• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 04:17
CEST 10:17
KST 17:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21
Community News
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo20Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28)12[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June4
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th Is the larve respawn broken? Yamato Cup Series What kind of tool would you be interested in? Daily SC2 Player Grid - feedback wanted
Tourneys
Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) GSL CK #4 20-21th June Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All Mutation # 529 Opportunities Unleashed
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ STARCRAFT MOVIE - Last Night at the Command center BW General Discussion Battle cruiser feet vs Carrier fleet Fact based Zerg Upgrade Tier List
Tourneys
CSLAN 4 is Coming! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Simple Questions, Simple Answers Relatively freeroll strategies Creating a full chart of Zerg builds
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Nintendo Switch Thread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread [H]Internet/Gaming Cafe Tips and Tricks The Games Industry And ATVI UK Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
McBoner: A hockey love story 2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
How To Predict Tilt in Espor…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7716 users

I an average noob in starcraft....

Forum Index > Brood War Strategy
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
August 11 2007 09:35 GMT
#1
I play Zerg and I am an average noob and my Apm is about 40 something but sometimes i peak 200. Anywayz I have problems with ZvT. Well the most vurneble strategy I go against while playing ZvT is my friend using M&M with Tanks so he can push me way back. Another is at early game i lose my concentration if i get really annoying harassment, so I am wondering how can I stop being harrased too much. Mostly I always fast expand then build another hatchery In my base. So can anyone help me overcome these obstacles?
Daranee
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
338 Posts
August 11 2007 09:39 GMT
#2
you will just have to improve your multitask. Practice mass hotkeying (even your tech buildings) that way you will get comfortable by playing almost entirely with hotkeys instead of your mouse alone. I suspect that you multitask is a big part of the problem. practice buidling units while not looking at your hatchery also. While scouting, build drones by using hotkeys only. i.e hit 3 s d. That should help, once your multitask develops strategy and everything else will come much easier.
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
August 11 2007 09:48 GMT
#3
Well I know how to stack them and micro them a bit, but i think my problem is i don't go on the offense well rather i wait for his attack to finish and then go attack. And another thing i forgot to mention is that i try to use up all minerals i have but u know its a bit hard to concentrate everywhere on the battle field by the end so i forget about them and start to no use them and by the end i have like 1000-2000 unused minerals which is really bad. Most of the time i target their econ and go attack with 8 or 9 stacked mutas and really wear him up, but if i see that that fails i tech up. And i hotkey about 10 hotkeys in the match, my main hatchs and forces that i use alot.
5HITCOMBO
Profile Joined March 2006
Japan2239 Posts
August 11 2007 09:54 GMT
#4
You gotta learn how to improve your handspeed - you should have at LEAST 80 if you want to be competitive on bnet. And it shouldn't be just warmup spam, either, it should be hotkeyed buildings macroing and hotkeyed units microing. Anything else is building or scouting.

You need to keep the terran's numbers containable by your level of tech. Zerg have lots of cheap units, but they're not quite as game-changing without masses of them. So you have to be at mutalisk if you want to keep him in his base early midgame, but if he's well prepared, harass will be hard. At the same time, you need to be teching lurkers. He's still in his base, so you can contain him better than if you were trying to defend with lurkers. He'll need to wait for a tank to break out (or dmatrix if he's a baller, but you should be targeting his units with lurker spines to hit the most infantry anyway). Try to scourge vessels. The longer you can keep him without mass vessel, the better. It's worth getting a spire for NO OTHER REASON than to scourge vessels mid and late game. Chill explains this very well in his ZvT Commentary.

After that, there are two ways to play - one is hard economy while you contain, and then busting out with ultras, and the other is to use defilers. Defilers are SO MUCH HARDER, but they're the better choice by far. Guardian is almost never a good option unless you have mass hydralisk and speed/sight lords, and even then, you should be using ultra hydra defiler (and ling). Muta base runs do sometimes gain big advantages lategame, though, when you can mass up enough to take out a bunker without losing significant mass. Watch out for vessels, though, and get used to splitting irradiated mutas. It's the most important part of muta micro in ZvT, by far.
I live in perpetual fear of terrorists and studio gangsters
5HITCOMBO
Profile Joined March 2006
Japan2239 Posts
August 11 2007 09:55 GMT
#5
Oh and get upgrades as often as you can.
I live in perpetual fear of terrorists and studio gangsters
alffla
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Hong Kong20321 Posts
August 11 2007 10:00 GMT
#6
u should'nt raelly expect your mutalisk 'harassment' to totally kill your opponent lol.
thats why its called harassment

its just for taking out small bits and pieces of his army in the building and damaging his econ as much as you can, as well as keeping his pesky marines and shit inside his own base so as to enable yourself to expand and get GAS!! :D:D

while you're doing mutalisk harass u should be building hydra den if u haven't done so already and getting lurkers.

unless ur trying to do some all in mass mutalisk thing - _-a which is usually not a very good idea unless ur really really good with your mutalisk micro like savior or julyzerg...which i don't thnk you are from your description of yourself
Graphicssavior[gm] : What is a “yawn” rape ;; Masumune - It was the year of the pig for those fucking defilers. Chill - A clinic you say? okum: SC without Korean yelling is like porn without sex. konamix: HAPPY BIRTHDAY MOMMY!
Chill
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
Calgary26001 Posts
August 11 2007 10:03 GMT
#7
ZvT is the hardest matchup to learn. Unlike TvZ micro (used ranged units to run away from melee units then fire), Zerg micro is not intuitive in ZvT. it will take you awhile to figure out what kills what and how. Furthermore, it will take you longer to figure out how to control Zerglings and Lurkers (and less, Mutas) to maximize kills.

There's nothing I can really say to help you immediately. As I said, Zerg versus Terran micro is the hardest in Starcraft. Most of the specific help people are giving you is useless at your level; just keep playing ZvT until you're comfortable at it. As of now, ZvT is my best matchup (despite ZvP bveing rumored as "imbalanced") and the matchup I feel most confident in.

If you ask more specific questions people may be able to help you more.
Moderator
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
August 11 2007 10:49 GMT
#8
Thanks guys for all the info, if i decided to go lurkers at early game which support unit do i send with them?
Daranee
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
338 Posts
August 11 2007 10:51 GMT
#9
lurkers/hydra. Since you're just starting out that micro will be considerably easier for you. Make sure to spread your hydras/lurkers and burrow your lurkers within range of his mnm
alffla
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Hong Kong20321 Posts
Last Edited: 2007-08-11 11:08:28
August 11 2007 11:01 GMT
#10
lurkerling early game. when u get more expos and minerals and gas are pumping in by the truckload change to hydraling

hydralurk takes a lot of gas :\\

acutally i dunno i've just never tried hydraurk from just my nat -_-a wtf
Graphicssavior[gm] : What is a “yawn” rape ;; Masumune - It was the year of the pig for those fucking defilers. Chill - A clinic you say? okum: SC without Korean yelling is like porn without sex. konamix: HAPPY BIRTHDAY MOMMY!
red.venom
Profile Joined October 2002
United States4651 Posts
August 11 2007 11:40 GMT
#11
Focus on macro and get a small circle of buddies around and hopefully above your skill level. Improve with them. When you get a bit better and tighten up your game start laddering.

The only thing that really matters is to play a lot. Anyone who is quite good played a shit load to get that way.

Analyze reps you lose in as well. This will help you see timings and openings in yourself and your opponent.
Broom
red.venom
Profile Joined October 2002
United States4651 Posts
August 11 2007 11:41 GMT
#12
On August 11 2007 19:51 Daranee wrote:
lurkers/hydra. Since you're just starting out that micro will be considerably easier for you. Make sure to spread your hydras/lurkers and burrow your lurkers within range of his mnm


Oh and I was gonna say this too.

At low low level using mutas or trying to do nuanced high level strats is really pointless. Go with bold shit, learn how to expand your ass off and power and be greedy.
Broom
H
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
New Zealand6138 Posts
August 11 2007 11:56 GMT
#13
On a somewhat related note, does your APM climb higher as you get better? Or is it just one of those things encompassed in "innate talent" that everyone has a set amount of?
[iHs]HCO | のヮの | pachi & plexa ownz | RIP _
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
August 11 2007 12:04 GMT
#14
[url blocked]
This is a match i played with one of my friends, although I won, I played super crapily lol.
Try and watch it and feel free to criticize as much as you want.
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
August 11 2007 12:21 GMT
#15
Even better I got a replay pack with some of my games in it, some are recent others were really old. Anywayz try them and criticize if you want.
[url blocked]
PiSCeS
Profile Joined June 2007
Canada80 Posts
August 11 2007 13:02 GMT
#16
On August 11 2007 20:56 H_ wrote:
On a somewhat related note, does your APM climb higher as you get better? Or is it just one of those things encompassed in "innate talent" that everyone has a set amount of?


It rises as you get better.
I started playing at the start of the summer and my APM was at like.. 25ish on my first game, but now I get about 110-120 on almost all my matches.
It's nothing that a good amount of practice can't help.
"After today, this is the only site you'll ever visit."
sc0rchedst0rm
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
Ireland176 Posts
August 11 2007 13:04 GMT
#17
Yeah, APM increases over time. When I started playing Starcraft again back in May after a long hiatus my APM was only about 30. Now it's around 100. I was averaging 150-180 for a while but I realised I was mostly spamming pointless actions, when I calmed down a bit I found I was getting much better results even with lower APM.
Kill a man, you're a murderer. Kill 100 men, you're a hero. Kill 1000 men, LVL UP!!!
ahk-gosu
Profile Joined July 2004
Korea (South)2099 Posts
August 11 2007 15:33 GMT
#18
what i do with mutalisks is i use them to harass as much as i can and when the terran has turrets or mnm set up i just mix the mutalisks into my ling army.

so lurker lingmuta and then try to get hive with ultralisks. you should try to harass the terran as much as you can too. use lurkers on cliffs or lurkers near their mineral line.
Micro.Macro.Scouting.Harassment.
jkillashark
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
United States5262 Posts
August 11 2007 15:58 GMT
#19
StarCraft isn't a porno dude. You don't click play and just watch, you gotta keep clicking constantly tapping away at your keyboard.

If you have 40 APM, you're somebody who's attack clicking and WATCHING. Keep yourself occupied.
Do your best, God will do the rest.
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
August 11 2007 16:02 GMT
#20
Thanks people I appreciate all your comments.
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 43m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Larva 183
Leta 150
Hm[arnc] 95
actioN 92
Soma 69
soO 23
Noble 16
NaDa 14
League of Legends
JimRising 594
Counter-Strike
summit1g10672
shoxiejesuss646
Other Games
Gorgc655
ceh9522
KnowMe68
Pyrionflax30
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream4928
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream1724
Other Games
gamesdonequick967
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 18
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 9
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1557
• Jankos1235
• Stunt669
• HappyZerGling117
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Weekly
2h 43m
Monday Night Weeklies
7h 43m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 1h
The PondCast
2 days
Douyu Cup 2020
2 days
Oliveira vs Trap
Jieshi vs XY
soO vs FanTaSy
TY vs Coffee
Douyu Cup 2020
3 days
Neeb vs Impact
MacSed vs Cyan
Scarlett vs Kelazhur
INnoVation vs Dear
Douyu Cup 2020
4 days
Maestros of the Game
5 days
herO vs Classic
Maru vs Serral
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
5 days
Douyu Cup 2020
5 days
[ Show More ]
BSL22 NKC (BSL vs China)
6 days
Online Event
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4
WardiTV Spring 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 1
SCTL 2026 Spring
Maestros of the Game 2
Murky Cup 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026

Upcoming

CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
Douyu Cup 2026
BCC 2026
Light HT
Heroes Pulsing #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.