
On August 21 2016 21:15 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:
does anyone else find the degree to which polls fluctuate in itself rather disconcerting?

people whose opinions on who to vote for who can be swayed by momentarily shifting angles by the news media... too many? or are the news items that came out really that important?

though im rather miffed at myself for actually taking the time to think even more on this election


not disconcerting.
There's a margin of error, so some amount of random fluctuation in polls is just expected due to sampling errors.
Also, the question is usually worded "if you voted today", while some people have made up their minds, a fair number haven't, and may still be deciding. There's also a lot of people who really don't pay much attention to the news (unlike most of us here), and so only have a vague awareness of the campaigns, and haven't really put much thought into it at all yet. They only really sit down to think and decide about it in the last month (or days).

thats not disconcerting?

oh well idk GE's overrated anyway

not disconcerting to me. it's not surprising that most people don't make up their mind in time for early polling; they make up their mind by the time it actually matters.
Great read: http://shorensteincenter.org/news-coverage-2016-general-election/ great book on democracy: http://press.princeton.edu/titles/10671.html zlefin is grumpier due to long term illness. Ignoring some users.
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23466 Posts
August 21 2016 16:26 GMT
#95782
CHICAGO — Chicago Police Supt. Eddie Johnson is moving to fire seven officers accused of lying about the shooting of Laquan McDonald and its aftermath.

"The officers have been relieved of their police powers prior to the determination of the Police Board," Police Department spokesman Anthony Guglielmi said.

As part of process, Johnson will submit his recommendations to the Chicago Police Board, which will ultimately decide whether to fire the officers.

Officers in the Police Department were notified via email that Johnson will recommend the firing of seven members of the force involved in the October 2014 shooting, a source said.

Thursday's email to officers came after Joe Ferguson, the city's inspector general, sent a report to Johnson recommending the firing of 10 police officers involved with the case.

"The department and its outside counsel have carefully reviewed the reports and supporting documents, videos, and other evidence and will accept" the recommendations to fire seven of the officers, Guglielmi said.

The firings would be based on Rule 14, a section of the Police Department's disciplinary code that concerns an officer "making a false statement, written or oral."

Shortly after the Police Department received Ferguson's report, Deputy Chief David McNaughton, who signed off on a police report justifying McDonald's shooting by officer Jason Van Dyke in October 2014, announced his retirement.

A lieutenant involved in the case, Anthony Wojcik, retired in May.

The Police Department disagreed that a 10th officer should be fired and "feels that there is insufficient evidence to prove those respective allegations," Guglielmi said.

Earlier this week, Mayor Rahm Emanuel said any changes within the Police Department were in Johnson's hands.

"I appreciate Supt. Johnson's thoughtful review of the Inspector General's report, and I fully support his decisions," Emanuel said in a statement Thursday." As the city takes these important steps to hold individuals accountable, we must also recommit ourselves to partnering together to rebuild trust between our police department and our residents."


www.dnainfo.com


Here we are almost 2 years after he was killed by lying/criminal police officers, and the best we have is a reduced number of recommendations for firing and a retirement. Our justice system is all system and no justice.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
PassiveAce
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States18076 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-21 16:45:41
August 21 2016 16:39 GMT
#95783
On August 21 2016 21:19 zeo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 20:59 GoTuNk! wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:57 zeo wrote:
Trump in the lead again in the polls. I've missed the last 100 pages here but every time I popped in there where people saying Trump is totally finished now its finally over.

I really wonder how many 'Trump has no chance' posts there have been in this thread, would make a nice montage when Trump wins.


links :D

LA Times http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/

edit: It's followed the general trend throughout the election cycle so expect more. Interesting to note the boost he got in black votes (and latino)

By the way guys its been 260 days since Clintons last press conference.

so when you say 'polls' you mean 'poll'.
The USC Dornsife/Los Angeles Times "Daybreak" is a single poll.

if you want a look at weighted polling aggregates:
http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-election-forecast/?ex_cid=rrpromo
Call me Marge Simpson cuz I love you homie
Biff The Understudy
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
France7917 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-21 17:40:34
August 21 2016 17:39 GMT
#95784
On August 21 2016 21:19 zeo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 20:59 GoTuNk! wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:57 zeo wrote:
Trump in the lead again in the polls. I've missed the last 100 pages here but every time I popped in there where people saying Trump is totally finished now its finally over.

I really wonder how many 'Trump has no chance' posts there have been in this thread, would make a nice montage when Trump wins.


links :D

LA Times http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/

edit: It's followed the general trend throughout the election cycle so expect more. Interesting to note the boost he got in black votes (and latino)

By the way guys its been 260 days since Clintons last press conference.

Please be even a bit more obnoxious and post every day how many days it has been. We all care.

Clinton doesn't want the press conference format during her campaign. Can regret it, can think it's bad, but we got it.

So give a break, thanks.

And 531 gives Trump 15% chances to win, based on a gazillion polls, so don't give yourself false hopes.
The fellow who is out to burn things up is the counterpart of the fool who thinks he can save the world. The world needs neither to be burned up nor to be saved. The world is, we are. Transients, if we buck it; here to stay if we accept it. ~H.Miller
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23466 Posts
August 21 2016 17:50 GMT
#95785
Clinton doesn't want the press conference format during her campaign


That's probably in my top 25 most ridiculous spins for Hillary. I don't think there's anything wrong with a weekly reminder that Hillary gives the press less access than Trump despite all the fear mongering over Trump's relationship with the press.

Meanwhile the Podesta group is following Hillary's lead of "I was too stupid to know I was doing something wrong" since they got caught up in the same crap as Manafort.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
GGTeMpLaR
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States7226 Posts
August 21 2016 17:50 GMT
#95786
On August 22 2016 02:39 Biff The Understudy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 21:19 zeo wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:59 GoTuNk! wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:57 zeo wrote:
Trump in the lead again in the polls. I've missed the last 100 pages here but every time I popped in there where people saying Trump is totally finished now its finally over.

I really wonder how many 'Trump has no chance' posts there have been in this thread, would make a nice montage when Trump wins.


links :D

LA Times http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/

edit: It's followed the general trend throughout the election cycle so expect more. Interesting to note the boost he got in black votes (and latino)

By the way guys its been 260 days since Clintons last press conference.

Please be even a bit more obnoxious and post every day how many days it has been. We all care.

Clinton doesn't want the press conference format during her campaign. Can regret it, can think it's bad, but we got it.

So give a break, thanks.

And 531 gives Trump 15% chances to win, based on a gazillion polls, so don't give yourself false hopes.


Why are you getting so defensive?
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States43219 Posts
August 21 2016 17:53 GMT
#95787
On August 22 2016 02:50 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 02:39 Biff The Understudy wrote:
On August 21 2016 21:19 zeo wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:59 GoTuNk! wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:57 zeo wrote:
Trump in the lead again in the polls. I've missed the last 100 pages here but every time I popped in there where people saying Trump is totally finished now its finally over.

I really wonder how many 'Trump has no chance' posts there have been in this thread, would make a nice montage when Trump wins.


links :D

LA Times http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/

edit: It's followed the general trend throughout the election cycle so expect more. Interesting to note the boost he got in black votes (and latino)

By the way guys its been 260 days since Clintons last press conference.

Please be even a bit more obnoxious and post every day how many days it has been. We all care.

Clinton doesn't want the press conference format during her campaign. Can regret it, can think it's bad, but we got it.

So give a break, thanks.

And 531 gives Trump 15% chances to win, based on a gazillion polls, so don't give yourself false hopes.


Why are you getting so defensive?

It's Zeo, putting him down isn't really a case of "The lady doth protest too much, methinks", it's more a case of "nobody is really in the mood to hear what paid Kremlin shills are saying today, fuck off".

Zeo always picks the dumbest lines of attack, bases his claims on assumptions that nobody else accepts as real and cherry picks evidence, in this case one poll, to the exclusion of all contrary evidence.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
GGTeMpLaR
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States7226 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-21 17:58:32
August 21 2016 17:54 GMT
#95788
Oh I missed Zeo putting him down nevermind

edit: Oh I read your post without the comma that's why my post makes no sense
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States5765 Posts
August 21 2016 18:40 GMT
#95789
On August 21 2016 18:30 puerk wrote:
just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country.

Gorbachev is not a country. What a revelation. Only our parents' generation vividly remembers the day Ze Great Kimunikvator stood up to the president of the traditionally hard-line US and said "Komrade Reagans, teer down zis voll." Reunification didn't just happen by accident, it took diplomacy on the part of the US to make it happen both with the USSR, Poland that didn't want to get "breathing room"ed again, and those in NATO that were actually apprehensive about supporting a sovereign Germany.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
mahrgell
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Germany3943 Posts
August 21 2016 18:44 GMT
#95790
On August 22 2016 03:40 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 18:30 puerk wrote:
just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country.

Gorbachev is not a country. What a revelation. Only our parents' generation vividly remembers the day Ze Great Kimunikvator stood up to the president of the traditionally hard-line US and said "Komrade Reagans, teer down zis voll." Reunification didn't just happen by accident, it took diplomacy on the part of the US to make it happen both with the USSR, Poland that didn't want to get "breathing room"ed again, and those in NATO that were actually apprehensive about supporting a sovereign Germany.

You mean, for once the US did not completely fuck up diplomacy, when other nations did something useful? Congrats, huge achievement. But please, it was not the US who made the reunification happen.
zeo
Profile Joined October 2009
Serbia6306 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-21 18:49:07
August 21 2016 18:47 GMT
#95791
On August 22 2016 02:53 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 02:50 GGTeMpLaR wrote:
On August 22 2016 02:39 Biff The Understudy wrote:
On August 21 2016 21:19 zeo wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:59 GoTuNk! wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:57 zeo wrote:
Trump in the lead again in the polls. I've missed the last 100 pages here but every time I popped in there where people saying Trump is totally finished now its finally over.

I really wonder how many 'Trump has no chance' posts there have been in this thread, would make a nice montage when Trump wins.


links :D

LA Times http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/

edit: It's followed the general trend throughout the election cycle so expect more. Interesting to note the boost he got in black votes (and latino)

By the way guys its been 260 days since Clintons last press conference.

Please be even a bit more obnoxious and post every day how many days it has been. We all care.

Clinton doesn't want the press conference format during her campaign. Can regret it, can think it's bad, but we got it.

So give a break, thanks.

And 531 gives Trump 15% chances to win, based on a gazillion polls, so don't give yourself false hopes.


Why are you getting so defensive?

It's Zeo, putting him down isn't really a case of "The lady doth protest too much, methinks", it's more a case of "nobody is really in the mood to hear what paid Kremlin shills are saying today, fuck off".

Zeo always picks the dumbest lines of attack, bases his claims on assumptions that nobody else accepts as real and cherry picks evidence, in this case one poll, to the exclusion of all contrary evidence.

Last time I mentioned 'wheres hillary?' It was 235 days or something, I went on holiday and came back to no press conference, monthly reminders never hurt anybody.

Your ad hominems and character assasination attempts are getting sloppy and predictable btw. Can't correct the record guys come up with anything better?

Maybe you should use your mod status to add a press conference ticker as a mod note instead of personally attacking forum users.
"If only Kircheis were here" - Everyone
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
August 21 2016 18:52 GMT
#95792
Why, when we have you to give us updates we never really wanted and provide us with the finest cherry picked polls showing Trump winning? And then to engage in what-about-ism if anyone responds to your points.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
August 21 2016 19:06 GMT
#95793
Mook's (HRC campaign manager) response to the press conference issue was pretty lame, but it gives an idea of the Clinton campaign's thought process
Well, the real question here is, whether Secretary Clinton has been taking questions from reporters, which she absolutely has. We went and counted and she has been in more than 300 interviews with reporters this year alone, she’s been on your show, and we’re going to continue to do that. There are lot of different formats which she can engage in reporters, whether it’s one on one interviews, whether it’s talking with her traveling press reporters, or a press conference. We’re going to look at all of those as we move forward. But I don’t think it’s fair to say that someone is shying away from tough questions when they have taken over 300 interviews from reporters, we tried to have the interns look how many questions she took, which is much bigger number, and we haven’t even finished tallying that.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/hillary-clinton-campaign-manager-brags-she-has-done-more-than-300-interviews-in-2016/
Dan HH
Profile Joined July 2012
Romania9136 Posts
August 21 2016 19:24 GMT
#95794
On August 21 2016 21:19 zeo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 20:59 GoTuNk! wrote:
On August 21 2016 20:57 zeo wrote:
Trump in the lead again in the polls. I've missed the last 100 pages here but every time I popped in there where people saying Trump is totally finished now its finally over.

I really wonder how many 'Trump has no chance' posts there have been in this thread, would make a nice montage when Trump wins.


links :D

LA Times http://graphics.latimes.com/usc-presidential-poll-dashboard/

edit: It's followed the general trend throughout the election cycle so expect more. Interesting to note the boost he got in black votes (and latino)

By the way guys its been 260 days since Clintons last press conference.

So poll singular, not polls. They've been a consistent outlier since the conventions. Ctrl+F 'USC' there.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationwide_opinion_polling_for_the_United_States_presidential_election,_2016#Since_convention_nominations
JinDesu
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States3990 Posts
August 21 2016 19:26 GMT
#95795
On August 22 2016 04:06 Nevuk wrote:
Mook's (HRC campaign manager) response to the press conference issue was pretty lame, but it gives an idea of the Clinton campaign's thought process
Show nested quote +
Well, the real question here is, whether Secretary Clinton has been taking questions from reporters, which she absolutely has. We went and counted and she has been in more than 300 interviews with reporters this year alone, she’s been on your show, and we’re going to continue to do that. There are lot of different formats which she can engage in reporters, whether it’s one on one interviews, whether it’s talking with her traveling press reporters, or a press conference. We’re going to look at all of those as we move forward. But I don’t think it’s fair to say that someone is shying away from tough questions when they have taken over 300 interviews from reporters, we tried to have the interns look how many questions she took, which is much bigger number, and we haven’t even finished tallying that.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/hillary-clinton-campaign-manager-brags-she-has-done-more-than-300-interviews-in-2016/


Doesn't matter. The Media (H)achine works for Shillary, and it would only take a proper press conference where true reporters from Breitbart and the Alex Jones Show can grill her to expose her.
Yargh
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States43219 Posts
August 21 2016 19:49 GMT
#95796
On August 22 2016 04:26 JinDesu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 04:06 Nevuk wrote:
Mook's (HRC campaign manager) response to the press conference issue was pretty lame, but it gives an idea of the Clinton campaign's thought process
Well, the real question here is, whether Secretary Clinton has been taking questions from reporters, which she absolutely has. We went and counted and she has been in more than 300 interviews with reporters this year alone, she’s been on your show, and we’re going to continue to do that. There are lot of different formats which she can engage in reporters, whether it’s one on one interviews, whether it’s talking with her traveling press reporters, or a press conference. We’re going to look at all of those as we move forward. But I don’t think it’s fair to say that someone is shying away from tough questions when they have taken over 300 interviews from reporters, we tried to have the interns look how many questions she took, which is much bigger number, and we haven’t even finished tallying that.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/hillary-clinton-campaign-manager-brags-she-has-done-more-than-300-interviews-in-2016/


Doesn't matter. The Media (H)achine works for Shillary, and it would only take a proper press conference where true reporters from Breitbart and the Alex Jones Show can grill her to expose her.

Deliberately leaving our Infowars I see. How long have you been in the pocket of Big Fluoride?
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States5765 Posts
August 21 2016 19:52 GMT
#95797
On August 22 2016 04:49 KwarK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 04:26 JinDesu wrote:
On August 22 2016 04:06 Nevuk wrote:
Mook's (HRC campaign manager) response to the press conference issue was pretty lame, but it gives an idea of the Clinton campaign's thought process
Well, the real question here is, whether Secretary Clinton has been taking questions from reporters, which she absolutely has. We went and counted and she has been in more than 300 interviews with reporters this year alone, she’s been on your show, and we’re going to continue to do that. There are lot of different formats which she can engage in reporters, whether it’s one on one interviews, whether it’s talking with her traveling press reporters, or a press conference. We’re going to look at all of those as we move forward. But I don’t think it’s fair to say that someone is shying away from tough questions when they have taken over 300 interviews from reporters, we tried to have the interns look how many questions she took, which is much bigger number, and we haven’t even finished tallying that.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/hillary-clinton-campaign-manager-brags-she-has-done-more-than-300-interviews-in-2016/


Doesn't matter. The Media (H)achine works for Shillary, and it would only take a proper press conference where true reporters from Breitbart and the Alex Jones Show can grill her to expose her.

Deliberately leaving our Infowars I see. How long have you been in the pocket of Big Fluoride?

Fluoride was a false flag to get people to be dismissive of the real treachery, estrogen in the water.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
August 21 2016 19:56 GMT
#95798
On August 22 2016 04:52 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 22 2016 04:49 KwarK wrote:
On August 22 2016 04:26 JinDesu wrote:
On August 22 2016 04:06 Nevuk wrote:
Mook's (HRC campaign manager) response to the press conference issue was pretty lame, but it gives an idea of the Clinton campaign's thought process
Well, the real question here is, whether Secretary Clinton has been taking questions from reporters, which she absolutely has. We went and counted and she has been in more than 300 interviews with reporters this year alone, she’s been on your show, and we’re going to continue to do that. There are lot of different formats which she can engage in reporters, whether it’s one on one interviews, whether it’s talking with her traveling press reporters, or a press conference. We’re going to look at all of those as we move forward. But I don’t think it’s fair to say that someone is shying away from tough questions when they have taken over 300 interviews from reporters, we tried to have the interns look how many questions she took, which is much bigger number, and we haven’t even finished tallying that.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/hillary-clinton-campaign-manager-brags-she-has-done-more-than-300-interviews-in-2016/


Doesn't matter. The Media (H)achine works for Shillary, and it would only take a proper press conference where true reporters from Breitbart and the Alex Jones Show can grill her to expose her.

Deliberately leaving our Infowars I see. How long have you been in the pocket of Big Fluoride?

Fluoride was a false flag to get people to be dismissive of the real treachery, estrogen in the water.


Which leads to the pussification of America and the PC movement.
Never Knows Best.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-21 20:24:18
August 21 2016 20:24 GMT
#95799
We all know that "real reporters" badger a candidate or head of media relations during a press conference. Because that is the mark of a real reporter, harass someone until they say something that you can use on b-roll for your next hit piece. Forget investigative reporting, that shit is for noobs, this is journalism 2.0.

All Breitbart and its ilk are looking for is the new hot quote to put on their next click bait garbage. They are Gawker for hard conservatives.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
puerk
Profile Joined February 2015
Germany855 Posts
August 21 2016 20:26 GMT
#95800
On August 22 2016 03:40 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 21 2016 18:30 puerk wrote:
just to clarify about the reuninfication: gorbachov is not a country.

Gorbachev is not a country. What a revelation. Only our parents' generation vividly remembers the day Ze Great Kimunikvator stood up to the president of the traditionally hard-line US and said "Komrade Reagans, teer down zis voll." Reunification didn't just happen by accident, it took diplomacy on the part of the US to make it happen both with the USSR, Poland that didn't want to get "breathing room"ed again, and those in NATO that were actually apprehensive about supporting a sovereign Germany.


Your understanding of the forces leading to reunification are so obnoxiously bad it hurts.
I am from Leipzig. I was born in the GDR, my parents protested in 1989 and were part of church organized groups, and understandably afraid, that there would be repeats of 1953, 68 or Tian'anmen.

The reunification happened because of the bravery of demonstrating people in the streets, the sowjet decision not to send tanks again as they did before, and the decision of the outnumbered police and secret police to not slaughter the 70000 people protesting peacefully on the 9.10.1989.

Reagan had no influence on those people. None at all. The people in power and responsible that it didn't turn into a bloodbath, looked to the east for guidance, not across the ocean. The Kremlin not sending troops, and not ordering a violent crackdown on protests, was vital, but it was inaction that allowed local action to succeed not action inspired by reagan or what ever you imagine in your purposefully ridiculous version of history you wrote.

Maybe this helps you understand: http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/09/lets-please-stop-crediting-ronald-reagan-for-the-fall-of-the-berlin-wall/262647/

but i doubt it judging your post history.
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