The first eight seeds are placed into groups A through H, with the first seed in Group A and the eighth seed in Group H. The first eight seeds may never be moved by any player, they remain in the groups in which they are seeded. Seeds nine through sixteen are determined by previous MSL appearances and performance, with more obviously being better. Seeds nine through sixteen are placed into the other pair in groups A through H, but in reverse order. Seeds eight and nine would be in the same group, then seven and ten, six and eleven and so on up until the first and sixteenth.
Once players are placed into the groups, the remaining players are also ranked based upon previous MSL appearance and performances. Starting with the seventeenth, and ending with the thirty-second, each player takes his own name and places it in an open spot next to the player he wishes to play against.
After everyone has been placed upon the board, the stealing begins. It starts in ascending order at the sixteenth seed and moves all the way up to the first. Seed nine through sixteen are allowed three options: (1) Exchange himself with another player, (2) Exchange his current opponent with another player, or (3) Pass the turn and exchange no one.
Seeds three through eight work a little differently. They are able to pick two moves from the following: (1) Exchange a player in their group with another player, (2) Exchange any two other players with each other, or (3) Pass the turn and exchange no one. Seeds two and one earn a few more decisions. They are able to switch any player with another player and may do so up to three times or until they wish to pass.
There are too many zergs, but most of them are leftovers, so hopefully the groups will filter them and we will be left with a truly great MSL. Let's hope it happens like that for the future of the tournament itself.
i predict terrans having an "easy day" since most groups will have 2 zergs and since most zergs here are great vs p and maybe vs z zvt isnt the strong mu for most zergs here ! (not as strong as tvz of terran players ) if no groups of 4 terrans will happen i see most terran rise to the r of 16
On November 16 2009 02:02 meeple wrote: I dunno, Hwasin and Ruby have been kickin' it lately, I'm not sure about all the way, but I think they could make it pretty far.
It's not that I think they're all complete thrash, but imagine Ruby vs Jaedong in a Bo5. It would get ugly.
Actually if you look at the list of Players I think that the Zergs "sucks", just Zero, Jaedong, by.hero, SAVIOR!, July, Calm, Effort are the good Zergs. Thats only 7 zergs (just like 7 toss and 1 more than Terrans). For me the rest of the Zergs would lose if they play against other race.
I just hope that all of the "bad" zergs get eliminated. Well this is the Stork MSL, Finals Flash vs Stork!
It's the return of the dragons. 5 of 6 dragons are hereeeee. Victory after Victory yeahhhh. Time to represent and destroy those pitiful zergs and terrans.
I'll be pissed if we see some all protoss group. If it somehow gets to be like Bisu, Stork, Jangbi, Best, I'd pretty much just stop watching SC altogether.
On November 16 2009 05:09 Roffles wrote: It's the return of the dragons. 5 of 6 dragons are hereeeee. Victory after Victory yeahhhh. Time to represent and destroy those pitiful zergs and terrans.
I'll be pissed if we see some all protoss group. If it somehow gets to be like Bisu, Stork, Jangbi, Best, I'd pretty much just stop watching SC altogether.
All 6 Dragons are there man; Stats has replaced Free.
On November 16 2009 05:09 Roffles wrote: It's the return of the dragons. 5 of 6 dragons are hereeeee. Victory after Victory yeahhhh. Time to represent and destroy those pitiful zergs and terrans.
I'll be pissed if we see some all protoss group. If it somehow gets to be like Bisu, Stork, Jangbi, Best, I'd pretty much just stop watching SC altogether.
All 6 Dragons are there man; Stats has replaced Free.
I would say Movie replaced Free. He's got more of the emo protoss look than Stats or Guemchi
On November 16 2009 05:09 Roffles wrote: It's the return of the dragons. 5 of 6 dragons are hereeeee. Victory after Victory yeahhhh. Time to represent and destroy those pitiful zergs and terrans.
I'll be pissed if we see some all protoss group. If it somehow gets to be like Bisu, Stork, Jangbi, Best, I'd pretty much just stop watching SC altogether.
All 6 Dragons are there man; Stats has replaced Free.
I would say Movie replaced Free. He's got more of the emo protoss look than Stats or Guemchi
Movie ain't got nothing on Stats. Stats is the next Protoss star! :D
On November 16 2009 03:26 Ikonn wrote: As long as Flash can dodge the better protoss players, he'll walk through this. I hope July does really good too.
On November 16 2009 05:09 Roffles wrote: It's the return of the dragons. 5 of 6 dragons are hereeeee. Victory after Victory yeahhhh. Time to represent and destroy those pitiful zergs and terrans.
I'll be pissed if we see some all protoss group. If it somehow gets to be like Bisu, Stork, Jangbi, Best, I'd pretty much just stop watching SC altogether.
All 6 Dragons are there man; Stats has replaced Free.
backho is the 6th dragon, replacing best as the 6th best protoss in kespa ranking. =P
Are we finally getting a JD vs Bisu starleague finals? I'm curious to see how Calm is going to use his final pick. He is such an intelligent player in-game, I wonder if he is going to do some brilliant group forming too.
Well, most of the Zergs qualified are pretty weak, the only true contenders are Jaedong, Calm, Effort. Savior, Kwanro, Hero and July might be able to pull something, the other Zergs just got lucky.
If FlaSh gets eliminated by anyone besides JD I'm going to be pissed; sc needs a little more JD v FlaSh in it's diet. Also, I never thought I'd say this but I miss Fantasy, who can I root against now? Edit: Also, Type-B is gonna win the whole thing
Stork goes to the Finals and suddenly gives his spot to Yellow, who wins the MSL and finally gets a gold medal. The two high-five as the "2nd-placers" finally both have gold medals.
The silver-mining industry weeps at the lack of brand-name recognition anymore and asks Fantasy/Jangbi to be their new poster-childs (maybe not so much Jangbi).
On a serious note, I have a feeling this year's MSL will be great. Hopefully not a ZvZ finals and hopefully no group of death (though everyone does get excited with a group of 4 great players). After all, I want to see the good players face each other in the Ro16 and beyond rather than see two get eliminated right away at the Group Stages.
With 5 of the 6 dragons qualifying plus Movie and Stats, the Protoss roster is posed to strike back at the Swarm of the 16 Zergs. While some may cry bonjwa at GuemChi's name, he is mere food to the great Swarm. Meanwhile, the historical nemesis of the Zerg swarm, the Terrans, are on uncertain ground with the weakest assembly out of the three great powers. The Terran warmachine may be spearheaded by the terrifying power of the Ultimate Weapon, but alone the weapon will not be sufficient to win back the glorious days of the old Terran domination.
Couple notes:
-Hwasin may reach deeper than anybody may predict in this Zerg infested environment. With his impressive TvZ, perhaps he is ready to make an impression.
-If the last CJ v.s. Khan was any indication, I'd say that Jangbi is almost ready for his resurgence.
-Savior is dead. Too many Zergs
-Iris sucked in proleague. But he sucked during last season's proleague too and walked away with a GOM silver and penetrated deep into the starleagues.
-Hyuk is ZvZ bonjwa. Let's see how long his luck lasts before he meets a decent Terran. I can see Bogus rolling over him, which would be bogus.
-Bisu's PvZ sucks recent. I can totally see him picking an all Zerg "easy" group to prove his PvZ and then choke again. In the round of 32. With that said, I hope it doesn't happen.
-Movie is a serious contender. Watch out for that kid.
-Firefist is apparently the most powerful of the MSL "royalroaders". Weepee. Now only if this is the Gatorade MSL.
-Stork already set his eyes on the silver. Don't let nobody tell you otherwise.
I am rooting for Stork, Savior, July, Movie and Jangbi. Will watch out for Hyuk for the lolz. Conflicted about Jaedong, he is got too many gold medals already.
On November 16 2009 10:24 Xiphos wrote: Well, most of the Zergs qualified are pretty weak, the only true contenders are Jaedong, Calm, Effort. Savior, Kwanro, Hero and July might be able to pull something, the other Zergs just got lucky.
You seem to have forgotten Zero in your list. I hope Zero gets to roll Bisu yet again in this tournament.
Hoping Flash doesn't crash out this time! Best snapped his 10-0 which I'm happy about. I'ld rather he loses a game in PL then in individuals, and he was due for a loss soon.
On November 16 2009 14:12 revy wrote: Hoping Flash doesn't crash out this time! Best snapped his 10-0 which I'm happy about. I'ld rather he loses a game in PL then in individuals, and he was due for a loss soon.
A player is never due for a loss imo i find it pretty funny that this thread already has more pages than msl prematch or whatever that was, even though they were some nice matches
On November 16 2009 16:35 LunarDestiny wrote: Bisu stuck with by.hero, shine, and hyuk.
Yeah
Actually, it would be funny if he ends up with by.hero, ZerO, and shine or even Jaedong. But I seriously doubt that will happen. Praying for a JD vs Flash final. Imagine how epic that would be.
On November 16 2009 20:25 Biff The Understudy wrote: I remember last time FBH saying he would roll over Flash and Jaedong and got 5 proxy hatcheries in his natural, hahaha.
I expect some epic badmouthing.
Yes, and as a result Hwasin advanced from this group of death
On November 16 2009 20:25 Biff The Understudy wrote: I remember last time FBH saying he would roll over Flash and Jaedong and got 5 proxy hatcheries in his natural, hahaha.
I expect some epic badmouthing.
Yes, and as a result Hwasin advanced from this group of death
Oh when flash had to play jaedong to advance i dont think i have ever had my heart sink so low, but some how jaedong decided that it was a grand idea to go guards and got rolled :D, hopefully no utterly stupid groups like this happen again
On November 16 2009 20:25 Biff The Understudy wrote: I remember last time FBH saying he would roll over Flash and Jaedong and got 5 proxy hatcheries in his natural, hahaha.
I expect some epic badmouthing.
Yes, and as a result Hwasin advanced from this group of death
Oh when flash had to play jaedong to advance i dont think i have ever had my heart sink so low, but some how jaedong decided that it was a grand idea to go guards and got rolled :D, hopefully no utterly stupid groups like this happen again
That was one of the worst moments in my time following the proscene; having to witness one of the two best players in the world being eliminated by the other best player in the world in an early stage. In a BO1. In a stupid way.
On November 16 2009 16:35 LunarDestiny wrote: Bisu stuck with by.hero, shine, and hyuk.
Yeah
Actually, it would be funny if he ends up with by.hero, ZerO, and shine or even Jaedong. But I seriously doubt that will happen. Praying for a JD vs Flash final. Imagine how epic that would be.
If I was a seeded Terran and I wanted to win the whole thing and not just advance, I'd switch Hyuk into groups with Effort or JAedong and have him do some sniping.
On November 17 2009 05:14 lone_hydra wrote: If I was a seeded Terran and I wanted to win the whole thing and not just advance, I'd switch Hyuk into groups with Effort or JAedong and have him do some sniping.
You know that Hyuk has to be your opponent for that option right?
On November 17 2009 05:14 lone_hydra wrote: If I was a seeded Terran and I wanted to win the whole thing and not just advance, I'd switch Hyuk into groups with Effort or JAedong and have him do some sniping.
You know that Hyuk has to be your opponent for that option right?
Yes, so if I wanted to win the whole thing, I would trade Hyuk away to do some zerg sniping instead of having a easy win in my group. It is a better investment.
On November 16 2009 16:35 LunarDestiny wrote: Bisu stuck with by.hero, shine, and hyuk.
Yeah
Actually, it would be funny if he ends up with by.hero, ZerO, and shine or even Jaedong. But I seriously doubt that will happen. Praying for a JD vs Flash final. Imagine how epic that would be.
On November 16 2009 16:35 LunarDestiny wrote: Bisu stuck with by.hero, shine, and hyuk.
Yeah
Actually, it would be funny if he ends up with by.hero, ZerO, and shine or even Jaedong. But I seriously doubt that will happen. Praying for a JD vs Flash final. Imagine how epic that would be.
On November 17 2009 07:15 dekuschrub wrote: thats a pretty sweet plan
put an all zerg group with hyuk jd and effort
then lol when hyuk goes 0-2.
somehow i don't see that happening though (the hyuk winning part.. im still a doubter)
Hyuk is like ZvZ bonjwa. He won't go winless with an all zerg group. In fact, he'd go undefeated. His ZvZ play has been ridiculously good, even though he still blows at ZvT and to a lesser extent ZvP.
On November 16 2009 16:35 LunarDestiny wrote: Bisu stuck with by.hero, shine, and hyuk.
Yeah
Actually, it would be funny if he ends up with by.hero, ZerO, and shine or even Jaedong. But I seriously doubt that will happen. Praying for a JD vs Flash final. Imagine how epic that would be.
On November 16 2009 16:35 LunarDestiny wrote: Bisu stuck with by.hero, shine, and hyuk.
Yeah
Actually, it would be funny if he ends up with by.hero, ZerO, and shine or even Jaedong. But I seriously doubt that will happen. Praying for a JD vs Flash final. Imagine how epic that would be.
On November 17 2009 11:05 Vasoline73 wrote: JD against ForGG in Arena played a completely different style than JD v Flash in GOM. Had nothing to do with form. *imo*
Someone needs to dig up that picture of the map stats for the Arena finals.
I'm sure July will do everything in his power to get himself out of that group. Calm has the final say, and I'm sure he won't let his hyung languish in such a disadvantageous position.
Protoss players try to avoid getting stuck in Zerg groups, and they end up forming a group with 3 Protoss in it as a result.
Calm or Kwanro use one of their swaps to move Flash into the group with 3 strong Protoss players. Flash drops out of MSL to one of the dragons. The dragons then promptly roll over and die to Zerg players. ZvZ for the rest of the MSL.
On November 17 2009 19:45 Hinanawi wrote: My prediction:
Protoss players try to avoid getting stuck in Zerg groups, and they end up forming a group with 3 Protoss in it as a result.
Calm or Kwanro use one of their swaps to move Flash into the group with 3 strong Protoss players. Flash drops out of MSL to one of the dragons. The dragons then promptly roll over and die to Zerg players. ZvZ for the rest of the MSL.
On November 17 2009 19:45 Hinanawi wrote: My prediction:
Protoss players try to avoid getting stuck in Zerg groups, and they end up forming a group with 3 Protoss in it as a result.
Calm or Kwanro use one of their swaps to move Flash into the group with 3 strong Protoss players. Flash drops out of MSL to one of the dragons. The dragons then promptly roll over and die to Zerg players. ZvZ for the rest of the MSL.
On November 17 2009 19:45 Hinanawi wrote: My prediction:
Protoss players try to avoid getting stuck in Zerg groups, and they end up forming a group with 3 Protoss in it as a result.
Calm or Kwanro use one of their swaps to move Flash into the group with 3 strong Protoss players. Flash drops out of MSL to one of the dragons. The dragons then promptly roll over and die to Zerg players. ZvZ for the rest of the MSL.
Keep in mind that the last MSL had 16 terrans! Starved for SC I watched some of the group ceremony for the Avalaon MSL. It was hilarious to see all the players together having fun. Can't wait for the Nate MSL. As for predictions - Flash is looking crazy good, so I'm betting that he wins the MSL, OSL and proleague with KT Rollster. It feels like the planets are aligned for a Flash all-win.
On November 17 2009 15:56 TwoStep wrote: Is there a new selection process before? I don't remember the other recent MSLs having two people initially in each group.
You may be confused with OSL Ro16 Groups: There it is 1 seed and groups are filled with picking the next player for your group iirc
On November 17 2009 15:56 TwoStep wrote: Is there a new selection process before? I don't remember the other recent MSLs having two people initially in each group.
You may be confused with OSL Ro16 Groups: There it is 1 seed and groups are filled with picking the next player for your group iirc
On November 17 2009 15:56 TwoStep wrote: Is there a new selection process before? I don't remember the other recent MSLs having two people initially in each group.
You may be confused with OSL Ro16 Groups: There it is 1 seed and groups are filled with picking the next player for your group iirc
On November 17 2009 19:45 Hinanawi wrote: My prediction:
Protoss players try to avoid getting stuck in Zerg groups, and they end up forming a group with 3 Protoss in it as a result.
Calm or Kwanro use one of their swaps to move Flash into the group with 3 strong Protoss players. Flash drops out of MSL to one of the dragons. The dragons then promptly roll over and die to Zerg players. ZvZ for the rest of the MSL.
I cry girlie tears and drink away my sorrows.
And thus we have a ZvZ final in the MSL between Hyuk and some non-Hyuk scrub only to succumb by godly bonjwa zvz power of Hyukness and being HYUKEDDD and fanboys (and girls) all cry and cheer for the new overmind and master of the zerg who is known as HYUK HYUK HYUK.....
There, thought I added more to your prediction with my seemingly un-bias Hyuk's first MSL victory prediction...
MBCGame's made a pretty significant change to the format
In addition to the eight fixed seeds, there are 8 more players who will also receive fixed spots (cannot be stolen or moved), so only the sixteen players are actually moveable -_-. Those additional eight players are players MBCGame chose at their discretion, based on overall skill and past MSL performances.
The brackets are like this:
Group A Calm vs A2, A3 vs ForGG Group B Kwanro vs B2, B3 vs Hwasin Group C Iris vs C2, C3 vs Flash Group D Jaedong vs D2, D3 vs JulyZerg Group E Canata vs E2, E3 vs Stork Group F Bisu vs F2, F3 vs Savior Group G Zero vs G2, G3 vs Kal Group H Effort vs H2, H3 vs Jangbi
When you examine the groups, it becomes ridiculously obvious MBCGame is trying to seed its tournament so it can get a minimum amount of popular players to the next round, and avoid the "group of deaths" it has had in the past, and try to get themselves a good finals card for once. One can understand that with a history of terrible finals no one wanted to watch, MBCGame would want to try and fix the brackets. But it is a rather jarring departure from their previous format, which made the group selection quite an exciting event to watch.
17~32번 시드- 빈 자리 중 자신의 자리 선택 16~9번 시드- 자신의 옆자리 변경 가능 8~3번 시드- 대진표를 최대 한 번 변경 가능 2번 시드- 대진표를 최대 두 번 변경 가능 1번 시드- 대진표를 최대 두 번 변경 가능, 추가로 중간 지명권 한 번 존재 (단 중간 지명권은 마지막 지명시 사용할 수 없다)
On November 18 2009 20:27 pachi wrote: I think the OP is still missing exact powers of the seeds + Show Spoiler [This?] +
시드별 지명권한
17~32번 시드- 빈 자리 중 자신의 자리 선택 16~9번 시드- 자신의 옆자리 변경 가능 8~3번 시드- 대진표를 최대 한 번 변경 가능 2번 시드- 대진표를 최대 두 번 변경 가능 1번 시드- 대진표를 최대 두 번 변경 가능, 추가로 중간 지명권 한 번 존재 (단 중간 지명권은 마지막 지명시 사용할 수 없다)
Seed 17-32 - choose their place of empty seats (basically can just put their names where they want) Seed 16-9 - next to you can change their (can switch the movable person that's in their group with another person) Seed 8-3 - Tables can be changed up to one (can switch any 2 movable people) No. 2 seed - Tables can be changed up to two times (can do two switches) 1 seed - Tables can be changed up to two times, once more to pick between the presence (not sure what the last phrase means)
On November 18 2009 21:14 motbob wrote: Google translate (and what I think it means):
Seed 17-32 - choose their place of empty seats (basically can just put their names where they want) Seed 16-9 - next to you can change their (can switch the movable person that's in their group with another person) Seed 8-3 - Tables can be changed up to one (can switch any 2 movable people) No. 2 seed - Tables can be changed up to two times (can do two switches) 1 seed - Tables can be changed up to two times, once more to pick between the presence (not sure what the last phrase means)
I think that last phrase means that #1 seed can make one switch any time during the group selection in addition to the 2 switches, but they can't use it if it's unused until their turn comes.
Too vague to tell exactly what they're saying without further explanation.
MBCGame's made a pretty significant change to the format
In addition to the eight fixed seeds, there are 8 more players who will also receive fixed spots (cannot be stolen or moved), so only the sixteen players are actually moveable -_-. Those additional eight players are players MBCGame chose at their discretion, based on overall skill and past MSL performances.
The brackets are like this:
Group A Calm vs A2, A3 vs ForGG Group B Kwanro vs B2, B3 vs Hwasin Group C Iris vs C2, C3 vs Flash Group D Jaedong vs D2, D3 vs JulyZerg Group E Canata vs E2, E3 vs Stork Group F Bisu vs F2, F3 vs Savior Group G Zero vs G2, G3 vs Kal Group H Effort vs H2, H3 vs Jangbi
When you examine the groups, it becomes ridiculously obvious MBCGame is trying to seed its tournament so it can get a minimum amount of popular players to the next round, and avoid the "group of deaths" it has had in the past, and try to get themselves a good finals card for once. One can understand that with a history of terrible finals no one wanted to watch, MBCGame would want to try and fix the brackets. But it is a rather jarring departure from their previous format, which made the group selection quite an exciting event to watch.
Seems like what MSL was last year (fixed 16 players seed). Only difference I see here is if seeds from 8 to 1 cant switch x4 placed players
On November 18 2009 22:55 Mykill wrote: stupid stupid MBC they're just trying to make more $$ group of death = fun fun fun!
Well after that big failure having 4 protoss at same group is not really what MBC wanted. All mirror groups aren't that interesting to follow.
You have to consider that out of 16 spots there will be 9 zergs, 3 terrans and 4 protoss. This way we wont have too many zvz games.
At the moment only C and D groups can be all mirror groups.
After looking groups again there are no same team members playing same groups at the moment. So thats why seeding is kinda weird. There would be more blaming if MBC would have seeded same team members to same groups. Calm vs Kal, kinda anti STX...
On November 18 2009 22:55 Mykill wrote: stupid stupid MBC they're just trying to make more $$ group of death = fun fun fun!
It's fun fun fun when you watch the group, then after only two advance from that group, it's weep weep weep as you watch potential snoozers come the Ro16 and beyond because two of the good players got eliminated right off the bat.
I am more pumped for the OSL ro16, but since only the MSL thread is out...
like Apex said, groups of death suck because than you are stuck with far less capable players in the rest of the tourny. Sure it may be fun to watch, but it will be alot more fun to watch those players compete in the later stages.
On November 18 2009 23:26 alffla wrote: this thread is 11 pages and it hasn't even started! ;o
Because Group selections are one of the most interesting things in progaming. Besides, MSL Group Selection is more complicated and entertaining than OSL GS.
On November 19 2009 02:28 dukethegold wrote: Wait, are the seeded players fixed in their own group or can they still move themselves around and insert themselves into other groups?
For example, can Iris move himself out of Group C if he doesn't want to face against Flash to move out of his group?
He could just move Flash..
I'm pretty sure the seeds can move each other around so I don't see any reason why they couldn't move themselves if they wanted to.
On November 19 2009 02:28 dukethegold wrote: Wait, are the seeded players fixed in their own group or can they still move themselves around and insert themselves into other groups?
For example, can Iris move himself out of Group C if he doesn't want to face against Flash to move out of his group?
He could just move Flash..
I'm pretty sure the seeds can move each other around so I don't see any reason why they couldn't move themselves if they wanted to.
MBCGame's made a pretty significant change to the format
In addition to the eight fixed seeds, there are 8 more players who will also receive fixed spots (cannot be stolen or moved), so only the sixteen players are actually moveable -_-. Those additional eight players are players MBCGame chose at their discretion, based on overall skill and past MSL performances.
The brackets are like this:
Group A Calm vs A2, A3 vs ForGG Group B Kwanro vs B2, B3 vs Hwasin Group C Iris vs C2, C3 vs Flash Group D Jaedong vs D2, D3 vs JulyZerg Group E Canata vs E2, E3 vs Stork Group F Bisu vs F2, F3 vs Savior Group G Zero vs G2, G3 vs Kal Group H Effort vs H2, H3 vs Jangbi
When you examine the groups, it becomes ridiculously obvious MBCGame is trying to seed its tournament so it can get a minimum amount of popular players to the next round, and avoid the "group of deaths" it has had in the past, and try to get themselves a good finals card for once. One can understand that with a history of terrible finals no one wanted to watch, MBCGame would want to try and fix the brackets. But it is a rather jarring departure from their previous format, which made the group selection quite an exciting event to watch.
All 16 players that are there now are unmovable according to dailyesports.
Can't wait for this. I'm relieved to hear that Flash will at least have one Terran (lol FvT) in his group no matter what. I still think people will try to throw in two Protoss in his group, though.
This MSL is probably Hwasin's best chance to win a starleague, if he gets lucky with groups. Red Sniper and all that, he could conceivably cruise to the finals without winning a single TvT or TvP.
On November 19 2009 02:28 dukethegold wrote: Wait, are the seeded players fixed in their own group or can they still move themselves around and insert themselves into other groups?
For example, can Iris move himself out of Group C if he doesn't want to face against Flash to move out of his group?
He could just move Flash..
I'm pretty sure the seeds can move each other around so I don't see any reason why they couldn't move themselves if they wanted to.
This change makes group selection less interesting, since players have more limited options, but should make for more high quality games late in the season. Overall I think this is a better way.
On November 18 2009 23:26 alffla wrote: this thread is 11 pages and it hasn't even started! ;o
Because Group selections are one of the most interesting things in progaming. Besides, MSL Group Selection is more complicated and entertaining than OSL GS.
Aye, because ending up with the best players in the same group is always conducive to a great tourny. (This thing about half the players being locked in to a group is a good start tho... as far as I remember it wasn't like that last time was it?).
If they're going to lock half the pool of players into place they might as well go all the way, eliminate the group selection ceremonies, and do the groups entirely by previous MSL appearances/success. This ceremony is pointless if there's no drama of the big names exchanging smack talk when they move each other into & out of their groups.
Right now who is the most controversial character that isn't locked in a group? Hyuk? He's done a bit of smack talk. But seriously I don't see how anything interesting will come of the steal draft unless someone comes out of nowhere like maGma did.
Anyways, I'm sure this will probably make for more interesting tournaments as a whole, instead of having the one or two all T, all Z or mostly P groups, there should be a fairly even mix and late round play will be more interesting in general.
Only a quarter of the pool is "locked" - seeds 1-8. 9-16 are placed in groups, but not locked into them. For instance, Bisu is stuck in Group F (can't move himself out of it, but he can trade two people out of it), but sAviOr is NOT stuck in Group F in that he can trade himself out of it.
On November 19 2009 06:49 oBlade wrote: Only a quarter of the pool is "locked" - seeds 1-8. 9-16 are placed in groups, but not locked into them. For instance, Bisu is stuck in Group F (can't move himself out of it, but he can trade two people out of it), but sAviOr is NOT stuck in Group F in that he can trade himself out of it.
So we are guaranteed a sAviOr v. Bisu and EffOrt v. JangBi? I kind of like the new format, though there is less meaningful Freedom. As a July fan, yes he has to play Jaedong, but of the remaining 16 players there aren't many I fear him playing.
On November 19 2009 09:58 Deletrious wrote: So we are guaranteed a sAviOr v. Bisu and EffOrt v. JangBi? I kind of like the new format, though there is less meaningful Freedom. As a July fan, yes he has to play Jaedong, but of the remaining 16 players there aren't many I fear him playing.
Bisu <map> player xx player yy <map> Savior Winners set losers set final set
On November 19 2009 09:58 Deletrious wrote: So we are guaranteed a sAviOr v. Bisu and EffOrt v. JangBi? I kind of like the new format, though there is less meaningful Freedom. As a July fan, yes he has to play Jaedong, but of the remaining 16 players there aren't many I fear him playing.
Bisu <map> player xx player yy <map> Savior Winners set losers set final set
On November 19 2009 09:58 Deletrious wrote: So we are guaranteed a sAviOr v. Bisu and EffOrt v. JangBi? I kind of like the new format, though there is less meaningful Freedom. As a July fan, yes he has to play Jaedong, but of the remaining 16 players there aren't many I fear him playing.
Bisu <map> player xx player yy <map> Savior Winners set losers set final set
You are right, damn. Sorry for noob confusion.
Well, we are still practically guaranteed savior vs bisu, considering both are in decent enough form that they can be expected to win.
I'm looking forward to the matchups in the MSL moreso than the OSL right now. Then again there are only 16 people in the OSL at the moment, so.........
It should be that you can move someone from 9-16 rank, but only with another player in that range. would at least make the selection a little more interesting.
On November 19 2009 13:57 Kyuukyuu wrote: jd/bisu finals are destined to never occur
whatever htey're so hyped and whenever there are games with the two players they end up being so anticliamctic lol.
only good game was like the blue storm one
blue storm just set the bar sooo high
and their proleague match on andromeda
this. bisu vs jd on andromeda is like my all time favourite sair/reaver into lategame carrier game.
i think this msl will be great, in particular much better than the osl. very strong protoss lineup, all the strong zergs plus many up and coming zergs to tear through, and several tvz gods.
On November 19 2009 13:57 Kyuukyuu wrote: jd/bisu finals are destined to never occur
whatever htey're so hyped and whenever there are games with the two players they end up being so anticliamctic lol.
only good game was like the blue storm one
blue storm just set the bar sooo high
and their proleague match on andromeda
this. bisu vs jd on andromeda is like my all time favourite sair/reaver into lategame carrier game.
i think this msl will be great, in particular much better than the osl. very strong protoss lineup, all the strong zergs plus many up and coming zergs to tear through, and several tvz gods.
MSL ain't as imbalanced as the OSL. More protosses and terrans around this time.
On November 19 2009 17:30 randombum wrote: Speaking of the "nate" msl, I've got a great joke involving a snake named nate.
Oh man that joke is amazing :D
On November 19 2009 15:25 dekuschrub wrote: wtf is this locking shit...
Msl probably wants to make sure that no big names get knocked out in ro32 like a few seasons with FBH (who was good at the time) and jd getting knocked out in that group of death, its gonna make for better games later on
On November 19 2009 15:25 dekuschrub wrote: wtf is this locking shit...
Msl probably wants to make sure that no big names get knocked out in ro32 like a few seasons with FBH (who was good at the time) and jd getting knocked out in that group of death, its gonna make for better games later on
A truck driver is heading west across the Arizona desert. He has been driving all night, and as the sun starts to rise, he feels the need to stop and commune with nature. He pulls to the side of the road, parks, and walks out into the sage brush.
As he is standing there, looking around at the beauty of the early morn, he notices a lever sticking out of the ground. After a few moments, he walks over, walks all the way around, and then reaches out to grasp the lever. Just as he does, he hears a voice say, "Don't touch that lever."
The driver jumps about two feet off the ground, and as he comes down, he looks around. No one is to be seen. Thinking it was just his imagination, he again reaches for the lever. Again the voice yells, "I said don't touch that lever!" Being more prepared, the driver senses the location of the voice and looks down under a sage brush. There he sees a small snake.
The driver, in much astonishment, said, "Was that you that just spoke?"
The snake said, "Yes. I have to keep people from touching that lever. If the lever is moved, it will be the end of the world."
The driver, still rather astonished, said, "What is your name? And will you talk on TV?" The snake said his name was Nate and that he wasn't interested in going on TV; anyway, he had to stay and watch the lever to see that it wasn't moved. The driver said, "Look, I will get the networks to send out camera crews. That way, you can inform the entire world about the danger of the lever."
Nate thought that over and allowed as how there was a great deal of sense to the idea. The driver, true to his word, got the network camera crews out. They put on broadcasts in which Nate warned the entire world of the dangers of moving the lever.
A few weeks later, another truck driver was going through the area. He was following an oil tanker, and the tanker sprang a leak. When the driver's truck hit the slick, it went out of control, and he found himself headed straight for the lever. He remembered seeing Nate on the TV telling about the lever and so he knew that if he hit it, he would cause the world to end. He strove, with all his might to maneuver the truck. Finally, at the last moment, he was able to swerve, but he ran over Nate, the snake, and killed him flat!
The truck driver was heard to say "Well, better Nate than lever."
Does anyone else like that dude from Twilight because he resmebles flash so much? I don't know his name but he's everywhere and I can't help but not hate him because he looks like a white flash.
On November 19 2009 19:08 Warrior Madness wrote: Does anyone else like that dude from Twilight because he resmebles flash so much? I don't know his name but he's everywhere and I can't help but not hate him because he looks like a white flash.
On November 19 2009 19:08 Warrior Madness wrote: Does anyone else like that dude from Twilight because he resmebles flash so much? I don't know his name but he's everywhere and I can't help but not hate him because he looks like a white flash.
On November 19 2009 19:08 Warrior Madness wrote: Does anyone else like that dude from Twilight because he resmebles flash so much? I don't know his name but he's everywhere and I can't help but not hate him because he looks like a white flash.
robert pattison?? lol
Yes... That's so flash. It's not just the eyebrows either, it's the entire shape of the face.
how to guarantee tough opponent (that you want to play against)
1. pick tough opponent 2. during explanation, taunt opponent by saying that "it doesn't matter whether i pick him or not. he's going to just change it anyways because he's afraid" 3. opponent accepts challenge and doesn't change it, so you get what you wanted
incomplete listing of most switches - damn confusing
Kal: pass Flash: switch Light with hyvaa forGG: switch Guemchi with Crazy-Hydra July: switch Shine with Guemchi Jangbi: switch Shine with Bogus. Stork: pass Hwasin: (Firefist??) Savior: Stats with Saint
that about right?
Zero: Switches BeSt and Guemchi (So July vs. BeSt and Guemchi vs. Iris) Effort: BeSt with Shine Canata: by.hero with Movie Bisu: XXX with Guemchi
Jaedong: BeSt with Ruby Iris: BeSt with Crazy-Hydra Kwanro: BeSt vs. Light, (Kwanro vs. Best and forgg vs. Light) hyvaa - Stats (Hwasin - Stats) Calm: Light with Stats | BeSt <-> Hogil | Stats with Light (undo change 1) | Stats with Shine
I think I'd recognize Hwasin (jin-jon-soo), Iris (byun hyung tae), flash (lee young ho), july (park sung jun), and a few others. Spelling above might not be 100% correct though.
On November 19 2009 21:21 cokencheese wrote: I don't get why everything must be this long-winded. Why can't they just pick groups once and be done with it?
you only say that because you don't understand korean :p
On November 19 2009 21:21 cokencheese wrote: I don't get why everything must be this long-winded. Why can't they just pick groups once and be done with it?
On November 19 2009 21:20 Pit667 wrote: konadora plz unban me on you stream i dont flooding now
If you reveal yourself as a stream flooder with your TL id too, I think your reward should be an additional TL ban and not an unban from stream. Just my two cents.
On November 19 2009 21:21 cokencheese wrote: I don't get why everything must be this long-winded. Why can't they just pick groups once and be done with it?
you only say that because you don't understand korean :p
On November 19 2009 21:20 Pit667 wrote: konadora plz unban me on you stream i dont flooding now
If you reveal yourself as a stream flooder with your TL id too, I think your reward should be an additional TL ban and not an unban from stream. Just my two cents.
I second that..
BTW anyone could update how the group look like currently?? if possible..
Improbably enough, there's a decent chance of at least one Bisu vs Savior.
I don't care if it's just ro32, it's the most significant matchup in progaming (sorry but Boxer vs Yellow just doesn't cut it as a pure sideshow anymore). I'm excited.
On November 19 2009 22:05 darktreb wrote: I don't care if it's just ro32, it's the most significant matchup in progaming (sorry but Boxer vs Yellow just doesn't cut it as a pure sideshow anymore). I'm excited.
On November 19 2009 22:05 darktreb wrote: Improbably enough, there's a decent chance of at least one Bisu vs Savior.
I don't care if it's just ro32, it's the most significant matchup in progaming (sorry but Boxer vs Yellow just doesn't cut it as a pure sideshow anymore). I'm excited.
Nowadays this matchup isn't even something special anymore...
A - I actually like BeSt's chances to get out of this one alive. After he loses to Calm, naturally. B - Even with 16 Zergs, how did Hwasin manage to get a 3-Zerg group? C - Really not liking Iris's chances at the moment. But Saint could always fail hard. D - I have a feeling Stats will not manage to pull through this group. Quite possibly July won't either. July AND Stats going through would make my day. E - We could actually see both Protoss in this group go through. Of course Canata and by.hero are dangerous, but still. F - As long as we get a Bisu-Savior game I don't really care. G - ZerO and Kal. Please? H - I don't think he can beat EffOrt, but Ruby might actually pass this stage(!).
This is actually good group placement for all the ZvZ haters out there - although there aren't any 4Z groups, there are a couple of 3 zerg groups, and with Hwasin, Stats and Kal in them. I don't really give Stats much of a chance, but with Hwasin and Kal being pretty good players, as many as 5 zergs could get kicked out of those groups alone.
Jangbi and Effort have some unfinished business since the last ace between khan and CJ, so Im looking forward to that one. Nice of Calm to rescue Best. For a while he was in the Jaedong/July group. His chances of advancing look pretty good. Jaedong vs. July will be entertaining to say the least. Thanks for keeping with the switches Aesop!
On November 19 2009 22:19 LetMeShine wrote: Looks like Hwasin is going to get into the Ro16...again.
He usually does, even in death groups.
Which makes it all the more disappointing. He rips thorugh his Ro32 group even if he's dumped with Flash and Jaedong yet he seems to wet himself and curl up into a ball in the later stages
Dude what the fuck for Stats!? He shows us PvT that beats Fantasy and then gets stuck in a monster ZvP group O_O. Hopefully he can pull something, but I don't like his chances haha.
And ForGG O_O. Probably not going to make it out either with BeSt's PvT and Calm... even Light might beat him (don't know though, ForGG's TvT is still ok)
I think Firefist could advance 2-0 in his group if he beats Jangbi in the first game. He's a solid ZvZ'er and could definitely take a game from Effort...
Lol red sniper gets all zerg group..too bad shine and hogil are fucking on point at the moment, he better play tight. I hope Light and Forgg advance..well especially Light, the way he played last season he deserves to get into a bo3 or bo5, He definitely has the match up skills to take anyone in that group easily, depending on the maps.
On November 20 2009 11:32 mog87 wrote: Lol red sniper gets all zerg group..too bad shine and hogil are fucking on point at the moment, he better play tight. I hope Light and Forgg advance..well especially Light, the way he played last season he deserves to get into a bo3 or bo5, He definitely has the match up skills to take anyone in that group easily, depending on the maps.
Hogil's ZvT has never exactly been uh...good.
Shine..shine might do some damage but Hwasin should beat Hogil no problem.
On November 20 2009 11:32 mog87 wrote: Lol red sniper gets all zerg group..too bad shine and hogil are fucking on point at the moment, he better play tight. I hope Light and Forgg advance..well especially Light, the way he played last season he deserves to get into a bo3 or bo5, He definitely has the match up skills to take anyone in that group easily, depending on the maps.
Hogil's ZvT has never exactly been uh...good.
Shine..shine might do some damage but Hwasin should beat Hogil no problem.
Hes ogn his zvt cant be that bad...and did you see his games vs Sea and Mind, like I said hes on point "at the moment" if he can take Sea and Mind he can take Hwasin, especially if the maps are zerg favoring. I mean just because flash beat him decisively doesn't mean he sucks.
The Bisu-Savior rivalry never really got off the ground. I'd much rather see savior in a different group, especially if he spends all of his time preparing for Bisu and ends up losing to Bogus and GuemChi. It seems if there's a three-way tie for second, Savior might stand a fair chance of getting through, but it's difficult to see him going 2-1 unless he manages to steal another game from Bisu. Here's hoping Bisu is his last opponent.
On November 20 2009 18:26 agen wrote: The Bisu-Savior rivalry never really got off the ground. I'd much rather see savior in a different group, especially if he spends all of his time preparing for Bisu and ends up losing to Bogus and GuemChi. It seems if there's a three-way tie for second, Savior might stand a fair chance of getting through, but it's difficult to see him going 2-1 unless he manages to steal another game from Bisu. Here's hoping Bisu is his last opponent.
You guys do realize that sAviOr won his last 3 or 4 games against Bisu, do you? He also beat GuemChi soundly in the preliminaries. Even IF he should lose to Bogus, which I rightfully doubt, he should have no problem advancing in this group.
On November 20 2009 18:26 agen wrote: The Bisu-Savior rivalry never really got off the ground. I'd much rather see savior in a different group, especially if he spends all of his time preparing for Bisu and ends up losing to Bogus and GuemChi. It seems if there's a three-way tie for second, Savior might stand a fair chance of getting through, but it's difficult to see him going 2-1 unless he manages to steal another game from Bisu. Here's hoping Bisu is his last opponent.
You guys do realize that sAviOr won his last 3 or 4 games against Bisu, do you? He also beat GuemChi soundly in the preliminaries. Even IF he should lose to Bogus, which I rightfully doubt, he should have no problem advancing in this group.
According to the player profile, he one his last two against Bisu...one from the group stages of the Lost Saga MSL which Bisu didn't even qualify from, and lost in a rather spectacular manner (to Savior and Zero, when he was trying to change PvZ style, and failing hard), and one from the All-Star event...I don't think I watched that game, but special events are often not a fair gauge of skill. He did apparently win an OSL game vs Bisu, but lost the series. I dunno, I just don't think Savior's ever won any important games against Bisu, and I can imagine him losing a game to Bogus if he doesn't prepare vT. I can even imagine him losing to GuemChi, though I wouldn't expect it. Either way, I'm hoping he advances, and he very well may. I just don't want to watch mediocre games between all the players who aren't Bisu. Bogus and Savior will hopefully add some flair.
On November 20 2009 18:26 agen wrote: The Bisu-Savior rivalry never really got off the ground. I'd much rather see savior in a different group, especially if he spends all of his time preparing for Bisu and ends up losing to Bogus and GuemChi. It seems if there's a three-way tie for second, Savior might stand a fair chance of getting through, but it's difficult to see him going 2-1 unless he manages to steal another game from Bisu. Here's hoping Bisu is his last opponent.
You guys do realize that sAviOr won his last 3 or 4 games against Bisu, do you? He also beat GuemChi soundly in the preliminaries. Even IF he should lose to Bogus, which I rightfully doubt, he should have no problem advancing in this group.
According to the player profile, he one his last two against Bisu...one from the group stages of the Lost Saga MSL which Bisu didn't even qualify from, and lost in a rather spectacular manner (to Savior and Zero, when he was trying to change PvZ style, and failing hard), and one from the All-Star event...I don't think I watched that game, but special events are often not a fair gauge of skill. He did apparently win an OSL game vs Bisu, but lost the series. I dunno, I just don't think Savior's ever won any important games against Bisu, and I can imagine him losing a game to Bogus if he doesn't prepare vT. I can even imagine him losing to GuemChi, though I wouldn't expect it. Either way, I'm hoping he advances, and he very well may. I just don't want to watch mediocre games between all the players who aren't Bisu. Bogus and Savior will hopefully add some flair.
So a MSL Ro36 game isn't important to you. Especially during the time Bisu was dominating once again?
On November 20 2009 11:32 mog87 wrote: Lol red sniper gets all zerg group..too bad shine and hogil are fucking on point at the moment, he better play tight. I hope Light and Forgg advance..well especially Light, the way he played last season he deserves to get into a bo3 or bo5, He definitely has the match up skills to take anyone in that group easily, depending on the maps.
Hogil's ZvT has never exactly been uh...good.
Shine..shine might do some damage but Hwasin should beat Hogil no problem.
Hogils ZvT is GREAT, it has been since he first debuted around 2007. Hite brings out great zvt'ers (and shit zvp'ers in comparison).
EPT![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/alffla/NATEMSL_banner.jpg)
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Calm 
Iris ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/125.jpg)
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Bisu ![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/images/players/195.jpg)
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It would get ugly. 
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