EPTand it kind of became a running gag that matches between bisu and jd and a bo5 in particular are one of the matchups most desired by the fans and yet whenever they come close one of them fails in the last minute. (bisu vs fantasy, bisu vs iris, jd vs stork, jd vs fantasy; just to name the most recent ones....)
Jaedong vs Bisu Stats - Page 3
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Black Gun
Germany4482 Posts
and it kind of became a running gag that matches between bisu and jd and a bo5 in particular are one of the matchups most desired by the fans and yet whenever they come close one of them fails in the last minute. (bisu vs fantasy, bisu vs iris, jd vs stork, jd vs fantasy; just to name the most recent ones....) | ||
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OreoBoi
Canada1639 Posts
On September 15 2009 22:52 Foucault wrote: Ugh people discussing map balance should do everyone a favor and never become scientists because it's all RIDICULOUS. If a map is 3-9 PvZ it doesn't mean that it's imbalanced. It has probably the most to do with the skill level of the players. People are really quite stupid about this too often. Also you can't read anything into that small size of a sample. Even a couple of hundred games is almost too little to determine map balance only, because so many other factors count. I'm sure scientists are suppose to study statistics like that to create hypotheses, and then prove those hypotheses. Nowhere in this thread are people claiming that a 3-9 PvZ map is imbalanced. The least amount of games played on one map is a 9:21 PvZ record on Neo Harmony. Instead of saying the sample size is too small, question why there were only 30 games played PvZ on this map. This map was probably taken out after one round, much like Battle Royal because of the imbalance. Also, if  YellOw[ArnC] can beat a protoss, I'm quite certain it is not 100% balanced map.In regards to Jaedong vs  Bisu, I think their skill level is equal, and in any game either play can win. However, I believe Jaedong is mentally tougher than Bisu, which gets him more BoX wins. Also doesn't help that Bisu keeps losing to people he shouldn't in starleagues. | ||
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Geo.Rion
7377 Posts
Sin Peaks of Baekdu Bisu 71.43% Jaedong 60% Blue Strom Bisu 40% Jaedong 75% Othello Bisu 0% Jaedong 100% Colosseum II Bisu 50% Jaedong 66% Andromeda Bisu 66% Jaedong 50% Destination Bisu 63% Jaedong 60% Neo Harmony Bisu 50% Jaedong 0% Medusa Bisu 81% Jaedong 66% Heartbreak Ridge Bisu 60% Jaedong 57% Woot, wtf? Bisu doing better on the maps in PvZ, and still having a loosing record against JD? He must be way worse than JD, right? + Show Spoiler + NO, they are pretty even I wouldn't mind if you would include this in the OP. Just as a different point of view. | ||
MrHoon
10183 Posts
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noddyz
United Kingdom462 Posts
Bonjwa. | ||
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ReketSomething
United States6012 Posts
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AzureEye
United States1360 Posts
On September 15 2009 22:59 o[twist] wrote: of course zerg tends to be slightly overpowered vP, just like protoss tends to vT and terran tends to vZ. it's odd of course given that that jaedong tends to have some trouble with players like bisu, stork, and free, but he's the dominant player of our era. sort of silly to start a bonjwa argument while no games are being played after jaedong won a golden mouse Everything about your post is true except P=T my friend | ||
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WWJDD
India342 Posts
-- JD fanboy here. | ||
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Klive5ive
United Kingdom6056 Posts
It just seems like another excuse to drag the JD vs Bisu war on a bit longer. | ||
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Fr33t
United States1128 Posts
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Count9
China10928 Posts
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Kyo Yuy
United States1286 Posts
On September 15 2009 22:52 Foucault wrote: If a map is 3-9 PvZ it doesn't mean that it's imbalanced. On the other hand, if a map is 9-3 PvZ, it suddenly IS imbalanced. It's only imbalanced if Protoss are winning. If Protoss is losing a lot, then statistics are irrelevant. | ||
disciple
9070 Posts
On September 16 2009 00:41 Kyo Yuy wrote: On the other hand, if a map is 9-3 PvZ, it suddenly IS imbalanced. It's only imbalanced if Protoss are winning. If Protoss is losing a lot, then statistics are irrelevant. take this guy in the Liquipedia thing ! | ||
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Djabanete
United States2786 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + Atrioc vs disciple, Bo13 on primeval isles gogogo | ||
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siv00
261 Posts
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Ideas
United States8141 Posts
Blue Strom(160:159) => "Fair" Map Othello (23:22) => "Fair" Map Colosseum II (74:81) => "Fair" Map, but only by a little (Zerg is 52%) Andromeda (95:126) => 57% Zerg Map Destination (133:148) => 53% Zerg Map Neo Harmony (9:21) => 70% GAY ZERG MAP Medusa (136:189) => 58% Zerg Map Heartbreak Ridge (39:56) => 59% Zerg Map my favorite part about the OP is how it calls medusa/destination/heartbreak zerg maps. especially Desti at only 53% statistically LOL Whats sad is that Bisu is undoubtedly the best PvZer right now, but there are still a lot of zergs that could probably beat him in a Bo5: JD, zero, hero (LOL from zero to hero!), July.... damnit Protoss need to stop sucking. | ||
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Tom Phoenix
1114 Posts
In any case, Bisu and Jaedong are fairly even in terms of skill. Infact, that is the reason why fans love watching their games, beacuse they are so even in a lot of things. They are of roughly the same age, both are the best players of their respective races, both made a breakthrough on the scene in the same year at the expense of other successful players, both are well-known for one particular matchup, both are excellent in multitasking...it is scary, really. So whenever these two enter the booths at the same time, you can preety much be certain that an earth-shattering game is about to follow (certain hickups such as Bisu`s failed block and Jaedong`s cancelled Spire notwithstanding). As for the whole best vs. worst matchup. To be honest, at the level Bisu and Jaedong play, what is your best or worst matchup becomes much less important. When you are a player of such caliber, chances are that even your worst matchup is far superior to that of the majority of progamers in your respective race. Plus, both Bisu and Jaedong have proven that they are more then capable of easily dismantling even the top progamers of the races they are historically "weak" against (Bisu vs Fantasy in the Avalon MSL, Jaedong vs Stork in the Batoo OSL). | ||
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KP_CollectoR
United States744 Posts
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Mindcrime
United States6899 Posts
Jaedong: 4 Bisu: 1 number of starleague titles in the past 2 years | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
In regards to whether Bisu's best matchup is PvP or PvZ, that depends on how you define his "best matchup". In terms of his actual ability to win, Bisu is FAR more consistent in PvP, and always has been. However, if you compare his skill relative to other players, his PvZ is better (e.g. there are players that are close to his level of PvP like Stork, but there are no other Protoss players that can match Bisu's PvZ--the reason he's statistically poorer at it is because Protosses as a whole have been statistically poor in the matchup). On September 16 2009 01:25 Mindcrime wrote: OP forgot these stats: Jaedong: 4 Bisu: 1 number of starleague titles in the past 2 years Nice way to choose a time duration that neatly encompasses all of Jaedong's titles and cuts out all of Bisu's. | ||
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