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On February 27 2009 06:26 Monsen wrote:It's true- Savior never excelled at ZvZ- that's probably why his time of dominance was when every other Zerg got killed off by Terrans. Still I'm sad to see him amongst the "decent" players. I liked Savior most of all the Bonjwas, as his style was no less dominant but consisted of always walking the edge to surmount a lead. Made for such nailbiters back then (Iris game 5 anyone?). With Boxer the fun was in wondering what freaky build he had cooked up this time- with Nada how many tanks he'd fill the screen with and Oov how many tanks he'd fill the screen with in under 10 minutes  .
with oov, how many screens he'd fill tanks with? :p
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Wow this was a good read.
I agree with the author on the fact that Savior didn't "have to happen". Yes, he brought about timings to the game, but it's not like the game was at a simplistic (poor word but I can't think of the right one right now) point in time like it was before macro, or before they hybrid evolved. Like Jordan, he just was there. I think the comparison to Jordan was perfect. Savior will never win the most titles or win the most games, but he will always be one of the greatest.
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THe OP gets it right with savior's je ne sais quoi. Air Jordan is a valid comparison in terms of what he brought the playing field, viz. an ethereal quality that would influence all subsequent generations whether they were conscious of it or not.
Plexa is doing right to point out that savior's practical weapon is(was) timing. The OP mentions the fundamental elements of SC as micro and macro. But as SC is a dynamic and thus in motion there is also the Z axis of time. Timing and Ma Jae Yoon's understanding thereof influenced the next generation just as much as lim yo hwan micro influenced jaedong. certainly there is no direct evidence of this but if one looks to the current metagame they shall see how Savior's 2006 play brought the recognition and study of timing to the forefront in a similar manner as Lim Yo Hwan did for micro and Chio Yeon Sung for macro in previous years.
great topic and OP was written well
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I remembered the Hwaesung CJ SWL, and some actually wanted a sAviOr vs Jaedong. Reality check, Jaedong is a lot better than sAviOr in recent ZvZ.
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well sad for savior,our maestro is well....dunno what to say,hopefuly he will crush more in WL
and...
+ Show Spoiler +
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Winning a good deal of games in Proleague against strong oponents and reaching MSL Ro8.
I would call that a good start of the year for Savior after being that bad.
There are ten months left after all, he may even win a starleague.
For destroying everyone well he may has exaggerated a bit ...
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good read, i should check the old vods again!
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I really hated Savior when he was raping everyone, but for an year now I support him almost every game.
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The level of mechanics have improve so much since the era of Savior. I didn't feel Savior would be able to beat Zero straightup in zvz, especially in a bo5 unless Savior did something unorthodox which was what happened. Savior is just not improving enough mechanically.
At least Savior made it out of group stage.
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On February 28 2009 06:58 [X]Ken_D wrote:
The level of mechanics have improve so much since the era of Savior. I didn't feel Savior would be able to beat Zero straightup in zvz, especially in a bo5 unless Savior did something unorthodox which was what happened. Savior is just not improving enough mechanically. He played Flash on ICCup and Flash thought it was Jaedong.
I don't think it has anything to do with mechanics... There's something going on upstairs, with his confidence.
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On February 28 2009 07:02 Zozma wrote:Show nested quote +On February 28 2009 06:58 [X]Ken_D wrote:
The level of mechanics have improve so much since the era of Savior. I didn't feel Savior would be able to beat Zero straightup in zvz, especially in a bo5 unless Savior did something unorthodox which was what happened. Savior is just not improving enough mechanically. He played Flash on ICCup and Flash thought it was Jaedong. I don't think it has anything to do with mechanics... There's something going on upstairs, with his confidence.
We never seen that game. For all we know, it could be Savior getting a huge ass lead then falling apart to where Flash makes a comeback when he shouldn't. His confidence? He has been bonjwa and played on live stage for a long time. It has everything to do with his mechanics not being good enough. However, making it into the RO8 is a huge accomplishment for anyone.
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I truly feel the OP as I feel the same way to myself.... I have finally returned and came back home after meeting sAviOr that day (check my previous post) and at the moment, I felt really excited and had a sense that he would do well in 2009 and that he won't disappoint us with his words that he stated back in 2008.
It's true, sAviOr "didn't had to happen" but the truth is, he did happen and now that it did happen, he needs to happen again. I suppose this is my view and my fanboyism for sAviOr but he needs to happen... why? because I believe... we believe... and he believes... that in 2009, a certain progamer said a certain statement that he will destroy EVERYONE in 2009..... and that man is Ma Jae Yoon....
I haven't given up yet and I'm sure neither would a whole number of other sAviOr fans and I'm sure MJY himself hasn't given up yet... he may not become what he used to be back in those days but I believe he will move on and continue his destiny and role that is set up for him in 2009, in 2010, and for that it matters, even in 2050.. (gosh, would Starcraft even exist in that day?? o.O)
Like I have stated before, I will state again to sAviOr as he has stated to us back in Blizzcon in 2008, I believe Ma Jae Yoon will destroy everyone in 2009!
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For me...waking up and finding out that Savior had defeated Bisu in January was probably the most excited I've ever felt over a video game.
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The question is whether Savior will come back after his recent losses; he could potentially get depressed again and slump just as hard, if not harder, than before.
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Why does everyone on TL have such an abundant flair for the dramatic. Its a game people good players will always be good or at least fun to watch. When was the last time a pro-sports athlete was given one of these funerals while still in the league. Jesus.
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On March 01 2009 12:29 keV. wrote:
Why does everyone on TL have such an abundant flair for the dramatic. Its a game people good players will always be good or at least fun to watch. When was the last time a pro-sports athlete was given one of these funerals while still in the league. Jesus.
Because you have no soul. If you had a passion you would understand.
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On March 01 2009 12:31 eatmyshorts5 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2009 12:29 keV. wrote:
Why does everyone on TL have such an abundant flair for the dramatic. Its a game people good players will always be good or at least fun to watch. When was the last time a pro-sports athlete was given one of these funerals while still in the league. Jesus. Because you have no soul. If you had a passion you would understand.
Way to completely miss the point. I'm sure signing death warrants on a player who just made it to the ro8 (BEATING GOOD PLAYERS) is a much better way to demonstrate my passion.
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On March 01 2009 12:34 keV. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2009 12:31 eatmyshorts5 wrote:On March 01 2009 12:29 keV. wrote:
Why does everyone on TL have such an abundant flair for the dramatic. Its a game people good players will always be good or at least fun to watch. When was the last time a pro-sports athlete was given one of these funerals while still in the league. Jesus. Because you have no soul. If you had a passion you would understand. Way to completely miss the point. I'm sure signing death warrants on a player who just made it to the ro8 (BEATING GOOD PLAYERS) is a much better way to demonstrate my passion.
I don't think you understand. Did we actually sign a death warrant? Have you actually read the posts the people on this thread have posted? The original poster said that HE believes that Savior will not win another starleague but many others say that he still has the flair, and that if he's willing to keep being diligent he will succed.
And way to take life to seriously....
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On March 01 2009 12:36 eatmyshorts5 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 01 2009 12:34 keV. wrote:On March 01 2009 12:31 eatmyshorts5 wrote:On March 01 2009 12:29 keV. wrote:
Why does everyone on TL have such an abundant flair for the dramatic. Its a game people good players will always be good or at least fun to watch. When was the last time a pro-sports athlete was given one of these funerals while still in the league. Jesus. Because you have no soul. If you had a passion you would understand. Way to completely miss the point. I'm sure signing death warrants on a player who just made it to the ro8 (BEATING GOOD PLAYERS) is a much better way to demonstrate my passion. I don't think you understand. Did we actually sign a death warrant? Have you actually read the posts the people on this thread have posted? The original poster said that HE believes that Savior will not win another starleague but many others say that he still has the flair, and that if he's willing to keep being diligent he will succed. And way to take life to seriously....
I was referring to the original poster.
"It will never happen again." = I don't think it will happen again?
The whole point of my post was that people are either saying he's dead or he will ascend to the heavens. I'm just wondering where the in-between people are, when I saw the loss against zero I saw two good players playing and one over coming the other. As he was statistically expected to. I'm not saying savior is dead or going to destroy everyone. Just that he made it far into a tournament and lost to a better ZvZer. That is all I see, this doesn't indicate his "last hurrah" to me. Its sort of ironic that people blame pressure on a savior loss, the same pressure they knowingly create in these sorts of threads.
Just my 2cents.
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Some of us feel that these "overly dramatic" tributes are a nice way to honour and discuss one of the best SC players of all time. If you're the type who simply likes looking at his statistics and going "hmm yes he was statistically expected to win, of course hrm *twiddles fingers*" then by all means go ahead.
For others of us, progamers are more than numbers
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.ygosu.com/editor/attach/board_yeobgi/49a7113eaba54.jpg)
