[SPL] Hwaseung Oz vs MBCGame HERO - Page 14

On November 11 2009 06:00 JWD wrote:

BackHo, HiyA, and Lomo are underperforming no doubt, but not nearly as much as your post seems to suggest. Fact is that BackHo, HiyA and Lomo, despite appearing in the vast majority of Oz's matches last season, were never great performers. In fact, not one of them had a winning record in the 08-09 PL:



(forgive the tooltips)

These numbers tell the story of Oz's 08-09 season: BackHo, HiyA, and Lomo did just well enough to allow Oz to take matches to their 5sets, where Jaedong would take control. Nobody else made any impact (the concentration of appearances amongst these 4 players is just shocking). And, because Jaedong had an absurd winrate, Oz did well enough to snag a playoff seed.

With this understanding of Oz's 08-09 season, it's easy to see why anything short of godliness from JD would doom them to failure: they don't have any other players who can win consistently, and they didn't develop any new talent last season.

On November 11 2009 06:54 SuperArc wrote:


Yeah, I just rewatched JD vs Miracle, Oz sure didnt look like a team who has just won an important match.

On November 11 2009 08:20 Djin)ftw( wrote:


well what do u expect? they all fail, miserably. killer as ace, the rest of the team in their own games. i still don't understand why coach cho tried to create another jd with killer.
imho the only other option hwaseung has is hiya or maybe lomo(lol). they should play ace matches from time to time. whats the point in getting another strong zerg if u have the best zerg in the world, no matter if he is playing at 100% or not.

i still dont get it how JD could be the best starcraft player in the world when having practice partners like this... ah well, on the other hand bisus pvz or storks/jangbis pvt are also quite good t.t

On November 11 2009 08:19 Ver wrote:


Absolutely not. You can't just ignore winners league and say 'these numbers tell the story.'

On November 11 2009 08:27 SuperArc wrote:

well Bisu used to have July as practice partner, but his PvZ dropped a lot since July left :o
His PvP (Best) improved greatly.

On November 11 2009 08:27 SuperArc wrote:


well Bisu used to have July as practice partner, but his PvZ dropped a lot since July left :o
His PvP (Best) improved greatly.

i still dont get it how JD could be the best starcraft player in the world when having practice partners like this... ah well, on the other hand bisus pvz or storks/jangbis pvt are also quite good t.t

On November 11 2009 08:19 Ver wrote:


Absolutely not. You can't just ignore winners league and say 'these numbers tell the story.'

There are a fair number of teams that relied on their ace player more than Oz did Jaedong last season. Flash, Light, Bisu, and Leta. Fact is if Oz was just team Jaedong, they would've been below KT at 8th place, because KT was literally Korea Telecom Flash, and Flash did better than Jaedong (9/5 vs 6/4 in Ace and +2 net overall). But instead Oz finished 2nd. That shows that their support was very strong, one of the strongest in the league in fact. They had to be to do that well because Jaedong was not a particularly consistent Ace match player. So strong actually, that they did better than SKT1 sans Bisu. Before bashing Oz's non-ace players for last season, start with KT's and SKT1's please. Or frankly, every team but STX, and CJ.

So yes, they did do quite well last season and aren't doing acceptable at all now, Jaedong included. Oz has been in the top 2 since 2007. They've done a fantastic job for 2 1/2 years, it's not unreasonable to see that they finally can't maintain it after an extraordinarily length of time.

See here for more details on the 08-09 season:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=105202

On November 11 2009 08:18 Sinensis wrote:
Lomo > Sea
BackHo > han
Jaedong > Saint

Hwaseung OZ < 3 - 0 > MBCGame HERO

This was my prediction...christ was I ever wrong.

On November 11 2009 08:19 Ver wrote:


Absolutely not. You can't just ignore winners league and say 'these numbers tell the story.'

There are a fair number of teams that relied on their ace player more than Oz did Jaedong last season. Flash, Light, Bisu, and Leta. Fact is if Oz was just team Jaedong, they would've been below KT at 8th place, because KT was literally Korea Telecom Flash, and Flash did better than Jaedong (9/5 vs 6/4 in Ace and +2 net overall). But instead Oz finished 2nd. That shows that their support was very strong, one of the strongest in the league in fact. They had to be to do that well because Jaedong was not a particularly consistent Ace match player. So strong actually, that they did better than SKT1 sans Bisu. Before bashing Oz's non-ace players for last season, start with KT's and SKT1's please. Or frankly, every team but STX, and CJ.

So yes, they did do quite well last season and aren't doing acceptable at all now, Jaedong included. Oz has been in the top 2 since 2007. They've done a fantastic job for 2 1/2 years, it's not unreasonable to see that they finally can't maintain it after an extraordinarily length of time.

See here for more details on the 08-09 season:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=105202

On November 12 2009 06:09 meeple wrote:
Just watched the vods of this match... MBC was so happy to win vs JD they were literally jumping for joy when scourge hit.

On November 12 2009 06:27 MrHickoryHam54 wrote:


rofl tough luck dude.

dont worry, oz vs mbc is not the most predictable match.

maybe u'll be correct on ur bets when u predict KT Rolster vs ACE

On November 12 2009 06:30 Chen wrote:

You must be fucking joking. Best 29-13, although most of it was in the first 1/2, Fantasy 28-15. Both were in the top-10 in the entire league in terms of win differential. You cant bash 2 non-ace players performing that well. there is a reason why SKT1 won most of its games 3-1 or 3-0 and Bisu didnt get that many Ace appearances. Hell, thezerg (9-11) and Hyuk (7-10) performed almost as well as Oz's supporting cast.
As for KT, ForGG(14-10), Violet(12-6), and 815(9-4) did quite a bit better than any of Oz's non-JD players, Luxury just omfgwtf failed so badly that the team couldn't make up for it.