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[SPL] Samsung KHAN vs KT Rolster - Page 85

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 83 84 85 86 Next
Nukid
Profile Joined April 2010
United States240 Posts
February 13 2012 05:58 GMT
#1681
On February 13 2012 11:37 WaterTower wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 10:48 Hinanawi wrote:
On February 13 2012 08:55 Zariel wrote:
The first push Flash sent out was traded very very efficiently by Flash. Although many tanks were lost, huge amounts of zealots and goons were also lost too. From my point of view, he used about 16 tanks and 12 vultures that wiped Stork's ground army. The push was designed to thin out his forces while he had the macro upper-hand, this then made Stork's line of defense very small across his 4-5 bases.

TBH, he never mined anything out of (5th) 3 o'clock expo, he only had 3-4 bases running at most.


In hindsight, only way I could see Stork winning was to give up his own natural straight away when Flash dropped 2 tanks there and go for Flash's base with what he had (Shuttle, 2 zeals, about 6 goons, reaver inc). Flash EMPTIED his base, he literally had no units (at most 2 tanks coming out, and delayed vulture upgrades).

I really don't know how anyone is gonna beat Flash. A player might have equal or better micro/macro than Flash, but it's his anticipation (and leaving a random unit at a key spot) that will outwit his opponent, almost like he's telling the opponent what build to use lol.


Sometimes Flash just suddenly loses to something like a bad early TvT engagement, if I had to put my guess on where his first loss will come from it would be from TvT.


Stork has better macro than Flash. He might have won if he had just keep army trading, and then gain the upper hand on economy. And having a food advantage isn't the whole story. Vultures cost 75 min and is 2 food while goons are 2 food and cost 125 min and 50 gas. (The record in terms of cost/food goes to devouver which is 2 food and 250 min/150 gas). Flash had a lot of vultures, while Stork's army was goon heavy. Thus, IMO, after the first push , they were even.

But Flash was just the better player and outplayed Stork.


I disagree with you. Stork doesn't have better macro than Flash as the game already pointed out. During the engagement, Flash continue to macro while microing his troops. Stork was too busy with the shuttle micro, he didn't macro and thus he's behind on supply.
Caladbolg
Profile Joined March 2011
2855 Posts
February 13 2012 07:21 GMT
#1682
Stork was never ahead. I don't get why people see otherwise? Maybe because it's Lightwip (and hence, it's fun to disagree with him?)
"I don't like the word prodigy at all. To me prodigy sounds like a person who was 'gifted' all these things rather than a person who earned all these talents by hard training... I must train harder to reach my goal." - Flash
Iplaythings
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Denmark9110 Posts
February 13 2012 08:34 GMT
#1683
On February 12 2012 10:49 Xiphos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 12 2012 10:06 Kipsate wrote:
On February 12 2012 10:05 Xiphos wrote:
On February 12 2012 09:59 pylonsalad wrote:
Stork was always disadvantaged from the moment Flash went 14CC without being punished and then really disadvantaged after the cliffing. However, after successfully breaking the first push, he put himself in a position to get back into the game. He was still behind but the game wasn't over. The game was effectively over when he started carrier tech instead of playing a ground attrition game.


Well...it was Barrack FE but I'm in completely harmony with the bold part.

It wasn't, it was a 14cc.


U srs? Wow, I thought it was a regular Barrack Expand. Stork's luck man....

Stork neglected to probe scout to be greedy, I'd say he had it coming
In the woods, there lurks..
okum
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
France5779 Posts
February 13 2012 08:34 GMT
#1684
On February 13 2012 12:41 VGhost wrote:
Also wtf nobody has better macro than Flash except maybe BeSt on a good day.

I don't know, man. I once saw Jaedong summon an entire army out of his main base in five seconds.
Flash fan before it was cool | Coiner of "jangbang"
pellejohnson
Profile Joined January 2012
United States1931 Posts
February 13 2012 08:38 GMT
#1685
On February 13 2012 11:37 WaterTower wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 10:48 Hinanawi wrote:
On February 13 2012 08:55 Zariel wrote:
The first push Flash sent out was traded very very efficiently by Flash. Although many tanks were lost, huge amounts of zealots and goons were also lost too. From my point of view, he used about 16 tanks and 12 vultures that wiped Stork's ground army. The push was designed to thin out his forces while he had the macro upper-hand, this then made Stork's line of defense very small across his 4-5 bases.

TBH, he never mined anything out of (5th) 3 o'clock expo, he only had 3-4 bases running at most.


In hindsight, only way I could see Stork winning was to give up his own natural straight away when Flash dropped 2 tanks there and go for Flash's base with what he had (Shuttle, 2 zeals, about 6 goons, reaver inc). Flash EMPTIED his base, he literally had no units (at most 2 tanks coming out, and delayed vulture upgrades).

I really don't know how anyone is gonna beat Flash. A player might have equal or better micro/macro than Flash, but it's his anticipation (and leaving a random unit at a key spot) that will outwit his opponent, almost like he's telling the opponent what build to use lol.


Sometimes Flash just suddenly loses to something like a bad early TvT engagement, if I had to put my guess on where his first loss will come from it would be from TvT.


Stork has better macro than Flash. He might have won if he had just keep army trading, and then gain the upper hand on economy. And having a food advantage isn't the whole story. Vultures cost 75 min and is 2 food while goons are 2 food and cost 125 min and 50 gas. (The record in terms of cost/food goes to devouver which is 2 food and 250 min/150 gas). Flash had a lot of vultures, while Stork's army was goon heavy. Thus, IMO, after the first push , they were even.

But Flash was just the better player and outplayed Stork.


To be honest when the terran has more supply than the protoss the protoss is in big trouble even if the terran has a lot of vultures in the mix. I didn't get to watch the game so I don't know if flash was 90% vults 10% tank but in general the toss should be at least 20-25 supply ahead at almost all times
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
February 13 2012 08:55 GMT
#1686
On February 13 2012 17:34 okum wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 12:41 VGhost wrote:
Also wtf nobody has better macro than Flash except maybe BeSt on a good day.

I don't know, man. I once saw Jaedong summon an entire army out of his main base in five seconds.

This is the best post I've seen in days.
Liquipedia
Caladbolg
Profile Joined March 2011
2855 Posts
February 13 2012 09:37 GMT
#1687
On February 13 2012 17:55 Elyvilon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 17:34 okum wrote:
On February 13 2012 12:41 VGhost wrote:
Also wtf nobody has better macro than Flash except maybe BeSt on a good day.

I don't know, man. I once saw Jaedong summon an entire army out of his main base in five seconds.

This is the best post I've seen in days.


OMFG that's amazing hahaha!

But yeah nobody has better macro than Flash. Please.
"I don't like the word prodigy at all. To me prodigy sounds like a person who was 'gifted' all these things rather than a person who earned all these talents by hard training... I must train harder to reach my goal." - Flash
TrainSamurai
Profile Joined November 2010
339 Posts
February 13 2012 10:03 GMT
#1688
On February 13 2012 18:37 Caladbolg wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 17:55 Elyvilon wrote:
On February 13 2012 17:34 okum wrote:
On February 13 2012 12:41 VGhost wrote:
Also wtf nobody has better macro than Flash except maybe BeSt on a good day.

I don't know, man. I once saw Jaedong summon an entire army out of his main base in five seconds.

This is the best post I've seen in days.


OMFG that's amazing hahaha!

But yeah nobody has better macro than Flash. Please.


I dunno about that! I get the feeling that JvF late game seems to favour Jaedong.
LoL is the greatest thing to happen to ESPORS. LoL is the KING of ESPORTS
Caladbolg
Profile Joined March 2011
2855 Posts
February 13 2012 10:20 GMT
#1689
Lategame is actually decided less by macro, and more by management and great decisions. Midgame is where macro players truly shine. That's how oov gained his rep.
"I don't like the word prodigy at all. To me prodigy sounds like a person who was 'gifted' all these things rather than a person who earned all these talents by hard training... I must train harder to reach my goal." - Flash
Baddieko
Profile Joined October 2008
Singapore855 Posts
February 13 2012 10:23 GMT
#1690
He is always better off playing zeal/goon against Flash since Stork has this uncanny ability to break push with same supply or less.
Hesmyrr
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Canada5776 Posts
February 13 2012 13:58 GMT
#1691
On February 13 2012 17:34 okum wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 12:41 VGhost wrote:
Also wtf nobody has better macro than Flash except maybe BeSt on a good day.

I don't know, man. I once saw Jaedong summon an entire army out of his main base in five seconds.

LOL.
"If watching the MSL finals makes you a progamer, then anyone in Korea can do it." - Ha Tae Ki
Kznn
Profile Joined March 2011
Brazil9072 Posts
February 13 2012 15:17 GMT
#1692
On February 13 2012 17:34 okum wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 13 2012 12:41 VGhost wrote:
Also wtf nobody has better macro than Flash except maybe BeSt on a good day.

I don't know, man. I once saw Jaedong summon an entire army out of his main base in five seconds.



ROFL
Zariel
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Australia1312 Posts
February 13 2012 22:47 GMT
#1693
Yeah, JD summoned an army. With the help of 4 troll drones to get him there. The part of that game I laughed was not JD's face, but Flying's face with the words 'WTF!" imprinted on him and his eyes O_O.
sup
OniGami
Profile Joined December 2011
Japan140 Posts
February 13 2012 23:29 GMT
#1694
Stork could really have won that match vs. Flash.
In the rematch then
物の哀れ
beachbeachy
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States509 Posts
February 13 2012 23:49 GMT
#1695
It says KT vs Samsung is scheduled later today. Am I reading the event calendar correctly?
Dream no small dreams for they have no power to move the hearts of men. - Goethe
pSikh0
Profile Joined January 2009
163 Posts
February 13 2012 23:51 GMT
#1696
On February 14 2012 08:49 beachbeachy wrote:
It says KT vs Samsung is scheduled later today. Am I reading the event calendar correctly?

Yes you are
beachbeachy
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States509 Posts
February 13 2012 23:53 GMT
#1697
Cool. When was the last time two teams played each other two times in a row like this?
Dream no small dreams for they have no power to move the hearts of men. - Goethe
Taekwon
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8155 Posts
February 14 2012 00:05 GMT
#1698
On February 14 2012 08:53 beachbeachy wrote:
Cool. When was the last time two teams played each other two times in a row like this?


T1 vs Entus
▲ ▲ ▲
hp.Shell
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2527 Posts
February 14 2012 00:31 GMT
#1699
Just for clarity, this is KHAN vs KT, and the new thread will be KT vs KHAN.
Please PM me with any songs you like that you think I haven't heard before!
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
February 14 2012 01:16 GMT
#1700
On February 14 2012 09:31 hp.Shell wrote:
Just for clarity, this is KHAN vs KT, and the new thread will be KT vs KHAN.


Are making the new one?
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
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