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Bracketting in TvP

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GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 16:08:24
April 06 2011 12:22 GMT
#1
Introduction

Hi GaryBrackett here and i would like to share with my fellow TLers the secret to Bracketting in the TvP matchup.

Summary

The idea of this build is to combat any form of Gateway or Fast Expand build used by the Protoss using heavy bio play with SCV's. Smaller maps or rush distances make Bracketting more effective. Bracketting is not a tactic that one employs from the start rather it is something that you decide to use based on intel from your scouts.

Initial Build

10 Depot
12 Rax
(Marine then Tech Lab)
(Marauder + Concussive Shells)
13 Gas
15 Rax

Follow Up
On scouting the Protoss base and noticing a Fast Expand you should add an Expansion of your own and encourage the Protoss to scout this. Stim should be researched as soon as possible as well as the construction of additional Barracks should be considered. 1 Vespene Geyser should be sufficient.

General Tactic

The heavy bio army you are building of Marines and Marauders should be used to poke and antagonize the weary Protoss beast. After your second Orbital is complete pull 90% of your SCV's and assault the Protoss base. Be very careful in the engagement you take. Sentry's can spell the death of Bracketting if used appropriately. Keep alot of pressure on and don't overstim. The MM ball with SCV protection should be easily able to take out the Protoss Expansion and Gateway Army with appropriate micro. MULES can be used back home to guarantee a flow of Bio to reinforce your weary boys. Once you have taken out the Protoss expansion and forced a contain you can either poke up the ramp or start production of SCV's again and transition. (The latter is advised) Bracketting will have allowed you to have a substantial lead over the Protoss

Notes

Bracketting will only work on maps where the Natural is open (Metalopolis) and not on maps where the Natural has little access (Shakuras Plateau)
Knowing when to Stim is key for Bracketting.
The idea of the push is to hit before Colossi or Forge Upgrades start to come into effect.

Micro

Marines at the back with Marauders in front.
Try to stim only a few units at a time and preferably the units at the back.
Spread out the units so as to reduce the effectiveness of forcefields and zealots (will be slowed)
Use the SCV carefully, more as a kinda shield and overwhelming factor, setting them on the stalkers/sentries.
SCV's can also be used to put up a Bunker

Tactic dedicated to MouzStrelok 'The Warship'

Liquid_Brackett
Synystyr
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1446 Posts
April 06 2011 12:34 GMT
#2
How is this different from any other Concussive Shell rush? It's always been known that this is a solid opener to play against a 1 Gate FE or anything faster. Also, the Concussive Shell upgrade starts before you even have a chance to scout an expansion, so you are going in blind unless you scouted a 15 Nexus. This loses

How is this original and justifies having your name used to classify this opener? Where are your replays to support your build?
Sky Terran TvP V2.0: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=355839
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 12:38 GMT
#3
Seems plausible. I'm gonna try this in my next ladder game thx a lot mate, needed a new tvp build.

Regards, Yans.
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 12:43:05
April 06 2011 12:40 GMT
#4
Concussive Shell is 50/50 and may be cancelled if you so wish. I see no problem with starting the upgrade blind.
The difference between the Openings is that this employs SCV's to guarantee the destruction of the expansion and the mind games of the expansion should butter up the Protoss for the hot knife (your bio units). The 2 orbitals should allow you to excel after the Expansions death.

Liquid_Brackett
stilez
Profile Joined November 2010
Mexico130 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 12:50:44
April 06 2011 12:48 GMT
#5
I prefer to Bukkake in TvP.
What are your thoughts on this?

Sincerely

Liquid_Faggett

User was temp banned for this post.
statikg
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada930 Posts
April 06 2011 12:59 GMT
#6
I can see this working effectively with good hold micro on the scvs, I am skeptical of whether it would actually result in an even trade, if they also use hold micro on their zealots you could easily lose all your scvs in return for some of their units and a nexus, I'm not sure that you could catch up.
loklok
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany161 Posts
April 06 2011 13:08 GMT
#7
This won't work against 3 gate sentry/zeal/stalker expands, robo openings (obs), stargate openings, 2 gate stalker heavy openings. Tested high-mid master.

3 Gate expand: Ends up with ~ 6 Sentries ~ 4 Zeals ~ 3 Stalker. Depends on attack timing it can be more. With 12 forcefields i can hold even on wide open naturals and some probes will help if i made mistakes at planting FFs.

Robo: 1 Gate 1 Robo 1 Gate. Observer will scout your one base play -> colossus tech on 1 base and its over.

Stargate: You can't really leave your base alone and P has full scouting information and knows when you want to attack (Nexus cancel or stay 1 base)

2 Gate stalker : full map control with 6 stalker, good pressure and kiting options. Will be probably bit complicated with FFs because P will have less sentries compared to 3 gate expand but stalker heavy -> ffs are more effective because you can split scvs and some MM from the rest without receiving high dmg (stalker heavy instead zeal heavy, range vs melee).

I think it's difficult to cursh P if the micro is at the same level
GinDo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
3327 Posts
April 06 2011 13:14 GMT
#8
Just 2 rax before orbital. The pull SCVs. Its faster and thus more effective rush.

Marines > Zeals
SCVs > Stalkers

By the time your attack comes he has a sentry and thus you lose.
+ Show Spoiler +
Lol at people that keep naming stuff after themselves.The best is when they name unit rush builds after themselves. Unless its completly game changing you don't really get that privalage imo. Bisu Build,Manoring Workers. Heck even note that the Flash Build is more commonly called the Double Armory.
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GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 13:17 GMT
#9
On April 06 2011 22:08 loklok wrote:
This won't work against 3 gate sentry/zeal/stalker expands, robo openings (obs), stargate openings, 2 gate stalker heavy openings. Tested high-mid master.

3 Gate expand: Ends up with ~ 6 Sentries ~ 4 Zeals ~ 3 Stalker. Depends on attack timing it can be more. With 12 forcefields i can hold even on wide open naturals and some probes will help if i made mistakes at planting FFs.

Robo: 1 Gate 1 Robo 1 Gate. Observer will scout your one base play -> colossus tech on 1 base and its over.

Stargate: You can't really leave your base alone and P has full scouting information and knows when you want to attack (Nexus cancel or stay 1 base)

2 Gate stalker : full map control with 6 stalker, good pressure and kiting options. Will be probably bit complicated with FFs because P will have less sentries compared to 3 gate expand but stalker heavy -> ffs are more effective because you can split scvs and some MM from the rest without receiving high dmg (stalker heavy instead zeal heavy, range vs melee).

I think it's difficult to cursh P if the micro is at the same level


Idea is this build is only used against very early expansions.
Phisk
Profile Joined June 2010
166 Posts
April 06 2011 13:17 GMT
#10
On April 06 2011 21:40 GaryBrackett wrote:
The difference between the Openings is that this employs SCV's to guarantee the destruction of the expansion and the mind games of the expansion should butter up the Protoss for the hot knife (your bio units). The 2 orbitals should allow you to excel after the Expansions death.


Well MM+SCV all-ins have been around forever, can't really see how this is very different from already acknowledged strats.

You definitely need to include some replays as well, otherwise it's hard to legitimize a strat.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 13:17 GMT
#11
On April 06 2011 22:14 GinDo wrote:
Just 2 rax before orbital. The pull SCVs. Its faster and thus more effective rush.

Marines > Zeals
SCVs > Stalkers

By the time your attack comes he has a sentry and thus you lose.
+ Show Spoiler +
Lol at people that keep naming stuff after themselves.The best is when they name unit rush builds after themselves. Unless its completly game changing you don't really get that privalage imo. Bisu Build,Manoring Workers. Heck even note that the Flash Build is more commonly called the Double Armory.

This isn't designed to kill the Main if you read the article, its designed to destroy the expansion and put the Protoss behind.
moridincuh
Profile Joined April 2011
3 Posts
April 06 2011 13:18 GMT
#12
Sincerely
Liquid_Faggett


I lol'ed irl

User was warned for this post
loklok
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany161 Posts
April 06 2011 13:25 GMT
#13
On April 06 2011 22:17 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 22:08 loklok wrote:
This won't work against 3 gate sentry/zeal/stalker expands, robo openings (obs), stargate openings, 2 gate stalker heavy openings. Tested high-mid master.

3 Gate expand: Ends up with ~ 6 Sentries ~ 4 Zeals ~ 3 Stalker. Depends on attack timing it can be more. With 12 forcefields i can hold even on wide open naturals and some probes will help if i made mistakes at planting FFs.

Robo: 1 Gate 1 Robo 1 Gate. Observer will scout your one base play -> colossus tech on 1 base and its over.

Stargate: You can't really leave your base alone and P has full scouting information and knows when you want to attack (Nexus cancel or stay 1 base)

2 Gate stalker : full map control with 6 stalker, good pressure and kiting options. Will be probably bit complicated with FFs because P will have less sentries compared to 3 gate expand but stalker heavy -> ffs are more effective because you can split scvs and some MM from the rest without receiving high dmg (stalker heavy instead zeal heavy, range vs melee).

I think it's difficult to cursh P if the micro is at the same level


Idea is this build is only used against very early expansions.


First Nexus or Gateway Nexus in PvT is very risky and can be punished without pulling SVCs. Probably on tournament level where the player know eachother will play such risky style. But even then, the timing will be a bit late. Nobody drones hard on 2 base if he doesn't know what his oponent want to do. So the P would invest 400 minerals and go back to gateway heavy style. The 400 minerals advantage won't be a big deal because T has to travel and that is mining time.
GinDo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
3327 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 13:50:50
April 06 2011 13:44 GMT
#14
On April 06 2011 22:17 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 22:14 GinDo wrote:
Just 2 rax before orbital. The pull SCVs. Its faster and thus more effective rush.

Marines > Zeals
SCVs > Stalkers

By the time your attack comes he has a sentry and thus you lose.
+ Show Spoiler +
Lol at people that keep naming stuff after themselves.The best is when they name unit rush builds after themselves. Unless its completly game changing you don't really get that privalage imo. Bisu Build,Manoring Workers. Heck even note that the Flash Build is more commonly called the Double Armory.

This isn't designed to kill the Main if you read the article, its designed to destroy the expansion and put the Protoss behind.


Pulling SCVs to punish an expo is stupid. He loses 400mins. You lose over 400mins in mining time.

And if MC vs MKP on Metal taught us anything+ Show Spoiler +
Toss can Nexus 1st lose an Expo and still effectivly 4 gate
ⱩŦ ƑⱠẬ$Ħ / ƩǤ ɈƩẬƉØƝǤ [ɌȻ] / ȊṂ.ṂṼⱣ / ẬȻƩɌ.ȊƝƝØṼẬŦȊØƝ / ẬȻƩɌ.ϟȻẬɌⱠƩŦŦ ϟⱠẬɎƩɌϟ ȻⱠẬƝ
SoftSoap
Profile Joined November 2010
United States170 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 13:48:12
April 06 2011 13:46 GMT
#15
Seems like a BITBYBITPRIME!!!@#!@#@#!@#. Jk lolz

Anyways, can you please post replays? It would help more a more in depth analysis. For my points of view right now, it seems your depending on a early expansion. As scouting isn't to informational unless you see two gases. Protoss don't reveal their tech until they kill the scouting scv. So a 1 basing protoss would forcefield the ramp a number of times and significantly delay your "Bracketing"

Tasteless, "IdrA always pulls out on time."
Vlare
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
748 Posts
April 06 2011 13:52 GMT
#16
On April 06 2011 21:48 stilez wrote:
I prefer to Bukkake in TvP.
What are your thoughts on this?

Sincerely

Liquid_Faggett

User was temp banned for this post.


This is one of the funnier things I've read on these forums in a while. Hahaha.

Ontopic : Sounds like you're doing an all in and then stopping it. 90% of the time the protoss will leave if you kill his fe, so I don't really comprehend what you're trying to do with this build. It's more of an all in than anything and is taking advantage of the broken mechanic that is mules :\

I don't see this being at all viable at higher levels of play.
Mass zerglings doesnt fail
Nakki
Profile Joined April 2011
4 Posts
April 06 2011 14:05 GMT
#17
Tried this in plat league, got matched up against a mid-diamond protoss and it worked wonders. He rage quit.
Pokebunny
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States10654 Posts
April 06 2011 14:07 GMT
#18
So you're basically teaching people how to beat bad protosses that try to fast expand?

I don't know why you need a guide to the tactic of pulling all your scvs after a standard opening.
Semipro Terran player | Pokebunny#1710 | twitter.com/Pokebunny | twitch.tv/Pokebunny | facebook.com/PokebunnySC
GinDo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
3327 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 14:11:47
April 06 2011 14:11 GMT
#19
On April 06 2011 23:05 Nakki wrote:
Tried this in plat league, got matched up against a mid-diamond protoss and it worked wonders. He rage quit.


Heres the problem. People symply try these tactics that simply aren't viable, play against some noob players and the make theads on it. Any competent Toss will defend this, and if they can't becaseu they went robo rather then more gates will sack their Nexus and simply FF their ramp. Effectivly puting themselves behind 400 minerals and you +400minerals in lost mining time and Tech. Not to mention the probable risk that you will lose alot of workers.
ⱩŦ ƑⱠẬ$Ħ / ƩǤ ɈƩẬƉØƝǤ [ɌȻ] / ȊṂ.ṂṼⱣ / ẬȻƩɌ.ȊƝƝØṼẬŦȊØƝ / ẬȻƩɌ.ϟȻẬɌⱠƩŦŦ ϟⱠẬɎƩɌϟ ȻⱠẬƝ
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 14:23:10
April 06 2011 14:11 GMT
#20
On April 06 2011 23:07 Pokebunny wrote:
So you're basically teaching people how to beat bad protosses that try to fast expand?

I don't know why you need a guide to the tactic of pulling all your scvs after a standard opening.


Exactly, if platinum-diamond players that lack the micro in order to pull off a one gate fast expand decide to one gate fast expand, chances are you've already won the game without "pulling 90% of your workers".

EDIT: You say in the OP not to do this on easy to expand maps like Shakuras Plateau... But then you say this build is designed to counter fast expand builds. Isn't that just a little bit contradictory?
GinDo
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
3327 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 14:14:40
April 06 2011 14:14 GMT
#21
On April 06 2011 23:07 Pokebunny wrote:
So you're basically teaching people how to beat bad protosses that try to fast expand?

I don't know why you need a guide to the tactic of pulling all your scvs after a standard opening.


[sarcasm] Its because he gets a rax before Orbital. Thats what makes it gamebreaking and a reason he should name something after himself. [/sarcasm]

Wasn't there supposed to be some form of purging of bad threads in the Strategy section?
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Aui_2000
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada435 Posts
April 06 2011 14:14 GMT
#22
Woah, thanks for inventing this completely new and original strategy. I believe that this strategy will revolutionize sc2.
follow @aui_2000 // www.twitch.tv/aui_2000
dere
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States153 Posts
April 06 2011 14:19 GMT
#23
I think Thor rush is better for punishing fast toss expos in TvP if positions are fairly close.
Tennessee Regional Rankings: http://sc2ranks.com/c/8473/tennessee-region-division/
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 14:34:00
April 06 2011 14:33 GMT
#24
Yea, I agree, Thor rush would be more effective in my opinion too since they crush force fields.

(Edit: I'm a high diamond protoss player.)
MidoZ
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden18 Posts
April 06 2011 14:36 GMT
#25
On April 06 2011 22:52 Vlare wrote:


Ontopic : Sounds like you're doing an all in and then stopping it. 90% of the time the protoss will leave if you kill his fe, so I don't really comprehend what you're trying to do with this build. It's more of an all in than anything and is taking advantage of the broken mechanic that is mules :\

I don't see this being at all viable at higher levels of play.


Mules are there to counter Cb and larva, also mules have to share the place of scans while protoss have flying maphacks , and actually toss are the strongest race with most win % so i dont see how you mix that together

Ontopic
IF a toss fe and you bring scv , the protoss player can just sac hes expo and kill of scv's , and your behind also this is like any rush really a marine scv all in works just as good
and if your in in close spawns and toss fe , try going marine tank instead , that even works pretty well vs even a 3 gate robo expo or anything with a later expo unless a stargate opening , if you know what your doing
look at the dreamhack finales , naama vs mana

/ by a 2 k games terran
Arguing on the internet is like running at the special olympics. Even if you win, you're still retarded
breadfan
Profile Joined February 2011
Poland5 Posts
April 06 2011 14:39 GMT
#26
On April 06 2011 23:11 GinDo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:05 Nakki wrote:
Tried this in plat league, got matched up against a mid-diamond protoss and it worked wonders. He rage quit.


Heres the problem. People symply try these tactics that simply aren't viable, play against some noob players and the make theads on it. Any competent Toss will defend this, and if they can't becaseu they went robo rather then more gates will sack their Nexus and simply FF their ramp. Effectivly puting themselves behind 400 minerals and you +400minerals in lost mining time and Tech. Not to mention the probable risk that you will lose alot of workers.


Done by a pro:
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/154546-1v1-terran-protoss-backwater-gulch

If SeleCT does it, then that is viable enough for me.

But honestly I am not planning to do it myself before getting to SeleCTs level
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 14:44 GMT
#27
Touché breadfan. Its funny how people automatically berate the OP even though a progamer has added bracketting to his arsenal of strategems. They should learn from their peers

Regards, Yans
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 14:47:42
April 06 2011 14:47 GMT
#28
On April 06 2011 23:11 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:07 Pokebunny wrote:
So you're basically teaching people how to beat bad protosses that try to fast expand?

I don't know why you need a guide to the tactic of pulling all your scvs after a standard opening.
You say in the OP not to do this on easy to expand maps like Shakuras Plateau... But then you say this build is designed to counter fast expand builds. Isn't that just a little bit contradictory?


The reason we're "Berating" the original poster is because he contradicts himself in the original post.
TurtlePerson2
Profile Joined October 2010
United States218 Posts
April 06 2011 14:48 GMT
#29
So basically this is a (T)SeleCT 2 rax expand but with an SCV all-in?
torturis exuvias eunt
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 14:49 GMT
#30
On April 06 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:11 Scrubington wrote:
On April 06 2011 23:07 Pokebunny wrote:
So you're basically teaching people how to beat bad protosses that try to fast expand?

I don't know why you need a guide to the tactic of pulling all your scvs after a standard opening.
You say in the OP not to do this on easy to expand maps like Shakuras Plateau... But then you say this build is designed to counter fast expand builds. Isn't that just a little bit contradictory?


The reason we're "Berating" the original poster is because he contradicts himself in the original post.

I suggest you read the OP again

Regards, Yans
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 14:49 GMT
#31
On April 06 2011 23:47 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:11 Scrubington wrote:
On April 06 2011 23:07 Pokebunny wrote:
So you're basically teaching people how to beat bad protosses that try to fast expand?

I don't know why you need a guide to the tactic of pulling all your scvs after a standard opening.
You say in the OP not to do this on easy to expand maps like Shakuras Plateau... But then you say this build is designed to counter fast expand builds. Isn't that just a little bit contradictory?


The reason we're "Berating" the original poster is because he contradicts himself in the original post.

Nowhere in the post did i contradict myself.
I said it's designed to counter Fast Expand builds on certain maps.

Liquid_Brackett
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 14:57:01
April 06 2011 14:55 GMT
#32
On April 06 2011 21:22 GaryBrackett wrote:
Bracketting will only work on maps where the Natural is open (Metalopolis) and not on maps where the Natural has little access (Shakuras Plateau)

The idea of this build is to combat any form of Gateway or Fast Expand build used by the Protoss

Liquid_Brackett


I know I'm not going to win this argument since the OP and Yans are obviously probably on skype right now raging over "That one guy who's hating on our post"...

But do you really see nothing contradictory with what I quoted from the OP?

My point is, in a normal/standard PvT matchup with an open map like metalopolis, a protoss won't fast expand. (Normally you'll go fast robo for an obs to scout what Terran's doing on unsafe to expand maps as protoss)
MidoZ
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden18 Posts
April 06 2011 14:56 GMT
#33
On April 06 2011 23:33 Scrubington wrote:
Yea, I agree, Thor rush would be more effective in my opinion too since they crush force fields.

(Edit: I'm a high diamond protoss player.)


actually i been trying to mix with the thor raven marine 250 cannon rush , and actually it works pretty good vs a 1 base play like 1 base collosi , or a lets say 3 gate robo expand

But the one thing this build dont work good against is a fe , like 1 gate fe or 2 gate fe or nexus first
just because its a to slow build for a fe and you will get out macrod by the time the rush hits even if you kill of the first army you already lost

all this is done with 2/3 of all scv pulled (its an all in) and the protoss is allways to stupid to understand that this is an all in and if he deffends it he win so in no games do the protoss pull his probes
and yet an fe beats and thor marine raven 250 cannons build , so this is i thing not to go for if you see and fe , just pointing that fact out

And for the next thing people will ask , cant you go for fast thor marine without 250 and raven? , yes you can but 3 things will happen , protoss will scout this (no raven and the early moveout , he will know there is no raven and no time for 250 )
stalkers will be way more effective (yes even with 2 thors)
And immortals will be way more effective

Yes a thor build is really effective , but not against an fe
Arguing on the internet is like running at the special olympics. Even if you win, you're still retarded
Alejandrisha
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6565 Posts
April 06 2011 14:57 GMT
#34
If you want to all in some one to punish them there are several ways 10x better than this.
- Thor rush should insta-win against 3gate-nexus-robo and has a chance against 1gate fe
- 1 base tank marine push (3 tanks) should auto-win against 3gate fe and if you push with 1 tank you pretty much auto-win against 1gate fe

If you're blindly all-inning anyway, there are builds 10x better than this.
- 2 rax gasless scv-marine all in that was already mentioned
- The Tasteless build! (1-1-1 with marine/tank/banshee/raven for pdd for the noobs who don't know what I'm sizzayin)

In the meantime, I advise all terran readers to use their scvs for mining minerals. And building stuff.
get rich or die mining
TL+ Member
LowChucky
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom243 Posts
April 06 2011 14:57 GMT
#35
This has to be a troll....right???

1) Calling it Bracketting
2)"Liquid_Bracket"
3)Obvious BitbyBitPrime
4)The thought that using 90% of your SCV's (going all in), whilst losing mining time AND probably losing some if not most of the SCV's, is a technique to kill an expo and not even to straight up win the game is silly...
"I feel like i'm watching two guys take turns at falling down the stairs" - Tasteless
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 14:59 GMT
#36
On April 06 2011 23:55 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 21:22 GaryBrackett wrote:
Bracketting will only work on maps where the Natural is open (Metalopolis) and not on maps where the Natural has little access (Shakuras Plateau)

The idea of this build is to combat any form of Gateway or Fast Expand build used by the Protoss

Liquid_Brackett


I know I'm not going to win this argument since the OP and Yans are obviously probably on skype right now raging over "That one guy who's hating on our post"...

But do you really see nothing contradictory with what I quoted from the OP?

My point is, in a normal/standard PvT matchup with an open map like metalopolis, a protoss won't fast expand.


You say you are high diamond in an earlier post. Builds do not matter below masters as shown by RootDestiny (you can win with mass queens).
This is highlighting your lack of knowledge on the matter.
Protoss still 1 Gate Expand on maps such as Xel Naga Caverns and Metalopolis where the natural is more open. It's fairly standard to say that a Protoss won't fast expand on Metalopolis is ridiculous where's your proof for this?

Sorry for the harsh tone of my response squire.

Liquid_Brackett
fire_brand
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Canada1123 Posts
April 06 2011 14:59 GMT
#37
I'm pretty sure this is just called all-ining, and if we were to ever make a fancy name for it I wouldn't call it Bracketting, but bitbybitting. I'm fairly certain he was the one who popularized this technique, not you.
Random player, pixel enthusiast, crappy illustrator, offlane/support
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 15:01 GMT
#38
On April 06 2011 23:57 Alejandrisha wrote:
If you want to all in some one to punish them there are several ways 10x better than this.
- Thor rush should insta-win against 3gate-nexus-robo and has a chance against 1gate fe
- 1 base tank marine push (3 tanks) should auto-win against 3gate fe and if you push with 1 tank you pretty much auto-win against 1gate fe

If you're blindly all-inning anyway, there are builds 10x better than this.
- 2 rax gasless scv-marine all in that was already mentioned
- The Tasteless build! (1-1-1 with marine/tank/banshee/raven for pdd for the noobs who don't know what I'm sizzayin)

In the meantime, I advise all terran readers to use their scvs for mining minerals. And building stuff.


All the builds you have mentioned are easily scout able while this build is not scout able until you pull the SCV's.

Liquid_Brackett
Alejandrisha
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6565 Posts
April 06 2011 15:06 GMT
#39
On April 07 2011 00:01 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:57 Alejandrisha wrote:
If you want to all in some one to punish them there are several ways 10x better than this.
- Thor rush should insta-win against 3gate-nexus-robo and has a chance against 1gate fe
- 1 base tank marine push (3 tanks) should auto-win against 3gate fe and if you push with 1 tank you pretty much auto-win against 1gate fe

If you're blindly all-inning anyway, there are builds 10x better than this.
- 2 rax gasless scv-marine all in that was already mentioned
- The Tasteless build! (1-1-1 with marine/tank/banshee/raven for pdd for the noobs who don't know what I'm sizzayin)

In the meantime, I advise all terran readers to use their scvs for mining minerals. And building stuff.


All the builds you have mentioned are easily scout able while this build is not scout able until you pull the SCV's.

Liquid_Brackett


the only one that is "easily scoutable" is the tasteless build, but that can easily be mistaken for dual port no-cloak or cloak rush. Could even be mistaken for a thor rush if it's a 2-gasser

2 rax scv-all in looks exactly like a gasless 1rax fe until the first stalker gets out if you're denying probe scouting properly

1 base tank marine push is 1 gas and looks exactly like anything else until you can deny the scouting probe.

???
get rich or die mining
TL+ Member
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:15:08
April 06 2011 15:06 GMT
#40
On April 06 2011 23:59 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:55 Scrubington wrote:
On April 06 2011 21:22 GaryBrackett wrote:
Bracketting will only work on maps where the Natural is open (Metalopolis) and not on maps where the Natural has little access (Shakuras Plateau)

The idea of this build is to combat any form of Gateway or Fast Expand build used by the Protoss

Liquid_Brackett


I know I'm not going to win this argument since the OP and Yans are obviously probably on skype right now raging over "That one guy who's hating on our post"...

But do you really see nothing contradictory with what I quoted from the OP?

My point is, in a normal/standard PvT matchup with an open map like metalopolis, a protoss won't fast expand.


You say you are high diamond in an earlier post. Builds do not matter below masters as shown by RootDestiny (you can win with mass queens).
This is highlighting your lack of knowledge on the matter.
Protoss still 1 Gate Expand on maps such as Xel Naga Caverns and Metalopolis where the natural is more open. It's fairly standard to say that a Protoss won't fast expand on Metalopolis is ridiculous where's your proof for this?

Sorry for the harsh tone of my response squire.

Liquid_Brackett


I'm speaking from experience, I often play master league Terran players, and I'm sure my fellow Protoss players would agree with me when I say 1 gate fast expanding on an open natural map (eg. Xel'naga, Metalopolis) as Protoss against a Terran player is borderline suicidal.

ROOTDestiny's point was builds don't matter as long as you have good mechanics at lower level, it's obvious that builds to matter at high level play.

In conclusion, you trying to use ROOTDestiny to support your argument was simply incorrect to do since this isn't Bronze league we're talking about... And as to respond to the "Where's your proof?" comment, again, I'm speaking from experience and I'm sure any Protoss player would agree with me.

EDIT: Don't name your build after yourself man, that's honestly the douchiest thing you could possibly do and it's bothering everybody in this thread (If sombody honestly disagrees with this please let me know, other than Yans and the OP obviously)... Sorry for the harsh tone of my response, squire.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 15:09 GMT
#41
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=142887

IMMVP v Adelscott 1 gate Fast Expand on XelNaga Caverns

Anything else i need to add?

Liquid_Brackett
Saechiis
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands4989 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:19:18
April 06 2011 15:15 GMT
#42
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon (your posts already have your id hovering over them fyi).

That's all.
I think esports is pretty nice.
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
April 06 2011 15:17 GMT
#43
On April 07 2011 00:15 Saechiis wrote:
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon.

That's all.


Honestly, please. It's bothering everybody, either a) stop trolling or b) take some of our advice if you're being serious.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:18:44
April 06 2011 15:17 GMT
#44
On April 07 2011 00:15 Saechiis wrote:
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon.

That's all.


I'm sorry you feel this way, but this is not relevant to the discussion of Bracketting.

As for Scrubington, you shouldn't argue things that are clearly wrong (Protoss do not fast expand on open maps) then resort to personal jabs after you've been proven wrong.

Liquid'TheBrackster'_Brackett

User was temp banned for this post.
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
April 06 2011 15:18 GMT
#45
On April 07 2011 00:17 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:15 Saechiis wrote:
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon.

That's all.


I'm sorry you feel this way, but this is not relevant to the discussion of Bracketting

Liquid'TheBrackster'_Brackett


Holy hell.

I see you're going maximum over troll.
MidoZ
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden18 Posts
April 06 2011 15:18 GMT
#46
On April 07 2011 00:09 GaryBrackett wrote:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=142887

IMMVP v Adelscott 1 gate Fast Expand on XelNaga Caverns

Anything else i need to add?

Liquid_Brackett

dident he even nexus first one that map vs someone to? , toss fe are not even close to terran fe right now , with stim nerf fe are pretty safe while terran needs to get bunkers , and thats depends on what map you play on much much more then a toss fe

but anyway ontopic , yes i've seen alot of toss do fe on this maps so i can agree with you there , why not? toss dont need bunkes to defend
micro, not without stim cc really dont do the jobb unless you going 3 rax mass raders or something , then yes you can micro without stim but then again zeallot + ff
Arguing on the internet is like running at the special olympics. Even if you win, you're still retarded
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 15:18 GMT
#47
On April 07 2011 00:17 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:15 Saechiis wrote:
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon.

That's all.


Honestly, please. It's bothering everybody, either a) stop trolling or b) take some of our advice if you're being serious.

Feel free to leave the thread if you have nothing constructive to say, if I didn't know any better I'd wager that you were a Protoss player that was fearing a resurgence of Bracketting killing your Nexus!

Regards, Yans
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
Markwerf
Profile Joined March 2010
Netherlands3728 Posts
April 06 2011 15:20 GMT
#48
There should be an autoban on people trying to name stuff after themslves. It is a highly annoying trend and it only confuses the threads.
This thread should just be something like 'Stimpushing TvP'.

As for the strat itself, stim timings have become a bit weaker with the 30 extra seconds and I don't really like those strats anymore. Sure with massive scv pull it can still work fine but a good toss will know to simply let his expo die and FF you out. 90% scv pulls is never good at that stage in the game, a 50-60% pull is the max imo as otherwise you will just be severely behind if they are smart enough to pull back.
Saechiis
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands4989 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:20:43
April 06 2011 15:20 GMT
#49
I thinks it's Liquid_Adun coming back with a vengeance.

God, I'm even calling him Liquid_Adun, it's working
I think esports is pretty nice.
Vlare
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
748 Posts
April 06 2011 15:21 GMT
#50
How has this thread not been locked.

Mass zerglings doesnt fail
Synystyr
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1446 Posts
April 06 2011 15:23 GMT
#51
On April 07 2011 00:20 Saechiis wrote:
I thinks it's Liquid_Adun coming back with a vengeance.

God, I'm even calling him Liquid_Adun, it's working


I was just thinking that xD. Where is Adun when we need him =[
Sky Terran TvP V2.0: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=355839
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:24:48
April 06 2011 15:23 GMT
#52
On April 07 2011 00:17 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:15 Saechiis wrote:
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon.

That's all.


I'm sorry you feel this way, but this is not relevant to the discussion of Bracketting.

As for Scrubington, you shouldn't argue things that are clearly wrong (Protoss do not fast expand on open maps) then resort to personal jabs after you've been proven wrong.

Liquid'TheBrackster'_Brackett


MidoZ, don't bother posting serious replies in this thread. Yans' & Gary are intentionally trolling, it's subtle, but it's there, naming a build after himself that's been known since the beta, the signatures every post, the "seriousness" only when somebody calls them out on trolling...

Adding in "TheBrackster" to his signature when somebody suggested he shouldn't put his signature in every post. Need a mod IMO.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:25:03
April 06 2011 15:24 GMT
#53
On April 07 2011 00:21 Vlare wrote:
How has this thread not been locked.


Please don't be so hasty and stay on topic.

The stim nerf has hit Bracketting badly but the timings still work out due to the fact that you are now taking an Expansion. I'm open to suggestion on number of SCV's you pull. 90% may be a bit much.
The build has not been perfected yet and i am open to criticism.

Liquid_Brackett
CaptainHaz
Profile Joined December 2010
United States240 Posts
April 06 2011 15:26 GMT
#54
This is basically taking the 2 rax tech/reactor expand and making it an allin. Getting the second orbital is kind of useless since if this rush fails it's basically game over. Even if you take out the nexus, depending on how many SCVs you pulled to do it, as you're "containing" him, the mining time lost from when your SCVs leave the outside of the enemy base is ridiculous.

This is just a really poorly thought out allin.

I'm pretty sure we're getting trolled though, the idiotic signature and build name as well as the writing itself is sort of telling.
All of us warned you of the big white face.
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
April 06 2011 15:29 GMT
#55
On April 07 2011 00:26 CaptainHaz wrote:
This is basically taking the 2 rax tech/reactor expand and making it an allin. Getting the second orbital is kind of useless since if this rush fails it's basically game over. Even if you take out the nexus, depending on how many SCVs you pulled to do it, as you're "containing" him, the mining time lost from when your SCVs leave the outside of the enemy base is ridiculous.

This is just a really poorly thought out allin.

I'm pretty sure we're getting trolled though, the idiotic signature and build name as well as the writing itself is sort of telling.


Honestly, at this point just waiting for a mod to lock the thread.
Jeffbelittle
Profile Joined August 2010
United States468 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:33:40
April 06 2011 15:32 GMT
#56
A protoss will open 1 gate FE in response to something. And it's generally not done on wide open naturals.

So: Liquid_Brackett- could you please explain to me how using an all-in to punish a lack-luster fast expanding Protoss who doesn't scout on an open natural map is a new concept that you: The Bracken, have discovered? Surely you must've done this a plethora of times against top Master level Protoss players for you to conclude on your mastery builds?
Venomsflame
Profile Joined February 2011
United States613 Posts
April 06 2011 15:35 GMT
#57
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36160 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:37:36
April 06 2011 15:37 GMT
#58
On April 06 2011 23:57 Alejandrisha wrote:
If you want to all in some one to punish them there are several ways 10x better than this.
- Thor rush should insta-win against 3gate-nexus-robo and has a chance against 1gate fe
- 1 base tank marine push (3 tanks) should auto-win against 3gate fe and if you push with 1 tank you pretty much auto-win against 1gate fe



So tell me, how are we supposed to expand exactly? I ask this seriously.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
LowChucky
Profile Joined March 2011
United Kingdom243 Posts
April 06 2011 15:37 GMT
#59
Annnnnnnnnd, everyone.....LIMERICK...

There once was a poster named Brackett,
who made such an annoying racket,
he dug a big hole,
like a regular troll,
an everyone returned to their zealot.

Your turn...
"I feel like i'm watching two guys take turns at falling down the stairs" - Tasteless
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
April 06 2011 15:37 GMT
#60
On April 07 2011 00:35 Venomsflame wrote:
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.


You sir, speak for the entire thread. Couldn't agree more.
K3Nyy
Profile Joined February 2010
United States1961 Posts
April 06 2011 15:37 GMT
#61
This build is old and has been done countless times.

There are better ways to punish a Protoss FE, such as the raven/banshee/marine and tank/marine.
Savant
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States379 Posts
April 06 2011 15:39 GMT
#62
lols. This guy set his country to Bulgaria. Creates the worst possible scv all-in I've ever heard of. Creates an obnoxious name and names it after himself, repeats it over and over. Then signs every post with said obnoxious name. I'd be disappointed if any further posts in this thread even mention game strategy. Don't feed the troll, people.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36160 Posts
April 06 2011 15:39 GMT
#63
There was once a poster named Chucky,
tried his hardest to be lucky,
he wrote a verse,
but i can't help but curse,
as I don't really give a fucky.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 15:42 GMT
#64
On April 07 2011 00:37 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:35 Venomsflame wrote:
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.


You sir, speak for the entire thread. Couldn't agree more.

sorry mate, but you should take a time out Based on your post history, you seem to lash out at others a lot. Try to learn a bit about respect
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
April 06 2011 15:44 GMT
#65
On April 07 2011 00:37 LowChucky wrote:
Annnnnnnnnd, everyone.....LIMERICK...

There once was a poster named Brackett,
who made such an annoying racket,
he dug a big hole,
like a regular troll,
an everyone returned to their zealot.

Your turn...


My name is Garry Brackett,
I act as if I wear a leather Gracket,
I pretend I'm in the liquid clan,
(In reality)
I'm ashamed to call myself a man.



danielsan
Profile Joined December 2010
Romania399 Posts
April 06 2011 15:44 GMT
#66
Oh what has trolling become? Bracket+ the alt account yans, you're a disgrace to trolls all around the internets. So unchiseled, so obvious.
Saechiis
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands4989 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:47:01
April 06 2011 15:45 GMT
#67
On April 07 2011 00:17 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:15 Saechiis wrote:
Stop calling yourself Liquid_Brackett, stop naming known builds and techniques after yourself, stop signing every one of your posts with your name and race icon.

That's all.


I'm sorry you feel this way, but this is not relevant to the discussion of Bracketting.

As for Scrubington, you shouldn't argue things that are clearly wrong (Protoss do not fast expand on open maps) then resort to personal jabs after you've been proven wrong.

Liquid'TheBrackster'_Brackett

User was plagued for this post.


Playguuuuu!
I think esports is pretty nice.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:46:59
April 06 2011 15:46 GMT
#68
For all the people asking why this build is original.
It's the Expansion and the use of MULES to guarantee constant reinforcement.
If a replay is found of a Professional using this exact technique i will be happy to name it after them
All of the flame and unjustified criticism is plain vindictive.

Scrubington
Profile Joined June 2010
Canada475 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 15:51:10
April 06 2011 15:47 GMT
#69
On April 07 2011 00:42 Yans wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:37 Scrubington wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:35 Venomsflame wrote:
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.


You sir, speak for the entire thread. Couldn't agree more.

sorry mate, but you should take a time out Based on your post history, you seem to lash out at others a lot. Try to learn a bit about respect


Keep acting nice and add as many smiley face emotes as you want, it's not going to help, a mod's going to read this and see how much you're supporting Garry in his crusade to degrade the teamliquid community by posting troll threads.

(The account's most likely an alternate account of Garry's to begin with like somebody else stated a couple posts back)

It's really sad what you're doing man.
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
April 06 2011 15:47 GMT
#70
--- Nuked ---
Alejandrisha
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6565 Posts
April 06 2011 15:52 GMT
#71
On April 07 2011 00:37 marvellosity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 06 2011 23:57 Alejandrisha wrote:
If you want to all in some one to punish them there are several ways 10x better than this.
- Thor rush should insta-win against 3gate-nexus-robo and has a chance against 1gate fe
- 1 base tank marine push (3 tanks) should auto-win against 3gate fe and if you push with 1 tank you pretty much auto-win against 1gate fe



So tell me, how are we supposed to expand exactly? I ask this seriously.


Well to be honest, I was speaking with pre-patch maps in mind. You can probably get away with being a little more greedy on the new maps, for sure. The only one that I still feel is pretty unwinnable is 3gateway-nexus-robo against thor rush, however.

One gate robo into 3 gate robo and expanding is the safest way, however. It gives you the ability to scout one of these all-ins, stay on one base, and smash it.
get rich or die mining
TL+ Member
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 15:52 GMT
#72
On April 07 2011 00:47 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:42 Yans wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:37 Scrubington wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:35 Venomsflame wrote:
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.


You sir, speak for the entire thread. Couldn't agree more.

sorry mate, but you should take a time out Based on your post history, you seem to lash out at others a lot. Try to learn a bit about respect


Keep acting nice and add as many smiley face emotes as you want, it's not going to help, a mod's going to read this and see how much you're supporting Garry in his crusade to degrade the teamliquid community by posting troll threads.

(The account's most likely an alternate account of Garry's to begin with like somebody else stated a couple posts back)

It's really sad what you're doing man.


Stop back seat modding with false accusations, none of this is relevant to the build. I'm sure you are the biggest kid in your high school class and the best at Starcraft but this is the real world and your flaming is not needed. Please refrain from posting in this thread if you have nothing relevant /constructive to say.

WaZz
Profile Joined November 2010
27 Posts
April 06 2011 15:53 GMT
#73
i dont see the point of this because you can just 2 rax pressure and kill him outright otherwise add an expo go into 3 rax add a ghost academy and go for a 3rax 1 ghost push at 9-9:30 and still be fine. There are plenty other ways to get rid of a tos early game before collosi than an all-in.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
April 06 2011 15:57 GMT
#74
On April 07 2011 00:53 WaZz wrote:
i dont see the point of this because you can just 2 rax pressure and kill him outright otherwise add an expo go into 3 rax add a ghost academy and go for a 3rax 1 ghost push at 9-9:30 and still be fine. There are plenty other ways to get rid of a tos early game before collosi than an all-in.


Yeah there are plenty of other tactics you can do, i'm just giving an alternative.
Personally i'm from a Warcraft 3 Background so i have pretty good micro so i find this kind of tactic quite easy to win with.
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 15:58 GMT
#75
On April 07 2011 00:47 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:42 Yans wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:37 Scrubington wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:35 Venomsflame wrote:
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.


You sir, speak for the entire thread. Couldn't agree more.

sorry mate, but you should take a time out Based on your post history, you seem to lash out at others a lot. Try to learn a bit about respect


Keep acting nice and add as many smiley face emotes as you want, it's not going to help, a mod's going to read this and see how much you're supporting Garry in his crusade to degrade the teamliquid community by posting troll threads.

(The account's most likely an alternate account of Garry's to begin with like somebody else stated a couple posts back)

It's really sad what you're doing man.

Feel free to keep editing your post since you're too weak minded to articulate yourself properly typical beta male behaviour
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
Alejandrisha
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6565 Posts
April 06 2011 15:59 GMT
#76
On April 07 2011 00:47 Scrubington wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:42 Yans wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:37 Scrubington wrote:
On April 07 2011 00:35 Venomsflame wrote:
Before the mods shut this down, I just want to say I find it HILARIOUS he calls the technique(technique, not a strategy. This is nothing new) after himself and yet every mention/replay of it features another player. You name things you invent, not things you found on the internet.

Also, this is honestly something people do in Clan Wars and other things routinely. You see an opening, you grab your scvs and go. 2 rax allin is not something new and it is definitely not your creation.


You sir, speak for the entire thread. Couldn't agree more.

sorry mate, but you should take a time out Based on your post history, you seem to lash out at others a lot. Try to learn a bit about respect


Keep acting nice and add as many smiley face emotes as you want, it's not going to help, a mod's going to read this and see how much you're supporting Garry in his crusade to degrade the teamliquid community by posting troll threads.

(The account's most likely an alternate account of Garry's to begin with like somebody else stated a couple posts back)

It's really sad what you're doing man.


Wow this is uncanny.. This yans fellow made an account this very day and has 6 posts, all in this thread! Small world isn't it! While this thread probably would survive without the OP propping it up with alternate accounts, it kind of takes away from its already shaky legitimacy. I think all who have commented here and have viewed this thread know what's up :/
get rich or die mining
TL+ Member
Yans
Profile Joined April 2011
United Kingdom12 Posts
April 06 2011 16:01 GMT
#77
why is everyone calling me an alt acc....... i saw this thread and wanted to show appreciation for it, because i have been struggling in TvP lately, so i registered to post -.- awesome how a highlighted user derails the thread with false accusations, thought they were supposed to be good strat forum posters?
ThorZaIN | Tyler | Ret
Venomsflame
Profile Joined February 2011
United States613 Posts
April 06 2011 16:03 GMT
#78
This thread is like Jackass to me. It's awful and completely stupid but I can't keep watching.

O.O

I'm in class and I keep hitting the refresh button it's too good to miss.
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 16:12:01
April 06 2011 16:10 GMT
#79
On April 07 2011 00:47 Sated wrote:
Show nested quote +
You say you are high diamond in an earlier post. Builds do not matter below masters as shown by RootDestiny (you can win with mass queens).


That's like saying football formations don't matter below the Premier League because Manchester United would roflstomp a pub-team no matter what formation they played. In a game between equally skilled players (equal macro/micro ability etc.), builds are always going to be important.

Don't be silly


My point was that if Messi played for a Non-League side who didn't use a formation they would still be good, because of his raw ability. People below Masters and even people in Masters are really unrefined and lacking due to the games age. Builds don't matter as long as you have RTS experience and can macro and micro (at a low level) obviously they help slightly.
Similar players, obviously builds matter but you can always improve until you get to the top.
gogogadgetflow
Profile Joined March 2010
United States2583 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 16:46:01
April 06 2011 16:45 GMT
#80
On April 07 2011 01:10 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:47 Sated wrote:
You say you are high diamond in an earlier post. Builds do not matter below masters as shown by RootDestiny (you can win with mass queens).


That's like saying football formations don't matter below the Premier League because Manchester United would roflstomp a pub-team no matter what formation they played. In a game between equally skilled players (equal macro/micro ability etc.), builds are always going to be important.

Don't be silly


My point was that if Messi played for a Non-League side who didn't use a formation they would still be good, because of his raw ability. People below Masters and even people in Masters are really unrefined and lacking due to the games age. Builds don't matter as long as you have RTS experience and can macro and micro (at a low level) obviously they help slightly.
Similar players, obviously builds matter but you can always improve until you get to the top.

Liquid'BackToTheGrackAttack_Brackett
Leyra
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1222 Posts
April 06 2011 17:19 GMT
#81
On April 07 2011 00:52 Alejandrisha wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 00:37 marvellosity wrote:
On April 06 2011 23:57 Alejandrisha wrote:
If you want to all in some one to punish them there are several ways 10x better than this.
- Thor rush should insta-win against 3gate-nexus-robo and has a chance against 1gate fe
- 1 base tank marine push (3 tanks) should auto-win against 3gate fe and if you push with 1 tank you pretty much auto-win against 1gate fe



So tell me, how are we supposed to expand exactly? I ask this seriously.


Well to be honest, I was speaking with pre-patch maps in mind. You can probably get away with being a little more greedy on the new maps, for sure. The only one that I still feel is pretty unwinnable is 3gateway-nexus-robo against thor rush, however.

One gate robo into 3 gate robo and expanding is the safest way, however. It gives you the ability to scout one of these all-ins, stay on one base, and smash it.


Totally off-topic, but since this topic is awful anyways I don't feel bad; I'm a little curious about the work you've done with 3gate-expo-+robo. In the scenarios you auto lose, is the fact proxy'd? It seems to me like your pressure (assuming something like the 3gate pressure/contain expand, such as CecilSunkure mapped out in some other awesome thread), should arrive at his front door before his thor hits your base. If he's defending his ramp with just bunker + marines, your build is sentry heavy enough that you ought to be able to FF the bunker, kill it, and engage in some sort of crazy base trade? (the 3gate expand build I mentioned is noted for being able to punish fast-teching terrans relying on just one bunker, a la Alicia vs MVP on XNC)

I suppose in a situation like close-pos Metal or something, where proxying isnt necessary and there's no chance of your stuff hitting his base when his thor's hitting yours, I can see why it would be auto-loss, however.

Sorry, was just reading the thread and was curious about your post, as I haven't had anyone thor rush me in a while ;x

Also, lol@The Brackster.
QTIP.
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States2113 Posts
April 06 2011 17:32 GMT
#82
I'm going to echo the sentiments of a few other posters here.

Regardless of whether or not your build is viable or not... The following reasons make your post hard to take seriously, and obnoxious to read.

i) naming the build after yourself and continuing to do so despite the surfacing of select's replay
ii) signing your name as liquid_brackett after every post to establish a false sense of authority
iii) citing root.destiny's mass queen strat as an example that diamond and below strats dont matter if mechanics are good (a little presumptuous no?)
iv) sarcastically replying to other posters with phrases such as 'squire' etc.

Just my advice. Try some modesty.
"Trash Micro but Win. Its Marin." - Min Chul
loveeholicce
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Korea (South)785 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 21:27:09
April 06 2011 17:36 GMT
#83
edit: troll thread nvm not gonna discuss lol
상처받은 그대에 가슴에 사랑을 심어줄께요♥
ZasZ.
Profile Joined May 2010
United States2911 Posts
April 06 2011 17:45 GMT
#84
What the hell happened to the strategy forum purge? This "guide" is obviously a troll, and if it's not, it's a terrible guide.

Stop validating him by discussing his "strategy."
Jeffbelittle
Profile Joined August 2010
United States468 Posts
April 06 2011 21:17 GMT
#85
On April 07 2011 00:46 GaryBrackett wrote:
For all the people asking why this build is original.
It's the Expansion and the use of MULES to guarantee constant reinforcement.
If a replay is found of a Professional using this exact technique i will be happy to name it after them
All of the flame and unjustified criticism is plain vindictive.



...Ooooh! It's the expansion which won't finish until after the attack finishes which guarantees the constant reinforcement! Gotcha! Hey: while we're at it: l've got a new build for you:

It's a Terran build, even though I'm a Zerg/Protoss player, but I came up with it just now for you. I'm going to call it "Belittling", because that's part of my name.

+ Show Spoiler +
Right anyways, here's the build order.

12 Rax
14 Rax
16 Rax
17 CC
18 CC
20 CC
28 CC
29 5 more Rax

Okay see now at this time, you should have about 4 CC's and 1 OC, aka 5 bases. AND 8 Barracks. Throw on tech labs on all 5 Barracks, Reactor on 3. Now, with your 5 bases, you should be able to support ALL of these rax's making constant Marauders and marines. So make like 19 supply depoits right away, and deny the guys natural. You should be able to poke and win the game as he'll probably only have about 10 units by this time.


Now of course I'm being sarcastic, and that was indeed a hyperbole (Which means to greatly exaggerate to prove the underlying point). That point was: this is nothing new, not even the slightest. Don't make threads like this ever again unless you want to get perma banned out of this community. We all think it'd be pretty sweet if we came out with this hardcore awesome new strategy that works at even the highest levels of play, unfortunately: very very very few of us actually do.

Now: when you get good enough to be say CecilSunkure - you can guide people in the direction of appropriately executing already well-known build orders, using replays for reference; however, I don't think your at that point yet. Surely not like this. And even the people who have their name in their build somehow, got it not by the user asking for it, but because the community either loved or respected the player enough. E.G: The very modest Fistdantilus making up the 5 Roach Rush, and others started to call each roach a finger of the fist.

Your punishing a fast expand which high unit count early on, and the pulling of workers. This has been done thousands of times in the past. And you even linked someone doing it, that wasn't you. Why aren't they getting any credit?

I really hope mods close this thread, because it's taking up space on the left thread bar of threads I WANT to read so I can stay in touch with the meta game.

~Jeffbelittle, a player. Nothing special.
loveeholicce
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Korea (South)785 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 21:26:20
April 06 2011 21:25 GMT
#86
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled
상처받은 그대에 가슴에 사랑을 심어줄께요♥
Fiendish
Profile Joined April 2010
United States210 Posts
April 06 2011 21:27 GMT
#87
trololololol
tehemperorer
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2183 Posts
April 06 2011 21:31 GMT
#88
All-inning in PvT is now called Bracketting, got it.
Knowing is half the battle... the other half is lasers.
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
April 06 2011 21:38 GMT
#89
On April 07 2011 06:25 loveeholicce wrote:
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled


50 wins 0 losses.
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
Moody
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States750 Posts
April 06 2011 21:39 GMT
#90
Several things I am genuinely interested in:

1.) How is this different than any other Marine/ Marauder / SCV all-in?

2.) Why did you want to attach your name to it? Why should anyone call it "Bracketting"?

3.) Y U NO HAVE REPLAYS?!

4.) When did you get recruited to team Liquid?

On April 06 2011 21:22 GaryBrackett wrote:
Liquid_Brackett

A marine walks into a bar and asks, "Where's the counter?"
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 21:52:01
April 06 2011 21:46 GMT
#91
I can make a variation of the 3 stalker rush by getting 5 stalkers in total (2 stalkers right after) and call it stalkering for god's sake.

I actually 1 gate FE in every map/position except for Delta, Steppes of War, and close positions.

I never knew it was that unsafe vs huge chokes because I really only played it like 10% out of my PvT's (talking about the very early marauder pressure).
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
Moody
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States750 Posts
April 06 2011 21:49 GMT
#92
On April 07 2011 06:46 iChau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 06:39 Moody wrote:
Several things I am genuinely interested in:

1.) How is this different than any other Marine/ Marauder / SCV all-in?

2.) Why did you want to attach your name to it? Why should anyone call it "Bracketting"?

3.) Y U NO HAVE REPLAYS?!

4.) When did you get recruited to team Liquid?

On April 06 2011 21:22 GaryBrackett wrote:
Liquid_Brackett



I can make a variation of the 3 stalker rush by getting 5 stalkers in total (2 stalkers right after) and call it stalkering for god's sake.

I actually 1 gate FE in every map/position except for Delta, Steppes of War, and close positions.

I never knew it was that unsafe vs huge chokes because I really only played it like 10% out of my PvT's (talking about the very early marauder pressure).


I see no relation between your post and my post... I don't understand why you quoted me.
A marine walks into a bar and asks, "Where's the counter?"
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
April 06 2011 21:51 GMT
#93
On April 07 2011 06:49 Moody wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 06:46 iChau wrote:
On April 07 2011 06:39 Moody wrote:
Several things I am genuinely interested in:

1.) How is this different than any other Marine/ Marauder / SCV all-in?

2.) Why did you want to attach your name to it? Why should anyone call it "Bracketting"?

3.) Y U NO HAVE REPLAYS?!

4.) When did you get recruited to team Liquid?

On April 06 2011 21:22 GaryBrackett wrote:
Liquid_Brackett



I can make a variation of the 3 stalker rush by getting 5 stalkers in total (2 stalkers right after) and call it stalkering for god's sake.

I actually 1 gate FE in every map/position except for Delta, Steppes of War, and close positions.

I never knew it was that unsafe vs huge chokes because I really only played it like 10% out of my PvT's (talking about the very early marauder pressure).


I see no relation between your post and my post... I don't understand why you quoted me.


Meant to click on edit.
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
GaryBrackett
Profile Joined December 2010
Bulgaria106 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 21:56:28
April 06 2011 21:53 GMT
#94
On April 07 2011 06:25 loveeholicce wrote:
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled


I'm Masters on EU why would i be on the US server when i'm from Bulgaria
It is possible to have a different account name to TeamLiquid username :S
loveeholicce
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Korea (South)785 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 22:01:19
April 06 2011 21:55 GMT
#95
On April 07 2011 06:38 iChau wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 06:25 loveeholicce wrote:
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled


50 wins 0 losses.


http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/2690435/1/GaryBrackett/matches

On April 07 2011 06:53 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 06:25 loveeholicce wrote:
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled


I'm Masters on EU why would i be on the US server when i'm from Bulgaria
It is possible to have a different account name to TeamLiquid username :S


Link your account then? I just searched garybrackett on the EU server and there's nothing resembling it.
상처받은 그대에 가슴에 사랑을 심어줄께요♥
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
April 06 2011 21:58 GMT
#96
On April 07 2011 06:55 loveeholicce wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 06:38 iChau wrote:
On April 07 2011 06:25 loveeholicce wrote:
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled


50 wins 0 losses.


http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/2690435/1/GaryBrackett/matches


Oh sc2ranks is kinda funky then.
Ty.
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
iChau
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1210 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 22:01:23
April 06 2011 22:00 GMT
#97
On April 07 2011 06:53 GaryBrackett wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 07 2011 06:25 loveeholicce wrote:
Would like to point out this guy's a low diamond player in season 1, hasn't played in season 2. Definitely not masters rofl

http://www.sc2ranks.com/us/2690435/GaryBrackett/season/1

Clearly being trolled


I'm Masters on EU why would i be on the US server when i'm from Bulgaria
It is possible to have a different account name to TeamLiquid username :S


So show us your b.net link and then prove it by uploading a replay (go into game and just surrender right after, type that you're garybrackett in tl, custom game of course).

That should be enough evidence that you're in masters as long as you provide the b.net link.
us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/1688911/1/SaniShahin/ | http://teamenvy.net/
Tracedragon
Profile Joined December 2010
United States948 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-04-06 22:05:19
April 06 2011 22:01 GMT
#98
I wonder if Bracketting's a possible strategy to use against the Gracken.

But what's the point of posting a generic marauder/bunker rush, and naming it after yourself?

EDIT: My bad, troll thread. ;-;
Do the impossible, see the invisible. Row, row, fight the power!
Blyadischa
Profile Joined April 2010
419 Posts
April 06 2011 22:07 GMT
#99
What the fuck is this?

"hi guys i am garybrackett, i invented scv-allining, i made this whole build up on how to do the best scv all in, i named it after myself"
CTStalker
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Canada9720 Posts
April 07 2011 00:08 GMT
#100
This is retarded. Sorry guys, I should have closed this when I looked at it the first time.
By the way, my name is Funk. I am not of your world
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