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I can't believe I fell asleep for this. Oh my god.
Can't wait for the VODs!
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FlaSh's mindgames exploded in his face. This is unfortunate, it'll make Jaedong's victory all the less spectacular 
On May 23 2010 03:33 mera wrote:
I can't believe I fell asleep for this. Oh my god.
Can't wait for the VODs!
Vod's are up on Jon747. Go watch!
Second Edit: Everything Idra said is spot on
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is awesome32278 Posts
On May 22 2010 20:10 Scaramanga wrote:
HAHA COP THAT EFFORT FANS AHAHA
enjoy.
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On May 23 2010 03:27 samachking wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I think this is relevant: Show nested quote + IdrA Korea (South). May 23 2010 01:12. Posts 10359 PM Profile BlogOn May 23 2010 00:35 Kenpachi wrote:
Well, flash got arrogant AGAIN. His cockyness was shown in his game vs effort in PL. This time, he felt he can win because he thought he crushed Effort's heart. Effort is a baller. its not cocky, its not arrogant, its not flash losing focus and its not stupid of him to take risks. terran is fragile. playing to minimize losses can work to an extent, if you're good enough. look at all the solid terrans there have been, people like midas and hwasin, theyre ridiculously good. they won, alot. they never won a title. because once you start playing against bisu and jaedong and effort, if you play to not lose you have no chance because that style can be abused very hard. thats why flash has always been able to win, he is one of the best mechanically anyway, but he takes risks. theyre normally very well calculated and based on scouting and knowledge, not pure luck, but they are risks none the less and sometimes that backfires and you look stupid no matter who you are. flash won game 2 cuz he left his base relatively open while mutas are out and goes to pressure effort's third. at that point hes way, way behind and if the attack doesnt go his way hes dead, but if he doesnt do anything with the situation hes in a lot of trouble anyway. so he takes his chance, and it works. game 4, if he just sits back and tries to turtle up effort runs him ragged with muta micro, given how fast mutas come off that build and the setup of fighting spirit. so he pushes out right before mutas will be out to try to pressure, hoping to catch effort off guard and force a sunken or lings, anything to lessen the effect of the mutas. but efforts prepared for this and it doesnt work. in both games hes in a tough situation and takes a risk to try to turn it in his favor. one game he looks great, the other he looks retarded. a more conservative player will sit back and turret up both games, he doesnt run the risk of dying immediately and he doesnt end up looking stupid and getting criticized. but hes never gonna win a starleague. The thread got closed but I'm reposting this because its a great post.
So the past 6 months of Flash raping it up with safe, standard builds is....?
Case in point: his game on HBR against Movie.
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On May 23 2010 03:27 samachking wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I think this is relevant: Show nested quote + IdrA Korea (South). May 23 2010 01:12. Posts 10359 PM Profile BlogOn May 23 2010 00:35 Kenpachi wrote:
Well, flash got arrogant AGAIN. His cockyness was shown in his game vs effort in PL. This time, he felt he can win because he thought he crushed Effort's heart. Effort is a baller. its not cocky, its not arrogant, its not flash losing focus and its not stupid of him to take risks. terran is fragile. playing to minimize losses can work to an extent, if you're good enough. look at all the solid terrans there have been, people like midas and hwasin, theyre ridiculously good. they won, alot. they never won a title. because once you start playing against bisu and jaedong and effort, if you play to not lose you have no chance because that style can be abused very hard. thats why flash has always been able to win, he is one of the best mechanically anyway, but he takes risks. theyre normally very well calculated and based on scouting and knowledge, not pure luck, but they are risks none the less and sometimes that backfires and you look stupid no matter who you are. flash won game 2 cuz he left his base relatively open while mutas are out and goes to pressure effort's third. at that point hes way, way behind and if the attack doesnt go his way hes dead, but if he doesnt do anything with the situation hes in a lot of trouble anyway. so he takes his chance, and it works. game 4, if he just sits back and tries to turtle up effort runs him ragged with muta micro, given how fast mutas come off that build and the setup of fighting spirit. so he pushes out right before mutas will be out to try to pressure, hoping to catch effort off guard and force a sunken or lings, anything to lessen the effect of the mutas. but efforts prepared for this and it doesnt work. in both games hes in a tough situation and takes a risk to try to turn it in his favor. one game he looks great, the other he looks retarded. a more conservative player will sit back and turret up both games, he doesnt run the risk of dying immediately and he doesnt end up looking stupid and getting criticized. but hes never gonna win a starleague. The thread got closed but I'm reposting this because its a great post.
yeah good post indeed, I've said this all the time, Flash's risk taking and his not underestimating his opponents ever is what made him as dominating as he is.
If you wanna see what happens to S-class players only going for safe builds every time, go look at bisu and how he's been doing lately.
When he beat light and sea on one proleague day with his super greedy CC nobody complained about it... simply because he won with them, very convincgly at that.
It was risky, it didnt backfire. In these finals it did.
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Haha, awesome finals.
<3 Effort
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AWWW HELL YEAH
I like how yet another Zerg made a comeback from a 2-0 deficit against a Terran in the OSL finals. First GGPlay, then Jaedong, and now Effort 
I really need to check out these VODs.
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On May 23 2010 03:49 Jyvblamo wrote:Haha, awesome finals. <3 Effort
Who's the overmind? Savior..?
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I got to give it up to Effort... he played really well this OSL Finals, but come on Flash... get your head straight man.
I hope Flash realizes he needs to hone his Bo5 skills and come back a LOT stronger for his matchup against Jaedong.
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On May 23 2010 03:27 samachking wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I think this is relevant: Show nested quote + IdrA Korea (South). May 23 2010 01:12. Posts 10359 PM Profile BlogOn May 23 2010 00:35 Kenpachi wrote:
Well, flash got arrogant AGAIN. His cockyness was shown in his game vs effort in PL. This time, he felt he can win because he thought he crushed Effort's heart. Effort is a baller. its not cocky, its not arrogant, its not flash losing focus and its not stupid of him to take risks. terran is fragile. playing to minimize losses can work to an extent, if you're good enough. look at all the solid terrans there have been, people like midas and hwasin, theyre ridiculously good. they won, alot. they never won a title. because once you start playing against bisu and jaedong and effort, if you play to not lose you have no chance because that style can be abused very hard. thats why flash has always been able to win, he is one of the best mechanically anyway, but he takes risks. theyre normally very well calculated and based on scouting and knowledge, not pure luck, but they are risks none the less and sometimes that backfires and you look stupid no matter who you are. flash won game 2 cuz he left his base relatively open while mutas are out and goes to pressure effort's third. at that point hes way, way behind and if the attack doesnt go his way hes dead, but if he doesnt do anything with the situation hes in a lot of trouble anyway. so he takes his chance, and it works. game 4, if he just sits back and tries to turtle up effort runs him ragged with muta micro, given how fast mutas come off that build and the setup of fighting spirit. so he pushes out right before mutas will be out to try to pressure, hoping to catch effort off guard and force a sunken or lings, anything to lessen the effect of the mutas. but efforts prepared for this and it doesnt work. in both games hes in a tough situation and takes a risk to try to turn it in his favor. one game he looks great, the other he looks retarded. a more conservative player will sit back and turret up both games, he doesnt run the risk of dying immediately and he doesnt end up looking stupid and getting criticized. but hes never gonna win a starleague. The thread got closed but I'm reposting this because its a great post.
Just a question: Did Flash know that Effort did not have a natural expo? If he did, wouldn't the muta timing be different? Thus, his intention for attacking be different?
Its just a question...not trying to correct or anything.
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United States10774 Posts
On May 23 2010 04:02 Housemd wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:27 samachking wrote:On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I think this is relevant: IdrA Korea (South). May 23 2010 01:12. Posts 10359 PM Profile BlogOn May 23 2010 00:35 Kenpachi wrote:
Well, flash got arrogant AGAIN. His cockyness was shown in his game vs effort in PL. This time, he felt he can win because he thought he crushed Effort's heart. Effort is a baller. its not cocky, its not arrogant, its not flash losing focus and its not stupid of him to take risks. terran is fragile. playing to minimize losses can work to an extent, if you're good enough. look at all the solid terrans there have been, people like midas and hwasin, theyre ridiculously good. they won, alot. they never won a title. because once you start playing against bisu and jaedong and effort, if you play to not lose you have no chance because that style can be abused very hard. thats why flash has always been able to win, he is one of the best mechanically anyway, but he takes risks. theyre normally very well calculated and based on scouting and knowledge, not pure luck, but they are risks none the less and sometimes that backfires and you look stupid no matter who you are. flash won game 2 cuz he left his base relatively open while mutas are out and goes to pressure effort's third. at that point hes way, way behind and if the attack doesnt go his way hes dead, but if he doesnt do anything with the situation hes in a lot of trouble anyway. so he takes his chance, and it works. game 4, if he just sits back and tries to turtle up effort runs him ragged with muta micro, given how fast mutas come off that build and the setup of fighting spirit. so he pushes out right before mutas will be out to try to pressure, hoping to catch effort off guard and force a sunken or lings, anything to lessen the effect of the mutas. but efforts prepared for this and it doesnt work. in both games hes in a tough situation and takes a risk to try to turn it in his favor. one game he looks great, the other he looks retarded. a more conservative player will sit back and turret up both games, he doesnt run the risk of dying immediately and he doesnt end up looking stupid and getting criticized. but hes never gonna win a starleague. The thread got closed but I'm reposting this because its a great post. Just a question: Did Flash know that Effort did not have a natural expo? If he did, wouldn't the muta timing be different? Thus, his intention for attacking be different? Its just a question...not trying to correct or anything.
you mean game 3? flash knew effort expanded to 9
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On May 23 2010 04:02 Housemd wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:27 samachking wrote:On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I think this is relevant: IdrA Korea (South). May 23 2010 01:12. Posts 10359 PM Profile BlogOn May 23 2010 00:35 Kenpachi wrote:
Well, flash got arrogant AGAIN. His cockyness was shown in his game vs effort in PL. This time, he felt he can win because he thought he crushed Effort's heart. Effort is a baller. its not cocky, its not arrogant, its not flash losing focus and its not stupid of him to take risks. terran is fragile. playing to minimize losses can work to an extent, if you're good enough. look at all the solid terrans there have been, people like midas and hwasin, theyre ridiculously good. they won, alot. they never won a title. because once you start playing against bisu and jaedong and effort, if you play to not lose you have no chance because that style can be abused very hard. thats why flash has always been able to win, he is one of the best mechanically anyway, but he takes risks. theyre normally very well calculated and based on scouting and knowledge, not pure luck, but they are risks none the less and sometimes that backfires and you look stupid no matter who you are. flash won game 2 cuz he left his base relatively open while mutas are out and goes to pressure effort's third. at that point hes way, way behind and if the attack doesnt go his way hes dead, but if he doesnt do anything with the situation hes in a lot of trouble anyway. so he takes his chance, and it works. game 4, if he just sits back and tries to turtle up effort runs him ragged with muta micro, given how fast mutas come off that build and the setup of fighting spirit. so he pushes out right before mutas will be out to try to pressure, hoping to catch effort off guard and force a sunken or lings, anything to lessen the effect of the mutas. but efforts prepared for this and it doesnt work. in both games hes in a tough situation and takes a risk to try to turn it in his favor. one game he looks great, the other he looks retarded. a more conservative player will sit back and turret up both games, he doesnt run the risk of dying immediately and he doesnt end up looking stupid and getting criticized. but hes never gonna win a starleague. The thread got closed but I'm reposting this because its a great post. Just a question: Did Flash know that Effort did not have a natural expo? If he did, wouldn't the muta timing be different? Thus, his intention for attacking be different? Its just a question...not trying to correct or anything.
He didn't know at the time, effort could have gone for a third hatch but he saw the gastiming so he knew that it was a two hatchbuild or some wierd fakegas into 3hatch and that he needed to preassure.
game4.
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On May 23 2010 04:08 StylishVODs wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 04:02 Housemd wrote:On May 23 2010 03:27 samachking wrote:On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I think this is relevant: IdrA Korea (South). May 23 2010 01:12. Posts 10359 PM Profile BlogOn May 23 2010 00:35 Kenpachi wrote:
Well, flash got arrogant AGAIN. His cockyness was shown in his game vs effort in PL. This time, he felt he can win because he thought he crushed Effort's heart. Effort is a baller. its not cocky, its not arrogant, its not flash losing focus and its not stupid of him to take risks. terran is fragile. playing to minimize losses can work to an extent, if you're good enough. look at all the solid terrans there have been, people like midas and hwasin, theyre ridiculously good. they won, alot. they never won a title. because once you start playing against bisu and jaedong and effort, if you play to not lose you have no chance because that style can be abused very hard. thats why flash has always been able to win, he is one of the best mechanically anyway, but he takes risks. theyre normally very well calculated and based on scouting and knowledge, not pure luck, but they are risks none the less and sometimes that backfires and you look stupid no matter who you are. flash won game 2 cuz he left his base relatively open while mutas are out and goes to pressure effort's third. at that point hes way, way behind and if the attack doesnt go his way hes dead, but if he doesnt do anything with the situation hes in a lot of trouble anyway. so he takes his chance, and it works. game 4, if he just sits back and tries to turtle up effort runs him ragged with muta micro, given how fast mutas come off that build and the setup of fighting spirit. so he pushes out right before mutas will be out to try to pressure, hoping to catch effort off guard and force a sunken or lings, anything to lessen the effect of the mutas. but efforts prepared for this and it doesnt work. in both games hes in a tough situation and takes a risk to try to turn it in his favor. one game he looks great, the other he looks retarded. a more conservative player will sit back and turret up both games, he doesnt run the risk of dying immediately and he doesnt end up looking stupid and getting criticized. but hes never gonna win a starleague. The thread got closed but I'm reposting this because its a great post. Just a question: Did Flash know that Effort did not have a natural expo? If he did, wouldn't the muta timing be different? Thus, his intention for attacking be different? Its just a question...not trying to correct or anything. He didn't know at the time, effort could have gone for a third hatch but he saw the gastiming so he knew that it was a two hatchbuild or some wierd fakegas into 3hatch and that he needed to preassure. game4.
ahhh...no the game i was talking about was game 3, which i think you explained. ty.
Sorry Idra...T_T
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On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it...
I just have to say it, this is the thoughts of a noob. -_-
You CANNOT play safe every game and win, terrans, hell any races, safe play can be exploited so fucking hard.
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On May 23 2010 04:10 Zoler wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I just have to say it, this is the thoughts of a noob. -_- You CANNOT play safe every game and win, terrans, hell any races, safe play can be exploited so fucking hard.
Perfect example... 12 fucking nexus.
I swear I hate that Protoss build when I play TvP
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United States10774 Posts
On May 23 2010 04:10 Zoler wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I just have to say it, this is the thoughts of a noob. -_- You CANNOT play safe every game and win, terrans, hell any races, safe play can be exploited so fucking hard.
? I am not saying he should one rax CC every single game. He used mech in game 1, won game 2 despite being behind, and made a stupid mistake in game 3. It makes perfect sense to just play normally on a map that FAVORS TERRAN e.g. Great Barrier Reef. I understand how mind games work in series situations but Flash lost this series without playing to his potential, and that's a little depressing. I mean I give a lot of props to Effort for continuously fighting after being down 0-2 but Flash was shaken up a bit after game 3. Unless Effort does a 3 hatch no pool build (which I didn't think he would after game 2), it's a solid choice to one rax CC, especially on a good Terran map. And this is where Flash excels at. If you are up 2-1, just play your suiting style and execute like how you always do.
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The pause in game 1 messed up the mentality of both players.
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great games and final, very epic! I was also thinking about voting on Effort but somehow I didn't have much hope against Flash, sorry CJ and Effort!
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DUDE WHAT
FUUUUU I WENT TO SLEEP AFTER EFFORT WAS DOWN 0-2
ASDLKJSALKDJFLSEKRGJLEKRG
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On May 23 2010 04:15 OneOther wrote:Show nested quote +On May 23 2010 04:10 Zoler wrote:On May 23 2010 03:15 OneOther wrote:On May 23 2010 03:10 Tien wrote:
Flash does this all the time.
Dominates everyone with 1 rax CC expo.
Gets bored, deviates from his normal build, gets greedy, loses. This, and it's kind of frustrating to watch. Flash knows he will win with expo builds in mid-game or late game. The maps were balanced or slightly favored Terran. Why not just play to your biggest strength? I don't get it... I just have to say it, this is the thoughts of a noob. -_- You CANNOT play safe every game and win, terrans, hell any races, safe play can be exploited so fucking hard. ? I am not saying he should one rax CC every single game. He used mech in game 1, won game 2 despite being behind, and made a stupid mistake in game 3. It makes perfect sense to just play normally on a map that FAVORS TERRAN e.g. Great Barrier Reef. I understand how mind games work in series situations but Flash lost this series without playing to his potential, and that's a little depressing. I mean I give a lot of props to Effort for continuously fighting after being down 0-2 but Flash was shaken up a bit after game 3. Unless Effort does a 3 hatch no pool build (which I didn't think he would after game 2), it's a solid choice to one rax CC, especially on a good Terran map. And this is where Flash excels at. If you are up 2-1, just play your suiting style and execute like how you always do.
Ofcourse you have to take chances and play mindgames etc.
But if you're up 2-0 and you are the beast that is Flash (uncomparable to other terrans right now in terms of mechanics) you should rely on the fact that you're the stronger player and that the stronger player will most likely not go 0-3 using a standard opening, behind or not.
Stop calling people noobs Zoler
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EPT
