EPTProleague 11-12 Preseason Power Rank - Page 4
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infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
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Harem
United States11393 Posts
On November 05 2011 10:51 Carnivorous Sheep wrote: In the end nothing is gonna change, KT and SKT are still 1-2 everyone else still sucks. CJ overrated Effort is gonna retire in less than 6 months after going 0-5 or something in proleague. Dream Team looks solid, still gonna go barely 50/50 in games. Jaedong sucks now. Sea's OK but not great, plenty of comparable players floating around out there and plenty better. Baby has always sucked Killer's not actually good, it'll be a miracle if Jaehoon Tyson go above 40 percent winrates. Khan closest to giving KT SKT a run for their money but Stork still sucks. Rest of the team is solid though. STX sucks more than anyone and is the worst team ever though. 8th place here we come. Wow Cheep, you don't even believe in your own team. Tsk tsk. (Of course how could you so it's understandable that you feel this way.) | ||
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Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
On November 05 2011 12:27 infinity2k9 wrote: Why would KT be top when all you can say about their other players is 'they are good sometimes'. Just on paper alone, CJ seems like easily the strongest with EffOrt back. It's a ridiculous lineup. That's probably op's opinion about kt previous run ,however I think it's too fast to come to a conclusion kt performance solely on two proleague wins. I need to see how they perform the first few months .. | ||
Kiett
United States7639 Posts
On November 05 2011 12:27 infinity2k9 wrote: Why would KT be top when all you can say about their other players is 'they are good sometimes'. Just on paper alone, CJ seems like easily the strongest with EffOrt back. It's a ridiculous lineup. Probably because that's the same thing you would have been able to say about them in 2010. And in 2011. Look who won both years. | ||
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CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
On November 05 2011 12:27 infinity2k9 wrote: Why would KT be top when all you can say about their other players is 'they are good sometimes'. Just on paper alone, CJ seems like easily the strongest with EffOrt back. It's a ridiculous lineup. We learned last Proleague that "just on paper alone" doesn't measure up. Snow broke my heart with his level of play. ;_; On November 05 2011 12:14 Kiante wrote: i use stats from their most recent games. you pull on information over the whole season. form slumps are about recent form. My points of data are relevant, and yours aren't. bisu may have failed to qualify for the OSL but his last 10 games he's lost only one. meanwhile jaedong lost his last two games of the season to hyvaa and hyuk. hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm See if I go back 2 games, then Jaedong has gone 0-2. If I go back 10 games, he suddenly becomes 8-2. And if I go back 12 10-2, with a 9-1 record in PL and a 9 game winning streak. Currently Bisu only has a 5 game winning streak in PL while going 9-1 as well. If I'm referring to OSL group games, then Jaedong has only gone 1-2 and seems to be in a slump. Funny thing is Bisu didn't lose any group games because he wasn't good enough to get to the groups, which is far more pathetic than merely failing to advance from it. So choose whatever form of cherry-picking you want. Either Jaedong performed just as well as Bisu in PL, or Jaedong outplayed Bisu to get to the point where losses are actually recorded in TLPD for the OSL. Either way it takes far more than 2 BO1's spread over 2 weeks to tell if a player is slumping or not. "Jaedong is slumping" indicates a much longer time period than you're quoting. For the record, I do think Jaedong is slumping hard in his ZvZ. But you're not exactly proving it with such a small sample size. | ||
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infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
I predict Jaedong to be the top PL player this time. With finally some top quality backup he won't need to be sent out very predictably and prepared for well. If the coaches are good hopefully he can be in a Bisu like situation; trying to catch out other teams with a ZvP. And maybe him and BaBy can both push their TvZ to new heights which is a scary thought. Edit; also remember in regards to KT this year, there's less 'easy wins' in PL this time. Aside from ACE and prehaps to some extent STX; everyone else is pretty strong this time. You got 3 whole games per round against somewhat weaker teams gone. | ||
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Fionn
United States23455 Posts
On November 05 2011 12:27 infinity2k9 wrote: Why would KT be top when all you can say about their other players is 'they are good sometimes'. Just on paper alone, CJ seems like easily the strongest with EffOrt back. It's a ridiculous lineup. Because they have the best player in the world and are the only back-to-back champions in Proleague history. They also just added a strong secondary terran for Flash and a promising protoss rookie. If Flash plays like he is Flash, then KT will end up in the finals for the third straight year. I believe in Flash, Stats, Mind, Wooki and the battery of zerg. Except for Action. I never believe in Action. | ||
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infinity2k9
United Kingdom2397 Posts
If EffOrt is back to form (it sounds like he never really stopped playing for long), then with the new team arrangements every team except ACE/STX has a player who can give Flash a good challenge in BO1 matches (Jangbi 4-4, Stork 10-9, Jaedong 23-21, ZerO 4-7 (3-1 in PL), BeSt 6-7 (5-4 in PL), EffOrt 6-6, even Calm on STX is 3-3 in PL games). He's now also prehaps the most predictable ace player now JD has a better team, so that makes him the obvious target for one player to solely practice for on 1 map. Both MBC/FOX gone means 2 less teams with no good ace, and 'new Oz' more likely to actually get to ace. Over the whole season that's a big difference. | ||
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aimaimaim
Philippines2167 Posts
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villageidiot
353 Posts
On November 05 2011 15:08 aimaimaim wrote: wow .. STX fans needs lighten up. O.o How about just Kalm down? | ||
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Ideas
United States8180 Posts
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Iplaythings
Denmark9110 Posts
At this point they can only perform better than people expeoct them to. KT es da best team allways (so is my bias)... In WL and Playoffs, other than that we are pretty inconsistent in when we decide to win.. Hopefully Hoejja and Stats keep their mojo so they can support flash... Then theres the next line of Mind, Wooki, Action (this is his breakout season, just wait for it!), Perfective, Tempest and Wooki... Excited about that wooki guy  I dont see SKT doing worse or better, but that depends on Fantasy and Bisu... Cus if either of them decides to not continue their hot streaks from last year SKT1 is gonna fall. Woongjin and Khan is probally gonna be what they were last year, middle teams who probally beats the top teams from time to time.. and then there is ACE which I just dont know about.. Dream team and CJ are 2 teams which looks amazing on paper... just dont know if they can live up to their potential.. my 2 cents  On November 05 2011 13:36 Fionn wrote: Because they have the best player in the world and are the only back-to-back champions in Proleague history. They also just added a strong secondary terran for Flash and a promising protoss rookie. If Flash plays like he is Flash, then KT will end up in the finals for the third straight year. I believe in Flash, Stats, Mind, Wooki and the battery of zerg. Except for Action. I never believe in Action. I still dotn get why people bash Action who has a bad and then fucking awesome potential but a guy like crazy-hydra who hasn't really performed well at all on KT gets no trash from people who like a team for only liking the top players.. Frankly disappointment is not a feeling far away from what feel towards that.. | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
On November 05 2011 12:27 infinity2k9 wrote: Why would KT be top when all you can say about their other players is 'they are good sometimes'. Just on paper alone, CJ seems like easily the strongest with EffOrt back. It's a ridiculous lineup. Because on paper, KT beat CJ 8-4 in the playoffs? Unless Effort accounts for 2 wins a match (which is basically saying Effort is favored vs Flash), then I don't see how you can say he makes a big enough change to be what vaults CJ over KT. On November 05 2011 12:45 infinity2k9 wrote: Well Winners league may not even be 2 rounds this time. Plus the issue with Flash and if he will fully recover or not. I feel like Flash had past his peak already last season personally.. i think most would agree he was at his best in 2010. At the end of last season he was already starting to drop games to the best players in every matchup much more than in 2010, Jaedong even on a 4 game winstreak against him. I predict Jaedong to be the top PL player this time. With finally some top quality backup he won't need to be sent out very predictably and prepared for well. If the coaches are good hopefully he can be in a Bisu like situation; trying to catch out other teams with a ZvP. And maybe him and BaBy can both push their TvZ to new heights which is a scary thought. Edit; also remember in regards to KT this year, there's less 'easy wins' in PL this time. Aside from ACE and prehaps to some extent STX; everyone else is pretty strong this time. You got 3 whole games per round against somewhat weaker teams gone. This applies to everyone so I don't get that. Hell, KT lost to ace a couple of times. On November 05 2011 15:02 infinity2k9 wrote: It sounds like it's staying BO7, in which case that lineup doesn't look particularly strong over the other teams though. They already struggled in regular PL last season, now there's 3 weaker teams out of the question and 1 harder team instead. Even if there is 2 rounds of WL again this year, that's going to be harder in general too. We don't even know how Flash is going to do after surgery at the moment. Last year they were 3rd helped heavily by the WL, this year the competition will be much tighter. I think the new team, with Jaedong and real quality backup has as much potential as KT, at least. If EffOrt is back to form (it sounds like he never really stopped playing for long), then with the new team arrangements every team except ACE/STX has a player who can give Flash a good challenge in BO1 matches (Jangbi 4-4, Stork 10-9, Jaedong 23-21, ZerO 4-7 (3-1 in PL), BeSt 6-7 (5-4 in PL), EffOrt 6-6, even Calm on STX is 3-3 in PL games). He's now also prehaps the most predictable ace player now JD has a better team, so that makes him the obvious target for one player to solely practice for on 1 map. Both MBC/FOX gone means 2 less teams with no good ace, and 'new Oz' more likely to actually get to ace. Over the whole season that's a big difference. Stats is better than anyone of Jaedong's supporting cast and a much more viable ace option. | ||
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Taekwon
United States8155 Posts
For one, hyvaa retired and I'd definately place ACE over stx | ||
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mustaju
Estonia4505 Posts
On November 05 2011 23:45 Taekwon wrote: For one, hyvaa retired What?!? When? | ||
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Sawamura
Malaysia7602 Posts
That's what I reacted too yeah when did hyvaa retired he was doing quite well in proleague and individual league.. | ||
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Ryo
8787 Posts
On November 05 2011 23:45 Taekwon wrote: I have a LOT of problems with this list... For one, hyvaa retired and I'd definately place ACE over stx Are you sure? Guy next to Bogus in the photo (taken 22nd Oct) looks like Hyvaa to me: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/M6teH.jpg) | ||
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lynx.oblige
Sierra Leone2268 Posts
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red4ce
United States7313 Posts
#1: SKT - I think people are forgetting just how dominant SKT was last year. They easily had the best record and I don't see why that would change, unless the protoss QQ is true and the new maps are bad for Protoss. #2: Kespa - Arguably stronger than SKT on paper. Gonna give SKT the benefit of the doubt but it would not surprise me at all if they dominated right out of the gate. BW is ultimately a 1v1 game and things like team chemistry don't really matter as much as some people think they would. #3: CJ - I was going to drop them to 4th, but then I remembered Effort was coming back. Effort's upset win over Flash in the OSL has made people forget that Effort wasn't really all that great in proleague in 2010. Nonetheless his return can only mean good things for a CJ team whose zerg line consisted solely of Hydra last year. #4: KT - It was tough for me choosing between CJ and KT for #3, but I think it will take a few months for Flash to be in form so until then I think 4th is a good spot. The addition of Mind is big and that's what separates KT from Khan and Stars. #5: Khan - With Jangbi's renaissance and the addition of Roro I could see Khan as high as #3. Unfortunately they're still vulnerable against zergs and not particularly deep. #6: Woongjin - A solid team with Zero and Light, but they didn't make any huge gains from the BW consolidation and other teams got stronger while Woongjin stayed the same. #7: STX - Definitely the weakest of the non-Ace teams, and then they lost Kal. Not going to be a good year for STX unless Bogus takes a big step in his development. #8: ACE - Such a shame. With the addition of Kal and Great this might be the best ACE team ever. Had the BW crisis not happened this team had a legitimate shot at the playoffs. As it is, ACE still has a chance of not getting 8th place, which would still be quite an accomplishment for them. Winner's League #1: KT - Flash *should* be back up to 100% by the time Winner's league rolls around and whatever team he plays on will always be the favorite in winner's league format #2: SKT - The only team with 2 bonafide S-class players #3: Dream Team - Jaedong, but with backup. Holy shit. #4: CJ - With all their matchup specialists, CJ are the team best equipped to take down TLS. #5: Woongjin - Zero and Light are 2 of the best non-S class players, but they themselves can be sniped easily. #6: Khan - Best players are simply too vulnerable to zerg snipers #7: STX - Poor STX #8: ACE - Poor Ace | ||
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Necosarius
Sweden4042 Posts
On November 05 2011 03:52 Gann1 wrote: I didn't forget him, I just made a bad joke. You evil man. | ||
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