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On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right).
I would have loved to see that... Not everyone would agree but I think it would be quite the baller move.
Now realistically speaking, if I were in that position, I'd want to win so badly that I probably would have trouble being tied with the Flash.
Also I would know that game 3 was almost certainly mine so it would be hard to just go against my feelings for good sportsmanship. It happens all the time. Losing games where you thought you were winning is a lot more disappointing than losing games in which you never secured an advantage.
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On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:
The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable.
t.t
jaedong was in a very good shape, having 4 bases, swarm ultras nice upgrades. although his drone saturation was probably pretty low he would have certainly won, so why is he not honorable to take the win? rofl
noone would have given away game 4 because of that, what a bullshit. flash still had the chance to win the series, but he didn't so gz jaedong
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On January 24 2010 02:31 KristianJS wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:15 Sanguinarius wrote:On January 24 2010 01:56 KristianJS wrote:On January 24 2010 01:50 Sanguinarius wrote:
That was the biggest disappointment I have ever seen in professional SC and I am a JG fan. People will say he didnt fairly win the match and thats not true. He was the better player but just got robbed from finishing off Flash in G3.
Also, The players computers and the Ref+obs+Hub should be all connected to a backup power supply. Seriously, this isn't hard to do. The problem is that you can't say Jaedong was the better player this finals and thus won cleanly and fairly. Jaedong was overall better over the course of the first 3 games, but finals are played as a best of 5, and under normal circumstances Flash could well have stepped it up and risen above JD for the last two games. Of course there was anything but normal circumstances in the end, which is why the championship was tainted for JD. Sucks but it's true. No I can't say JD is the better player from this Finals and that's the problem. I believe he is the better player and I believe that in a true finals he would have won. And there is the problem. It wasn't a clean, fair win (which is what I wanted). I feel that people will look down upon JD for this finals which is something he does not deserve - and that makes me feel bad. Going into game 4 I knew Flash was broken and it wasn't because of JD it was because of the crappy hosting. I don't think many people will seriously look down on Jaedong for this. I certainly don't. Jaedong played really well, and that's all you can ask of him at the end of the day. He did everything he was meant to do. It was MBC (and/or Kespa) who fucked up, not Jaedong. As long as Jaedong doesn't suddenly turn into some arrogant douche over beating Flash (which obviously isn't going to happen) then no one ought to lose any respect for him.
exactly, well said.
and to say that u were a big JD fanboy before this and now you`re not...it's complete nonsense. (sorry for continuously bringing this up but its damn annoying)
and please, dont start a racism war. It has nothing to do with Korea. I wouldn`t do that, and I bet no one else would if they were in that situation.
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i feel bad for both jaedong and flash lol.
such bullshit
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On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right).
This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch?
Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO.
The only one to blame is MBC.
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On January 24 2010 02:24 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:22 OpticalShot wrote:On January 24 2010 01:56 KristianJS wrote:On January 24 2010 01:50 Sanguinarius wrote:
That was the biggest disappointment I have ever seen in professional SC and I am a JG fan. People will say he didnt fairly win the match and thats not true. He was the better player but just got robbed from finishing off Flash in G3.
Also, The players computers and the Ref+obs+Hub should be all connected to a backup power supply. Seriously, this isn't hard to do. The problem is that you can't say Jaedong was the better player this finals and thus won cleanly and fairly. Jaedong was overall better over the course of the first 3 games, but finals are played as a best of 5, and under normal circumstances Flash could well have stepped it up and risen above JD for the last two games. Of course there was anything but normal circumstances in the end, which is why the championship was tainted for JD. Sucks but it's true. Agreed, I don't think JD would feel 100% happy about winning this MSL, it just turned out so bad at the end with the whole virtual studio business and the hardware fuckup + KeSPA bigger fuckup. He only felt 95% happy? He had a chance to change the results of KeSPA's decision, this wasn't out of his control. He could have given game 4 to Flash and showed KeSPA what he thought of them. Jaedong is not the hero or the victim in this, he was given an advantage and he rolled with it. I'm a huge Jaedong fan, but the constant stream of posts lamenting how bad he felt is disgusting. If he felt bad he should have done something about it. Flash is the only victim here.
The difference my friend, is that that advantage was not GIVEN to jd, it was EARNED by him.
If they had decided to do a rematch then the only victim here would be jd... would that be ok then?
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On January 24 2010 02:36 MagisterMan wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right). This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch? Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO. The only one to blame is MBC.
Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA. Would Flash protest it if they awarded him the win you mean? I don't know, probably not. It doesn't change anything I've said.
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Why can't people just point out how well JD played on Odd-Eye. It's a heavily T favored map which alot of Zerg progamers said was hard to win on. Even JD said in the interview that he had doubts about the map but he did say he practiced hard and he believes that long, hard practice won't betray. It only goes to show how much JD's skill shined in the series.
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On January 24 2010 02:38 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:36 MagisterMan wrote:On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right). This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch? Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO. The only one to blame is MBC. Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA. Would Flash protest it if they awarded him the win you mean? I don't know, probably not. It doesn't change anything I've said.
JD's build is specifically designed as a greedy build with a lot of sneaky expansions. If regamed, it would not work. That's "fair".
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On January 24 2010 02:38 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:36 MagisterMan wrote:On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right). This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch? Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO. The only one to blame is MBC. Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA.
no it wasn`t. That's the thing u don`t get.
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On January 24 2010 02:40 Jaeden wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:38 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:36 MagisterMan wrote:On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right). This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch? Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO. The only one to blame is MBC. Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA. no it wasn`t. That's the thing u don`t get.
Jaedong didn't win the game. Flash didn't lose the game. Somehow awarding Jaedong the game is fair to you? It was a game in progress. You can use your expert knowledge of StarCraft cultivated from years of watching VODs on YouTube to guess the winner, but that isn't fair. StarCraft isn't static, and comebacks (it's even argued by some Flash was ahead!) are possible.
The only fair option is to replay it, and people arguing against this really are puzzling.
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United States10774 Posts
congratulations to jaedong
but mbc is still fucking gay and i cant say i am not disappointed
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On January 24 2010 02:45 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:40 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 02:38 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:36 MagisterMan wrote:On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right). This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch? Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO. The only one to blame is MBC. Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA. no it wasn`t. That's the thing u don`t get. Jaedong didn't win the game. Flash didn't lose the game. Somehow awarding Jaedong the game is fair to you? It was a game in progress. You can use your expert knowledge of StarCraft cultivated from years of watching VODs on YouTube to guess the winner, but that isn't fair. StarCraft isn't static, and comebacks (it's even argued by some Flash was ahead!) are possible. The only fair option is to replay it, and people arguing against this really are puzzling.
I want to hear who thinks that flash was ahead. Please tell me. (I hope you won`t refer to youtube users)
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lol Flash is my favorite player. I'm a KT fan, but even Ray Charles could see that Jaedong was owning in game #3.
Jaedong IMO was the better player overall anyways this MSL series.
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Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA. Would Flash protest it if they awarded him the win you mean? I don't know, probably not. It doesn't change anything I've said.
No I mean if they ruled a rematch. There was no fair decision. But ruling JD the win was the least unfair imo. Game 3 was JD's game when he held of Flash's desperate attack.
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Wow, MBC just ruined and absolutely amazing series. I also was completely shocked they gave it to Jaedong but the more I think about it the more I think they made the correct decision.
It's sad, because people will remember this MSL for this controversy and not the amazing play of both Flash and Jaedong. I honestly thought that Jaedong's build orders were extremely impressive, especially the 3 hatch before pool.Such a shame.
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The answer is that MBC and kespa are douchebags, and Flash, Jaedong, and fans of the game of Starcraft (not rabid fanboys) were ripped off with this final. I haven't anticipated a starcraft game this much since...well a long time ago, and it seems that almost everyone else felt the same way. MBC will be known as the network that found a way to fuck up the most anticipated, hyped, defining starcraft finals in years. I can only hope fans in SK show their preference for OSL and other networks and make MBC eat shit.
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United States10774 Posts
on that note it is simply amazing how good jaedong is in a bo5. damn.
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So many pages of hate directed at the decision (which was the correct one given the circumstances), when the real problem was the fact that such a technical problem happened in the first place. Thousands of games played just fine, and then something like this happens in one of the most anticipated finals ever? You've got to be kidding me. How completely unprofessional. This harms the entire sport, and infinitely more so than MBC's overall set up for this final did.
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On January 24 2010 02:45 Scooge wrote:Show nested quote +On January 24 2010 02:40 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 02:38 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:36 MagisterMan wrote:On January 24 2010 02:15 Scooge wrote:On January 24 2010 02:06 Jaeden wrote:On January 24 2010 01:59 polarwolf wrote:
Jaedong will never be my champion of NATE MSL. Flash did not deserve this shit. We all know that a game is then over when one player GGs. Flash did not do that, so it is not over.
The shit following afterwards was a big burden for Flash and he was not able to play his A-game in set 4, so giving Jaedong the trophy is a joke. ??? what could JD do?! jeez you`re acting like its his fault... The honorable thing to do was GG immediately in game 4 to let it tie up 2-2, then game 5 takes the finals. He would have gained many more fans and been a legend regardless of what happened. Jaedong in the end showed he's not very honorable and will take advantage of anything that goes his way, even if questionable. The type of guy who would take a wallet he found on the sidewalk (a lot of people would do this, it doesn't make it right). This is ridiculus. Do you think Flash would have protested if Kespa would have ruled a rematch? Both players made their best out of the situation. Flash was manner enough to play game 4 and not leaving in a WO. The only one to blame is MBC. Why would Flash protest a rematch? It was the only fair option available to KeSPA. no it wasn`t. That's the thing u don`t get. Jaedong didn't win the game. Flash didn't lose the game. Somehow awarding Jaedong the game is fair to you? It was a game in progress. You can use your expert knowledge of StarCraft cultivated from years of watching VODs on YouTube to guess the winner, but that isn't fair. StarCraft isn't static, and comebacks (it's even argued by some Flash was ahead!) are possible. The only fair option is to replay it, and people arguing against this really are puzzling.
So let's say that you were ahead 85% and the disconnect happened. They decide to give you a win. You breathe a sigh of relief as you were about to achieve 5 gas against Flash's diminishing 2 gas and mineral only expo. Sure, he had SOME chance of winning, but most likely, you were about to close the deal. Add in the fact that the map is Terran favoring and you had worked out this BO for weeks in advance.
You're gonna ask for a rematch for "fairness"? You would FORFEIT the next game to protest the decision? How is either option fair in any sense? I agree that giving a win to JD is unfair for Flash, but that option is MORE unfair to JD.
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EPT
