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[Q] ZvZ -- How do I win? - Page 2

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kossak
Profile Joined August 2010
Portugal2 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-02 22:54:13
August 02 2010 22:51 GMT
#21
I'm currently at around 15 platinum and I play almost zerg exclusively since I started on the beta. One thing I particularly enjoy in ZvZ is that the speedling allows for extremely effective backstabbing early game.

You basically keep your speedlings out of your base in a hidden spot, wait for your opponent to rush you early game (which they almost will with lings or roaches), control the watchtowers and place 1 or 2 OL's in the right place so you see him moving out, and then you move with your speedling army into his base.

the build is a simple 10-13 gas->pool->queen->speedlings.

Of course you want to avoid banelings, but he usually will morph them outside his base, and you have some time to do damage (kill queen, drones), and then outmicro the banelings.

Also, this strategy will most of the time turn into a base race, so you want to save some minerals to build a hatchery someplace else if you see you'll lose the race.

I just finished a game with a diamond player where he went mass roaches and I ran by them and it was a base race. I won but I only had a spawning pool at the end. It was fun
Fistdantilus
Profile Joined August 2010
United States136 Posts
August 02 2010 23:27 GMT
#22
Roach openings are quite poor ZvZ, and it's because of their speed.

Going roaches with or without a spine crawler allows your opponent to have control of your ramp. You can't control your ramp as your zergling count is low due to spending larvae/minerals on roaches. Zerglings on your ramp means banelings are in your base.

Having banelings in your base is infinitely worse than having them outside of your base, as one random explosion wrecks you. Banelings get a speed bonus on creep, while drones do not. So the banelings *will* catch your drones on creep while you play ring around the hatchery. Meanwhile, the speedlings are just going bonkers everywhere (like running in front of the drones to stop them). It doesn't matter that the 3-5 roaches crush zerglings: it takes ONE exploding baneling to destroy your whole economy.

Let's say you held off the zerglings and banelings. Now you're trapped inside your base. The instant that ramp is open, 30 zerglings are running into your base and will be back home to defend after your drones are dead. So by going roaches you can't leave. It doesn't matter that roaches are strong against zerglings as the two will generally not meet in direct combat.

So by going roaches:
-The fight happens in your mineral line, against guys who explode.
-You can't counterattack because the ramp is left open for a back-stab.
-It requires very precise micro just to survive.
-Successful ramp blocking is map-dependent.

There's just no good reason to go roach in ZvZ.
zatic
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Zurich15366 Posts
August 02 2010 23:30 GMT
#23
Post a couple of your typical losses. How is anyone supposed to teach you ZvZ, generally, in a forum post?
ModeratorI know Teamliquid is known as a massive building
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