• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 19:57
CET 01:57
KST 09:57
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Dark completes military service, returns to SC28[BSL23] RO16 Group Stage19Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?2Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175
StarCraft 2
General
No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Dark completes military service, returns to SC2 Greetings.. Serral's getting trashed by New Catsle's Mind Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?
Tourneys
Dark returns! GSL CK #7 4v4 Team Battle (Nov 19) Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) soO & FanTaSy return! SC2 Kevin Scrim 4v4 (Nov 16) RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps Starcraft 2 Advance [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 551 Robotic Revival Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion List of top players active on ShieldBattery HELPls! The old replay video w full HD resolution Recommended BW Settings for Mouse and Video Starcraft:Brood War Discord Servers
Tourneys
Bisu's Team vs Shuttle's Team 2026-11-14 2v2v2v2 Tournament Stage 1: Community Poll [BSL23] Ro16 Group C - Sunday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Pluto's TvP 5Marine 2Medic Push Infested Terran strategies in 2026 Nuke strategy worked in K-League 2026-11-09
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Free Space RTS Game, optimised f. Phone/Tablet etc List of Game Threads The PlayStation 5
Dota 2
Can Game Data Analytics Help Players Improvements
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Dating: How's your luck?
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
VCT 2027 America Kickoff LAT…
anakin.
The time I organised my…
AssyrianKing
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 12380 users

What of the build orders?

Blogs > Osmoses
Post a Reply
Osmoses
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Sweden5302 Posts
March 05 2009 09:24 GMT
#1
OK, I see alot of new users register at teamliquid and immediately start a thread asking for basic advice and build orders, and like a good little elitist I scoff in an indignant kind of way and tell them to read the threads that have already been posted.

Now, reflecting upon my own superiority, I know all the basics, I got every nuance of what you can do with the keyboard and mouse down to reflexes (cloning, hotkeying, the F keys, etc) buuuut I actually don't know a whole lot of build orders, and the ones I know I have a very slim grasp on what they are good for. I think I got a total of four build orders for all three races.

My main race is Zerg, and I know 2 hatch muta... Oh shit that's actually it. Whenever I decide not to go 2 hatch muta I always wing it, putting down a hydralisk den slightly before the lair finishes or another hatch somewhere in between or something.

I've looked through the strategy forum, and boy there are alot of build orders in there, but I doubt they are very well organized in terms of viability and pros/cons, which is what I'm the most interested in. What does it mean to overpool? What exactly do you gain or lose by making an overlord before your spawning pool? What does 3hatch muta do better or worse than 2 hatch? Is getting the second gas right when you put up the spire optimal for 6 mutas or for your economy in general?

I feel these questions are often overlooked when reading about general build orders. I mean, I get the fact that 9 pooling will get you 6 lings faster than if you went 12 hatch, but what implications follow with this? Is map control and the small chance of surprising your opponent worth the later expansion?

See, this is what I've been doing ever since Starcraft first came out: winging it. Playing it by ear. Sometimes I get steamrolled and I wonder what the hell just happened. Then I read about how this or that build order or putting up one more sunken "lost" someone a game. Are the margins really that small? Could it be that I would become Super-Osmoses if I only learned the underlying implications of build orders?

Does someone feel inclined to perhaps make a list of the common build orders and their uses? Specifically, what exactly will I and my opponent gain or lose by me going with bo A instead of bo B.

*
Excuse me hun, but what is your name? Vivian? I woke up next to you naked and, uh, did we, um?
thedeadhaji *
Profile Blog Joined January 2006
39489 Posts
March 05 2009 09:27 GMT
#2
I remember chatting with Day and he'd talk about how he'd consider the distance between mains in TvZ and how many seconds that'd give him extra to delay sunkens etc which are the kinds of things you shoudl consider when making decisions (and BO choices are such decisions)

as a caveat the setting of this conversation was how Day would be thinking of this during sex in order to "delay" the inevitable and get his mind off the action
ToyotaDemon
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Australia150 Posts
March 05 2009 11:43 GMT
#3
Umm for 3 hatch ZvT there are some detailed threads in the Recommended Threads explaining pretty much everything, 3 hatch has changed but not dramatically over the last years, you have to be much more aware of what the terran is doing nowadays and cant just blindly 3hatch like you kinda use to be able to. Should also definitely learn the various ways to deal with mech.

Also theres quite a lot of builds for ZvP in the Ahzz and Superiorwolf guides, that should get you started, got me started and allowed me some wins when I was playing around with zerg, but it was mainly to see timings and stuff for PvZ.
rawr
miseiler
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States1389 Posts
March 05 2009 16:42 GMT
#4
On March 05 2009 18:27 thedeadhaji wrote:
as a caveat the setting of this conversation was how Day would be thinking of this during sex in order to "delay" the inevitable and get his mind off the action


That would totally put me over the edge.
"Jinro soo manly wearing only a T-Shirt while the Koreans freeze in their jackets" -- Double_O
"He's from Sweden, man. We have to fight polar bears on our way to school." -- Yusername
fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-05 17:18:42
March 05 2009 17:13 GMT
#5
SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
cgrinker
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States3824 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-06 04:39:25
March 06 2009 04:39 GMT
#6
mikeymoo
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
Canada7170 Posts
March 06 2009 05:35 GMT
#7
On March 06 2009 02:13 fusionsdf wrote:

Indeed.
o_x | Ow. | 1003 ESPORTS dollars | If you have any questions about bans please PM Kennigit
Osmoses
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Sweden5302 Posts
March 06 2009 06:47 GMT
#8
God I hate you people
Excuse me hun, but what is your name? Vivian? I woke up next to you naked and, uh, did we, um?
TheAntZ
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Israel6248 Posts
March 06 2009 07:23 GMT
#9
I have pretty much the same problem. I looked over the BO's for every race in the recommended threads, and a lot of them are very descriptive, but for the most part, it doesnt really explain "You are doing this to achieve exactly this". For most people on TL I guess its already obvious what is meant, but to people just starting out like myself, its really hard to execute these BO's to their full potential without knowing what exactly am I doing and why.
43084 | Honeybadger: "So july, you're in the GSL finals. How do you feel?!" ~ July: "HUNGRY."
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
09:00
FSL s12 week2: POG vs PTB
Freeedom35
Liquipedia
OSC
08:30
Masters Cup #151: Playoffs
Percival vs Shameless
LetaleX vs YoungYakov
Nicoract vs Gerald
GgMaChine vs ArT
davetesta27
Liquipedia
The PiG Daily
07:00
Best Games of SC
Clem vs MaxPax
herO vs Solar
SHIN vs TBD
PiGStarcraft518
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft518
StarCraft: Brood War
Noble 64
Force[name] 4
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm128
League of Legends
JimRising 397
Other Games
summit1g8483
tarik_tv5691
C9.Mang0208
ViBE34
PPMD32
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2421
BasetradeTV209
StarCraft 2
CranKy Ducklings33
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP7
• Response 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki47
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
9h 3m
WardiTV Invitational
11h 3m
ByuN vs SHIN
MaxPax vs Solar
Clem vs TBD
herO vs TBD
Lambo vs TBD
Rogue vs TBD
IPSL
16h 3m
TerrOr vs IJ_Terran
rasowy vs Hazorath
BSL
19h 3m
TerrOr vs OyAji
UltrA vs Gosudark
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 9h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 11h
IPSL
1d 16h
Art_Of_Turtle vs KameZerg
Radley vs George
BSL
1d 19h
Artosis vs Dewalt
Ret vs Tech
SOOP
2 days
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
[ Show More ]
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
PiGosaur Cup
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
GSL
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
KCM Race Survival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-12
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
Individual League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

YSL S4
Sector 591
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
StarCraft2 Weekly Open Tournament 2026 Grand Finals
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.