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On January 28 2009 20:21 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2009 20:15 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:11 Maenander wrote:On January 28 2009 20:06 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:03 Plexa wrote:On January 28 2009 20:00 Ace wrote:
I think it's more of the protoss fanboys + the maps + Bisu getting fortunate that makes people upset. If Bisu loses, there's an excuse. If he wins it's because he had the best micro, macro and game sense on the planet.
Seriously, it's only so many times you can read it. It's even WORSE than the Savior fanboys now.
God forbid Boxer or Anytime make an OSL again (ppl forget how fortunate Anytime was in his OSL run). <3 I feel exactly the same way about everything you said Anytime's shinhan 2 run makes me angry even today =[ me too :/ I still remember reading the LR match vs Xellos and it literally came down to a drop vs drop situation where Xellos' vulture drop was THIS close to ending the game. Anytime makes it to the finals and literally out of no where a billion protozombies crawl out of the TL.net soil. and here it is with Bisu again. God I hate you people  1. Bisu isn´t exactly a one-starleague-wonder like Anytime. 2. Anytime showed during several proleague seasons that he is a much more consistent player than Casy or Sync, other one-starleague-wonders. Has Bisu won an OSL AND placed second in another? Stupid question, it's like asking if Anytime won 3 MSL like oov/nada/savior did, placed second in another one and got bronze in OSL. Don't even try. I like anytime but you can't compare his accomplishements with bisu's.
you can't be serious can you?
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9071 Posts
well as a proud fan of bisu if feel a bit offended by all the hatred towards him and his fanbase. the key of being good fan is not to get overexcited, thats why I never ever said bisu is the best toss, but most accomplished ? hell yeah, besides it was the same thing with JD fans, remember how they were shitting rainbows just half a year ago? or the Hail to you god almighty after beating bisu and fantasy in the PL match... the list goes on and on. And btw finding excuses for dropping games is really JDfans stuff - Metal TvZ is overpowered, Tempest abused map imbalanced and so on. I'm not blind to see when bisu is playing shit. But what annoys me as hell is that bisu will never get the status he deserves because all his titles will be considered as luck or abusing map factor. Just take a look at the maps that were used during boxer's prime...
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On January 28 2009 20:21 Ace wrote:
@Choros - maps also have a lot to do with it. If Protoss players can't FE on maps and have to resort to 1 base. 2 gate pushes would be standard again and you'll probably see a lot of lurker contain->rape plays that made protoss players complain to the high heavens even though Nal_Ra was cremating Zergs left and right.
Probably largely correct. With Medusa this season I have decided that there will never be a time that the maps are in any way balanced. But the meta game of strategy vs strategy is ever changing and who ever is ahead of the curb will have the advantage. At the moment the Zergs have the advantage (over Protoss but NOT over Terran) and for us at the moment it is virtually impossible to predict what the next innovation will be but im hoping for a return of Zerg dominance but not so dominant it kills competition..
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On January 28 2009 20:21 Ace wrote:
@Choros - maps also have a lot to do with it. If Protoss players can't FE on maps and have to resort to 1 base. 2 gate pushes would be standard again and you'll probably see a lot of lurker contain->rape plays that made protoss players complain to the high heavens even though Nal_Ra was cremating Zergs left and right.
Well its true on a map like tears of the moon, you don't quite have the options to go for fe, or if you do you will be punished in someway. So that makes your options limited, which the zerg well knows, and so he can practice against those types of builds and expect them.
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Switzerland6838 Posts
On January 28 2009 20:22 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2009 20:21 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:On January 28 2009 20:15 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:11 Maenander wrote:On January 28 2009 20:06 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:03 Plexa wrote:On January 28 2009 20:00 Ace wrote:
I think it's more of the protoss fanboys + the maps + Bisu getting fortunate that makes people upset. If Bisu loses, there's an excuse. If he wins it's because he had the best micro, macro and game sense on the planet.
Seriously, it's only so many times you can read it. It's even WORSE than the Savior fanboys now.
God forbid Boxer or Anytime make an OSL again (ppl forget how fortunate Anytime was in his OSL run). <3 I feel exactly the same way about everything you said Anytime's shinhan 2 run makes me angry even today =[ me too :/ I still remember reading the LR match vs Xellos and it literally came down to a drop vs drop situation where Xellos' vulture drop was THIS close to ending the game. Anytime makes it to the finals and literally out of no where a billion protozombies crawl out of the TL.net soil. and here it is with Bisu again. God I hate you people 1. Bisu isn´t exactly a one-starleague-wonder like Anytime. 2. Anytime showed during several proleague seasons that he is a much more consistent player than Casy or Sync, other one-starleague-wonders. Has Bisu won an OSL AND placed second in another? Stupid question, it's like asking if Anytime won 3 MSL like oov/nada/savior did, placed second in another one and got bronze in OSL. Don't even try. I like anytime but you can't compare his accomplishements with bisu's. you can't be serious can you?
NO IT'S A BLATANT TROLL
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some of you guys need to tone it down a bit, the starcraft community should stick together, you can hate a particular player all you want but don't treat other fans like dogshit just because we're cheering for that player 
people shouldn't have to be afraid to root for their fav player without getting jeered at by our fellow starcraft droogies 
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On January 28 2009 20:11 oneofthem wrote:
being a fan of performances is mostly bandwagoning. historically, winning means more following, and memorable moments are winning ones. mindless bandwagoning is the first moment of fandom, and every fandom has mindless bandwagoning to thank.
if you happen to like bad performances or mindlessly bandwagon according to nationality, moral character or shapeliness of facial features, good luck with your bandwagon bro. i'll just sit here and rationally derive my objective following with sound and valid arguments for the ages.
The problem of bandwagoners is that as soon as the said player or team will stop winning everything, they'll jump to the next flavor of the month in a blink.
That's what I despise the most in bandwagoners. A true fan is one who continues to cheer for the same player or team even if they're slumping.
I'm nearly beginning to regret the time when everyone + brother was bandwagoning for Lecaf and we SKT fans were only a handful because SKT still didn't have Bisu or Best and was sucking hard.
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On January 28 2009 20:26 a-game wrote:some of you guys need to tone it down a bit, the starcraft community should stick together, you can hate a particular player all you want but don't treat other fans like dogshit just because we're cheering for that player people shouldn't have to be afraid to root for their fav player without getting jeered at by our fellow starcraft droogies
QFT
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On January 28 2009 20:15 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2009 20:11 Maenander wrote:On January 28 2009 20:06 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:03 Plexa wrote:On January 28 2009 20:00 Ace wrote:
I think it's more of the protoss fanboys + the maps + Bisu getting fortunate that makes people upset. If Bisu loses, there's an excuse. If he wins it's because he had the best micro, macro and game sense on the planet.
Seriously, it's only so many times you can read it. It's even WORSE than the Savior fanboys now.
God forbid Boxer or Anytime make an OSL again (ppl forget how fortunate Anytime was in his OSL run). <3 I feel exactly the same way about everything you said Anytime's shinhan 2 run makes me angry even today =[ me too :/ I still remember reading the LR match vs Xellos and it literally came down to a drop vs drop situation where Xellos' vulture drop was THIS close to ending the game. Anytime makes it to the finals and literally out of no where a billion protozombies crawl out of the TL.net soil. and here it is with Bisu again. God I hate you people 1. Bisu isn´t exactly a one-starleague-wonder like Anytime. 2. Anytime showed during several proleague seasons that he is a much more consistent player than Casy or Sync, other one-starleague-wonders. Has Bisu won an OSL AND placed second in another?
No, but unlike Anytime in his first run he has a rich history in progaming???? I dont know what is there to compare. The situations are totally different.
Well, probably we are talking past each other, I am sorry I disturbed your wonderful rants 
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On January 28 2009 20:26 a-game wrote:some of you guys need to tone it down a bit, the starcraft community should stick together, you can hate a particular player all you want but don't treat other fans like dogshit just because we're cheering for that player people shouldn't have to be afraid to root for their fav player without getting jeered at by our fellow starcraft droogies
well said...
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On January 28 2009 20:26 a-game wrote:some of you guys need to tone it down a bit, the starcraft community should stick together, you can hate a particular player all you want but don't treat other fans like dogshit just because we're cheering for that player people shouldn't have to be afraid to root for their fav player without getting jeered at by our fellow starcraft droogies
This
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On January 28 2009 20:23 disciple wrote:
well as a proud fan of bisu if feel a bit offended by all the hatred towards him and his fanbase. the key of being good fan is not to get overexcited, thats why I never ever said bisu is the best toss, but most accomplished ? hell yeah, besides it was the same thing with JD fans, remember how they were shitting rainbows just half a year ago? or the Hail to you god almighty after beating bisu and fantasy in the PL match... the list goes on and on. And btw finding excuses for dropping games is really JDfans stuff - Metal TvZ is overpowered, Tempest abused map imbalanced and so on. I'm not blind to see when bisu is playing shit. But what annoys me as hell is that bisu will never get the status he deserves because all his titles will be considered as luck or abusing map factor. Just take a look at the maps that were used during boxer's prime...
The most important thing I think is the fact that today Savior respects Bisu, but he does not respect FBH (taken from recent interview). Savior said you cannot challenge me until you win 3MSL's and he did that and he challenged him. Bisu had earned respect in Saviors mind and likewise Bisu has earned respect in the minds of most people. You will always have complaints about map imbalance as there will always be map imbalance. I think Bisu fans should not be so disappointed at the Bisu hatred although certainly it is over the top, you should be annoyed that the way Bisu has conducted himself recently that has brought that animosity upon himself. If Bisu conducts himself with honour than attitudes towards him will change. But I wouldnt get my hopes up.
Edit: I have NOTHING against Bisu fans BTW infact a good friend of mine is one.
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the worst part of this is all the anti-fans who think they are somehow cutting through the obnoxiousness of the fanboys by being derogatory.
you're not. at all. it is okay to skip over when some random person does it, when respected reds and blues start throwing around hate it is pretty terrible.
bisu plays attractive starcraft. i like attractive starcraft. i like bisu. i also like savior. i like mind. i like jaedong. i like flash. you people are all retarded, who reel of big lists to try to justify why you hate people over trivial crap. you go back over his wins and decide which ones he doesnt deserve and point them out. so deluded you think it is virtuous to fight back against all the dumb sheep who like bisu. it isnt.
also, idiots come in every colour plexa. there are plenty with t1 logos. there are plenty without.
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On January 28 2009 20:26 Matoo- wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2009 20:11 oneofthem wrote:
being a fan of performances is mostly bandwagoning. historically, winning means more following, and memorable moments are winning ones. mindless bandwagoning is the first moment of fandom, and every fandom has mindless bandwagoning to thank.
if you happen to like bad performances or mindlessly bandwagon according to nationality, moral character or shapeliness of facial features, good luck with your bandwagon bro. i'll just sit here and rationally derive my objective following with sound and valid arguments for the ages. The problem of bandwagoners is that as soon as the said player or team will stop winning everything, they'll jump to the next flavor of the month in a blink. That's what I despise the most in bandwagoners. A true fan is one who continues to cheer for the same player or team even if they're slumping. I'm nearly beginning to regret the time when everyone + brother was bandwagoning for Lecaf and we SKT fans were only a handful because SKT still didn't have Bisu or Best and was sucking hard.
I follow Boxer whereever he goes
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On January 28 2009 20:21 Ace wrote:
@Choros - maps also have a lot to do with it. If Protoss players can't FE on maps and have to resort to 1 base. 2 gate pushes would be standard again and you'll probably see a lot of lurker contain->rape plays that made protoss players complain to the high heavens even though Nal_Ra was cremating Zergs left and right.
Neo requiem made players try different strats which result in to amazing games, I'll be missing that map. Also I don't know the stats but i have a feeling toss had more wins than zergs in that map
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
On January 28 2009 20:31 Lachrymose wrote:
the worst part of this is all the anti-fans who think they are somehow cutting through the obnoxiousness of the fanboys by being derogatory.
you're not. at all. it is okay to skip over when some random person does it, when respected reds and blues start throwing around hate it is pretty terrible.
bisu plays attractive starcraft. i like attractive starcraft. i like bisu. i also like savior. i like mind. i like jaedong. i like flash. you people are all retarded, who reel of big lists to try to justify why you hate people over trivial crap. you go back over his wins and decide which ones he doesnt deserve and point them out. so deluded you think it is virtuous to fight back against all the dumb sheep who like bisu. it isnt.
also, idiots come in every colour plexa. there are plenty with t1 logos. there are plenty without.
its just that there are so many T1 fans compared to other fanbases, hence the reason why T1 is an easy image for a 'retarded fanbase'
Every fanbase has their own share of retards.
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On January 28 2009 20:26 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2009 20:22 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:21 Lukeeze[zR] wrote:On January 28 2009 20:15 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:11 Maenander wrote:On January 28 2009 20:06 Ace wrote:On January 28 2009 20:03 Plexa wrote:On January 28 2009 20:00 Ace wrote:
I think it's more of the protoss fanboys + the maps + Bisu getting fortunate that makes people upset. If Bisu loses, there's an excuse. If he wins it's because he had the best micro, macro and game sense on the planet.
Seriously, it's only so many times you can read it. It's even WORSE than the Savior fanboys now.
God forbid Boxer or Anytime make an OSL again (ppl forget how fortunate Anytime was in his OSL run). <3 I feel exactly the same way about everything you said Anytime's shinhan 2 run makes me angry even today =[ me too :/ I still remember reading the LR match vs Xellos and it literally came down to a drop vs drop situation where Xellos' vulture drop was THIS close to ending the game. Anytime makes it to the finals and literally out of no where a billion protozombies crawl out of the TL.net soil. and here it is with Bisu again. God I hate you people 1. Bisu isn´t exactly a one-starleague-wonder like Anytime. 2. Anytime showed during several proleague seasons that he is a much more consistent player than Casy or Sync, other one-starleague-wonders. Has Bisu won an OSL AND placed second in another? Stupid question, it's like asking if Anytime won 3 MSL like oov/nada/savior did, placed second in another one and got bronze in OSL. Don't even try. I like anytime but you can't compare his accomplishements with bisu's. you can't be serious can you? NO IT'S A BLATANT TROLL
Lol. Ya what do you mean he can't be serious? Bisu has more accomplishments than any protoss in history. In doing so he brought about the new era, where the average skill level for the pros (especially the top tier ones) is absolutely unreal. He is one of the best, like a Nada, Savior, July, Oov, only even more current. Now note 3 of those I mentioned were bonjwas, which Bisu isn't (but July is); but he is part of the elite club of winning 3 starleagues of the same type, the only protoss to do so.
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Can you feel the hate tonight..
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On January 28 2009 20:32 astalkulo wrote:Show nested quote +On January 28 2009 20:21 Ace wrote:
@Choros - maps also have a lot to do with it. If Protoss players can't FE on maps and have to resort to 1 base. 2 gate pushes would be standard again and you'll probably see a lot of lurker contain->rape plays that made protoss players complain to the high heavens even though Nal_Ra was cremating Zergs left and right. Neo requiem made players try different strats which result in to amazing games, I'll be missing that map. Also I don't know the stats but i have a feeling toss had more wins than zergs in that map
Neo requiem was great but unfortunately in the recent proleague it created boring crappy games because Protoss would abuse the map imbalance and Terrans simply could not play on it. But I agree that maps are the key to creating interesting games and new strats the hard part is tailoring the maps to the modern game. Im sure the people at map dori are having a tough time at the moment, but I have some faith.
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EPT
