EPTOn October 17 2017 23:30 yOngKIN wrote:
What if we get a herO vs.Flash finals and herO defeats Flash to win the championship
What if we get a herO vs.Flash finals and herO defeats Flash to win the championship
We won't.
[ASL4] Ro8 Soulkey vs hero - Page 7
| Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments |
EsportsJohn
United States4883 Posts
We won't. | ||
|
blade55555
United States17423 Posts
| ||
|
_Animus_
Bulgaria1064 Posts
Whats wrong with these youngsters really? Rain and Soulkey having such good play turn into suicide fest. Since when having an eco advantage means u have to desperately do damage to opponent who is getting more and more behind just as the timer is ticking anyway? He got way faster natural and gas in game five, he scouted with ling and knew perfectly that hero have the muta advantage and he just throw his place in the semis with easy hand. Now we have same old guys in the semi finals. If Finals are Hero vs Flash it will be one ugly stomp for Hero. I didnt see Hero being better than soulkey today, he had no better control and notable lack of multitasking compared to soulkey. Soulkey just throw just as Rain throw everything. After my big hope for dethroning flash is gone, dont think there is anything interesting to see after Bisu is out because Flash will toyplay with both Hero/Larva. | ||
TaardadAiel
Bulgaria750 Posts
On October 17 2017 23:54 _Animus_ wrote: The best zerg just suicided himself. Gratz Flash is the new champion. Whats wrong with these youngsters really? Rain and Soulkey having such good play turn into suicide fest. Since when having an eco advantage means u have to desperately do damage to opponent who is getting more and more behind just as the timer is ticking anyway? He got way faster natural and gas in game five, he scouted with ling and knew perfectly that hero have the muta advantage and he just throw his place in the semis with easy hand. Now we have the boring stuff, same old guys in the semi finals. If Finals are Hero vs Flash it will be one ugly stomp for Hero. I didnt see Hero being better than soulkey today, he had no better control and notable lack of multitasking compared to soulkey. Soulkey just throw just as Rain throw everything. After my big hope for dethroning flash is gone, dont think there is anything interesting to see after Bisu is out because Flash will toyplay with both Hero/Larva. Is larva one of those same old guys? I don't think you can safely say hero's going to beat him too. And when is Bisu going to be out? | ||
|
soldier8
Russian Federation60 Posts
On October 17 2017 23:30 yOngKIN wrote: What if we get a herO vs.Flash finals and herO defeats Flash to win the championship noooo way.. i hope he could win, but not now | ||
|
Dazed.
Canada3301 Posts
| ||
|
tanngard
Norway1325 Posts
On October 18 2017 01:21 Dazed. wrote: Never bought into soulkey. Played cheesy last season, his record on afreeca is good but only against weak players. Neither of them looked like they are in form to take down larva. Should be a pretty one sided semi final. Soulkey online matches since 1.8 vs Last 10:7 vs Mind 10:7 vs Flash 16:21 vs sSak 10:7 vs Light 6:4 vs Mini 13:1 vs Shuttle 8:5 vs Best 12: 9 vs Bisu 4:4 vs Snow 7:3 vs Rain 2:1 vs Sky 5:0 So where did you get the idea that he has only good record vs weak players? http://sponbbang.com/profile/?month1=2017-08&month2=2017-10&map_id=0&bj_id=17 | ||
|
ne4aJIb
Russian Federation3209 Posts
| ||
|
LucasWoJ
United States936 Posts
| ||
|
TaardadAiel
Bulgaria750 Posts
On October 18 2017 01:21 Dazed. wrote: Never bought into soulkey. Played cheesy last season, his record on afreeca is good but only against weak players. Neither of them looked like they are in form to take down larva. Should be a pretty one sided semi final. Are we talking about the same player? He's scary as hell in non-mirrors and ZvZ is way too intense for me to comprehend, but I don't think he's bad at it, either. And how is it exactly that he played cheesy last season? Ok, he pulled a 4pool in a bo5 vs FlaSh. This is more of a virtue than anything, though, the seemingly uncheesable flash. And he took him to five games, and the fifth one was a nailbiter. Top3 zerg atm, if you ask me. | ||
|
batsnacks
United States4466 Posts
On October 18 2017 00:10 TaardadAiel wrote: Is larva one of those same old guys? I don't think you can safely say hero's going to beat him too. And when is Bisu going to be out? bisu gonna lose to killer :O | ||
|
conTAgi0n
United States335 Posts
 Soulkey, what made you think that was a good time to attack with your mutalisks there in that last game? You had the slower spire, faster second hatch, and you knew hero skipped ling speed, so why pick a fight over his natural so early? And after playing so smart in the previous game too...Oh well.. in any case I do think Larva looks better in ZvZ than both hero and Soulkey right now, so he is my pick to make it to the finals. I would have rather watched him face off against Soulkey next round for sure, but c'est la vie. | ||
|
[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium7012 Posts
| ||
|
ppp87
Laos254 Posts
On October 18 2017 04:04 conTAgi0n wrote: Damnit Soulkey, what made you think that was a good time to attack with your mutalisks there in that last game? You had the slower spire, faster second hatch, and you knew hero skipped ling speed, so why pick a fight over his natural so early? And after playing so smart in the previous game too...Oh well.. in any case I do think Larva looks better in ZvZ than both hero and Soulkey right now, so he is my pick to make it to the finals. I would have rather watched him face off against Soulkey next round for sure, but c'est la vie.Seriously, that's an incomprehensible move from Soulkey, I just dont understand how it's possible to do it at pro lvl... can someone explain this move please. | ||
|
starkiller123
United States4030 Posts
| ||
|
conTAgi0n
United States335 Posts
On October 18 2017 04:10 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote: im amazed about u guys saying larva looking much better based in 2 games where he mass lings. I mean I hear what you're saying, in that we didn't see his ZvZ muta micro in that group, but you're still not giving Larva nearly enough credit. He didn't mass lings in either game or go for any kind of cheese; he outsmarted and outmicroed both of his opponents pretty handily, both of whom are themselves very strong ZvZers.In his game vs Shine, they both opened 9pool speed. Larva won multiple battles between equal ling counts, and consistently had his lings in better positions than Shine did. The fact that he smashed Shine so hard before mutas after identical openings and more or less equal ling production is impressive, especially since Shine's ling micro is not too shabby either.Against EffOrt, once again, both players went for identical 12 hatch openings*. Both players made about 2 control groups of zerglings before the first engagement. Larva straight up outsmarted EffOrt by building sunks at home and hiding half his lings out on the map for a backstab. Apparently believing that Larva was behind in lings, EffOrt sent all of his lings to attack. Larva not only managed to totally crush EffOrt with his backstab, but also lost practically no drones at home despite defending with only half his lings and a couple of sunks.I'll confess that I haven't been watching Larva's stream often enough or actively enough to know what his muta micro looks like in ZvZ. Unless there is some reason to believe his muta/scourge micro lags behind the rest of his game though, I don't see how you can watch those games and not think that Larva is looking really formidable in the matchup. Even if all he's got going for him is his decision-making and micro with lings, that might almost be enough if he can keep performing like that.* Technically, EffOrt went lair before ling speed and Larva went ling speed before lair, so the openings weren't exactly identical. Since ling speed was finished for both players before the first engage, EffOrt actually had a slight bo advantage at that point, since his muta/scourge would have started slightly sooner. | ||
|
Miragee
8700 Posts
| ||
|
L_Master
United States8017 Posts
On October 17 2017 23:54 _Animus_ wrote: The best zerg just suicided himself, Flash must be really happy because he just became the new champion. Whats wrong with these youngsters really? Rain and Soulkey having such good play turn into suicide fest. Since when having an eco advantage means u have to desperately do damage to opponent who is getting more and more behind just as the timer is ticking anyway? He got way faster natural and gas in game five, he scouted with ling and knew perfectly that hero have the muta advantage and he just throw his place in the semis with easy hand. Now we have same old guys in the semi finals. If Finals are Hero vs Flash it will be one ugly stomp for Hero. I didnt see Hero being better than soulkey today, he had no better control and notable lack of multitasking compared to soulkey. Soulkey just throw just as Rain throw everything. After my big hope for dethroning flash is gone, dont think there is anything interesting to see after Bisu is out because Flash will toyplay with both Hero/Larva. We already talked about this in the other thread too Animus, Rain didn't throw anything, he just got outplayed. Soulkey is one of the best late mech players around. But so is Larva. Acting like Flash is more likely to "toyplay" with Larva than he is with SK is absolutely ridiculous. Neither player has a good chance, Flash is Flash when it comes down to it, but Larva, SK, and EffOrt are head and shoulders the best ZvTers playing right now. Moreover acting like Larva's ZvT is even remotely related to herO's ZvT is ridiculous. herO is, and has always been, a decent ZvZer and at times a brilliant ZvPer. His ZvT has always been mediocre. On October 18 2017 01:21 Dazed. wrote: Never bought into soulkey. Played cheesy last season, his record on afreeca is good but only against weak players. Neither of them looked like they are in form to take down larva. Should be a pretty one sided semi final. SK has always been good. Not sure what there is to buy into. He was one of the strongest zergs at the end of BW era (close to 60% WR) and was clearly the best late mech player around in 11'/12', trends he has continued in till today. SK in ZvP or early/mid ZvT was never particularly impressive or brilliant, but better than average. As far as I can tell the same holds true now. His area of brilliance has always been in lategame ZvT, and in that area he separated himself from his peers, and is still clearly incredibly strong there. I don't think he is the second coming of JD, but he is a top tier zerg with particularly excellent late mech ZvT. | ||
|
[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium7012 Posts
| ||
|
[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium7012 Posts
On October 18 2017 05:21 conTAgi0n wrote: I mean I hear what you're saying, in that we didn't see his ZvZ muta micro in that group, but you're still not giving Larva nearly enough credit. He didn't mass lings in either game or go for any kind of cheese; he outsmarted and outmicroed both of his opponents pretty handily, both of whom are themselves very strong ZvZers.In his game vs Shine, they both opened 9pool speed. Larva won multiple battles between equal ling counts, and consistently had his lings in better positions than Shine did. The fact that he smashed Shine so hard before mutas after identical openings and more or less equal ling production is impressive, especially since Shine's ling micro is not too shabby either.Against EffOrt, once again, both players went for identical 12 hatch openings*. Both players made about 2 control groups of zerglings before the first engagement. Larva straight up outsmarted EffOrt by building sunks at home and hiding half his lings out on the map for a backstab. Apparently believing that Larva was behind in lings, EffOrt sent all of his lings to attack. Larva managed not only to totally crush EffOrt with his backstab, but lost practically no drones at home despite defending with only half his lings and a couple of sunks.I'll confess that I haven't been watching Larva's stream often enough or actively enough to know what his muta micro looks like in ZvZ. Unless there is some reason to believe his muta/scourge micro lags behind the rest of his game though, I don't see how you can watch those games and not think that Larva is looking really formidable in the matchup. Even if all he's got going for him is his decision-making and micro with lings, that might almost be enough if he can keep performing like that.* Technically, EffOrt went lair before ling speed and Larva went ling speed before lair, so the openings weren't exactly identical. Since ling speed was finished for both players before the first engage, EffOrt actually had a slight bo advantage at that point, since his muta/scourge would have started slightly sooner.larva played bo1 vs 2 different players in a two very specific situations, the first game was 9p vs 9p both made 6 lings,Larva hide his lings and counter attack,shine made 1 extra drone and loss 2 lings for free to that counter,this made him loss drones ,larva just made lings and defended well the attack at his main.Larva vs effort was mean to be more of the same,if effort didnt attack larva will attack him in some kind of all in attack,turns out effort decided to attack(i think overconfident,most of the games i see effort lossing is cuz he likes himself so much) 2 games 2 different players,good strat for a bo1 where it shows a player can make mass lings,didnt excell lings micro,he just had more.I was pretty sure hero will win vs soulkey,his zvz zvp are very very strong,he will win vs larva,larva zvz is weak. | ||
| ||
