• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 22:07
CEST 04:07
KST 11:07
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 20252Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202576RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18
Community News
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced17BSL Team Wars - Bonyth, Dewalt, Hawk & Sziky teams10Weekly Cups (July 14-20): Final Check-up0Esports World Cup 2025 - Brackets Revealed19Weekly Cups (July 7-13): Classic continues to roll8
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Power Rank - Esports World Cup 2025 What tournaments are world championships? Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 2025 I offer completely free coaching services
Tourneys
Esports World Cup 2025 $25,000 Streamerzone StarCraft Pro Series announced $5,000 WardiTV Summer Championship 2025 WardiTV Mondays FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $10,000 live event
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars Mutation # 482 Wheel of Misfortune Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava
Brood War
General
Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced BW General Discussion Flash Announces (and Retracts) Hiatus From ASL BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Dewalt's Show Matches in China
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China CSL Xiamen International Invitational [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] Mineral Boosting Does 1 second matter in StarCraft?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok) Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
UK Politics Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Ping To Win? Pings And Their…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Socialism Anyone?
GreenHorizons
Eight Anniversary as a TL…
Mizenhauer
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 578 users

Thoughts on thought and age

Blogs > lugggy
Post a Reply
lugggy
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
450 Posts
December 03 2007 15:52 GMT
#1
On December 04 2007 00:13 Hawk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 03 2007 23:32 lugggy wrote:
If my dog killed your child, it would be my responsibility.


But a dog can't think like a human can, so that's not so great of an analogy.

The reason we don't apply the same laws to adults as we do to children is precisely because we don't give them the credit for thinking "fully", so it is a perfect analogy. When someone else is not expected or believed able to "think like an adult" we lessen the responsibility on them. Again, think of a 2 year old. If my 2 year old burns down your house, isn't it because _I_ fucked up? And surely you can't argue that a 2 year old should be tried as an adult because he "thinks like a human." Maybe teens should be treated more like adults, sure. But they aren't.


Personally, I do think a lot of things should require minors to be charged as adults. Murder, rape, etc. These are all major things that you learn at a very young age—regardless of race, creed, social status, etc—that are major fuck ups thata you don't do. Still, I don't think the parent of a 16 year old should be held accountable if he shoots up the school.

Maybe that's because you think 16 should be considered adult. Obviously you wouldn't say the same things about a 2 year old, or an 8 year old, etc. The "nature" of the crime doesn't change who is doing it. Obviously some people, by age or mental defect, are not capable of the kind of guilt you are imagining. If someone is legally assigned to be responsible for that those people do, to watch over them etc., then that should mean something. The dog analogy works. If I am responsible for a dog, then it's my fault if it bites someone. If legal guardians are truly responsible for their 16 year olds, they are responsible for what their 16 year old does. Now you might say that they can't possibly know. If that's the case then they can't possibly really be a true legal guardian. The child is already independent if what you're saying is true. I don't think that's usually the case.

I mean, like if they were found to be negligent in that he told them the day before as he's goin to school, 'bye mom, going to shoot up my classmates!' 'hahaha, funny, have a good one hun!' then yeah, they should get punished. But I really don't think a lot of situations are like this.


No again, as you can see by my responses above, accepting responsibility for someone else (be it a child, teen, otherwise mentally incompetent entity, pet, etc.) should mean something. It should mean accepting responsibility, not just "well i'll make sure to feed it, not abuse it, but if it does anything really bad it ain't my fault." That's bullshit. Now maybe by the time someone is 16 it is time to give them full legal independence and full rights, but in any case that has not happened so IMO all this "tried as adult" shit is really wishful thinking for parents (and others who have some responsibility for those we deem as and treat as children) who have had bad results.

A little effort please, this isnt a forum for just posting every link on the internet.
nA.Inky
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
United States794 Posts
December 03 2007 19:06 GMT
#2
I'm just curious what holding a parent responsible entails, in your mind, Luggy.

Email (use instead of PM): InkMeister at aol dot com AIM: InkMeister
Jibba
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States22883 Posts
December 03 2007 23:02 GMT
#3
I think you're confusing two separate ideas.

We wouldn't punish a 1 year old (2 is too old) for burning down a house, because their brain hasn't physically developed into an analytical one. It comes down to psychology on a case by case basis, but in most cases infants cannot reason consequences and many simple things. They are just beginning to understand that they can physically alter the world around them and cannot process negative punishment for a bad action. By 2, most have figured it out and I'd imagine a two year old would be punished for playing with fire, as would the parents of course.

A 16 year old has pretty much fully developed that part of their brain and can understand good and bad. The parent is responsible for teaching those things and watching out for extraordinary circumstances (the Columbine kids putting an armory in their garage is an example of faulty parenting), but a 16 year old does have free will and the power to do good and bad, regardless of what their parents have taught them. The number 18 is probably a combination of influence from child labor laws, and a bunch of other crap, but I think it's fair to charge 16 year olds as adults and children, given the circumstances.
ModeratorNow I'm distant, dark in this anthrobeat
lugggy
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
450 Posts
December 03 2007 23:05 GMT
#4
No... anyone else?
A little effort please, this isnt a forum for just posting every link on the internet.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6h 54m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 138
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 4671
NaDa 69
Noble 64
HiyA 54
Sexy 46
sSak 14
Icarus 8
Dota 2
monkeys_forever1618
LuMiX1
Counter-Strike
shahzam625
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox1227
Mew2King343
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor196
Other Games
summit1g12192
tarik_tv11928
JimRising 1512
Nina239
ViBE216
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1808
BasetradeTV107
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 11 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 51
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
FEL
6h 54m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
11h 54m
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
15h 54m
Bonyth vs Zhanhun
Dewalt vs Mihu
Hawk vs Sziky
Sziky vs QiaoGege
Mihu vs Hawk
Zhanhun vs Dewalt
Fengzi vs Bonyth
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Online Event
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
Murky Cup #2

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Non-Korean Championship
BSL 20 Team Wars
FEL Cracov 2025
CC Div. A S7
Underdog Cup #2
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25

Upcoming

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
HCC Europe
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.