EPT
[ASL5] Ro8 Larva vs Mini
| Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments |
BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
| ||
|
ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
| ||
|
orvinreyes
577 Posts
| ||
|
RowdierBob
Australia13006 Posts
That said it could depend on the map order. Sparkle and Third World are good for protosses so you never know. Mini is pretty strong on the island maps from memory. I think he’s a good chance but I’ll go 3-2 Larva. | ||
|
razorsuKe
Canada2000 Posts
Like it goes: 1) third world 2) gladiator 3) sparkle 4) transistor ? | ||
|
M2
Bulgaria4116 Posts
On April 29 2018 17:39 razorsuKe wrote: Is sparkle confirmed as the 3rd map? Like it goes: 1) third world 2) gladiator 3) sparkle 4) transistor ? yeah thats it | ||
|
RowdierBob
Australia13006 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
So I expect Third World or either Gladiator is going to be played twice. (No idea how the voted maps will be ordered, but likely as 2nd and 3rd map. That would seem most fair.) | ||
|
winson
China138 Posts
| ||
|
M2
Bulgaria4116 Posts
On April 29 2018 18:32 Peeano wrote: As far as I know they both downvote a map and the 2 remaining maps will be ordered randomly. So I expect Third World or either Gladiator is going to be played twice. (No idea how the voted maps will be ordered, but likely as 2nd and 3rd map. That would seem most fair.) why are you speculating, the map order is posted two posts above you xDD | ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
Edit: Stream confirms map order as posted earlier! | ||
|
razorsuKe
Canada2000 Posts
| ||
|
r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
| ||
|
M2
Bulgaria4116 Posts
| ||
|
WiMa11
38 Posts
| ||
|
bovienchien
Vietnam1152 Posts
| ||
|
xccam
Great Britain1150 Posts
On April 29 2018 19:16 bovienchien wrote: Which map Mini banned? Gladiator | ||
|
bovienchien
Vietnam1152 Posts
On April 29 2018 19:14 WiMa11 wrote: If Mini doesn't take game one he is going to get crushed. Larva vs Flash in semi final would be the best possible regarding entertainment I guess. But Flash can't pass over by Snow  | ||
|
Ej_
47656 Posts
| ||
|
Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
| ||
|
Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
| ||
|
xccam
Great Britain1150 Posts
| ||
|
r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
| ||
|
winson
China138 Posts
| ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
| ||
|
Qikz
United Kingdom12022 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
oxKnu
1180 Posts
Larva didn't play that bad but he is a Zerg and this is Third World. | ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
| ||
|
Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
| ||
|
Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
| ||
|
BlackJack
United States10499 Posts
| ||
|
Heartland
Sweden24580 Posts
| ||
|
r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
BlackJack
United States10499 Posts
| ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
| ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
| ||
|
ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
| ||
|
winson
China138 Posts
Nice play mini | ||
|
Qikz
United Kingdom12022 Posts
| ||
|
RowdierBob
Australia13006 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
WiMa11
38 Posts
| ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
| ||
|
xccam
Great Britain1150 Posts
Fair enough. | ||
|
bovienchien
Vietnam1152 Posts
| ||
|
r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
| ||
|
[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium6581 Posts
On April 29 2018 19:52 WiMa11 wrote: Oh boy, Mini absolutely destroying larva. that was not what I expected. welcome to aiur | ||
|
BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES50121 Posts
On April 29 2018 19:52 WiMa11 wrote: Oh boy, Mini absolutely destroying larva. that was not what I expected. this is the last time I make a bold statement in previews. | ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
But honestely, this will probably be a 3-0 now, sparkle is too hard for zerg and mini is really good on this map | ||
|
oxKnu
1180 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
|
VioleTAK
4315 Posts
On April 29 2018 19:54 r.Evo wrote: 3-2 turnaround would be fun but I kinda doubt it will happen. One always does. But Larva can do it. | ||
|
Disregard
China10252 Posts
| ||
|
orvinreyes
577 Posts
| ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
| ||
|
Breach_hu
Hungary2431 Posts
| ||
|
Terrorbladder
2718 Posts
| ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
| ||
|
RHoudini
Belgium3627 Posts
| ||
|
Skeny
Australia121 Posts
| ||
|
r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
| ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
| ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
| ||
|
ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
| ||
|
orvinreyes
577 Posts
On April 29 2018 16:52 orvinreyes wrote: Larva too good. 3-1 I was so wrong about Larva. So weak! | ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
| ||
GTR
51449 Posts
| ||
|
oxKnu
1180 Posts
| ||
|
VioleTAK
4315 Posts
Got to be thankful we saw Flash+Larva+Bisu in top-4 last season, this one's not feeling so exciting. | ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
| ||
|
Dante08
Singapore4128 Posts
| ||
|
Golgotha
Korea (South)8418 Posts
Please let Snow v Flash be good. | ||
|
oxKnu
1180 Posts
On April 29 2018 20:22 Peeano wrote: I thoroughly enjoyed footstargamer getting knocked out like this, but for future matches it would probably have been better if Larva had advanced. Not really. I mean Flash would've won anyway but the games would've probably been a bit more entertaining and equally as short. | ||
|
Katkishka
United States649 Posts
| ||
|
xccam
Great Britain1150 Posts
On April 29 2018 20:20 VioleTAK wrote: Sad series... Got to be thankful we saw Flash+Larva+Bisu in top-4 last season, this one's not feeling so exciting. The best (most consistent in offline events, certainly) Zerg, probably the best protoss if he lives up to what he is capable, a good protoss, and one of Flash or Snow. That's not bad honestly. | ||
|
Ty2
United States1434 Posts
| ||
|
Altay
31 Posts
On April 29 2018 20:26 xccam wrote: The best (most consistent in offline events, certainly) Zerg, probably the best protoss if he lives up to what he is capable, a good protoss, and one of Flash or Snow. That's not bad honestly. agreed, larva is a fun dude but where are his amazing ASL sample games so we can say "oh what a shame" ? on the other hand, Hero, Mini and Snow have shown boss games this ASL, Im glad that they got to get through. | ||
|
SlayerS_BunkiE
Canada1707 Posts
just so much hype! oh well... | ||
|
Jackal03
Brazil7469 Posts
On April 29 2018 20:29 Ty2 wrote: No big surprise I have to say. Larva's been doing really mediocre in practice. He'll get 'em next ASL. he did play very subpar, the second game was such a huge blunder from him. Not his time, maybe his mindset is not that good this days | ||
|
orvinreyes
577 Posts
| ||
|
Alpha-NP-
United States1242 Posts
| ||
|
oxKnu
1180 Posts
On April 29 2018 21:36 orvinreyes wrote: Where was the Larva who destroyed Rain in ASL4 ro8? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9eCGElQJIM Maps were very different though. | ||
|
Nukid
United States240 Posts
| ||
|
PVJ
Hungary5214 Posts
On April 29 2018 22:33 Nukid wrote: Larva is good at late game vs terran but his vs Z and vs P isn't that great. I think it might be worth pointing out that this season he wasn't able to play vT at all. As for the other matchups: He went 2-0 vZ and 0-4 (!!!) vP so his vP (on these maps) is definitely lagging to his vZ (on these maps). | ||
TaardadAiel
Bulgaria750 Posts
Dweb usage in game 3 was so delicious, I have to say. | ||
|
TornadoSteve
1023 Posts
On April 29 2018 22:33 Nukid wrote: Larva is good at late game vs terran but his vs Z and vs P isn't that great. Following the scene since 20 years, never heard this one before. "Not that great in zvz in late game" n1 | ||
|
usopsama
6502 Posts
| ||
|
StylishVODs
Sweden5331 Posts
These games were typical games where everything goes wrong for one opponent. Kind of lackluster play from Larva to be honest while Mini was playing well because everything worked out. Larva didn't really "do" anything these games. It felt like he was struggling with figuring out what his game plan was in all games. It can't be the first time he got his 3rd hatch pylon blocked on third world... Maybe he had a bad day. Mini has been really strong lately and he's really fast too. I'd say the best PvT:ers right now are Stork, Snow and Mini. | ||
|
Aesthetician
20 Posts
| ||
|
ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
| ||
|
Shinokuki
United States859 Posts
| ||
|
Alpha-NP-
United States1242 Posts
On April 30 2018 01:34 Shinokuki wrote: Larva was saying that he had no hope on these maps.. He was saying he had no chance at all Hey maybe the same thing with Hero. If Larva can't beat mini, maybe Rain will beat Hero )) | ||
|
darktreb
United States3016 Posts
On April 30 2018 00:36 StylishVODs wrote: I doubt FlaSh can beat both SnOw and Mini given these maps. These games were typical games where everything goes wrong for one opponent. Kind of lackluster play from Larva to be honest while Mini was playing well because everything worked out. Larva didn't really "do" anything these games. It felt like he was struggling with figuring out what his game plan was in all games. It can't be the first time he got his 3rd hatch pylon blocked on third world... Maybe he had a bad day. Mini has been really strong lately and he's really fast too. I'd say the best PvT:ers right now are Stork, Snow and Mini. If Flash beats Snow, Mini, and Rain to win, it would be one of the great feats of his career. Casual fans may not see it that way because these aren't the biggest names, and everyone just assumes Flash will win nowadays. But, TvP on weird maps is so damn hard against crafty PvT abuser types like Snow and Mini. I honestly think Flash would prefer to play Bisu and Stork to Snow and Mini. | ||
|
EndingLife
United States1594 Posts
| ||
|
Miragee
8509 Posts
On April 29 2018 23:57 TornadoSteve wrote: Following the scene since 20 years, never heard this one before. "Not that great in zvz in late game" n1 Reading comprehension is a good thing toi have... | ||
|
winson
China138 Posts
| ||
|
Djabanete
United States2786 Posts
Re: Larva saying he had no chance on the maps --- what's the current view for race balance on Sparkle and Third World (in all matchups)? In LR threads right now, every loss seems to get chalked up to map imbalance faster than I can keep up with which races are favored. First Sparkle was a Zerg graveyard, then the center island got removed and now Terrans can't win a TvZ there to save their life. I thought Third World was supposed to be good for ZvP and that Shuttle was a visionary for finding a workable game plan, but it seems Larva doesn't think he can win a ZvP on the map. So where do things actually stand and what are the stats? More paradoxes: On the basis of their performance in YouTube matches, Jaedong is unstoppable in Sparkle ZvP and Effort always loses in the matchup. They're both good players, so what gives? Stork, too, is unstoppable in Sparkle PvZ. What if Jaedong and Stork face off on Sparkle? If someone doesn't persuade me otherwise, I might conclude that it all comes down to skill and preparation... which is crazy, right? Edit: Thank you, Miragee. That is informative. What does "tile" mean in the tables you posted? | ||
|
Miragee
8509 Posts
On April 30 2018 11:46 Djabanete wrote: Mini played beautifully! Congrats to him! Re: Larva saying he had no chance on the maps --- what's the current view for race balance on Sparkle and Third World (in all matchups)? In LR threads right now, every loss seems to get chalked up to map imbalance faster than I can keep up with which races are favored. First Sparkle was a Zerg graveyard, then the center island got removed and now Terrans can't win a TvZ there to save their life. I thought Third World was supposed to be good for ZvP and that Shuttle was a visionary for finding a workable game plan, but it seems Larva doesn't think he can win a ZvP on the map. So where do things actually stand and what are the stats? This was posted on the Mind vs Hero Thread: ![[image loading]](https://puu.sh/A9YWL/b2f7961a60.png) Looks like both Third World and Sparkle are about 60:40 in favour of protoss. Based on ELO the odds are more like 70:30 in favour of protoss. So yeah, zerg seems to have a hard time on those maps against protoss. //Addressing your last paragraph, I think it's far too early to talk about balance right now. With the current knowledge and strategy the above numbers are the odds for winning/losing. However, that doesn't take into account that the maps may play into the strength of certain player, which makes them defy all odds. The maps are also far from being figured out. There was so much strategy development on these maps and we are just at a level where that starts to slow down. For reference, even on standard maps new strategies, which completely overthrew the know balance of the map, were developed after months or even years. I don't actually know what tile means. Probably a miss-translation from Korean? I'm pretty sure the numbers in that category show the losses. | ||
|
LocoBolon
Argentina243 Posts
On today matches I'm just a little dissapointed, Mini looked very strong and I'm glad the better player advances, but you could tell by looking at Larva's face right from the start that he wasn't his best self, something was off. | ||
|
Starlightsun
United States1405 Posts
 | ||
2Pacalypse-
Croatia9504 Posts
Map (im)balance should be a last resort when discussing a certain game, as there are almost always other, bigger factors that lead to the outcome that it did. | ||
|
kogeT
Poland2037 Posts
My opinion is that maps were firstly good for zerg (both sparke and tranzistor), but now I would say they are really good for protoss. Gladiator being the most balanced out of 3 obviously (standard map), Sparke heavily favouring protoss in all matchups, and tranzistor being a very good P > T map, T > Z map and P = Z map with slight P adv. | ||
|
Barneyk
Sweden305 Posts
Larva got a bunch of lings into Minis main, Mini defended very very well. Kind of crazy how little he lost there. Larva got a big drop of in Minis main on Third World, Mini did a great job with countering and defending at the same time. Very impressive play. I felt like Mini was a step ahead and disrupting Larvas plans all the time while at the same time fending of Larvas attacks beautifully. Mini was on fire and Larva was put of balance, I thought it was a great series and Mini had great decision making without hesitation and played with confidence. It was great to see. Gonna miss Larva in the Ro4 but great games... | ||
|
Alpha-NP-
United States1242 Posts
| ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19237 Posts
| ||
|
Xeln4g4
Italy1209 Posts
| ||
|
mierin
United States4943 Posts
| ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On April 30 2018 00:10 usopsama wrote: Larva is so overrated. He had absolutely no answer to corsairs. Also, his unit control was mediocre. No I don't think he is overrated. Something wasn't right when he played the games. Watching the games, I was flabbergasted at how he played. It's like he didn't care or had no confidence or something. It was just extremely odd to me when a season back, he was taunting others and putting on these mini-ceremonies. Maybe part of it is that he's lost so much in practice or maybe he gave up internally when up against a player who's style is rough to deal with on these maps. Regardless, something was off with his game. Gladiator game is a prime example of that. He got rolled over and didn't even feel like he put up much of a fight. Sparkle game, I'll give to the toss and as for third world, all those pylon blocks must've been horrible, especially considering where his third was. Given, I don't blame the maps fully though I feel they did play a small role. Larva was just not himself. I kept thinking maybe he'll turn this around, nope. A dream ~ | ||
|
soujiro_
Uruguay5195 Posts
| ||
|
Malongo
Chile3472 Posts
| ||
|
Nematocyst
United States164 Posts
| ||
|
Magic Powers
Austria4095 Posts
I'm still unhappy about the map pool but it's impossible to reasonably point fingers with so little data. Mini probably deserved this victory. I don't like to admit it. But I really don't want to see another ASL like this. Such a mess. | ||
|
estuary
1 Post
User was warned for this post | ||
|
Nematocyst
United States164 Posts
On May 01 2018 11:55 estuary wrote: I am convinced Larva .... The truth will come out eventually. He's one of the top streamers, and you think he might put that at risk? Potential (permanent) streaming bans, public outcry leading to drop in viewership, sponsors, to say nothing of his many pro friends. "convinced" Seriously? Ok, whatver. | ||
|
Dante08
Singapore4128 Posts
On May 01 2018 00:14 Alpha-NP- wrote: Koget why do you think Sparkle favors P in PvT? I really think it favors Terran. But you are more gosu than me. Carriers | ||
|
TaardadAiel
Bulgaria750 Posts
On May 01 2018 11:55 estuary wrote: I am convinced Larva threw the match. We've seen this in the past. Money makes people do shitty things. The truth will come out eventually. User was warned for this post This is ridiculous. He is one of the most motivated players out there, one of the most followed streamers and his slump is fairly recent, maybe the last several weeks. I distinctly remember watching him beat Flash in a sponmatch something like 4:1 less than a month ago. He has absolutely no motivation to do things like these, even considering he has a small child to care for, he probably has some decent pay. And throwing such accusations - actually registering specifically for that - is very, very bad taste. | ||
|
LRM)VinCi
5 Posts
Youtube link for those who need | ||
|
Peeano
Netherlands4989 Posts
On May 01 2018 22:48 LRM)VinCi wrote: Youtube link for those who need It was posted on the first page of this thread and there is also the Small VOD Thread 2.0 for that. | ||
|
RxMidnight
United States251 Posts
| ||
| ||
Afreeca Starleague Season 5![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/2339.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/1102.jpg)
