• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 00:42
CET 06:42
KST 14:42
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
[BSL23] RO16 Group Stage14Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top?2Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175Evil Geniuses - shutting down23
StarCraft 2
General
Serral's getting trashed by New Catsle's Mind Weekly Cups (Nov 2-8): herO back on top? Liquibets sc2 season 30 No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? StarCraft open world shooter announced at BlizzCon
Tourneys
soO & FanTaSy return! SC2 Kevin Scrim 4v4 (Nov 16) RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22 Tasteless Time Warp: SC Evo Showmatch (May 25) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament iNu's Battles #22
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Starcraft 2 Advance [G] How to playtest arcade maps [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 551 Robotic Revival Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion List of top players active on ShieldBattery [BSL23] RO16 Group Stage screpdb: new Starcraft reporting tool [BW] Looking for Clan Thread!
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL23] Ro16 Group C - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL23] Ro16 Group A - Saturday 21:00 CET 2v2v2v2 Tournament Stage 1: Community Poll
Strategy
Infested Terran strategies in 2026 Nuke strategy worked in K-League 2026-11-09 50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy)
Other Games
General Games
List of Game Threads The PlayStation 5 Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Trading/Investing Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Dating: How's your luck? European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The time I organised my…
AssyrianKing
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 16854 users

Circular Reporting by US Intelligence Agencies

Blogs > Doodsmack
Post a Reply
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-22 08:09:35
April 22 2019 07:35 GMT
#1
Consider the concept of circular reporting, where information coming from just one source is made to look like it's coming from multiple sources. Now consider what an intelligence or law enforcement agency might be able to do if it wants to convince, say, a court or the public about something. Plant the same "evidence" in multiple places in slightly different ways, and you can claim that it's being corroborated. Even more effective if intelligence agencies from multiple countries, like the US and its allies, are involved.

The "yellowcake uranium" evidence concerning Saddam Hussein's alleged efforts to get WMD is an example. This supposed evidence was relied on by the Bush administration to sell the war to the public and to the world. One of the pieces of evidence was a document that Italian intelligence sent to the US that later turned out to be forged. It was disseminated multiple times to the US by Italian intelligence. For all we know, it could well have just been a document they planted, in cooperation with western intelligence agencies. It was pretty much nothing more than an anonymous tip too. All used to drum up support for the Iraq War, by both the US and UK. Interestingly, the document made its first appearance in October 2001 - very shortly after 9/11.

The FBI probably used circular reporting in its FISA application for Carter Page. It cited a media report about the Steele dossier, treating the media report as separate corroborating evidence of the dossier itself. Of course, we don't know for certain whether the FBI knew that the media report was only based on the Steele dossier. But it seems likely the FBI would have known, or at the least they were being willfully blind to it. In the worst case scenario, they did it intentionally. And they were doing it with a former UK intelligence agent. We share a ton of intelligence with UK and Australia, so they probably knew about all this too.

If George Papadopoulos was set up in a sting operation, it's not circular reporting I guess but it's another kind of fake predicate. The FBI likely needed some sort of predicate beyond what they had on Trump/Russia in order to justify opening a formal investigation. Once they had an investigation going, it probably enlarged their investigative power and made it into an enduring thing. If it was a sting, they essentially manufactured a predicate. Oddly enough, Italian intelligence is right nearby to the story, since Mifsud was based in Rome. Mifsud was part owner of a university that trained western intelligence agents. Also, a reputable Italian newspaper is now reporting that, ever since Nov 2017 when Mifsud went to ground immediately after his identity went public, he has been living just a block from the US embassy in Rome.

*****
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
April 23 2019 00:51 GMT
#2
Bush lied. People died.
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3275 Posts
April 23 2019 16:48 GMT
#3
I'm not sure what you are trying to say. That intelligence agencies aren't dumb and that government organizations have influence on media?
I mean Fox, NYT and CNN could hardly be more partisan if they tried, right? "Quality journalism" is 100 feet under if it ever existed.

I guess those are nice cases in point if true.
low gravity, yes-yes!
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
April 23 2019 17:56 GMT
#4
On April 24 2019 01:48 Archeon wrote:
I'm not sure what you are trying to say. That intelligence agencies aren't dumb and that government organizations have influence on media?
I mean Fox, NYT and CNN could hardly be more partisan if they tried, right? "Quality journalism" is 100 feet under if it ever existed.

I guess those are nice cases in point if true.


Ultimately the point is that it is possible that the Intel agencies under Bush and Obama engaged in illegal misconduct by manufacturing fake predicates so that they could take further action on something.
Starlightsun
Profile Blog Joined June 2016
United States1405 Posts
April 23 2019 18:07 GMT
#5
Afraid they're gonna do stuff like this to attack Iran soon.
Archeon
Profile Joined May 2011
3275 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-25 17:56:09
April 25 2019 13:44 GMT
#6
On April 24 2019 02:56 Doodsmack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 24 2019 01:48 Archeon wrote:
I'm not sure what you are trying to say. That intelligence agencies aren't dumb and that government organizations have influence on media?
I mean Fox, NYT and CNN could hardly be more partisan if they tried, right? "Quality journalism" is 100 feet under if it ever existed.

I guess those are nice cases in point if true.


Ultimately the point is that it is possible that the Intel agencies under Bush and Obama engaged in illegal misconduct by manufacturing fake predicates so that they could take further action on something.

Tbh my impression of intelligence agencies is that they collectively don't give a rats ass about law. A recent popular example would be that the NSA illegally observed thousands of US-citizens despite patriot act already giving them massive and imo unconstitutional powers.

Then there are all the cases where secret services stirr up shit in other countries proving that international law isn't worth the paper it's written on, so the Italian part would definitely fall under business as usual.

The only problem I see with your case was that the CIA without valid reason lied to the government they are supposed to serve, which imo is a serious crime. If the gov really didn't know/didn't get a report that is.
low gravity, yes-yes!
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
April 27 2019 04:35 GMT
#7
The key to this is that if one western intelligence agency sends a cable to another containing some allegation, the latter has a predicate to initiate some sort of investigation within their own country.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-13 00:33:48
October 13 2020 00:33 GMT
#8
Circular reporting at work.





Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
October 13 2020 11:59 GMT
#9
Included there:
FBI went to Democratic operatives for corroboration. It is pretty dumb to go with the party that financed the document to spread oppo against Trump in order to verify the information within.


And tweets cited by Australian newspapers become reporting from Australia.


It’s not even well hidden circular reporting, or partially defensible “accidental” circular reporting.
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 18m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RuFF_SC2 261
StarCraft: Brood War
GuemChi 1495
Free 157
ProTech135
Leta 88
Barracks 86
910 71
Icarus 9
NotJumperer 7
Force[name] 6
Britney 0
League of Legends
JimRising 763
Counter-Strike
fl0m4127
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King311
Other Games
summit1g9752
WinterStarcraft349
C9.Mang0277
Maynarde117
NeuroSwarm94
ViBE43
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• practicex 20
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota259
League of Legends
• Rush1046
• Lourlo819
• Stunt294
Other Games
• Shiphtur193
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
4h 18m
KCM Race Survival
4h 18m
WardiTV Invitational
6h 18m
Lambo vs Shameless
Rogue vs uThermal
Percival vs YoungYakov
TBD vs GgMaChine
OSC
10h 18m
OSC
17h 18m
ArT vs MindelVK
MiniZergUA vs TBD
Shameless vs TBD
Ultimate Battle
1d 6h
OSC
1d 8h
OSC
1d 17h
ByuN vs MaxPax
herO vs Krystianer
Percival vs Shameless
LetaleX vs YoungYakov
Nicoract vs Gerald
GgMaChine vs ArT
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
IPSL
2 days
TerrOr vs IJ_Terran
rasowy vs Hazorath
[ Show More ]
BSL
2 days
TerrOr vs OyAji
UltrA vs Gosudark
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
IPSL
3 days
Art_Of_Turtle vs KameZerg
Radley vs George
BSL
3 days
Artosis vs Dewalt
Ret vs Tech
WardiTV Weekly
4 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-11
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
Individual League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

YSL S4
Sector 591
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
StarCraft2 Weekly Open Tournament 2026 Grand Finals
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.