• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 07:22
CEST 13:22
KST 20:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt2: News Flash10[ASL21] Ro24 Preview Pt1: New Chaos0Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy18ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT30Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book20
Community News
$5,000 WardiTV TLMC tournament - Presented by Monster Energy1GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding0Weekly Cups (May 30-Apr 5): herO, Clem, SHIN win0[BSL22] RO32 Group Stage4Weekly Cups (March 23-29): herO takes triple6
StarCraft 2
General
BGE Stara Zagora 2026 cancelled Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool Weekly Cups (May 30-Apr 5): herO, Clem, SHIN win Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - Presented by Monster Energy
Tourneys
RSL Season 4 announced for March-April $5,000 WardiTV TLMC tournament - Presented by Monster Energy Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) GSL CK: More events planned pending crowdfunding Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 520 Moving Fees Mutation # 519 Inner Power Mutation # 518 Radiation Zone
Brood War
General
so ive been playing broodwar for a week straight. Gypsy to Korea ASL21 General Discussion Pros React To: JaeDong vs Queen [BSL22] RO32 Group Stage
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL22] RO32 Group B - Sunday 21:00 CEST [BSL22] RO32 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CEST 🌍 Weekly Foreign Showmatches
Strategy
Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Starcraft Tabletop Miniature Game General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Darkest Dungeon
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion Cricket [SPORT] Tokyo Olympics 2021 Thread General nutrition recommendations
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
[G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Loot Boxes—Emotions, And Why…
TrAiDoS
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1538 users

Fixed Odds Betting Terminals and Loot boxes

Blogs > Jockmcplop
Post a Reply
Jockmcplop
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United Kingdom9807 Posts
February 28 2020 13:38 GMT
#1
OK a bit of background:

I'm a gambling addict. In the last 10 years I have probably lost >£10,000 in bookmakers here in the UK on machines called fixed odds betting terminals (FOBTs).
Recently a conservative minister resigned in order to force the government to regulate the machines (which helped me quit gambling). This seems like an extreme measure over some machines in bookie's shops, no?

Well it was justified. FOBTs were called the 'crack cocaine of gambling'. They are insanely addictive, as every single part of the experience of using one is designed to get you hooked.

Here's an article:
+ Show Spoiler +

MPs rebelled, a minister resigned and the UK government was forced to change tack. No, this is not Brexit. It’s fixed-odds betting terminals(FOBTs), the incredibly addictive machines that are often found in betting shops.

The government had promised to reduce the maximum stake that people playing FOBTs would be limited to just £2 per play from April 2019. This is the figure recommended by the Gambling Commission regulator – a dramatic reduction in price from the current £100 limit. But the chancellor announced in his budget that this reduction would be pushed back to October 2019. This would have allowed bookmakers to make an estimated £900m extra from FOBTsin the meantime and the government a lot more in tax revenues.

The move prompted sports minister Tracey Crouch to resign from the front bench of British politics and a growing number of MPs from across the political divide to call the government out for its decision to delay. It has bowed to the pressure and will once again reduce the maximum stake to £2 from April 2019.

The fact is, FOBTs are so addictive that they have been labelled the “crack cocaine” of gambling methods, encouraging gamblers to play quickly and continuously.

http://theconversation.com/fixed-odds-betting-machines-are-devastatingly-addictive-why-its-right-to-cut-maximum-stakes-106266



What's this got to do with loot boxes?

Having used these machines for 10 years I am very used to the specific way n which the software works, from the user's POV. There is a specific routine to spinning the roulette wheel, for example.
You make your bet, then press go. There is then a short pause which is slightly different in length on each spin. The spin animation is different in different software, but lasts 4-8 seconds.
There are two possible outcomes, win or lose. If you win, you get some flashing lights and a happy sound. If you lose, you are taken quickly back to the 'place bets' interface.
Either way, within seconds you are back at the screen where you can continue betting.

Here's a video:
+ Show Spoiler +


And here's how FIFA loot box opening has changed over the years. Notice the implementation of the same techniques over time:
+ Show Spoiler +


Now, it would be foolish to think that there isn't a science behind each stage of this routine. The main developer of FOBT software is called Scientific Games for God's sake.

Now, loot boxes and in game purchases, from my experience, use EXACTLY the same routine to get people addicted to the rush of buying the loot box itself. It is NOT the reward or search for the reward that the designer wants you addicted to, it is the animation, the sound, and most importantly, the TENSION of waiting to see what your money has got you that they want you addicted to.

Bear in mind I'm using the only experience I have of loot boxes to draw the comparison (FIFA, Battlefield and UFC 3).

So what's the problem here? Well there isn't too much of one when a game is aimed at adults, as adults can give consent and are able to understand the consequences of getting addicted to something.
The problem is when games are not given an 18+ rating (like FIFA for example) and contain these exact mechanics. They are designed to get kids addicted to a specific routine which can end up costing huge amounts of money and have serious, long lasting psychological consequences.

I know loot boxes are already hated by most people, but I don't know how much people understand about what it is that they are aiming at, and how they work.



*****
RIP Meatloaf <3
Zambrah
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States7393 Posts
February 28 2020 16:21 GMT
#2
Loot boxes are manipulative casino scumbaggery and should be very regulated.
Incremental change is the Democrat version of Trickle Down economics.
linestein
Profile Blog Joined June 2018
United States210 Posts
February 28 2020 23:11 GMT
#3
So basically you're spending your dough at an arcade instead of a real-life casino? 10,000£ isn't that much over 10 years!
"You can wish to be rich, you can wish to be tall. You can wish away the haters, you just gimme a call" ---Will Smith & DJ Khaled "Friend Like Me (End Title)"
Dangermousecatdog
Profile Joined December 2010
United Kingdom7084 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-02-29 13:28:58
February 29 2020 13:28 GMT
#4
Why would it matter if it was a real life casino or not? The emotions are all the same.

£10,000 is enough for a decent second hand car or a smaller new car. Enough for 2 years of luxury dining. It's enough for a 6 month holiday. £10,000 is £10,000, people have killed for far less.
WombaT
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Northern Ireland26523 Posts
March 01 2020 00:21 GMT
#5
Congrats on getting over your addiction man.

The space is appallingly badly regulated in terms of ‘real’ gambling, ads for gambling are everywhere. Was talking to some football journalists after a show and they said that even ostensibly independent podcast have gambling money somewhere.

Given I listen to literally like 9 sports podcasts religiously it’s thus not surprising that the one topic that is rarely ever tackled is gambling and it’s influence.

Loot boxes in games, eugh. It’s really depressing, predatory bollocks and I hate them. They’re turning a magical part of my childhood, exploring the vidya, and enjoy the game, the experiences and getting proficient, playing with friends to ‘spin the wheel so you have the thing’. Which is the most depressingly capitalistic thing I can think of.

I’ll try my best to shepherd minibat away from them but it’s tough when all the other kids are doing it.
'You'll always be the cuddly marsupial of my heart, despite the inherent flaws of your ancestry' - Squat
StaleTosis
Profile Joined February 2020
13 Posts
March 01 2020 05:01 GMT
#6
Great post OP. Games are addictive as hell these days, by design. I'm trying to stop gaming myself!
roguecast
Profile Joined September 2019
7 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-03-05 15:05:57
March 05 2020 14:57 GMT
#7
very interesting also how games like the recent Autochess are so incredibly addictive whilst being things that people after a while say out loud "Why am I wasting my life on this?"

there was a game Day9 started playing on his youtube the other day, i looked up the steam reviews and literally every one is saying "Do not touch this game - it's the most addictive game of the decade" . game is called Factorio

very interesting how addiction works with game design. very interesting

some things are really able to trigger our sense of "play", "curiosity", and whatever other emotions are engaged and go crazy stimulating the brain

in japan the noise of the game centers is fucking insane. i don't know if it's like that in other parts of the world. i wonder too how that sound is effective (gambling is massive over here too).

heres a decent video of the noise



i'm guessing it's to keep everyone on edge and stimmed up like they're in a busy frantic place, maybe it plays on what you said about tension
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 89
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Lowko271
SortOf 141
ProTech98
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4198
Sea 2810
Jaedong 1731
Bisu 1706
firebathero 614
Hyuk 483
Leta 397
Rush 283
EffOrt 252
actioN 228
[ Show more ]
Stork 224
Mini 181
Light 145
Pusan 130
Killer 123
Soulkey 109
ZerO 106
Snow 96
Aegong 90
Free 66
sorry 60
hero 54
Sharp 53
ToSsGirL 47
NaDa 44
Shinee 41
[sc1f]eonzerg 35
Backho 33
Sea.KH 29
ggaemo 29
JYJ 24
Barracks 23
scan(afreeca) 16
JulyZerg 16
Bale 15
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
Nal_rA 13
Icarus 12
NotJumperer 12
GoRush 11
IntoTheRainbow 8
HiyA 8
SilentControl 7
Dota 2
Gorgc907
XaKoH 607
febbydoto9
Counter-Strike
olofmeister4876
shoxiejesuss664
edward63
markeloff58
Other Games
singsing1742
Liquid`RaSZi744
B2W.Neo463
crisheroes242
Mew2King43
ZerO(Twitch)11
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL25613
Other Games
BasetradeTV498
StarCraft 2
WardiTV132
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 7
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP3
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 1
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2501
Other Games
• WagamamaTV37
Upcoming Events
CranKy Ducklings
12h 39m
WardiTV Team League
23h 39m
Replay Cast
1d 12h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 22h
WardiTV Team League
1d 23h
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
BSL
2 days
n0maD vs perroflaco
TerrOr vs ZZZero
MadiNho vs WolFix
DragOn vs LancerX
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
WardiTV Team League
2 days
OSC
3 days
[ Show More ]
BSL
3 days
Sterling vs Azhi_Dahaki
Napoleon vs Mazur
Jimin vs Nesh
spx vs Strudel
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Wardi Open
3 days
GSL
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Elite League 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
StarCraft2 Community Team League 2026 Spring
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S2: W2
IPSL Spring 2026
Escore Tournament S2: W3
Acropolis #4
BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
RSL Revival: Season 5
WardiTV TLMC #16
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.