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Flash and Jaedong: Clash of Paradigms - Page 3

Forum Index > BW General
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Crissaegrim
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
2947 Posts
August 28 2010 06:45 GMT
#41
A very good write up. Its a shame that the very essence and traits of these legendary races failed to make it into sc2.

Quite curious to see whats your take on the somewhat despised ugly-stepbrother sorta way 3rd race.
prosatan
Profile Joined September 2009
Romania8961 Posts
August 28 2010 06:48 GMT
#42
Great write ! Thx
Lee JaeDong Fighting! The only church that illuminates is the one that burns.
TriniMasta
Profile Joined December 2009
United States1323 Posts
August 28 2010 08:07 GMT
#43
On August 28 2010 07:22 NeCroPoTeNce wrote:
The Flash picture never gets old.

Really? I feel sick that FlaSh gets such a common picture and Jaedong gets a baller one. I'm kind of tired of that picture lol
정명훈 FIGHTING!!! Play both T and P.
Fenrax
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States5018 Posts
August 28 2010 08:30 GMT
#44
HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE HYPE


Seriously, this is going to be so awesome. I hope for an epic best of 5. Flash with the Map Pool advantage, but both players seem so ridiculously strong, I can't tell who is ahead. Also: HYPE HYPE
Zinbiel
Profile Joined October 2008
Sweden878 Posts
August 28 2010 08:31 GMT
#45
On August 28 2010 06:35 Jeremy Reimer wrote:
This is a very well written piece. I like the contrast of the players and the races. I think it also explains why I am forever a Jaedong fan, and despite Flash being one of the greatest players of all time (and arguably technically better than Jaedong, although their head-to-head championship record is yet to be decided) I simply cannot be a Flash fan. Still, I totally understand how people could be. These are two truly dominant players.

Nicely done!


This summarizes my thought's as well.
Backho fan since 080416. Favourite terran: Mind. Favourite Zerg: Jaedong.
Fenrax
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States5018 Posts
August 28 2010 08:44 GMT
#46
What the heck? Where is the Hype?
Khul Sadukar
Profile Joined August 2009
Australia1735 Posts
August 28 2010 08:48 GMT
#47
Nice article!

Match starting in 10m. Sooo HYPED
I don't want to be part everything. I want to be something. - Weapon X
KlaCkoN
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1661 Posts
August 28 2010 08:57 GMT
#48
Really nice article, thank you for writing it. It summarises alot of my thoughts on the subject very well
"Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders ... All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
pr0jekt
Profile Joined May 2010
United States24 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-28 09:27:51
August 28 2010 09:22 GMT
#49
Is Flash REALLY stuck in traffic? =P
Neoattitude
Profile Joined April 2010
Guam172 Posts
August 28 2010 13:25 GMT
#50
Nice right up
Wings
Profile Joined January 2010
United States999 Posts
August 28 2010 14:29 GMT
#51
epic. fantastic article... deserves to be front-paged, especially after the recent string of FvJ's...

on a side note, I love how we've "classified" Flash and Jaedong as different races. We compliment people like Stork for his PvT. But. We worship JvZ and FvT. And the matchup is no longer TvZ or ZvT... it's Freaking JvF or FvJ.

Two "of" the greatest players of all time? No. The GREATEST hands-down. Perhaps not the most influential. Perhaps not the most popular. But by far the two most skillful, strategic, powerful, monstrous beings in all of e-sports. You know you could have won against Boxer, Nada, Oov, Savior (if you paid him enough lol), but you KNOW you would NEVER be able to defeat the J and F.

I personally think everyone should stop picking sides and bow down to them both. As the writer here said nicely, Yin & Yang, Steel and Quicksilver... both of them together is what make up starcraft.

(lol protoss.)
The probability of Kim Carrier getting all those predictions wrong is similar to the probability Flash loses a TvT. Kim Carrier MUST BE a genius. His only big mistake... STORK.
Sanguinarius
Profile Joined January 2010
United States3427 Posts
August 28 2010 14:52 GMT
#52
Epic thread about epic players
Your strength is just an accident arising from the weakness of others -Heart of Darkness
jambam
Profile Joined June 2010
United States324 Posts
August 28 2010 15:33 GMT
#53
Where can i find the vods for this?
zerious
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada3803 Posts
August 28 2010 16:02 GMT
#54
On August 29 2010 00:33 jambam wrote:
Where can i find the vods for this?


http://www.teamliquid.net/vods/
mutantmagnet
Profile Joined June 2009
United States3806 Posts
August 28 2010 16:47 GMT
#55
Very nice write up but I don't agree with the Terran stereotype. That said I'm curious what the OP thinks the protoss stereotype is even if no one is currently filling it.
tyCe
Profile Joined March 2010
Australia2542 Posts
August 28 2010 17:29 GMT
#56
Wow, awesome write-up. I wish I read this before the finals
On August 28 2010 06:32 ella_guru wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 28 2010 06:13 Exteray wrote:
Epic write-up! I like the comparisons you draw between the two players.
In the wake of SC2, this will probably be the last major rivalry in SC:BW.



What about ggaemo and mines?

Lol, that's not even a contest. Mines > ggaemo anyday!
Betrayed by EG.BuK
jackofclubs81
Profile Joined January 2010
United States196 Posts
August 28 2010 17:31 GMT
#57
This thread makes me want to switch to Terran.

I actually think I might do it...
deafhobbit
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States828 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-28 19:28:39
August 28 2010 19:28 GMT
#58
Can we just agree at this point that the only thing preventing either of these players from being recognized as Bonjwa's is each other?
I cheer for underdogs and Flash
xlat
Profile Joined August 2010
176 Posts
August 28 2010 20:17 GMT
#59
Wow... amazing writeup. After following Jaedong for years I have also learned to know Flash quite well and although I often curse at his safe and "boring" play I can not dismiss the fact that he has virtually no flaws.

and flaws, Jaedong has them.

So many games I've been dumbstruck in front of my screen trying to figure out why jaedong fails, being too cocky with mutas or going eco in a game where he should expect the opponent to rush and looking so tired and off even though the stakes are high.

noone punishes an enemy for mistakes like jaedong. not a perfect wall in? oh hai here comes the lings. bad turret placement? gg already.

in the end flash is the more solid player but jaedong the one that makes me excited.

um.. not sure what i wanted to say.. just thanks for the writeup i guess
L0thar
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
987 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-28 21:25:10
August 28 2010 21:23 GMT
#60
This is really well written article, but I have to disagree with almost everything you wrote about Flash. Well, not with almost everything, but with substantial part of it.

Flash actually improvise a lot in his game, more than majority of other progamers I would say. He doesn't try to account for every possibility beforehand, he let his game sense and adaptability to cope with every situation when it arises. I've read probably every Flash interview, and something along the lines "situation X arised so I followed my instinct and luckily everything went well" isn't uncommon.

His builds are more like an outline, basic stuff to do, and he than let his incredible adaptability to expand on them. There is a reason no other Terran was able to copy Flash, they simply lack the game sense and adaptability. There is a reason no other progamer has so many seemingly impossible comebacks, they simply fall apart when their game plan is compromised (see fantasy). But with Flash, it's different. Even in very disadvategous position, he is able to read the situation and make on the fly decision, which will often allow him to come back.

Also (MSL finals spoiler ahead):
+ Show Spoiler +
Look at the game 5 in Flash vs Effort in last OSL finals. Look at the game 5 in Light vs Jaedong MSL semis. Now look at the game 5 in MSL finals and try to say that Flash is a player with safe approach to the game with straight face. He isn't. He can (and usually do) play safe against lesser opponent knowing his superior skills will win the game for him, but he can also take huge risks if he feels it's for the best.

Jaedong to me feels inferior as the adaptablity goes. His true strengh is his extreme mental fortitude.

At least that's how I see it.
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