• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:32
CEST 13:32
KST 20:32
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Holding On6Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4)5TL.net Map Contest #21 - Finalists4Team TLMC #5: Vote to Decide Ladder Maps!0[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Mile High15
Community News
5.0.15 Balance Patch Notes (Live version)44$2,500 WardiTV TL Map Contest Tournament 150Stellar Fest: StarCraft II returns to Canada10Weekly Cups (Sept 22-28): MaxPax double, Zerg wins, PTR12BSL Season 217
StarCraft 2
General
5.0.15 Balance Patch Notes (Live version) Stellar Fest: StarCraft II returns to Canada SC2 5.0.15 PTR Patch Notes + Sept 22nd update Had to smile :) Weekly Cups (Sept 22-28): MaxPax double, Zerg wins, PTR
Tourneys
Stellar Fest Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $2,500 WardiTV TL Map Contest Tournament 15 LANified! 37: Groundswell, BYOC LAN, Nov 28-30 2025 Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 493 Quick Killers Mutation # 492 Get Out More Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight
Brood War
General
Flash On JaeDongs ASL Struggles & Perseverance ASL20 General Discussion Thoughts on rarely used units Any rep analyzer that shows resources situation? Recent recommended BW games
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro8 Day 4 [ASL20] Ro8 Day 3 3D!Community Brood War Super Cup №3 BSL Team Wars - Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta I am doing this better than progamers do. Simple Questions, Simple Answers Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy)
Other Games
General Games
Dawn of War IV Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Liquipedia App: Now Covering SC2 and Brood War!
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club! The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final
Blogs
Mental Health In Esports: Wo…
TrAiDoS
[AI] Sorry, Chill, My Bad :…
Peanutsc
Try to reverse getting fired …
Garnet
[ASL20] Players bad at pi…
pullarius1
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1861 users

[MSL] Ro4 Previews, ABCMart MSL

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
]343[
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States10328 Posts
May 26 2011 05:32 GMT
#1
[image loading]
Thanks to disciple for the banner!


Hello all again. I'm ]343[ with yet another set of good excuses for why we don't have a real MSL post out before the Jaedong vs Zero match that's happening today! Though we're out of school now, I have work, flamewheel's been off at TL HQ (lucky... congratulate him on becoming blue!), nbaker has written something, but not enough for a whole post, and contagi0n (who we are borrowing from the non-existent OSL) has disappeared to some exotic land for a while. So umm... sorry!

Also, I decided to waste my 5000th post on this because I have nothing better to talk about [except maybe math, but no one wants to hear about that... plus I don't know any math. Maybe if I had actually learned Galois theory instead of half-learning it I can maybe tell you the Main Theorem and some stuff about automorphism groups... ugh. Should've brought my algebra book home T.T] Be sure to check out my 4999th post as well, which did not contribute at all to the thread, but may prove amusing to some of you.

Now for your viewing / arguing / flaming pleasure, without further ado, here's my set of predictions for the Semifinals of the ABCMart MSL!




Semifinal Predictions





Match A:
May 26, 2011, 1800 KST
(Z)Jaedong <Dante's Peak SE> (Z)ZerO
(Z)Jaedong <Circuit Breaker> (Z)ZerO
(Z)Jaedong <La Mancha> (Z)ZerO
(Z)Jaedong <Monte Cristo> (Z)ZerO
(Z)Jaedong <Dante's Peak SE> (Z)ZerO

May 26th 18:00 KST

Jaedong ZvZ
Overall: 153-51 (75.00%)
Last 10: 6-4 (L W W W W L W L W L)

ZerO ZvZ
Overall: 83-82 (50.30%)
Last 10: 6-4 (L W W L L W W L W W)

Head-to-head*: Jaedong 11-4 ZerO


       We kick off the MSL Semifinals with yet another ZvZ Bo5. It's the second this season, sixth this year, and twelfth since Calm won the Avalon MSL two years ago. Bleargh. At least a few have been interesting--Calm vs Jaedong in Avalon and Great vs ZerO in PDPop come to mind--so hopefully this one will exceed our expectations for the "coin-flip" micro-fest that is ZvZ.

       The big favorite, as usual, is our KeSPA #1, Power Rank #1, all-time best ZvZer Lee Jae Dong. Boasting a peak ZvZ ELO of 2341 (the second-best Zerg killer of all time, edged out only by Flash; higher than Bisu's PvZ peak by 25 points and the next best ZvZer, YellOw, by 92), three separate 10+-game ZvZ win streaks in his career, and an amazing 35-7 (83%) record in the year leading up to his ELO peak--all in what is considered the biggest coinflip matchup in Brood War--JvZ has always been a wonder to behold. Alas, the Dong has fallen off recently, winning only 63% of his ZvZs this year!... How terrible for Jaedong! Sarcasm aside, and more pertinently, Jaedong dropped a ZvZ Bo5 just last season to Hydra, while losing 3 of his last 5 mirror matchups. People have called him "shaky" in the matchup. Boo-hoo. Jaedong is still Jaedong, and it would be a huge upset if he dropped the series.

       Is ZerO the man to pull it off, just as Hydra did last year? Unfortunately, Kim Myung Woon has been cursed by an eternal 50% win rate in his mirror matchup.
From the MSL Ro8 Interview by doothegee:
- Do you know that both your career ZvZ rate and MSL rate are at 50%?
▲ Really was known for always staying at a 50% win rate, and I think it's become worse after he moved to our team. Recently he's been complaining that his bed is uncomfortable and sleeping in my bed instead, and I think I got his energy when he did that. Of course, I don't sleep with him, and I run away to some other room (laughs).


       But who doesn't love Zero, especially for quotes like the one above and for being so cute (except + Show Spoiler [here] +
[image loading]
)? More importantly, when the Prince of Queens is on his game, he can beat anyone. (On second thought, why'd I include Stork there? Zero hasn't lost to Stork in a while...) So I hope Zero brings his A-game Thursday, like he did in the quarterfinals, for his own sake and the sake of all the fans.

       But really, I don't think the Queen of Zerg will take out the Tyrant (so chauvinistic of me ). I predict he'll end up at 50% again. Too bad he passed 50-50 when he beat Calm...

Prediction: Jaedong 3-2 ZerO


*In KeSPA-sanctioned games.



Match B:
June 2, 2011, 1800 KST
(Z)Hydra <La Mancha> (T)Flash
(Z)Hydra <Monte Cristo> (T)Flash
(Z)Hydra <Circuit Breaker> (T)Flash
(Z)Hydra <Dante's Peak SE> (T)Flash
(Z)Hydra <La Mancha> (T)Flash

Hydra ZvT:
Overall: 20-15 (57.14%)
Last 10: 6-4 (L W W L L L W W W W)

Flash TvZ:
Overall: 131-55 (70.43%)
Last 10: 8-2 (W W W W L W L W W W)

Head-to-head: Hydra 0-1 Flash


       The defending MSL champion faces off against the other best vZ player of all time. FvZ is a bit different from JvZ though, since Flash has the advantage of a more stable matchup. He has lost to only 10 Zergs since being eliminated from the Incruit OSL by GGPlay. That was October 2008. Other than his few random losses--featuring a failed 8rax against Hyuk, a tough loss to Battle Royal OversKy, and unexpectely inspired play by hyvaa and HyuN--Flash has, in that timespan, lost only to Jaedong (against whom he is 17-14), EffOrt (6-6), Calm (6-4), Kwanro (8-3), Zero (3-3), and YellOw[ArnC] (2-1). He's played epic games against five of those latter six (all except YarnC who's a match-fixer anyway... sigh.) But like Jaedong, Flash is faltering just a bit compared to his usual invincible play; JD tore him apart in their last two meetings. Despite his W's, his play against Zerg recently has just seemed... not quite as terrifying as it could have been. I'd like to blame his wrist and all, but maybe he's just getting figured out.

Hydra, on the other hand, has been putting rumors of his weak ZvT to rest, scalping Mind, Bogus (did you know Bogus is actually pretty good!?), and even Light in the past month. Even more impressively, he played really well! Hydra ran the gamut from early lings against Light to beating Mind's late mechanic on La Mancha of all maps (and in case you didn't know, mech is why La Mancha is 26-18 TvZ...), showing that perhaps he has a chance after all. And of course, Hydra's goal this MSL is clearly to take out all the TBLS; he's already knocked out the Protoss ones, directly or otherwise, and his eye is on the goal. Effort's around to help, too, so don't count Hydra out quite yet. This is shaping up to be a great series.

I'd still rather not see a ZvZ final though (even if it's a Hydra vs Jaedong rematch.) And I'm sure Flash wouldn't either.

Prediction: Flash 3-2 Hydra


Writer
Kiante
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Australia7069 Posts
May 26 2011 05:38 GMT
#2
<]343[>spam spam http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=226656
<]343[> by spam i mean not spam
Doing as directed!

sick write up tho. i think jaedong vs zero is about the best possible zvz that could happen right now :O
jvf finals plz!
if hydra beats flash i'll cry myself to sleep each night for a month
Writer
Trizz
Profile Joined June 2010
Netherlands1318 Posts
May 26 2011 05:38 GMT
#3
Bleh, I need to go to bed soon and I'm sad that I'm missing this :<.
I'm predicting a 3-1 for both JD and Flash though.
nope
NicksonReyes
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Philippines4431 Posts
May 26 2011 05:40 GMT
#4
I'm worried for Flash . I hope that his wrist/pinky problems are not that much serious.
+ Show Spoiler +
It's kinda ok if Flash loses this because ABC mart MSL Champion doesn't sound that awesome but Go Flash Go!!!
"Start yo" -FlaSh
Crunchums
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States11144 Posts
May 26 2011 05:41 GMT
#5
Flash better win because ZvZ finals are lame
JD should win too
Flash and JD can produce epic games, just not very frequently, let's roll the dice one more time baby!
brood war for life, brood war forever
RaLakedaimon
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1564 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-26 05:46:47
May 26 2011 05:46 GMT
#6
I'm sure Flash's wrist wont keep him from kicking ass but if somehow he had any issues and it was a zvz MSL final that would be really crappy, at least for me lol. But I don't think Flash will have any issues with Hydra, also I love Monte Cristo I can't wait to see that game especially! (edit:spelling)
a9arnn
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States1537 Posts
May 26 2011 05:48 GMT
#7
Well it's looking like JvF finals again, sigh... hopefully ZerO will be able to pull something out tonight! Curses ZvZ, why must you ruin ZerO every single time D: ...
PS: You can do this Kim Myung Woon!
VOD finder guy for sc2ratings.com/ ! aka: ogndrahcir, a9azn2 | Go ZerO, Stork, Sea, and KawaiiRice :D | nesc2league.com/forum/index.php | youtube.com/watch?v=oaGtjWL5mZo
ReketSomething
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States6012 Posts
May 26 2011 05:48 GMT
#8
3 More hours.....im so stoked :D

hoping for a 3-2 series tonight! :D
Jaedong :3
Morbidius
Profile Joined November 2010
Brazil3449 Posts
May 26 2011 05:49 GMT
#9
Nice write up.
Hydra is looking scary lately but i believe in Flash. JD 3-1-Zero Flash 3-2 Hydra.
Has foreign StarCraft hit rock bottom?
endy
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Switzerland8970 Posts
May 26 2011 05:50 GMT
#10
I don't want to see another upset. I was so sad for JD after last MSL
JD 3-1 ZerO

Flash will just stomp Hydra 3-0. Oh well, Hydra might take the game on Monte Cristo since it seems to be heavily Z imbalanced even though the amount of games isn't significant. But with Dante's Peak and La Mancha (x2), I can't see Flash not advancing to finals.
ॐ
0mgVitaminE
Profile Joined February 2009
United States1278 Posts
May 26 2011 06:01 GMT
#11
Want to see Jaedong in a final so bad. Jesus
Hi there. I'm in a cave, how bout you?
Grettin
Profile Joined April 2010
42381 Posts
May 26 2011 06:03 GMT
#12
Jae-dong, Jae-dong!!
"If I had force-fields in Brood War, I'd never lose." -Bisu
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
May 26 2011 06:07 GMT
#13
Jaedong 3-1
Flash 3-1
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
zlosynus
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Czech Republic339 Posts
May 26 2011 06:22 GMT
#14
On May 26 2011 14:50 endy wrote:
I don't want to see another upset. I was so sad for JD after last MSL
JD 3-1 ZerO


Agree, JD has win this and get another gold!
red4ce
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States7313 Posts
May 26 2011 06:32 GMT
#15
I'm surprised you're predicting Zero to take 2 games off of Jaedong. I think it's about a 50% chance he gets swept by JvZ. Hydra will have some tricky stuff prepared for Flash but even if Flash doesn't play his best (and I think he will) games 1 and 5 are on La Mancha so Hydra really has no chance.
4vvhiplash7
Profile Joined December 2010
South Africa392 Posts
May 26 2011 06:55 GMT
#16
Great writeup! I don't care about the score, just as long as we have another FvJ finals!
Whiplash
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2928 Posts
May 26 2011 07:18 GMT
#17
Hydra vs Flash is going to be really great, if Hydra beats flash and then Jaedong in the finals I think we may have a new zerg king!
Cinematographer / Steadicam Operator. Former Starcraft commentator/player
Rodiel3
Profile Joined March 2011
France1158 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-05-26 07:36:22
May 26 2011 07:35 GMT
#18
edit: wrong section delete plz
http://www.youtube.com/user/rodiel3 SCBW FPVOD
kuroshiroi
Profile Joined November 2010
3149 Posts
May 26 2011 08:00 GMT
#19
On May 26 2011 15:55 4vvhiplash7 wrote:
Great writeup! I don't care about the score, just as long as we have another FvJ finals!

I don't care about the score as long as JD is in the finals. If hydra wins, JD gets a chance at revenge. If Flash wins, JD gets a chance at revenge. Either way, he has a chance at winning the MSL golden badge against the most terrifying competition he has ever faced.

If JD happens to lose against Zero, Flash must win. Hydra vs. Zero would be about as shitty as the last final for me. But if that's what happens, we can't really complain, so meh.
Fly Jaedong, fly!
Existential
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia2107 Posts
May 26 2011 08:04 GMT
#20
I wish oh so badly that JD will get the gold this time..
Jaedong <3 | BW - The first game I ever loved
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Map Test Tournament
11:00
QUALIFIER WardiTV TLMC
WardiTV275
IndyStarCraft 111
LiquipediaDiscussion
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 65
CranKy Ducklings47
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 111
ProTech78
Codebar 72
UpATreeSC 41
ForJumy 34
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 19914
Sea 3171
Bisu 1218
Jaedong 1126
Mini 1052
Flash 887
Snow 601
Stork 422
firebathero 389
actioN 339
[ Show more ]
Hyun 328
ZerO 301
Leta 294
sSak 243
Soma 179
Last 141
EffOrt 140
Mong 139
Light 119
ToSsGirL 71
Larva 68
Liquid`Ret 62
Sharp 33
soO 32
Icarus 15
Shine 15
Sacsri 15
Noble 13
Terrorterran 12
scan(afreeca) 11
Movie 11
HiyA 10
sorry 8
yabsab 8
Dota 2
Cr1tdota1118
boxi98341
XcaliburYe317
BananaSlamJamma240
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1893
shoxiejesuss735
x6flipin505
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King73
Westballz21
Other Games
singsing2307
B2W.Neo448
DeMusliM316
crisheroes253
XaKoH 191
Pyrionflax181
mouzStarbuck138
NeuroSwarm85
rGuardiaN52
ArmadaUGS25
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 1369
lovetv 11
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• LUISG 40
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
• swagsyndrome_ 0
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV336
• lizZardDota239
Upcoming Events
Online Event
11h 29m
Wardi Open
23h 29m
Online Event
1d 5h
Online Event
1d 23h
[BSL 2025] Weekly
2 days
Safe House 2
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
BSL Team Wars
3 days
Team Bonyth vs Team Dewalt
Dewalt vs kogeT
JDConan vs Tarson
RaNgeD vs DragOn
StRyKeR vs Bonyth
Aeternum vs Hejek
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-25
Maestros of the Game
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
Acropolis #4 - TS2
EC S1
ESL Pro League S22
Frag Blocktober 2025
Urban Riga Open #1
FERJEE Rush 2025
Birch Cup 2025
DraculaN #2
LanDaLan #3
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

IPSL Winter 2025-26
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
WardiTV TLMC #15
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.