Nice banner ! Woongjin got a painting like G-Chizzle would put on his ghetto walls, and KT got a Rol(ler Cos)ster. Woongjin has been doing great recently, but Flash will get a win, and probably Stats too. One of KT's awful zergs can probably take a 3rd game, or even wooki if he gets to play Light. Will definitely be interesting.
some z to snipe Free on outlier and should be fine! KT should win 3:1 or 3:2 if they leave Stats or Flash for ace Hoejja<Light Action>Free Flash> whoever he gets xD lets say Shy Mind<SK Stats>Zero
Funny, before the CJ game I was laughing in uproar every time someone suggested KT might win a single game. Now I look at the lineups and serious consider liquibetting them. Decisions decisions...
Stats' match-up will be decisive in this series me thinks. Zero can beat him, Soulkey and Free isn't that bad either. Sacc-ing someone weak to Flash and sweeping the rest of the series would probably be Woongjin's best bet, but KT probably won't want that.
Stats' match-up will be decisive in this series me thinks. Zero can beat him, Soulkey and Free isn't that bad either. Sacc-ing someone weak to Flash and sweeping the rest of the series would probably be Woongjin's best bet, but KT probably won't want that.
Statistically, zero's win record is 1-5 vs Stats. Seeing how Stats handled Effort, I'm even more confident to say "Zero can beat [stats]", this statement is not that valid, but who knows. I still hope to see Flash vs Zero (who doesn't ).
would love to see flash vs shy... shy has been playing some incredible games lately and has shown his micro/macro to be grade A. Matching up against Flash would be the test of nerves
Some potential for some really great games! I think an exciting and preferable arrangement would look a little like: Soulkey > Barracks Free < Hoejja Zero > Stats Shy < Flash Light > Action
I'm in the studio standing at the back by the Christmas tree. I will try to post who's playing when I see them go up so you guys have something to talk about during the commercials :p
On December 24 2011 11:38 Sayle wrote: I'm in the studio standing at the back by the Christmas tree. I will try to post who's playing when I see them go up so you guys have something to talk about during the commercials :p
The only simple one to predict is the second set. free's the only Star who's played on Outlier. Stats plays most of KT's games there. Neither one is enough of a PvP sniper, or bad enough at PvP, to make either team change. The other map that's fairly easy to predict is Jade: sHy has played all of Woongjin's games, and Action has two games to Flash's one and Stats' one. The last map is Ground Zero and will probably be saved for Soulkey who's played there most often. Then it's a matter of filling in ZerO and Light on the other two maps: for KT it's a little harder. I'm going to guess:
On December 24 2011 11:54 VGhost wrote: Lineup predictions:
The only simple one to predict is the second set. free's the only Star who's played on Outlier. Stats plays most of KT's games there. Neither one is enough of a PvP sniper, or bad enough at PvP, to make either team change. The other map that's fairly easy to predict is Jade: sHy has played all of Woongjin's games, and Action has two games to Flash's one and Stats' one. The last map is Ground Zero and will probably be saved for Soulkey who's played there most often. Then it's a matter of filling in ZerO and Light on the other two maps: for KT it's a little harder. I'm going to guess:
i think what happened is hoejja lost too many lings trying to pressure zero's nat and then zero counterattacked and hoejja had to cut a lot of drones to defend and zero then put scourge above the hatcheries and it was gg
On December 24 2011 12:23 Sawamura wrote: what's happening T_T , no LR ?
Kind of passively watching it, but Zero went on the counterattack as he had more zerglings than his opponent, and overwhelmed Hoejja. Zero also had a ton of scourge along the way and (I think) killed all of Hoejja's overlords and then camped over his hatcheries to kill the incoming mutas. Zero then followed up with mutas of his own and killed all of the rest of the drones that were left while defending a few pandering zerglings.
On December 24 2011 12:27 PineappleLumpsToss wrote: I don't think I've seen that many Scourge hanging out like that waiting to suicide into new Muta's.
I appreciate any novelty in ZvZ.
yeah that was quite a lot of scourge over the eggs, it's been a while since I've seen that many
Obviously winning would have been better, but sacrificing Hoejja to Zero isn't too bad of a result for KT. I have confidence in Stats to beat anyone else on Stars so combine that with Flash auto-win and KT only needs to pull out 1 more win out of Santa's bag.
How long have they been doing the player interviews while watching the replays? I know I've missed the odd match this season, but I hadn't noticed them doing that before.
On December 24 2011 12:33 PineappleLumpsToss wrote: How long have they been doing the player interviews while watching the replays? I know I've missed the odd match this season, but I hadn't noticed them doing this before.
Might have started last week(ish), they also have their own intro songs now, CJ tweeted people for suggestions
On December 24 2011 12:33 PineappleLumpsToss wrote: How long have they been doing the player interviews while watching the replays? I know I've missed the odd match this season, but I hadn't noticed them doing this before.
Might have started last week(ish), they also have their own intro songs now, CJ tweeted people for suggestions
Both good ideas I reckon. The interviews are an opportunity to get some insight how the players think, and maybe get a glimpse of their personalities.
I was wondering why people were talking about intro music all the time. Makes sense now
people eating popcorn from ogn kfc-lookalike buckets
meanwhile Free is getting his forge first, his probe has arrived at perfective's base, in time to hinder that drone from planting a hatchery at the natural, pylon goes down to block the drone
perfective getting his has, free cancelling that pylon
pair of lings are made, they're hot on the probe's tail.
perfective getting his hatchery at 8 instead. probe trying to stop the drone from placing the hatchery at the natural once more but this time the drone is successful
Perfective moving onto Lair probe still running around inside the main
core warped in, overlord spots it as it slowly moves away from free's main
fthere's a lone zealot moving about, but it looks like it's headed home stargate warping in at the natural, adun in the main probe finally dies to a bunch of lings
sairs and mutas are out now. i don't see a den, but evo chamber is up and a lot of sunkens. i think we might be seeing guards or ultras or some nonsense like that
7th hatchery for perfective Free trying to get a 3rd up, just south of the center. ahhh free's sairs are under attack, sairs run home, storm casted to kill some scourge.
perfective able to take out a few more sairs with scourge, free still has decent numbers though
perfective getting his 8th and 9th hatchery now he's also starting to pump out hydras
storms and sair wreck the muta army, they're all dead
hydras moving into the 3rd, storms casted, damaging the hydras, zealots move in but perfective is microing them to reduce the damage, he's also dodging storms, Free's forces arrive forcing the hydras to retreat
roo loses a whole lot of hydras attacking the 3rd and doesn't make much progress. probably should have waited imho. supply is around 130 to 110 in free's favor. hydras approaching the nat now
free is making a 4th, sairs kill an overlord, massive hydraling assault on free's 3rd, zealot drop on roo's 4th, roo loses a few drones, free repels his attack again. right now i feel like this was a good concept from roo but he's failing to execute. now he's moving to assault the 3rd again
hydras taking out around nine cannons at free's 4th now and they all go down somehow, and the 4th is going down. this is more like it from roo. free needs to send people around because roo is going RIGHT AROUND INTO THE MAIN
Hydras are inside the main now, zealots arriving with HT, storms casted, a few hydras explode.
Lurkers are added into perfective's unit mix. sairs spot the zerg army, storms casted once more, some good storms from free. perfective stopping another expo attempt
the templar archives almost goes down but free reacts in time bringing a lot of units back to the main. supply around 165 to 125 now. roo looks in better shape, lurker tech out now. free building a new 4th near midmap but it's denied by hydras. now roo walks right up to free's nat and throws some lurker/hydra in there, but is promptly evacuated. supply 150 to 130 now
hydras and lurkers headed towards free's natural, lurkers burrow close to the cannons, zealots arrive, a single ht storms the ramp. Free holding the attack at the natural
free trying to retake his 4th expo at 6 o'clock, hydras spots it.
Free losing all but one of his sairs trying to take down an overlord.
Free forced to cancel his 4th as hydras move through the area. storms casted, there's a lot of zerg units though
lurkers burrow as the protoss army approaches, storms kill the lurkers. still a large number of hydras, they move into free's main, where free is trying to get up cannons, templar archive under attack
Free going for an attack of his own at perfective's natural!
hydras going back into free's main. this time the templar archives WILL go down. free attacking into roo's 3rd. massive storms kill a lot of hydra but roo is surrounding the attacking forces and they will go down
Roo was making awful trades the entire game. The difference was he had an economy that dwarfed frees and he made sure to never let free take an easy fourth. It's okay to make awful trades when you can recover from it and your opponent can't. Gonna nickname him Pyrrhus.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
by his 3rd being denied, then losing his 4th, then his other 4th being denied, plus the backstabs
So all-in-all, he was macroed to death.
i'm not great at sc but that was my interpretation yeah. the storms were great but that was almost all free had and he failed to ever do any real damage to roo's economy. roo threw units away but every time he did it he delayed free just a little bit and a few times he managed to actually destroy tech buildings, deny expansions, and crucially he destroyed that 4th yeah.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
Or if he didnt engage and got his ass stormed and actually spread his lurkers
Roo played well in the early-midgame. I guess he made the strategy work later on, but that was more because of free's fail. Why did he mine out the backdoor minerals just as roo had finished razing his 4th?! Just avoid getting backstabbed, please!
Anyway, I look forward to roo's interview if KT wins after hearing Stats' last one, LOL
roo certainly didnt make the best trades. but his backstab diverted free's attention
The 4th is never going to be easy to defend but free took it. taking it simply opens the path for a backstab. roo might not do it if free's 4th isnt there.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
Or if he didnt engage and got his ass stormed and actually spread his lurkers
didn't matter in the end, just too many hydras.
positioning and proper engagement is the last thing I'll ask from a rookie.
turning point was when free dropped ht's into roo's 3rd and did almost no dmg and right after roo attacked free's 4th before the 8 cannons could finish warping in. if free had saved that ht drop to defend his 4th instead then he might have held the 4th and win the game
On December 24 2011 13:02 lFrost wrote: turning point was when free dropped ht's into roo's 3rd and did almost no dmg and right after roo attacked free's 4th before the 8 cannons could finish warping in. if free had saved that ht drop to defend his 4th instead then he might have held the 4th and win the game
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
Or if he didnt engage and got his ass stormed and actually spread his lurkers
didn't matter in the end, just too many hydras.
positioning and proper engagement is the last thing I'll ask from a rookie.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
Or if he didnt engage and got his ass stormed and actually spread his lurkers
didn't matter in the end, just too many hydras.
positioning and proper engagement is the last thing I'll ask from a rookie.
On December 24 2011 13:00 Elyvilon wrote: I just realized roo is using the music stork should be using :notactuallymad:
wtf you talking about. Stork's song rocks! I really like it actually!
A couple years back Stork was reading/watching a bunch of One Piece, and in a couple interviews was basically saying, "man, I could practice, but I have all this One Piece to catch up on." It was a joke based on that.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
No mana on HTs from the storm drop that only kills 4 drones.
He could have saved 4th just fine if not for that.
The 4th would have died even if he saved those storms for defence, which he should have done. What cost Free the game was his absolutely horrendous sair usage. He had critical mass to fight muta/scourge much earlier than he did. Not doing any damage with his sairs was the deciding factor. Roo got huge because of that.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
Or if he didnt engage and got his ass stormed and actually spread his lurkers
didn't matter in the end, just too many hydras.
positioning and proper engagement is the last thing I'll ask from a rookie.
How is roo a Rookie?
he doesn't have experience.
That's not a rookie. A rookie is someone who is starting in their first year, and roo obviously played last season.
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
No mana on HTs from the storm drop that only kills 4 drones.
He could have saved 4th just fine if not for that.
The 4th would have died even if he saved those storms for defence, which he should have done. What cost Free the game was his absolutely horrendous sair usage. He had critical mass to fight muta/scourge much earlier than he did. Not doing any damage with his sairs was the deciding factor. Roo got huge because of that.
i agree with this too - it seemed like free was being RIDICULOUSLY passive with the sairs even though roo was muta-heavy and low on scourge
On December 24 2011 12:58 kuroshiroi wrote: How the fuck did free lose that game? By losing his fourth?
well roo abused the fact that he can make millions of units from his so man hatcheries to spread free's army as thin by backdooring into free's main,eventually thats what happened.
roo would have had the game much earlier if he got defilers.
Or if he didnt engage and got his ass stormed and actually spread his lurkers
didn't matter in the end, just too many hydras.
positioning and proper engagement is the last thing I'll ask from a rookie.
How is roo a Rookie?
he doesn't have experience.
That's not a rookie. A rookie is someone who is starting in their first year, and roo obviously played last season.
On December 24 2011 13:04 bearbuddy wrote: So we have shy, light, and SK against flash, mind, and stats.
Not liking our chances. At all.
What??
SK's ZvT can be the best in the world. Light can win against Mind or Flash, can definitely win against Action. Shy can win against anyone.. IMO he's the wildcard and the up-and-coming monster. When I look at Shy's face I see the devil playing. He's a diabolical puppeteer. He enjoys to watch his opponents struggle instead of trying to "just" win
On December 24 2011 13:04 bearbuddy wrote: So we have shy, light, and SK against flash, mind, and stats.
Not liking our chances. At all.
What??
SK's ZvT can be the best in the world. Light can win against Mind or Flash, can definitely win against Action. Shy can win against anyone.. IMO he's the wildcard and the up-and-coming monster. When I look at Shy's face I see the devil playing. He's a diabolical puppeteer. He enjoys to watch his opponents struggle instead of trying to "just" win
stats on the attack with 3 goons, he manages to take out one of shy's cannons before it finishes, shy's units arrive, zealots and goons, he manages to fight off stat's goons, probes are pulled! more of stats goons arriving, he has range advantage
cannon warps in but it dies shortly, probes attacking once more along with 1 goon, shy managing to fight off the attack
shy moving his shuttle into stat's main! probes start running! shuttle follows! HT dropped, gets a decent amount of probes another storm drop at the natural, nabs more probes. Shuttle goes down
stats looks like he has the large army shy looking to get his 3rd up at 12.5
stats getting his 4th now, widening the gap even further, shy just getting his 3rd now
stats very close to shy's 3rd, shy moving his units into position to defend against it
stats engages! zealots punching each other
DA feedbacked! so are some HT storms casted everywhere! wow! shy's numbers are going down though! more storms on the goons, shy's in trouble! stats backing off though!
insane storm/feedback battle but stats comes out ahead, with basically equal dragoon numbers plus archons remaining. not sure why he's not going in for the kill at all
armies almost engaging once more, but stats retreats to find a better position.
ahhhh massive engagement, more storms are thrown! shys moving his army back, more storms and the numbers from both sides are low! shy pulling out ahead though! stats is forced to retreat his forces, he's losing almost everything retreating!
stats putting a zealot at potential expos to hinder shy
armies now moving NW! feedback on HT! storms covering all the zealots, looks like stats is overpoweing shy, shy's army is in a bad position! stats takes advantage and moves ahead with the attack! shy's 4th is now exposed and undefended!
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
But if Light or SoulKey do beat Flash (which is possible), the other one's a heavy favorite over anyone KT has less unless MAYBE Light runs into Wooki.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
On December 24 2011 13:36 Kipsate wrote: I expect KT to send out a rookie/someone to give some playing time, since Flash is pretty much autowin anyway.
On December 24 2011 13:36 Kipsate wrote: I expect KT to send out a rookie/someone to give some playing time, since Flash is pretty much autowin anyway.
On December 24 2011 13:36 Kipsate wrote: I expect KT to send out a rookie/someone to give some playing time, since Flash is pretty much autowin anyway.
I'm expecting wooki
I would like this
No thanks, I just traded him because KT never plays him.
On December 24 2011 13:36 Kipsate wrote: I expect KT to send out a rookie/someone to give some playing time, since Flash is pretty much autowin anyway.
I'm expecting wooki
I would like this
I wouldn't, we all wanna watch Flash vs Soulkey, it would be very sad to see the match ending without having seen neither of them play.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
On December 24 2011 13:36 Kipsate wrote: I expect KT to send out a rookie/someone to give some playing time, since Flash is pretty much autowin anyway.
I'm expecting wooki
I would like this
I wouldn't, we all wanna watch Flash vs Soulkey, it would be very sad to see the match ending without having seen neither of them play.
Agreed, I love watching Flash play when he's not playing SKT
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win.
Being 50:50 vs flash in the last few years just means he's due for a loss
Yah, you're not supposed to be 50:50 against flash, if it seems like it's coming secret societies will do everything in their power to suddenly shift the favor towards flash. Their toughest time was with Jaedong in the 3 finals the other time.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
well, he has Mind now
also he's Flash
but uhhh yeah Light is one of the few T's who actually has a reasonable (>25%) chance of beating Flash lawl
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
I'd have to guess some pretty high-classed practice partners.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
He practices with BaBy and Fantasy a fair bit I believe.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
Hmm. Both the coaches were basically like "fuck it man" from the looks of it. Wooki would have been a much better choice than Flash, and SK would arguably have been better than Light. Oh well.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
It's Flash. It doesn't matter who his practice partners are.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
All these games were played when he was still on MBC. Which high level Terran does he have to practice with on Woongjin?
Which high level T does Flash practice against? Barracks?
He practices with BaBy and Fantasy a fair bit I believe.
Exactly my point. Light can look outside of Stars for practice just as easily as Flash can.
Merry Christmas <3 Even though its still the 23rd here Lets go, I honestly want to see Light beat Flash, just cause Light- blue terran;; YELLOW TERRAN 1 oclock God- teal terran;;; RED TERRAN 5 oclock
On December 24 2011 13:47 shucklesors wrote: Man flash being greedy as hell, even canceled the second marine after he has just 1 marine and 1 bunker at his nat, going for CC straight I think
Fact complete for both players now Flash gets the scout in, and starts his nat CC 2 starport from Light as a followup Machine shop for Flash, and second fact
On December 24 2011 13:47 shucklesors wrote: Man flash being greedy as hell, even canceled the second marine after he has just 1 marine and 1 bunker at his nat, going for CC straight I think
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
Light is good and consistent player, there is no doubt about that. The problem is, Flash is at a level FAR, FAR, FAR above Light's.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
Light is good and consistent player, there is no doubt about that. The problem is, Flash is at a level FAR, FAR, FAR above Light's.
And yet Light has won 2 out of their last 5 games? Far, far, far above is ridiculous hyperbole. He's better but not massively so.
Armory from Flash First wraith is out for Light 34/37 Light-Flash 4 vutlures of Flash, microing down Light's ground army Vultures force a depot wall at the bottom of the ramp 3 wraiths pew pew pewing away at the scv makign the armory Turrets going up now CC to finish the wall again Tank is out for Light!
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
Light is good and consistent player, there is no doubt about that. The problem is, Flash is at a level FAR, FAR, FAR above Light's.
And yet Light has won 2 out of their last 5 games? Far, far, far above is ridiculous hyperbole. He's better but not massively so.
Don't worry. Regardless of what you say, Flash will roll over Light in this game.
Wraiths cloak, but theres a turret at the nat! Flash's vultures pull back, NO more vultures reinforce, 8 total Against 2 tanks of Light Armory finally goes up from Flash Vultres tanking their way through the tanks Spider mines are done Two vultures left unchecked in the main GG from Light 3-1 KT
On December 24 2011 13:48 TwoToneTerran wrote: Flash must get jokingly called a hacker more than any player in history. Seems almost impossible after Savior, but here you go.
He's been unjokingly called an ear hacker by Light's old coach in a game versus Light
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
Light is good and consistent player, there is no doubt about that. The problem is, Flash is at a level FAR, FAR, FAR above Light's.
And yet Light has won 2 out of their last 5 games? Far, far, far above is ridiculous hyperbole. He's better but not massively so.
Don't worry. Regardless of what you say, Flash will roll over Light in this game.
A scouted proxy rax that does no damage is no indicator of overall skill.
Flash reacted brilliantly to everything Light tried to pull though.
for everyone who's talking up light, i don't think anybody denies that light has always been excellent, and in fact right now is in pretty great form as a top-5 terran, and has been for a while. that said, nobody is on flash's level, and nobody has been for the past three or four years, and attempts to compare people to him always end in failure.
On December 24 2011 13:56 o[twist] wrote: for everyone who's talking up light, i don't think anybody denies that light has always been excellent, and in fact right now is in pretty great form as a top-5 terran, and has been for a while. that said, nobody is on flash's level, and nobody has been for the past three or four years, and attempts to compare people to him always end in failure.
I'll agree with that. Light's always been a dominating PL presence.
An uneventful final game... Light should've just played straight up. I really don't like cheese strategies when you have your teams life on the line. gg
On December 24 2011 13:56 o[twist] wrote: for everyone who's talking up light, i don't think anybody denies that light has always been excellent, and in fact right now is in pretty great form as a top-5 terran, and has been for a while. that said, nobody is on flash's level, and nobody has been for the past three or four years, and attempts to compare people to him always end in failure.
On December 24 2011 13:32 poisui wrote: Stats has a 50 food advantage. Looks like it will be 3:1 for KT.
Not over till it's over. Light + SK can definitely beat Flash + whoever.
Lolwut.
Flash (aka God) > Light + SK.
Light never gets any credit: their recent record is pretty even and Light is due for a win. SK might win too but it's less likely but not a forgone conclusion.
Light is good and consistent player, there is no doubt about that. The problem is, Flash is at a level FAR, FAR, FAR above Light's.
And yet Light has won 2 out of their last 5 games? Far, far, far above is ridiculous hyperbole. He's better but not massively so.
Don't worry. Regardless of what you say, Flash will roll over Light in this game.
A scouted proxy rax that does no damage is no indicator of overall skill.
Flash reacted brilliantly to everything Light tried to pull though.
On December 24 2011 13:56 o[twist] wrote: for everyone who's talking up light, i don't think anybody denies that light has always been excellent, and in fact right now is in pretty great form as a top-5 terran, and has been for a while. that said, nobody is on flash's level, and nobody has been for the past three or four years, and attempts to compare people to him always end in failure.
On December 24 2011 13:56 o[twist] wrote: for everyone who's talking up light, i don't think anybody denies that light has always been excellent, and in fact right now is in pretty great form as a top-5 terran, and has been for a while. that said, nobody is on flash's level, and nobody has been for the past three or four years, and attempts to compare people to him always end in failure.
Past 4 years =P?
i meant no terran, apologies
I know, I'm just teasing. Hard to believe it's been that long though
On December 24 2011 13:56 o[twist] wrote: for everyone who's talking up light, i don't think anybody denies that light has always been excellent, and in fact right now is in pretty great form as a top-5 terran, and has been for a while. that said, nobody is on flash's level, and nobody has been for the past three or four years, and attempts to compare people to him always end in failure.
Past 4 years =P?
i meant no terran, apologies
I know, I'm just teasing. Hard to believe it's been that long though
seriously, i feel old as shit watching starcraft these days. and it's amazing that basically the same guys have been dominating the scene since i started in early 2008
Let's just stop here, yes? Disagreements on a video game board don't end up anywhere.
Don't be silly. He won because he was put in a good enough position with enough skill to pull out a win. Not because of some sort of extra drive to get some milestone or other.
Let's just stop here, yes? Disagreements on a video game board don't end up anywhere.
Don't be silly. He won because he was put in a good enough position with enough skill to pull out a win. Not because of some sort of extra drive to get some milestone or other.
You're right. In this completely rational world of ours, intangible metrics hold no value whatsoever. Not even being sarcastic. That's a valid way to view the world.
Let's just stop here, yes? Disagreements on a video game board don't end up anywhere.
Don't be silly. He won because he was put in a good enough position with enough skill to pull out a win. Not because of some sort of extra drive to get some milestone or other.
You're right. In this completely rational world of ours, intangible metrics hold no value whatsoever. Not even being sarcastic. That's a valid way to view the world.
I dunno man, beating someone worse than you really takes some serious strength of will, especially in a game where you're put into a good position.
Let's just stop here, yes? Disagreements on a video game board don't end up anywhere.
Don't be silly. He won because he was put in a good enough position with enough skill to pull out a win. Not because of some sort of extra drive to get some milestone or other.
You're right. In this completely rational world of ours, intangible metrics hold no value whatsoever. Not even being sarcastic. That's a valid way to view the world.
I dunno man, beating someone worse than you really takes some serious strength of will, especially in a game where you're put into a good position.
I wasn't kidding when I said I was not being sarcastic. Flash is the better player. Light realized this, knowing that as the game progressed his chances of winning would slim down, so he tried to pull cheese on him. It was spotted and countered with ease and the rest of the game was bleak for him.
Let's just stop here, yes? Disagreements on a video game board don't end up anywhere.
Don't be silly. He won because he was put in a good enough position with enough skill to pull out a win. Not because of some sort of extra drive to get some milestone or other.
You're right. In this completely rational world of ours, intangible metrics hold no value whatsoever. Not even being sarcastic. That's a valid way to view the world.
I dunno man, beating someone worse than you really takes some serious strength of will, especially in a game where you're put into a good position.
Beating any great SC player takes some strength of will. Practice is hard, man.
If beating an inferior player is never impressive, then I guess Flash can't impress anymore.
Really happy to see KT pulling it out. It was getting ridiculous how many people, even our own supposed 'fans', were writing off KT after 3 2-3 losses (match against SKT would have been 2-3 if Coach Lee had played Flash so it's basically the same thing). I know most people outside the KT fanbase don't think particularly highly of Stats but in my mind he's the best non-dragon protoss and one of the top 5 protoss overall. Between him and auto-win Flash, KT will always be a contender against any team.
On December 24 2011 13:54 VGhost wrote: Woulda worked a lot better without the audience give-away, sound-proofing seriously not good.
I'm complaining, but I guess everybody has to deal with it so eh.
Yea, I mean FlaSh is FlaSh. He does do stuff like that pretty frequently. However in this game you see his SCV heading up normal, the crowd and commentators go "AAAHH" and within a half second of that he turns around.
If it wasn't sound giveaway it looked incredibly like it.
Actually if you watch the vod you can see that flash wasnt directly going to scout towards 1 but with his scouting scv going towards the right side and not the normal path you take when just simply scouting you can see that he was looking for a proxy rax somewhere. What he was doing probably was checking a buildable path to the right side of the outside ramp of the 5 oclock base (i dont really know if there is one, havent played the map myself) and when he saw there was nothing proceeded to scout towards 7 where he finds the proxy racks.
On December 24 2011 13:54 VGhost wrote: Woulda worked a lot better without the audience give-away, sound-proofing seriously not good.
I'm complaining, but I guess everybody has to deal with it so eh.
Yea, I mean FlaSh is FlaSh. He does do stuff like that pretty frequently. However in this game you see his SCV heading up normal, the crowd and commentators go "AAAHH" and within a half second of that he turns around.
If it wasn't sound giveaway it looked incredibly like it.
To me it looked like he was checking both the buildable areas to either side. The reverse ramp and flash going for a high ground rax made careful scouting a priority, plus he's such a huge favourite he shouldn't be just blindly building a forward rax without checking thoroughly for proxies. He's clearly seen such shenanigans on that map before.
On December 24 2011 13:54 VGhost wrote: Woulda worked a lot better without the audience give-away, sound-proofing seriously not good.
I'm complaining, but I guess everybody has to deal with it so eh.
Yea, I mean FlaSh is FlaSh. He does do stuff like that pretty frequently. However in this game you see his SCV heading up normal, the crowd and commentators go "AAAHH" and within a half second of that he turns around.
If it wasn't sound giveaway it looked incredibly like it.
To me it looked like he was checking both the buildable areas to either side. The reverse ramp and flash going for a high ground rax made careful scouting a priority, plus he's such a huge favourite he shouldn't be just blindly building a forward rax without checking thoroughly for proxies. He's clearly seen such shenanigans on that map before.
From Flash's interview:
" I sent SCV to wrong direction (Island area) by mistake because I was so nervous. So I sent to horizontal way, as usual, I found Non.ge(Light)'s barracks. Since 'By.Barrack' used this tactic and won against me many times during team pracitce......"
credit: mintteu2 @ youtube
Just putting this out there. Take it for what it's worth.
So getting cheesed in practice games helps you in televised matches . No wonder flashes knows all the trick in the book when he is playing against lsome tricky opponent's .
On December 24 2011 14:00 endy wrote: Amazing game sense as usual from Flash. Also, how did Light know where to build his proxy barracks ? What if Flash was at 11 o'clock ?
a good question. leaves me scratching my head. also, that scouting was the funniest turn around i've seen. i mean, you can put it down to luck, and then again the floating rax found the first wraith.
On December 24 2011 14:00 endy wrote: Amazing game sense as usual from Flash. Also, how did Light know where to build his proxy barracks ? What if Flash was at 11 o'clock ?
a good question. leaves me scratching my head. also, that scouting was the funniest turn around i've seen. i mean, you can put it down to luck, and then again the floating rax found the first wraith.
oh well, just another day in the life of flash...
Light was simply gambling on Flash spawning at 5 or 7 and not at 11.
Woongjin got so badly countered in player selection it's silly.. except for ZerO (and wasting their top Z player with a ZvZ was probably intentional anyway) they had to play against the strongest 3 matchups possible pretty much.
Same goes for half of their games this season.. it's going to be an uphill struggle if you are playing the hardest matchups every game. They need to stop being predictable with choices.
On January 03 2012 05:16 infinity2k9 wrote: Woongjin got so badly countered in player selection it's silly.. except for ZerO (and wasting their top Z player with a ZvZ was probably intentional anyway) they had to play against the strongest 3 matchups possible pretty much.
Same goes for half of their games this season.. it's going to be an uphill struggle if you are playing the hardest matchups every game. They need to stop being predictable with choices.
I think the predictability is intentional. It makes sense when games are happening 3x a week to focus only on one map, because even if someone else trains a snipe build they only have 1-2 days to practice it. But with a slower pace this season, snipe builds suddenly become much more lethal. Unfortunately, it seems Woongjin's coaches still haven't fully grasped that fact. If it's any consolation, juggling your players between maps is a relatively easy feat to pull off, so once they change their mentality things should get better quickly.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/gvdw9.png)
2011-2012 Proleague Season 1/Round 1![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/zrSMl.png)
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Woongjin Stars vs KT Rolster ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/teams/icons/uniforms/2.png){kind=icon}
ZerO « Electric Circuit » 
free « Outlier » ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/RDxxM.png)
Light « Jade » ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/kLbKJ.png)
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