(FYI, I am a straight asian guy in the mid-20s living in the US for a point of reference)
Over the past year, I've been flirting with the girls that I am attracted to and I have decided to stop doing it, starting today. This is not to say that I've learned much about the opposite sex and conversing with them. I have, and it has been pretty educational, such as observing the flow of the conversation, looking at body language, and noting certain key words and phrases that means yes or no. I have concluded that this just doesn't work for me.
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting. I started to open up a bit more and tried talking to women. At first, I thought it was going well. People responded and we talked for a bit. However, I felt that none of them were going anywhere AKA being "friend-zoned". I know a couple of "asshole" friends that treat women in an "asshole" kind of way, so I tried their way for a bit. This really didn't work and made it worse.
I was getting frustrated and sought help from a friend who I will call M (haha), and who happens to be female. We're good friends, and I asked her for advice. I gave one of the responses from one of the girls I've been talking to and she told me to stop because she isn't interested. This was pretty heartbreaking and I realized that none of the people I've been talking to are interested in a romantic manner.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same. Perhaps, it is something more inherent, like I'm just a bad person or I'm ugly. If those were the case, then it isn't my fault. (I doubt either of this because M said no and I trust her).
It is clear to me that I should stop flirting. I have gained nothing from it, nor do I have any motivation to do so now. Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end. If flirting with people makes me constantly unhappy about myself, then I will stop doing it in order to BE happy about myself.
Hope you guys have better luck than me, and don't get hung up on any exes or crushes for long periods of time because that can get very painful.
The only way to get better is to keep trying! There's no use in "declaring" that you're no longer going to flirt, as if you need to take a stand for or against pursuing future relationships.
There is a difference between flirting on purpose and following the natural behavior. If you really like someone, chances are that you're flirting already, in your own way.
There is no such thing as to flirt or not to, if you flirt just for the sake of it you'll probably end up being annoying. You shouldn't be using strategies to "flirt better", just be yourself - always.
On May 18 2016 11:20 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: The only way to get better is to keep trying! There's no use in "declaring" that you're no longer going to flirt, as if you need to take a stand for or against pursuing future relationships.
Alright time to give some advice... Not that i am the best with girls but i do feel like your general approach is wrong here.
Flirting seems to be stressful four you and it really shouldn't be. The main thing you should focus on when talking to a reasonably attractive girl (or boy) is: 'Do I actually like her?' But instead most people and i guess that includes you focus on 'How do I get her to like me?' and then dating and flirting becomes that painfull, stressfull, test-like activity that you actually try to avoid.
Fix that. Don't stop talking to girls because life becomes boring really quickly when you ignore 50% of earths population but stop trying to focus on her feelings and her attitude towards you. Figure out what kind of girls you actually like and then the rest will go easy. You don't have to pass her test, she has to pass yours.
You're not really flirting unless you're genuinely enjoying yourself. It's obvious (and not particularly flattering) when people try to force a certain type of behavior.
On May 18 2016 11:12 midnight999 wrote: I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same.
women care about 3 things
1) self esteem, 2) productivity, long term income, and money, 3) physical fitness.
increase these 3 and women will magically begin responding to your flirting and may also initiate flirtatious episodes with you
i'll examine #3 in detail. at 17 i was 6 feet tall and 145 lbs and it was obvious women were not physically attracted to my body although most felt i was "decent looking". I had 1 decent looking gf during my entire time from age 13 to 19 that i seriously wanted a girl/woman. At 19 i decided to do something about it. I adopted the 5X5 Strong Lifts work out and made sure my diet was good. I gained 20 lbs of muscle in 6 years and remain at 165 lbs. Now , females will occasionally initiate flirtatious episodes with me via comments like "James always keeps himself in such good shape". This never happened when i weighed 145 lbs. Its far easier to "flirt" when the female initiates it.
#1 and #2 are also important but i'm too lazy to cover those. #1 is particularly complex.
since age 19 #1, #2, and #3 have gone way up... and magically somehow... my flirting skills are awesome. really ... they're marginally better.. the big difference is that women like me before i ever open my mouth. most communication is non-verbal any way.
I'm a bit confused about your post. If you could give us some examples of how and where you flirt with these women, maybe we could help you out with your approach. It doesn't make sense to me that you'd be friend-zoned after showing interest in a woman. That usually happens when you talk to her without flirting. There could be a bunch of different reasons why you aren't successful. Maybe you don't smell nice, are awkward with conversation due to lack of experience, or possibly give off an uncomfortable vibe (stemming from the depression-anxiety issues you mentioned). Since you've already made the decision to stop flirting, though, I guess advice in flirting isn't what you're looking for.
You've already done what I would recommend, and that is to do what makes you happy. If that means not flirting with women, then so be it. Find something worth living for and focus on improving yourself. With a purpose in life, you will develop confidence.
Contrary to what many believe, you do not need a woman in your life to be happy. In fact, without one you don't have to spend time dealing with all the shit tests and nagging or managing her emotions. You're in your mid-20s and you have raging hormones; therefore, a woman's beauty can be very difficult to resist. Know, however, that your obsession with women will wane gradually as you get older. As you become more mature, you will gain better control over your emotions, and you won't get hung up over crushes as you did in the past. Also, you will be able to handle yourself better around women and be more attractive to them.
I hope you found this helpful at least a little bit. Good luck to you, brother.
Sincerely, Shalashaska_123
P.S. Oh, and I just realized something else that confused me. In the last paragraph you said you should stop flirting because you haven't gained anything from it. But in the first paragraph you talked about how you've learned a little about conversing with women and body language. You've made some progress with your attempts to flirt, and you should be proud of yourself for that.
On May 19 2016 02:34 Shalashaska_123 wrote: You're in your mid-20s and you have raging hormones; therefore, a woman's beauty can be very difficult to resist. Know, however, that your obsession with women will wane gradually as you get older. As you become more mature, you will gain better control over your emotions, and you won't get hung up over crushes as you did in the past.
this is a sad anti-life commentary. one should savour their emotions, feel their emotions and not make "controlling emotions" a top priority. Emotions are very important internal signals... instantaneous subconscious evaluations. Its better to feel too much than it is to feel too little. When you feel too much your challenge is to manage your actions around those feelings. When you feel little or nothing you are dead inside.
sry man .. but there is nothing better in life then going down on a woman for 30+ minutes and experiencing her body's gyrations as she is overcome with ecstasy.
if he wants a woman .. i got 3 words for him....... GO FOR IT.
Hmm, this is just a guess but i would assume that you are pretty introverted with maybe a handful of friends(maybe less)? I think for someone like you it might be best to not focus on the dating scene right now but instead focus on networking and establishing yourself within a circle of friends. You could meat a girl within that group or a friend of that group. It is a lot less awkward and girls will feel more comfortable around you if you are friends with their friends.
On May 19 2016 02:34 Shalashaska_123 wrote: You're in your mid-20s and you have raging hormones; therefore, a woman's beauty can be very difficult to resist. Know, however, that your obsession with women will wane gradually as you get older. As you become more mature, you will gain better control over your emotions, and you won't get hung up over crushes as you did in the past.
this is a sad anti-life commentary. one should savour their emotions, feel their emotions and not make "controlling emotions" a top priority. Emotions are very important internal signals... instantaneous subconscious evaluations. Its better to feel too much than it is to feel too little. When you feel too much your challenge is to manage your actions around those feelings. When you feel little or nothing you are dead inside.
sry man .. but there is nothing better in life then going down on a woman for 30+ minutes and experiencing her body's gyrations as she is overcome with ecstasy.
if he wants a woman .. i got 3 words for him....... GO FOR IT.
Hello, JimmyJRaynor.
You misunderstand me. By "gaining better control of your emotions," I don't mean you should numb yourself to your emotions and not ever enjoy yourself. That would be sad, indeed. What I am saying is he should become stronger emotionally and not obsess over some past crush or ex and move on. If he were meeting new women regularly, then I don't think these women of the past would be an issue. I agree with you that we should savor our emotions but that it is very important to manage our actions.
Some questions the OP will need to answer to give us a better picture so we can help him:
1) how much money do you have/make? 2) how tall are you and how much do you weigh? 3) on a scale of 1-10 how good looking are you? - post a pic on 'hot or not' to get an opinion don't rely on your friends, they may be scared of pissing you off 4) on a scale of 1-10 how funny are you? can you make people laugh on command?
On May 19 2016 02:34 Shalashaska_123 wrote: You're in your mid-20s and you have raging hormones; therefore, a woman's beauty can be very difficult to resist. Know, however, that your obsession with women will wane gradually as you get older. As you become more mature, you will gain better control over your emotions, and you won't get hung up over crushes as you did in the past.
this is a sad anti-life commentary. one should savour their emotions, feel their emotions and not make "controlling emotions" a top priority. Emotions are very important internal signals... instantaneous subconscious evaluations. Its better to feel too much than it is to feel too little. When you feel too much your challenge is to manage your actions around those feelings. When you feel little or nothing you are dead inside.
sry man .. but there is nothing better in life then going down on a woman for 30+ minutes and experiencing her body's gyrations as she is overcome with ecstasy.
if he wants a woman .. i got 3 words for him....... GO FOR IT.
Hello, JimmyJRaynor.
You misunderstand me. By "gaining better control of your emotions," I don't mean you should numb yourself to your emotions and not ever enjoy yourself. That would be sad, indeed. What I am saying is he should become stronger emotionally and not obsess over some past crush or ex and move on. If he were meeting new women regularly, then I don't think these women of the past would be an issue. I agree with you that we should savor our emotions but that it is very important to manage our actions.
thanks for the clarification. i think if you want something really badly .. you should go for it.
I think people here are missing the point. I didn't write this to get dating advice; I wrote this as a reflection of what I've done and how I feel that flirting with people in general is not for me. Now I'm not saying that I won't talk to ANY girls. I mean, if it feels very natural to talk to someone, then I'll oblige. Otherwise, I won't actively talk to someone by forcing it, if that makes sense.
On May 19 2016 02:34 Shalashaska_123 wrote: You're in your mid-20s and you have raging hormones; therefore, a woman's beauty can be very difficult to resist. Know, however, that your obsession with women will wane gradually as you get older. As you become more mature, you will gain better control over your emotions, and you won't get hung up over crushes as you did in the past.
this is a sad anti-life commentary. one should savour their emotions, feel their emotions and not make "controlling emotions" a top priority. Emotions are very important internal signals... instantaneous subconscious evaluations. Its better to feel too much than it is to feel too little. When you feel too much your challenge is to manage your actions around those feelings. When you feel little or nothing you are dead inside.
sry man .. but there is nothing better in life then going down on a woman for 30+ minutes and experiencing her body's gyrations as she is overcome with ecstasy.
if he wants a woman .. i got 3 words for him....... GO FOR IT.
Hello, JimmyJRaynor.
You misunderstand me. By "gaining better control of your emotions," I don't mean you should numb yourself to your emotions and not ever enjoy yourself. That would be sad, indeed. What I am saying is he should become stronger emotionally and not obsess over some past crush or ex and move on. If he were meeting new women regularly, then I don't think these women of the past would be an issue. I agree with you that we should savor our emotions but that it is very important to manage our actions.
I'm sorry, but that phrase is pretty fucking offensive for people who CAN'T handle emotions well because I saw a doctor for this. Also occasionally, I work with people who are considered mentally and emotionally unstable and it's pretty hard to see. I understand what you're saying though; that's part of the reason I started flirting with people, other than trying something new. However, I have no idea where the "managing our actions" come from when I really haven't done much, except for talking and evaluating what I've said.
On May 18 2016 11:12 midnight999 wrote: (FYI, I am a straight asian guy in the mid-20s living in the US for a point of reference)
Over the past year, I've been flirting with the girls that I am attracted to and I have decided to stop doing it, starting today. This is not to say that I've learned much about the opposite sex and conversing with them. I have, and it has been pretty educational, such as observing the flow of the conversation, looking at body language, and noting certain key words and phrases that means yes or no. I have concluded that this just doesn't work for me.
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting. I started to open up a bit more and tried talking to women. At first, I thought it was going well. People responded and we talked for a bit. However, I felt that none of them were going anywhere AKA being "friend-zoned". I know a couple of "asshole" friends that treat women in an "asshole" kind of way, so I tried their way for a bit. This really didn't work and made it worse.
I was getting frustrated and sought help from a friend who I will call M (haha), and who happens to be female. We're good friends, and I asked her for advice. I gave one of the responses from one of the girls I've been talking to and she told me to stop because she isn't interested. This was pretty heartbreaking and I realized that none of the people I've been talking to are interested in a romantic manner.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same. Perhaps, it is something more inherent, like I'm just a bad person or I'm ugly. If those were the case, then it isn't my fault. (I doubt either of this because M said no and I trust her).
It is clear to me that I should stop flirting. I have gained nothing from it, nor do I have any motivation to do so now. Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end. If flirting with people makes me constantly unhappy about myself, then I will stop doing it in order to BE happy about myself.
Hope you guys have better luck than me, and don't get hung up on any exes or crushes for long periods of time because that can get very painful.
Throwing my 2 cents into this (and sorry if some of it comes off as "advice." )
I remember back to the first relationship I had (this is back like in High-school and what not) when I heard you say the last sentence. I remember the girl, yet, for the sake of time (and my own sake lol) we shall call her....Hmmmm... A. Now, just as a reference, I back then was just a average looking dude, nothing along the lines of "hot" or what not. Nor could I talk needless to say perfectly, due to aparxa (speech), tho i wasn't shy or nothing. Actually, much of the opposite, i was very outspoken and loud (but not in like the annoying way), and was practically known as the cool headed guy, who made jokes and was smart.
A on the other hand, was..Different needless to say. Long story short, even though she didn't show off in terms of beauty, she had it. Though, I never noticed it till after we dated but anyways. Me and her were friends for a while before, and naturally we got together after a while.
2 months later we broke up over, to make a really long story short, cheating.
I was, a course hurt, but for some reason, I got hung over her for months afterwards. Hell, it took me till 3 months afterwards to stop fucking thinking about her each day. I also feel like it changed me for a short time as well because I became much more suspicious of anyone.
Anyways, much better place now (she was like 6 years ago in my life. And currently dating someone else)
To the rest of your post and not just 1 sentence XD,
@Thebolded and who ever posted that post about working out:
In my personal experience, and just in life, people will "desire" different things. Now, I not going to lecture you about this, as this isn't what I am getting at. But what has always interested me is that:
Low esteem people tend to favor Personality Med. Esteem people tent to favor a mix, each one is different tho High esteem people tent to favor Physical traits
Now, obv, not everyone (me for example) will follow this. But just something I've noticed from what I seen/been through. But don't do what I tried to do growing up and try to "understand" love and how people fall in love etc. It just is a fucking pain in the arse.
And in general, don't feel bad because of flirting or dating. If it was suppose to be easy, then well, we wouldn't have a dating forum. Just focus on your life, the things you like to do etc. This is something that I had to learn hard, and eventually, fate just paired me up.
It's kinda hard for me to explain, And I prob. didn't do a great job, but just don't kill yourself over not finding love. + Show Spoiler +
Time that was suppose to be sent doing useful stuff for the TL mafia subpage has been wasted for good Things!
I'm sorry, but that phrase is pretty fucking offensive for people who CAN'T handle emotions well because I saw a doctor for this. Also occasionally, I work with people who are considered mentally and emotionally unstable and it's pretty hard to see. I understand what you're saying though; that's part of the reason I started flirting with people, other than trying something new. However, I have no idea where the "managing our actions" come from when I really haven't done much, except for talking and evaluating what I've said.
My apologies. I didn't know you were receiving medical help for this. It would've been helpful if you included that in the original post. Just so you know, what you're going through isn't so pathological. Men in general are weaker emotionally relative to women. Shapelog mentioned how he obsessed over a girl when he was younger. Back when I was in middle school and high school I used to obsess over crushes, too. Part of it was due to the limited number of attractive women I had seen in my life up to that point, but also it was because I lacked an understanding of female nature and I didn't realize my own value as a man.
Once you see women not as flawless, harmless, beautiful, angelic beings but as ordinary people with problems like you and me, you will have more success with them. As I said before, your hormones are affecting your physiology a great deal right now, so it is easy to overlook their flaws. That will become less of an issue, though, as you get older.
Please be careful in your interactions with women. If you can't handle your emotions very well or manage your actions, you are more vulnerable to a woman's manipulation.
Lol, people are obsessed with giving you advice for this, I'm not surprised though.
Sometimes it's good to take a break from doing these things, especially if it's not getting you anywhere. Who knows, maybe later you'll get a new angle and give flirting a fresh start again.
Anyways I think a lot of the reason you're getting barraged with advice for this is it's hard to respond with much else. I think it might help if you pointed to something you'd like people to comment on. For example, I don't disagree with your analysis or your conclusion but I'm not even sure what to comment on...
On May 19 2016 22:51 TwoTrickPony wrote: Lol, people are obsessed with giving you advice for this, I'm not surprised though.
Sometimes it's good to take a break from doing these things, especially if it's not getting you anywhere. Who knows, maybe later you'll get a new angle and give flirting a fresh start again.
Anyways I think a lot of the reason you're getting barraged with advice for this is it's hard to respond with much else. I think it might help if you pointed to something you'd like people to comment on. For example, I don't disagree with your analysis or your conclusion but I'm not even sure what to comment on...
I wish you the best though, and good luck.
Thanks. I think people are forgetting that they don't HAVE to comment on a blog post. For example, one can just move on if it were an offensive post, like racism or bigotry, and not go full SJW on it.
I'm sorry, but that phrase is pretty fucking offensive for people who CAN'T handle emotions well because I saw a doctor for this. Also occasionally, I work with people who are considered mentally and emotionally unstable and it's pretty hard to see. I understand what you're saying though; that's part of the reason I started flirting with people, other than trying something new. However, I have no idea where the "managing our actions" come from when I really haven't done much, except for talking and evaluating what I've said.
My apologies. I didn't know you were receiving medical help for this. It would've been helpful if you included that in the original post. Just so you know, what you're going through isn't so pathological. Men in general are weaker emotionally relative to women. Shapelog mentioned how he obsessed over a girl when he was younger. Back when I was in middle school and high school I used to obsess over crushes, too. Part of it was due to the limited number of attractive women I had seen in my life up to that point, but also it was because I lacked an understanding of female nature and I didn't realize my own value as a man.
Once you see women not as flawless, harmless, beautiful, angelic beings but as ordinary people with problems like you and me, you will have more success with them. As I said before, your hormones are affecting your physiology a great deal right now, so it is easy to overlook their flaws. That will become less of an issue, though, as you get older.
Please be careful in your interactions with women. If you can't handle your emotions very well or manage your actions, you are more vulnerable to a woman's manipulation.
Ah, it's alright. I'm not as spazzy and emotional as I was, like before college, and I don't think I got mad or snapped at anyone I hit on. I think my problem was I had expectations going into this when I should have had none.
Find places and people that bring the best out in you. I think lots of people try to force themselves into situations that they are awkward and uncomfortable in, and it just destroys their self-esteem. If you don't feel good flirting, then not doing it is the right decision. Not because you're bad at the technique or whatever, but because it isn't you.
It's also important to focus on people who share your interests. If someone likes clubs and partying and you don't, just don't bother they probably would not interest you if you got to know them. There's plenty of nerds in the sea. The most awkward thing is someone asking you what you did with your weekend and you not feeling good about telling them you spent it doing something nerdy / saying you did nothing instead because you think that's less embarrassing. Talk to people you feel good about sharing your interests with. Not people who are going to bore you with some shitty story about a party they went to.
tldr Just work on your self-esteem and don't worry too much about sex. It's not that critical.
Hey man I know how you feel because I was in the same boat, and after studying dating advice for more than a year it's blatantly clear to me what your problem is. I know you didnt come here for dating advice but for self reflection.. either way what I say is still relevant cause you need to self reflect anyway..
You don't invest enough in yourself.
That's your problem
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting.
What this means is you don't see yourself having a lot of value which results with a lack of confidence. "LIfe is pretty much the same now as it was in college." This means you still see yourself with the same value as before; you haven't done anything to improve yourself.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same.
You care more about the outcome rather than expressing yourself freely. For example if you really know yourself well you know what you value, you know what you stand up for and you have a very strong opinion about it. I guarantee you you will not compromise on that (changing yourself). And you wont be afraid to offend the girl. Interestingly enough she will respect you even if you piss her off.
Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end.
Rejection just means incompatibility. She's open or closed.
Think about it. If you knew what you liked and what you didn't like, value or don't value, believe or don't believe and you just put yourself out there you wouldn't be afraid of rejection. She's either open or closed to your expression. You're okay with both ways, why? Because you're comfortable with yourself. You know what you value, know what you want, you're in line with your needs and interests, you're fucking you. You like being that way, you're not trying to get anything from her, no outcome, just expressing your desire to be with her.
This is so DAMN OBVIOUS to me. You're more invested in other people's opinions than your opinion or yourself.
If you invest inyourself your value will go up = rocket confidence
If you invest in yourself you will express yourself in the best possible way = attract girls who are in line with your values and "reject" (<-----INCOMPATIBILITY) the ones that dont.
If you invest in yourself you tend to not give a fuck. Actually thats misleading. After investing in yourself the result is not giving a fuck = don't give a damn about "rejection"
I learned this from a book called, "Models- Attract Women Through Honesty" This isn't a PUA book, PUA means you change yourself, say practiced lines, do routines, etc. This book is about a way of life, how to express yourself in the best possible way and attract the women who are the best fit for you.
It just tears at my soul to see another guy devalue himself when he doesn't see he's worth more, doesn't see the solution and I do. Buy the book, it will make so much damn sense to you. It's just $12 fucking dollars.
On May 20 2016 12:30 Gotoh wrote: Hey man I know how you feel because I was in the same boat, and after studying dating advice for more than a year it's blatantly clear to me what your problem is. I know you didnt come here for dating advice but for self reflection.. either way what I say is still relevant cause you need to self reflect anyway..
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting.
What this means is you don't see yourself having a lot of value which results with a lack of confidence. "LIfe is pretty much the same now as it was in college." This means you still see yourself with the same value as before; you haven't done anything to improve yourself.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same.
You care more about the outcome rather than expressing yourself freely. For example if you really know yourself well you know what you value, you know what you stand up for and you have a very strong opinion about it. I guarantee you you will not compromise on that (changing yourself). And you wont be afraid to offend the girl. Interestingly enough she will respect you even if you piss her off.
Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end.
Rejection just means incompatibility. She's open or closed.
Think about it. If you knew what you liked and what you didn't like, value or don't value, believe or don't believe and you just put yourself out there you wouldn't be afraid of rejection. She's either open or closed to your expression. You're okay with both ways, why? Because you're comfortable with yourself. You know what you value, know what you want, you're in line with your needs and interests, you're fucking you. You like being that way, you're not trying to get anything from her, no outcome, just expressing your desire to be with her.
This is so DAMN OBVIOUS to me. You're more invested in other people's opinions than your opinion or yourself.
If you invest inyourself your value will go up = rocket confidence
If you invest in yourself you will express yourself in the best possible way = attract girls who are in line with your values and "reject" (<-----INCOMPATIBILITY) the ones that dont.
If you invest in yourself you tend to not give a fuck. Actually thats misleading. After investing in yourself the result is not giving a fuck = don't give a damn about "rejection"
I learned this from a book called, "Models- Attract Women Through Honesty" This isn't a PUA book, PUA means you change yourself, say practiced lines, do routines, etc. This book is about a way of life, how to express yourself in the best possible way and attract the women who are the best fit for you.
It just tears at my soul to see another guy devalue himself when he doesn't see he's worth more, doesn't see the solution and I do. Buy the book, it will make so much damn sense to you. It's just $12 fucking dollars.
Damn I nailed it. Ez. GG. Have a nice day.
I was gonna post something similar to this but not so in depth.
I have been in your shoes and I'm only a couple years older probably. I would say I have the same issues you describe. I do not know all the approaches you tried, but I would suggest trying online. The most important thing I would take away from the quote and most advice is work on yourself and everything you want (be it a women or things) will fall in line eventually. Even if you didn't want advice you blog for a reason and you should consider what some people have said here and just be confident in yourself. Once you are more sure of yourself you will know what you want and don't want. That along with the rejection you have already experienced makes you tough and unafraid to try new things. When I read your post again I am unclear of what you are searching for... is it a girlfriend? a friend with benefits? a wife? this is what Gotoh and I are talking about. Once you know what you want and care about its much simpler and less stressful.
On May 20 2016 12:30 Gotoh wrote: This is so DAMN OBVIOUS to me. You're more invested in other people's opinions than your opinion or yourself.
Self esteem is the reputation you acquire with yourself.
I think the blog author needs to do some work in raising his self esteem. I do not say this from a condescending perspective; I work every day, week, and month to maintain my self esteem in areas where its good and raise it in areas where i'm weak.
These are both great books and I've worked very hard the past 10 years using many of the techniques outlined by Dr. Branden. What I've learned is : its just as much work to maintain self esteem as it is to build self esteem.
On May 20 2016 12:30 Gotoh wrote: Hey man I know how you feel because I was in the same boat, and after studying dating advice for more than a year it's blatantly clear to me what your problem is. I know you didnt come here for dating advice but for self reflection.. either way what I say is still relevant cause you need to self reflect anyway..
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting.
What this means is you don't see yourself having a lot of value which results with a lack of confidence. "LIfe is pretty much the same now as it was in college." This means you still see yourself with the same value as before; you haven't done anything to improve yourself.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same.
You care more about the outcome rather than expressing yourself freely. For example if you really know yourself well you know what you value, you know what you stand up for and you have a very strong opinion about it. I guarantee you you will not compromise on that (changing yourself). And you wont be afraid to offend the girl. Interestingly enough she will respect you even if you piss her off.
Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end.
Rejection just means incompatibility. She's open or closed.
Think about it. If you knew what you liked and what you didn't like, value or don't value, believe or don't believe and you just put yourself out there you wouldn't be afraid of rejection. She's either open or closed to your expression. You're okay with both ways, why? Because you're comfortable with yourself. You know what you value, know what you want, you're in line with your needs and interests, you're fucking you. You like being that way, you're not trying to get anything from her, no outcome, just expressing your desire to be with her.
This is so DAMN OBVIOUS to me. You're more invested in other people's opinions than your opinion or yourself.
If you invest inyourself your value will go up = rocket confidence
If you invest in yourself you will express yourself in the best possible way = attract girls who are in line with your values and "reject" (<-----INCOMPATIBILITY) the ones that dont.
If you invest in yourself you tend to not give a fuck. Actually thats misleading. After investing in yourself the result is not giving a fuck = don't give a damn about "rejection"
I learned this from a book called, "Models- Attract Women Through Honesty" This isn't a PUA book, PUA means you change yourself, say practiced lines, do routines, etc. This book is about a way of life, how to express yourself in the best possible way and attract the women who are the best fit for you.
It just tears at my soul to see another guy devalue himself when he doesn't see he's worth more, doesn't see the solution and I do. Buy the book, it will make so much damn sense to you. It's just $12 fucking dollars.
Damn I nailed it. Ez. GG. Have a nice day.
Thank you, anonymous one-poster. You REALLY opened my eyes on how much of a loser I am.
For the lack of confidence in college, you didn't really question WHY I didn't really put value in myself. Maybe it had something to do with that I had no control over. Also, you don't really know much about my "improvement" or whatever.
And caring more about outcome rather the expression part, did you really think I DIDN'T express myself freely at one point? Again, I was getting frustrated because it wasn't working, so I was getting advice from other people. Also, if I started to talk girls, doesn't that mean I have the confidence now?
You assume that flirting, dating, and relationship revolve only around self-expression and self-esteem, which is just too romantic. So, if you believe in yourself and express yourself, things will work out. How utterly and typically American. This sort of attitude leads me to believe you're just some rich, white kid sitting in front of a computer and that's probably the reason the book works for you (I checked the author). And people like you don't consider other factors.
So no, you didn't nail it. Now, I suggest you read some books on general psychology, sociology, and different personality types (I wouldn't be surprised if you WERE Mark Manson).
On May 20 2016 12:30 Gotoh wrote: Hey man I know how you feel because I was in the same boat, and after studying dating advice for more than a year it's blatantly clear to me what your problem is. I know you didnt come here for dating advice but for self reflection.. either way what I say is still relevant cause you need to self reflect anyway..
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting.
What this means is you don't see yourself having a lot of value which results with a lack of confidence. "LIfe is pretty much the same now as it was in college." This means you still see yourself with the same value as before; you haven't done anything to improve yourself.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same.
You care more about the outcome rather than expressing yourself freely. For example if you really know yourself well you know what you value, you know what you stand up for and you have a very strong opinion about it. I guarantee you you will not compromise on that (changing yourself). And you wont be afraid to offend the girl. Interestingly enough she will respect you even if you piss her off.
Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end.
Rejection just means incompatibility. She's open or closed.
Think about it. If you knew what you liked and what you didn't like, value or don't value, believe or don't believe and you just put yourself out there you wouldn't be afraid of rejection. She's either open or closed to your expression. You're okay with both ways, why? Because you're comfortable with yourself. You know what you value, know what you want, you're in line with your needs and interests, you're fucking you. You like being that way, you're not trying to get anything from her, no outcome, just expressing your desire to be with her.
This is so DAMN OBVIOUS to me. You're more invested in other people's opinions than your opinion or yourself.
If you invest inyourself your value will go up = rocket confidence
If you invest in yourself you will express yourself in the best possible way = attract girls who are in line with your values and "reject" (<-----INCOMPATIBILITY) the ones that dont.
If you invest in yourself you tend to not give a fuck. Actually thats misleading. After investing in yourself the result is not giving a fuck = don't give a damn about "rejection"
I learned this from a book called, "Models- Attract Women Through Honesty" This isn't a PUA book, PUA means you change yourself, say practiced lines, do routines, etc. This book is about a way of life, how to express yourself in the best possible way and attract the women who are the best fit for you.
It just tears at my soul to see another guy devalue himself when he doesn't see he's worth more, doesn't see the solution and I do. Buy the book, it will make so much damn sense to you. It's just $12 fucking dollars.
Damn I nailed it. Ez. GG. Have a nice day.
Thank you, anonymous one-poster. You REALLY opened my eyes on how much of a loser I am.
For the lack of confidence in college, you didn't really question WHY I didn't really put value in myself. Maybe it had something to do with that I had no control over. Also, you don't really know much about my "improvement" or whatever.
And caring more about outcome rather the expression part, did you really think I DIDN'T express myself freely at one point? Again, I was getting frustrated because it wasn't working, so I was getting advice from other people. Also, if I started to talk girls, doesn't that mean I have the confidence now?
You assume that flirting, dating, and relationship revolve only around self-expression and self-esteem, which is just too romantic. So, if you believe in yourself and express yourself, things will work out. How utterly and typically American. This sort of attitude leads me to believe you're just some rich, white kid sitting in front of a computer and that's probably the reason the book works for you (I checked the author). And people like you don't consider other factors.
So no, you didn't nail it. Now, I suggest you read some books on general psychology, sociology, and different personality types (I wouldn't be surprised if you WERE Mark Manson).
What does white and american have to do with it? Lol. I have plenty of non-white friends who are masters at seducing women. Not to seem blunt, but I think the large part of your problem is attitude.
On May 20 2016 12:30 Gotoh wrote: Hey man I know how you feel because I was in the same boat, and after studying dating advice for more than a year it's blatantly clear to me what your problem is. I know you didnt come here for dating advice but for self reflection.. either way what I say is still relevant cause you need to self reflect anyway..
In college, I did not flirt or try to date anyone due to a lack of confidence and being hung up on a crush. For me, life was pretty much the same as it is now, without flirting.
What this means is you don't see yourself having a lot of value which results with a lack of confidence. "LIfe is pretty much the same now as it was in college." This means you still see yourself with the same value as before; you haven't done anything to improve yourself.
I thought to myself that I was doing something wrong. It is certainly possible, but I feel that this is unlikely because I used different approaches and talked to different people that I am attracted to and all of the outcomes were the same.
You care more about the outcome rather than expressing yourself freely. For example if you really know yourself well you know what you value, you know what you stand up for and you have a very strong opinion about it. I guarantee you you will not compromise on that (changing yourself). And you wont be afraid to offend the girl. Interestingly enough she will respect you even if you piss her off.
Getting rejected isn't fun and for someone who has depression-anxiety issues, this is pretty bad. I reason that women will treat me the same whether I talk to them or not and I learned that this isn't simply a matter of just doing something and it will work out in the end.
Rejection just means incompatibility. She's open or closed.
Think about it. If you knew what you liked and what you didn't like, value or don't value, believe or don't believe and you just put yourself out there you wouldn't be afraid of rejection. She's either open or closed to your expression. You're okay with both ways, why? Because you're comfortable with yourself. You know what you value, know what you want, you're in line with your needs and interests, you're fucking you. You like being that way, you're not trying to get anything from her, no outcome, just expressing your desire to be with her.
This is so DAMN OBVIOUS to me. You're more invested in other people's opinions than your opinion or yourself.
If you invest inyourself your value will go up = rocket confidence
If you invest in yourself you will express yourself in the best possible way = attract girls who are in line with your values and "reject" (<-----INCOMPATIBILITY) the ones that dont.
If you invest in yourself you tend to not give a fuck. Actually thats misleading. After investing in yourself the result is not giving a fuck = don't give a damn about "rejection"
I learned this from a book called, "Models- Attract Women Through Honesty" This isn't a PUA book, PUA means you change yourself, say practiced lines, do routines, etc. This book is about a way of life, how to express yourself in the best possible way and attract the women who are the best fit for you.
It just tears at my soul to see another guy devalue himself when he doesn't see he's worth more, doesn't see the solution and I do. Buy the book, it will make so much damn sense to you. It's just $12 fucking dollars.
Damn I nailed it. Ez. GG. Have a nice day.
Thank you, anonymous one-poster. You REALLY opened my eyes on how much of a loser I am.
For the lack of confidence in college, you didn't really question WHY I didn't really put value in myself. Maybe it had something to do with that I had no control over. Also, you don't really know much about my "improvement" or whatever.
And caring more about outcome rather the expression part, did you really think I DIDN'T express myself freely at one point? Again, I was getting frustrated because it wasn't working, so I was getting advice from other people. Also, if I started to talk girls, doesn't that mean I have the confidence now?
You assume that flirting, dating, and relationship revolve only around self-expression and self-esteem, which is just too romantic. So, if you believe in yourself and express yourself, things will work out. How utterly and typically American. This sort of attitude leads me to believe you're just some rich, white kid sitting in front of a computer and that's probably the reason the book works for you (I checked the author). And people like you don't consider other factors.
So no, you didn't nail it. Now, I suggest you read some books on general psychology, sociology, and different personality types (I wouldn't be surprised if you WERE Mark Manson).
What does white and american have to do with it? Lol. I have plenty of non-white friends who are masters at seducing women. Not to seem blunt, but I think the large part of your problem is attitude.
Do your friends live in the Deep South? If not, then come on down and try it out!
I was merely commenting on that guy's attitude on how idealistic it is. I already acknowledged my attitude, so I don't know what the point of your post is.
EPT
)
