• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 18:31
CEST 00:31
KST 07:31
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play1Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8
Community News
[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)83ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo39Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611
StarCraft 2
General
Is the larve respawn broken? The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start) Old Replays From 1.4.6 The future of the SC game model
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event INu's Battles#17 <BO.9> Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Best thing happen to StarCraft since Remastered? ProGamer Paychecks Story Data needed BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7703 users

Pankration - The Art of ZvZ; Part 1

Blogs > Ej_
Post a Reply
Ej_
Profile Blog Joined January 2013
47656 Posts
November 06 2015 19:21 GMT
#1
For the last 5 years, ZvZ in Starcraft 2 has been by many considered the worst, or at least the most boring, match up in the game. Going from the 1 base ling/bane to infestor/BL, then mass mutalisk wars and then the endless roach wars, certainly it has never appealed that much to an average viewer.
However, if we try to delve in, beneath the 9 pools, the speedling all-ins, and all the roaches, we will see the true nature of Zerg versus Zerg. A knife fight, a merciless game where players are constantly on their toes. Where every pair of lings, every drone, every larva matters. A game where one small mistake could lead to one's immediate elimination. And yet, a game where everyone plans 2 steps ahead.
And that is the nature of pankration, a fight of 2 men using all of their force.

[image loading]

And as HotS is nearing its end, with only Blizzcon top8 being left, it seems to be the perfect time to pay a tribute to the matchup.

This blog series is going to both celebreate the beauty of the match up and my breaking of 20k posts and conclude with a HotS ZvZ Power rank.


THE OPENING

+ Show Spoiler [15 hatchery] +

15hatch
can be followed by:
-pool/gas
-gas/pool
-pool; gasless
-pool with later gas

Pros:
-strong economy
-faster creep at natural
-faster queen production

Cons:
-prone to early pools:
-9pool will at least force you to cancel your natural expansion
-6 and 8pool can kill you (depends on your pool timing and worker control)
-10pool bane becomes a real threat if you can't micro at all
-later zerglings mean later scout on 3 and 4 player maps

With the advantages of 15hatchery significantly outweighing the downsides, it shouldn't be much of a surprise that this build is the favorite of progamers. In hands of a good player, 15hatch becomes safe vs every build, only really being at a disadvantage against well executed 9 and 10pools.
Faster queen production and earlier creep at natural offer a good set up for gasless play styles that relly on early queens and wall offs to defend.
While you sometimes want the safety of pool first (especially on 3 and 4 player maps where you can't always scout enemy rush with OL), 15hatchery has become the golden standard of high level ZvZ and for a good reason.

+ Show Spoiler [15 pool] +

15pool
can be followed by
-hatchery/gas
-gas/hatchery
-hatchery; gasless
-hatchery with later gas

Pros:
-a build order win vs any kind of early pool
-faster scout
-able to deny OL scout with early queen

Cons:
-slow economy if you didn't opt for gasless
-later creep at natural
-late 2nd queen

Ah, the always so scared brother of 15hatch. 15pool is another bread&butter build in ZvZ, but a bit less popular amongst Korean. However, pool first is still perfectly to play at any level below the top. It sees a lot more popularity amongst foreigners (notably Nerchio, who very very rarely deviates from 15pool and is one of the best ZvZ players outside Korea) and while behind 15hatch in early game, you just need a single good exchange to even the things out and the better player should have no problem at all winning the game after opening 15pool even vs the greedier versions of hatchery first.
IMHO, the biggest setback of going 15pool vs 15hatch is losing the initiative after your first 2 lings, since the 15hatch player will have his larva production kick in earlier.

+ Show Spoiler [Early pools] +

Early pools in ZvZ are aimed to keep a couple things in check:
-greedy hatchery first openings
-lazy overlord scouting patterns

Now, to go to the actual early pools, there's a few of these:

9pool:
good versus: 15hatch, 8pool, 7pool, 6pool
bad versus: 15pool, 14/14, 13/12, 10pool speed, 10pool bane

The goal of 9pool is to punish a 15hatchery opening, the 9pooler will try to either go for the drones or the hatchery of their opponent and give himself a lead through an ultimately earlier expansion (after the cancel) or more workers (after the attack). 9pool is not destined to end the game, but rather secure an advantage over hatchery first.
If 9pool meets any pool timing between 15pool and 10pool, it's kind of a build order loss, sorry.

8pool:
good versus: 15hatch, 7pool, 6pool
bad versus: 15pool, 14/14, 13/12, 10pool speed, 10pool bane, 9pool

It's kinda like 9pool, you hope for a hatch first. With 8pool, you will be looking for a locked kill with your lings, not a lead. 8pool will very often also feature a drone to spine rush opponent''s main base outside of his vision on creep.

10pool bane:
good versus: literally nothing, Tasteless (actually good vs all other early pools and 10pool speed)
bad versus: 15pool, 14/14, 13/13, properly executed 15hatch
A build that is nowadays considered outdated at the pro level, instead of going for an earlier pool or economic followup, you just make banes and try to nuke all of opponents drones.
Isn't considered viable since Leenock showed us how 15hatch can destroy 10pool bane with good drone micro. A notable player who keeps falling for 10pool bane is Life (Watch Dark vs Life from Kespa Cup). Still a rather good build on amateur level.
10pool bane also fares very well vs other early pools because of being able to morph defensive banelings

10pool and 10pool expand
good versus: bad players
bad versus: everyone else
nowadays more of a curiosity than an actual build, but it can be done in ZvZ and is worth mentioning.
the 10pool expand build goes like this: 10pool, double extractor trick, 12overlord, 6 lings, then drones
10pool is like 9pool, you aim to cancel the natural/cripple and macro behind it. On pro level, 10pools are very easily defendable with hatchery first so they have been retired. Still work on ladder, because people don't know the timings of early pools that well. Especially 10pool expand that can throw off even 15pool, as people won't notice the subtle differences in ling timings and will overestimate their economic lead

6pool and 7pool
good versus: bad overlord scouting paths
bad versus: literally every build that isn't hatchery first

6pool sucks, 7pool is even worse. We've seen I think 2(?) 6pools in high level ZvZ. This build is simply meant to abuse a playing going hatchery first who you know won't scout your early drone/lings with OL and just die when the lings arrive and you have a spine in their base. Like in this game. Jaedong 6pools because 1st ovie on Newkirk is sent not across the map, but across the dead space. He wins.

+ Show Spoiler [1 base all-ins] +

These builds aren't really early pools, but they still mostly rely on the element of surprise to take full effect. Very often used on 3 and 4player maps where your initial overlords aren't guaranteed to scout your opponent on the first try.

14/14
14gas 14pool, speedling all-in. Almost non-existant at high level. You just kind of make lings with this one, sometimes fake an expansion (Miniraser beat Snute with a build like this) and then go for the throat, hoping to abuse lackluster defence or subpar micro of your opponent.

13/12
13gas 12pool, speedling/baneling all-in. Created by Life himself, this build was designed for 4p maps. By the time your opponent can scout you (provided he didn't just scout you 1st with his overlord, then you lose the coinflip and lose, sorry), you have lings ready to deny scouting any scouting. If you succeed at it, you can just straight up kill anyone who even very slightly underprepares for the incoming attack.
Now as the pros have learned how to play vs this, the build has been retired, but is still very good for the ladder

10pool speed
Ok this one is both an early pool and 1 base speedling all-in.
You can execute it both ways:
-you send first lings to your opponent's base, cause some havoc, disrupt his build, then you catch him off-guard with a swell of speedlings and he dies
-you don't send your first lings to harass, just keep pooling units until speed is nearing completion, then leave your base to attack and (with a bit of scouting luck) he sees you at the last possible moments, has nothing and dies. Here's Jaedong doing this variant to sucker punch Hydra (who scouts it and still loses).


And when the dust settles, both parties have their defenses set up, the cheeses are done, this is where ZvZ enters early game and the madness just begins...




*****
"Technically the dictionary has zero authority on the meaning or words" - Rodya
The_Templar
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
your Country52798 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-11-06 19:24:07
November 06 2015 19:22 GMT
#2
What if I open 14/14 and then take two hidden bases?
I guess that's a less effective strategy than pool/hatch/hidden hatch, never mind. Good start
ModeratorI am still alive, somehow
TL+ Member
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 11h 29m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Codebar 50
ProTech46
SpeCial 7
StarCraft: Brood War
BeSt 71
Bale 10
Purpose 8
Counter-Strike
fl0m1425
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King82
PPMD20
Other Games
summit1g11343
Grubby3176
shahzam596
RotterdaM464
ZombieGrub131
UpATreeSC53
JuggernautJason35
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream358
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 88
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Other Games
• imaqtpie767
• Shiphtur330
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
11h 29m
RSL Revival
18h 29m
Bombastic Starleague
21h 29m
PiGosaur Cup
1d 1h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 12h
Replay Cast
2 days
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Bombastic Starleague
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
HomeStory Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
4 days
HomeStory Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
HomeStory Cup
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
BCC 2026
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
Heroes Pulsing #3
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.