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Hey guys,
unless I absolutely shat the linens, I'll be graduating with a useless BA and 5.000 Euro student debt this fall. I have a 1,3-1,7 average (depending on the result of my thesis), meaning I'm elligible for a Master's programme, but I don't think that appeals to me.
I'm getting up there in age, and I've had countless jobs, but I never enjoyed doing anything for more than a year. I'm a trained mason (bricklayer), I worked as an IT technician for the Bundeswehr, I worked as a baker for 2*6 months, I did bookkeeping for a dentist, I had countless office jobs and the last year I've supported myself by being a street- / pub musician.
So my CV is an absolute mess.
Now I want to turn over a new leaf and begin a proper career, in spite of my relatively advanced age. I really want to commit to a proper career, meaning to get a degree, work in the same field, put most of my time and energy into one particular subject.
I'm too dumb to become a scientist and too lazy / squeamish to become a doctor, but I'm pretty good with maths, physics and chemistry and okay with computers. My dream job would involve not being tied to one place at a time for too long, or ideally work from home.
My plan for the next year is to study online at a public university whilst working part time and paying off a good chunk of my student debt. I have a job offer for 20h / week in education, so I don't have to worry about that at least.
So here's where you come in:
What career do you have?
What exactly do you love - like - dislike about it?
How competitive do you think your field is?
If you're from Germany, or if you are an electrical, structual or software engineer, your reply is especially appreciated.
I have until July 15th to enrol, so hit me.
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I'm a software engineer at Microsoft developing security features. This job requires skills in both software engineering and penetration testing aka computer hacking. I work on a team with some of the best computer hackers in the world. What I basically do is develop security features to be as reliable and hack proof as possible, and the penetration testers try to take it down, and we repeat until we have something really solid to ship to customers.
Software security is a field that requires a very high degree of technical skill, but once you reach that bar, getting a job should be easy. Security software engineers are in very high demand right now. It's only recently that companies have realized the importance of security, after Sony got hacked countless times, so everywhere is trying to hire security experts like crazy.
Being a penetration tester is actually a very interesting job in that you are basically playing a very open ended puzzle game. If you are someone who likes to break into people's houses, or get free soda from vending machines, then this is the perfect job for you. One way some penetration testers work is by solely making money off bug bounties. Most tech companies offer large rewards for anyone who finds bugs in their code, and if you are good at finding bugs, then you can make a lot just sitting at home. On the higher end, you can make like $60k from a single bug. You know those ads where single moms make $30k a month sitting at home? I would imagine this is probably what they do.
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I´m not really the kind of peson you´re looking for, but I work with people that probably are. I work for an IT service provider and what you´re decribing sounds alot like the job our database engineers do.
They usually are trained as "Fachinformatiker für Anwendungsentwicklung". They work in international projects, meaning they are basicaly on duty 24/7, but mostly from home. You would need to to be good with sql and scripting languages. I´d say it´s quite a competitive field, but if you are good, companies will look for you.
Looking for a company that is listed as a oracle partner can be good place to start. Where in Germany do you live?
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Heidelberg, Baden-Württemberg.
@ Chairman Ray:
That sounds really interesting, but since you don't become a cyber security expert over night, the field might be oversaturated once I have the basics down. Still, that's a point in favour of studying software engineering.
Your job sounds balls, by the way.
Vega:
I was asking about how competitive these fields are not because I want to slack off or assume I'll suck at my job, but because I'm basically eight years older than people I would be studying with, which is a rather large handycap.
Another point for software engineering.
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To be honest you should go study in Switzerland. Economy is doing fine there, it's right next to Germany, they even speak almost the same language.
Structural Engineers are lacking in Switzerland so you find a job in no time. Salaries start at 80k€ if you have a masters degree. If you're not looking to study for that long, you can get a job as a draftsman in civil engineering with less diplomas.
I can tell you more about the job if you're interested.
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I would keep studying.
I studied until 27 years old, and it ended up serving me a lot; I have a much better job than the people I had around me when I was 22 and who went into the job market straight away. My career has nothing to do with yours (I'm a classical musician) so my experience has little value and I can't give you any other advice, but just invest, and investing at our stage of life usually means studying.
My two cents 
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I don't really have a career as such yet so I'm not the kind of person you are looking for. However, here is my opinion anyway. I also graduated with a useless BA (and more than 4x as much debt as you) a few years ago. After that I spent a year doing shitty jobs I hated, and then I managed to get on a Computer Science masters degree course. I now have an MSc in Computer Science and a set of skills that should allow me to get a variety of junior software development type jobs.
I haven't got round to starting my career yet because I'm off doing other things at the moment, but I think doing this MSc in Computer Science was one of the best decisions I ever made. After I graduated I started getting emails and calls from recruiters offering me software development positions. I don't even know how they got my CV. My older brother had a similar experience after finishing his degree in Electronic Engineering; he got headhunted by some recruiter and got a pretty good job straight out of university.
Being a software engineer/developer of some kind would allow you to to work from home or travel I suppose if you got the right kind of job or managed to get into freelance work.
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On July 03 2015 18:49 Chairman Ray wrote:
I'm a software engineer at Microsoft developing security features. This job requires skills in both software engineering and penetration testing aka computer hacking. I work on a team with some of the best computer hackers in the world. What I basically do is develop security features to be as reliable and hack proof as possible, and the penetration testers try to take it down, and we repeat until we have something really solid to ship to customers.
Software security is a field that requires a very high degree of technical skill, but once you reach that bar, getting a job should be easy. Security software engineers are in very high demand right now. It's only recently that companies have realized the importance of security, after Sony got hacked countless times, so everywhere is trying to hire security experts like crazy.
Being a penetration tester is actually a very interesting job in that you are basically playing a very open ended puzzle game. If you are someone who likes to break into people's houses, or get free soda from vending machines, then this is the perfect job for you. One way some penetration testers work is by solely making money off bug bounties. Most tech companies offer large rewards for anyone who finds bugs in their code, and if you are good at finding bugs, then you can make a lot just sitting at home. On the higher end, you can make like $60k from a single bug. You know those ads where single moms make $30k a month sitting at home? I would imagine this is probably what they do.
Hi mami
I'm a penetration tester
how cool is that?
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On July 03 2015 21:08 mooose wrote:
I don't really have a career as such yet so I'm not the kind of person you are looking for. However, here is my opinion anyway. I also graduated with a useless BA (and more than 4x as much debt as you) a few years ago. After that I spent a year doing shitty jobs I hated, and then I managed to get on a Computer Science masters degree course. I now have an MSc in Computer Science and a set of skills that should allow me to get a variety of junior software development type jobs.
What BA did you get that was useless, yet at the same time taught you what you needed to know to get into a Master's course in Computer Science?
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Take the part time job in education imo, and if you can work for a private or religious institution so you don't have to deal with district level administration. You will make less money than if you were doing the same job for some corporation but your job security will be better and promotions will come easier. I'm not sure about Germany but in the US IT/communications/administrative jobs in education are in demand. Once you're "in" it will be very easy to find work anywhere.
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Oh I'm definitely taking the job, the question is what I'll be studying whilst doing it.
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i make database software primarily using microsoft tools.
i am an independent consultant/contractor.
as part of that
i built a custom report writer that allows "power users" to build their own reports without requiring a skilled programmer guy.
i made a deal with a giant vendor to sell my report writer and i am constantly adding new features to it.
i know a project manager with 30+ years experience who specializes in internationalizing existing applications. He constantly feeds me new work.
i started programming Visual Foxpro applications when i was 12 in 1999 and i helped out with setting up presentations for Visual Foxpro lectures and teaching sessions (basic boring grunt work but at the time i thought it was awesome).
i got a 4 year degree in software engineering from the best tech school in Canada
its pretty tough for others to follow my career path because i started so young.
i don't find my field very competitive at all. There are very few coders who can see the forest through the trees. So they can build software that works great at a microscopic level , but does a mediocre job of dealing with issues the user faces.
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On July 03 2015 17:22 SixStrings wrote:
Hey guys,
unless I absolutely shat the linens, I'll be graduating with a useless BA and 5.000 Euro student debt this fall. I have a 1,3-1,7 average (depending on the result of my thesis), meaning I'm elligible for a Master's programme, but I don't think that appeals to me.
I'm getting up there in age, and I've had countless jobs, but I never enjoyed doing anything for more than a year. I'm a trained mason (bricklayer), I worked as an IT technician for the Bundeswehr, I worked as a baker for 2*6 months, I did bookkeeping for a dentist, I had countless office jobs and the last year I've supported myself by being a street- / pub musician.
So my CV is an absolute mess.
Now I want to turn over a new leaf and begin a proper career, in spite of my relatively advanced age. I really want to commit to a proper career, meaning to get a degree, work in the same field, put most of my time and energy into one particular subject.
I'm too dumb to become a scientist and too lazy / squeamish to become a doctor, but I'm pretty good with maths, physics and chemistry and okay with computers. My dream job would involve not being tied to one place at a time for too long, or ideally work from home.
My plan for the next year is to study online at a public university whilst working part time and paying off a good chunk of my student debt. I have a job offer for 20h / week in education, so I don't have to worry about that at least.
So here's where you come in:
What career do you have?
What exactly do you love - like - dislike about it?
How competitive do you think your field is?
If you're from Germany, or if you are an electrical, structual or software engineer, your reply is especially appreciated.
I have until July 15th to enrol, so hit me.
I'm a software developer / tester.
I get to utilize my ability to perceive unusual situations and my 20+ years of computer experience. The downside is that I'm typically tied to my desk for hours at a time and have to put in extra effort to hit deadlines. This applies to testing and development.
Software Development is pretty competitive, but most developers who think they're good developers (much like most poker players) are pretty awful at what they do. If you have a good understanding of math and logic, I would recommend software development since it's basically... all math and logic.
Software Testing however is competitive but in a different way. So I don't rant, let's just say that Testing does not pay well enough nor does any company that's not a giant corporation give Testing the resources it needs to get it's job done correctly.
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On July 03 2015 18:49 Chairman Ray wrote:
I'm a software engineer at Microsoft developing security features. This job requires skills in both software engineering and penetration testing aka computer hacking. I work on a team with some of the best computer hackers in the world. What I basically do is develop security features to be as reliable and hack proof as possible, and the penetration testers try to take it down, and we repeat until we have something really solid to ship to customers.
Software security is a field that requires a very high degree of technical skill, but once you reach that bar, getting a job should be easy. Security software engineers are in very high demand right now. It's only recently that companies have realized the importance of security, after Sony got hacked countless times, so everywhere is trying to hire security experts like crazy.
Being a penetration tester is actually a very interesting job in that you are basically playing a very open ended puzzle game. If you are someone who likes to break into people's houses, or get free soda from vending machines, then this is the perfect job for you. One way some penetration testers work is by solely making money off bug bounties. Most tech companies offer large rewards for anyone who finds bugs in their code, and if you are good at finding bugs, then you can make a lot just sitting at home. On the higher end, you can make like $60k from a single bug. You know those ads where single moms make $30k a month sitting at home? I would imagine this is probably what they do.
Penetration testing sounds like a lot of fun. The company I work for had a penetration test done and we spent half a day in development discussing various tactics each of us would use. Of course, we're not professionals at all in terms of penetration testing, but it was an interesting discussion none-the-less.
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Full time web developer here. I think it'll hit all your requirements but like anything else I think it's best if you know you enjoy it.
Have you considered a career in going on weird dates an blogging about them?
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On July 03 2015 23:39 obesechicken13 wrote:
Full time web developer here. I think it'll hit all your requirements but like anything else I think it's best if you know you enjoy it.
Have you considered a career in going on weird dates an blogging about them?
No, but the reason I'm looking for a career is because I want to make lots of money before my hair falls out, so I can continue going on weird dates.
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I would just say that finding people and a work environment you like is more important than the field.
Do you like working under pressure and performing? Finance and purchasing tend to fit. Though there are plenty of analysis positions.
Do you like problem solving and working/leading projects? Engineer. Computer, machining, logistics (a topic people often forget about), anything at all with that title.
Do you like working with people and improving them and the work they do while making some decisions. Management.
Those are the ones I know about from what I do work with in the Engineer sphere.
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the favourite part of my job is going into a new customer that has haphazard, poorly designed business processes and improving things.
re-engineering many of the processes from the ground up and turning an organizational weakness into a strength.
and seeing all the happy users being able to focus more time and energy on their job function rather than jumping over stupid technical hurdles created by poor business processes.
so i'd say business process re-engineering is the most rewarding aspect of my profession.
once this solid foundation is in place the organization is in the position to put in place some kind of ERP system.
being an engineer and all i don't get that abstract.. i really stick to the ground level stuff... no fancy shmancy ERP work for me
in order for me to do my job i need a really good Project Manager above me to cut through all the organization politics and false roadblocks created by turf protectors and middle management empire builders.
the project manager i work under (most of the time) has an international reputation and is an acclaimed author and so the weight of these accomplishments really helps bulldoze through the bullshit.
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I'm a (IT) business analyst with Accenture (management/technology consulting company) working on the software development side.
Its great because I love technology and computers but I'm not very good (nor do I enjoy) the very technical side like programming. I came from studying computer engineering and then I switched into business which is where I got my bachelors degree. We work in project teams with a variety of people that range from very business-y (functional) to very technical. Basically individuals within my role handle all the client interactions, understanding the client's business model and needs, working with them to figure out their AS-IS and where they want to be (from a business and systems perspective) and gathering requirements for what that To-Be system looks like. We do all the functional designs (UIs, data modeling etc.) and the more technical people on the team handle the things like security, technical architecture, etc. After the designs are approved, the technical folks then build the application/system and we work on figuring out how to test all the features/requirements that were decided on and making sure the client gets what they paid for.
If you know what the software development life cycle (SDLC) is, we basically go through that from project to project.
I love my job because every project is different so I'm never stuck doing the same thing. Every project also introduces new and different types of challenges which help me grow and continue to learn (not stuck). I'm someone who enjoys new and being pushed to continue to grow and develop and this environment helps with that.
I love technology and we need to understand enough about it in order to work well with the developers/technical folks and make good calls with the client. But since I'm not very skilled at the technical side, I don't need to do the actual programming but I still have a role within software delivery. My skills lie with understanding the client's business process, business model, and so I get to work between getting them the right/correct technical solution to meet their business/functional needs.
Because we are a technology firm, we heavily leverage technology to work, so things like working remote and working from home are common. There are people from our team who are work purely remote and only fly in for the super important events (system implementation or project kickoff).
What's also good is that you can play to your strengths. If you are more technical, you can pick up focus on the more technical side, and if you are more business minded, you can focus on that instead. The job market (not sure about Germany) in Canada is great and I assume it will continue to grow as more and more companies need new systems to improve margins and efficiencies and computers are handling ever increasing amounts of work. You'll never grow bored as your role can also transition into development (focus/study on more technical stuff), project management, sales, etc.
There's not much I dislike tbh, its basically my dream job. I guess depending on your company type there may be more dislikes? Since I work consulting, lots of travel can be both a pro and a con depending on your family status, life goals, etc. Also the client comes before anything so if we can't meet a deadline we work 60+hr weeks in order to hit it. But that usually doesn't happen as long as your project manager is good at managing risks and the schedule. You need to push yourself to keep growing and adapting which is an absolute requirement for any technology type job (and is a pro for me) but that can be a con for people who don't are not good at adapting/learning new things.
Competitiveness... not too competitive due to the growing market and different ways you can specialize.
Examples: Specializations can come in many different ways
Specialize in industry (Oil and gas vs finance vs government vs agriculture)
Specialize in role (business analyst, system analyst, project management, sales, etc)
Specialize in technology type (SAP, vs oracle, vs .NET, etc)
Specialize in technology area (Databases, business intelligence (data warehousing), general application development, security)
Ways of entry into the field (in terms of study):
Comp sci - have strong technical background, pick up the business skills/knowledge on the job
Business - have strong business background, pick up the technical skills/knowledge through self study and on the job training
Let me know if you have any questions and hope this helps!
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On July 04 2015 01:19 joshie0808 wrote:
Competitiveness... not too competitive due to the growing market and different ways you can specialize.
if you're in southern ontario a lot hinges on how hot the economy is in New York.
seeing software engineers leave 1 by 1 for NY makes a lot of IT shops like a season of Survivor.
and it forces places to bring in lone wolf gun-slingers like me.
and then this allows guys like me to crank up their rates...which in turn forces up salaries of employees.
as long as New York stays hot working in southern ontario is a dream come true.
there is opportunity in anarchy
i just hope the Canadian dollar keeps on falling.
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On July 04 2015 01:39 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2015 01:19 joshie0808 wrote:
Competitiveness... not too competitive due to the growing market and different ways you can specialize.
if you're in southern ontario a lot hinges on how hot the economy is in New York. seeing software engineers leave 1 by 1 for NY makes a lot of IT shops season of Survivor. and it forces places to bring in lone wolf gun-slingers like me. and then this allows guys like me to crank up their rates...which in turn forces up salaries of employees. as long as New York stays hot working in southern ontario is a dream come true. there is opportunity in anarchy i just hope the Canadian dollar keeps on falling.
Ah, good point. I forget how big Canada is and yes, things really do vary from province to province. I'm in Alberta.. lots of oil and gas guys getting laid off, but tech industry still looking good here (so far). Oil seems to be going back up too...
Sounds like things are going well for you! Thats good
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I work tech support during the day and slay newbs on ladder at night. I wish you the best of luck!
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Did you say math?
Teach!
Also, look on the bright side... if you went to college in America, your useless BA would cost 10 times as much...
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I think you should consider a career in professional assassinations. I know you said you didn't like blood, but hear me out; you can use your chemistry background to create poisons that will kill your targets without shedding a drop of blood. Many times, one of the requirements of your job is to "make it look like an accident", and so a bloody demise would be suspicious to the authorities. I also must advise you that this career path, while it is often glamorized in modern cinema, it's actually quite boring. You spend most of your time sitting around and waiting, so it takes some patience. The good part is you won't be tied down to a desk and will get to travel quite a bit. The bad part is that if anyone catches you, they will probably either incarcerate you for the rest of your life, or simply kill you. So don't get caught! gl!
On July 04 2015 04:14 GGzerG wrote:
I work tech support during the day and slay newbs on ladder at night. I wish you the best of luck!
He means he's unemployed and gets owned when he stays up too late at night trying to git gud.
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people ask me how i got into the career path that i am in ...
and i let them know that my hobbies in high school included shoplifting and vandalism.
the little gang i was in ... we'd destroy a few luxury cars in the local shopping mall parking lot and then read the next week's Mississauga News to see if we made it into the paper.
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On July 03 2015 21:28 SixStrings wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2015 21:08 mooose wrote:
I don't really have a career as such yet so I'm not the kind of person you are looking for. However, here is my opinion anyway. I also graduated with a useless BA (and more than 4x as much debt as you) a few years ago. After that I spent a year doing shitty jobs I hated, and then I managed to get on a Computer Science masters degree course. I now have an MSc in Computer Science and a set of skills that should allow me to get a variety of junior software development type jobs.
What BA did you get that was useless, yet at the same time taught you what you needed to know to get into a Master's course in Computer Science?
The BA was in Philosophy. The MSc course I took was a special 'Conversion Course' for people who had a Bachelor's degree in a subject that isn't relevant to computer science. The requirements were just a Bachelor's degree with a reasonable grade in any subject, and an A level in maths (basically a high school qualification). We took a few basic programming classes as well as other ones with the regular computer science MSc students, and did a dissertation/thesis project at the end just like all the other students. It was very fast paced and quite difficult but I'm very glad I did it.
I'm not sure if they have an equivalent type of course in Germany. There are only a few universities in the UK which do this kind of course, and there were quite a few international students in my class, some of whom said they came to the UK because their own country didn't offer this kind of conversion course.
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I don't know how things are in other nations, but my personal anecdote is that if you decide not to go get your masters, you may find it very difficult to ever go back. Depending on what you're going for, a formula used here is to get your BA, work a few years in your field, go back for masters, and ascend to the job/income that will carry you for life. But a lot can happen while you're just working before you go back. Wife, house, kids, personal strife, career changes, etc. So I guess, whatever you do, just be sure to be very confident in your decision.
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I have a bachelor degree in Hospitality Management (BBA). As such I work as a bar manager in a large international hotel chain (Marriott) in China (I'm European).
The good:
-Noone in this industry lasts if they're not passionate. As such you are working with a team towards the best possible product.
-Again I love fine foods and drinks and I get to work with that daily. As a large luxury hotel other luxury brands are always eager to work with you.
-Working and living all over the world.
The bad:
-This career takes up so much of your time that it's a struggle to maintain a social life on the side.
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On July 04 2015 13:53 B.I.G. wrote:
I have a bachelor degree in Hospitality Management (BBA). As such I work as a bar manager in a large international hotel chain (Marriott) in China (I'm European).
The good:
-Noone in this industry lasts if they're not passionate. As such you are working with a team towards the best possible product.
-Again I love fine foods and drinks and I get to work with that daily. As a large luxury hotel other luxury brands are always eager to work with you.
-Working and living all over the world.
The bad:
-This career takes up so much of your time that it's a struggle to maintain a social life on the side.
Can you elaborate on the duties of a job for someone graduating from hospitality management? - Not OP
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Generally me and the people I graduated with get hired to many different sectors. The overlying factor is that people from my school have very strong people skills combined with good insight and feel for business. As such many of us become sales managers, account managers or recruiters in industries varying from banking to IT to sales in imported decorative stones for gardens (as in: pretty much any industry where people skills come in handy).
For those like me that stick to hospitality there are still plenty of ways to go:
-You could go for a career in finance, such as friends of mine who have become revenue managers, a relatively new field in the hotel industry (basically they focus on pricing strategies with a strong eye on competitor pricing etc.)
-Just like many big companies there is also need for sales, marketing, public relations, and human resource. These are very similar to equivalent departments in other companies so I wont elaborate
-Or like me you could go for the operational side, so for example Rooms division (the people that do check-ins at hotels etc), Housekeeping (cleaning rooms etc.) Kitchen (all the food in the hotel needs to come from somewhere right), or Food & Beverage (basically the service and beverage side of restaurant, bar, room service etc.)
I'm not too familiar with working in any of those other divisions but I do know operations. As you can imagine delivering good service in a big hotel requires quite a lot of planning, coordinating, and teamwork. A career in operations should always start in the trenches, in the bottom ranks. Working your way up the ladder would look something like this (e.g. in a restaurant)
Trainee/intern -> Waiter -> Supervisor/team leader -> Assistant Restaurant Manager -> Restaurant Manager -(and beyond that in a bigger hotel)-> Director of Restaurants ->Assistant F&B Director -> F&B Director.
Generally during your studies you will do 1 or 2 internships. Most of us have also had part time jobs during our before our studies as something like waiter or supervisor. This means that when you graduate and take up a career in operations you will be able to step in on the supervisor/Assistant manager level. The whole process might take up to 10 or 12 years. After you reach that level you start looking into next steps like becoming General Manger of a hotel, or if you work for a large hotel chain something like regional management, concept development etc.
Plenty of options as you can see. Happy to elaborate some more if you would like me to.
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On July 04 2015 11:16 mooose wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2015 21:28 SixStrings wrote:On July 03 2015 21:08 mooose wrote:
I don't really have a career as such yet so I'm not the kind of person you are looking for. However, here is my opinion anyway. I also graduated with a useless BA (and more than 4x as much debt as you) a few years ago. After that I spent a year doing shitty jobs I hated, and then I managed to get on a Computer Science masters degree course. I now have an MSc in Computer Science and a set of skills that should allow me to get a variety of junior software development type jobs.
What BA did you get that was useless, yet at the same time taught you what you needed to know to get into a Master's course in Computer Science? The BA was in Philosophy. The MSc course I took was a special 'Conversion Course' for people who had a Bachelor's degree in a subject that isn't relevant to computer science. The requirements were just a Bachelor's degree with a reasonable grade in any subject, and an A level in maths (basically a high school qualification). We took a few basic programming classes as well as other ones with the regular computer science MSc students, and did a dissertation/thesis project at the end just like all the other students. It was very fast paced and quite difficult but I'm very glad I did it. I'm not sure if they have an equivalent type of course in Germany. There are only a few universities in the UK which do this kind of course, and there were quite a few international students in my class, some of whom said they came to the UK because their own country didn't offer this kind of conversion course.
Thanks, that sounds really interesting.
So many interesting replies, give me a moment to work this out.
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Move to Brazil and become a drug lord or move to Europe and become a pimp. Good money btw and you don't need much.
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M.Sc in Economics, Business Administration and Information Management.
I work as a Business Intelligence Consultant doing a lot with customers/clients helping them scope BI-Solutions. I also do some front-end development in QlikView/Excel/PowerView/Power BI/Tableau.
The field is currently screaming for people with skills. So if you like IT and Business then Business Intelligence is cool. Being German, learning SAP and developing in/for SAP and SAP HANA is probably very useful.
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I'm a researcher for a university and a class lecturer in political science as well as a PhD candidate/student. Why not do engineering though? If you want a job that pays well and where you don't need to be exceptionally book-smart (but you still need to work your ass in school), there are many branches of applied engineering that could be interesting.
If I had wanted an education that'd land me a stable career, it's what I would have done, instead of choosing a field of constant precarity and fear that my contracts will end.
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That's what it'll probably be, I just have to do some in depth research if it's mechanical / electrical or structural.
I'd love to work towards renewable energies at some point, so I have to figure out which is the better path for that.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
I did chemical engineering which might interest you. I went into the academic research side which is less lucrative but you can work for companies like Shell/BP and make some serious bank.
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On July 03 2015 19:31 SixStrings wrote:
Heidelberg, Baden-Württemberg.
@ Chairman Ray:
That sounds really interesting, but since you don't become a cyber security expert over night, the field might be oversaturated once I have the basics down. Still, that's a point in favour of studying software engineering.
Your job sounds balls, by the way.
Vega:
I was asking about how competitive these fields are not because I want to slack off or assume I'll suck at my job, but because I'm basically eight years older than people I would be studying with, which is a rather large handycap.
Another point for software engineering.
For the foreseeable future, the software engineering industry is not going to be at all oversaturated. Demand has only been going up. The pay is ludicrous in comparison to other industries. The entry requirements are rather low for non-enterprise positions, and catching up to the baseline can be done in a year of work. And the majority of positions don't actually care that much about your previous occupations if you're a good programmer and hard worker. This is mainly based on the States though.
Cyber-security is slightly different and requires more formal education usually, or a lots of learning.
Problem is it's a bit harder to move around. Benefit is you can find a job in almost any city if you have the skills or want that kind of position.
source: I'm a software engineer
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Thanks Blisse!
Although on an abstract level, software engineering sounds like a dream come true, on a very superficial level it involves what I don't really want to do: sitting in front of a computer 100% of the time. It also seems like something that could increasingly be online, which puts me in direct competition with hundreds of millions of Chinese and Indian software engineers.
I also have to think a bit more Euro-centric. Whilst in Silicon Valley software guys seem to be gods, I think in less technologically advanced countries it's much more difficult to land a job.
I'd love to move to the USA (or, better yet, Mexico or Canada) some day, but immigration seems rather difficult.
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What career do you have?
What exactly do you love - like - dislike about it?
How competitive do you think your field is?
Artist multi media platform.
I love it all, I hate it all. Having ideas, showing them to people, seeing it a year later done with success by someone else.
Most competitive battlefield if one discards the politics field.
I also re-transcript / translate / edit / shoot / direct commercial/marketing 's hit' to feed my kids and sometimes myself. I am in no hurry to get my drawings/scripts/etc into the mainstream, I'll wait for said kids to stop leeching all my time <3
On topic: Pursue your studies, coming back is hard, only canadians or scandinavians manage it because their system allows for it. In the old europe, they consider you a drop out and life takes a turn for the bleak (while it shouldn't and you can overcome the obstacles, "they" make it hard enough to disparage many, simply put it is not good). 
Edit: Cheer up .. at least you are not old like me 
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On July 06 2015 03:39 SixStrings wrote:
That's what it'll probably be, I just have to do some in depth research if it's mechanical / electrical or structural.
I'd love to work towards renewable energies at some point, so I have to figure out which is the better path for that.
i wouldnt do that. don't drink the german coolaid of: "we save the world with energiewende" and china is also building it!!!111
there is a lot of propaganda to straight up lies going around in Germany b/c a lot of ppl in media and politics want it to look good, but it really isn't. EEG is close to burning money.
you can't betray physics.
if you really want to combine "saving the planet" and engineering, then help building ITER. (or similar)
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On July 05 2015 04:33 Djzapz wrote:
I'm a researcher for a university and a class lecturer in political science as well as a PhD candidate/student. Why not do engineering though? If you want a job that pays well and where you don't need to be exceptionally book-smart (but you still need to work your ass in school), there are many branches of applied engineering that could be interesting.
If I had wanted an education that'd land me a stable career, it's what I would have done, instead of choosing a field of constant precarity and fear that my contracts will end.
Cheers to the social science PhD! I go on the job market in 2-3 months looking for a TT position...You read poliscirumors by any chance?
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On July 07 2015 05:51 Dknight wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2015 04:33 Djzapz wrote:
I'm a researcher for a university and a class lecturer in political science as well as a PhD candidate/student. Why not do engineering though? If you want a job that pays well and where you don't need to be exceptionally book-smart (but you still need to work your ass in school), there are many branches of applied engineering that could be interesting.
If I had wanted an education that'd land me a stable career, it's what I would have done, instead of choosing a field of constant precarity and fear that my contracts will end. Cheers to the social science PhD! I go on the job market in 2-3 months looking for a TT position...You read poliscirumors by any chance?
I don't read it, but maybe I should. Good community?
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It's an anonymous forum mostly full of PhD students, young professors, and some other noise. Pretty interesting and funny at times though some have described it as a 'cesspool' thanks to a lot of trolling but it is pretty interesting if you're into academia..They were the ones that began to get suspicious back of LaCour and his fraud back in December before it went big in May. I'm actually a criminal justice major with no interest in polisci; I just find the site amusing and a decent waste of time ever since I started following LaCour a few months back...
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pretty funny how op says he has an useless BA degree, then 56 people reply that have software engineer degrees and jobs and suggest him jobs that all require advanced technical knowledge.
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On July 08 2015 18:22 Poopfeast 024 wrote:
pretty funny how op says he has an useless BA degree, then 56 people reply that have software engineer degrees and jobs and suggest him jobs that all require advanced technical knowledge.
You should have read more. That's what I'm willing to acquire.
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On July 08 2015 19:15 SixStrings wrote:Show nested quote +On July 08 2015 18:22 Poopfeast 024 wrote:
pretty funny how op says he has an useless BA degree, then 56 people reply that have software engineer degrees and jobs and suggest him jobs that all require advanced technical knowledge. You should have read more. That's what I'm willing to acquire.
well in that case, what I can tell you is that in Germany and (everywhere) there is a huge demand of programmers, you don't even necessarily need a degree. you do need programming skills though, because most of the jobs require you to do some sort of test and/or homework. the most popular languages are Java (moderately hard to learn), C++ (very hard), C# (moderate). You can get some expertise in the language itself in a few weeks using online tutorials, if you have the affinity for it. But you also usually need knowledge of some tools like frameworks, git, merging apps, databases, etc, and some network knowledge, and ideally knowledge of some other programming languages as well.
It is possible to obtain these from zero skills in a few months, if you have the commitment and have affinity, and get an internship/junior job.
It is also much harder to get a relevant job in any other engineering field if you are not degree certified and those also pay less, so I guess your best bet is some kind of object oriented programmer career.
I have a masters in industrial design engineering, work as a development engineer at a company that specializes in sensors, have 2 years of exp at a german automotive supplier as a design engineer, and also speak very good english and german (and hungarian). also have decent IT skills, sql, advanced excel, visual basic, python, etc. And all my friends that work as software developers earn about 50% more than me, and have much more job opportunities, even if their skills in programming are worse than mine in my field. I am trying to make the transition too but it's hard to study with a full time job
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As it turns out, there are plenty of Master studies in software and mechanical engineering that only require a B. Sc. that's vaguely related to maths, so I'll just get a bachelor's in engineering mechanics with a theoretical focus.
That should leave enough room for specialisation down the road.
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I'm an animator/visual effects artist.
My work takes place on a computer, it's creative, technical knowledge/coding/math ability is a bonus, contractual nature of it means I'm not at one place longer than I want to be and I have the freedom to take vacations or work in other countries.
Almost completely skill-based. If you're good you can get a job, if you're not, you can't. Mega competitive.
EDIT: Although you probably will not get employable skills from a regular university course. Better to go to a specialist school.
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Well, for me it comes down to either:
- structural engineering
- mechanical engineering (Maschinenbau)
From what I've seen in the respective study guides, the former seems a deal more interesting, but I think the latter will be a bit more useful and is more general. Please help. 
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On July 10 2015 20:40 SixStrings wrote:Well, for me it comes down to either: - structural engineering - mechanical engineering (Maschinenbau) From what I've seen in the respective study guides, the former seems a deal more interesting, but I think the latter will be a bit more useful and is more general. Please help.
I can give you some imput about mechanical, since I have a BSC in mechanical and I have worked as a design engineer for 2 years for a German company.
mechanical engineering is one of the most interesting subjects to learn if you're into technical stuff, since it is quite interdisciplinar compared to electrical or computer science. you'll have to learn a lot of natural science basics (mathematics, with emphasis in differential equations, phsics, statics and dynamics, electronics, fluid dynamics, thermodynamics). a lot of these subjects are considered VERY hard. and also you have to keep in mind that you won't be as much of an expert in any subject (unless you specialize in it) as an electrical engineer will be in electricity for example.
other areas of subject: structure of machines, machine elements, manufacture technology, CAD technology, material science- these are EXTREMELY interesting. but you usually have to survive the basic subjects to get to the really interesting ones.
I went on to do a master's in Industrial Design, but you have many choices of specialization. Applied mechanics, fluid mechanics, machine design, manufacture technology, plastics, chemical machines and verfahrenstechnik, etc, mechatronics, etc.
Manufacturing technology is probably the best in terms of job prospects, these guys usually work as a process engineer in a cnc plant. They work with cnc programming software in machining factories. these jobs pay very well but the downside is there won't be any females at all and you'll have to wake up at like 6 am in the morning. these also tend to be not in big cities but in the outskirts or villages or the such.
Automotive is huge in germany, and you can get very good payment in this field. most of the jobs is just CAD design, you don't need any specialization for these jobs. In fact most of the german people, including my boss only did an apprenticeship. the payment is very good but the jobs are repetitive, with a lot of annoying, lengthy processes. 80% of your work will be absolutely useless which is a pretty annoying feeling. I worked for 3 of the largest german concerns, I could write a book about all the retarded shit I had to do without any rational explanation.
Most of your job, whatever you choose will mostly consist of using some kind of CAD software, maybe some other technical software like FEA, and creating technical documentation. You won't use 99% of your academic studies. In fact most of my german bosses were infinitely stupider than me in literally every subject, because they only had apprenticeships, while they required masters degrees from the hungarians.
there are more advanced paths, like plastic tooling designer, project engineer/project manager, etc, but you usually need to have a certain amount of specific experience.
If you manage to get a job at a smaller company that has the potential to be awesome though.
it is not an easy path to take, you'd probably better off with programming, and have an easier time too.
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It's awesome how many smart and successful ppl there are on TL.
I actually graduated with a finance degree in business school (almost got job working in finance / banking industry, thank god i didn't) I did some random drawings on the side and put them up on my website and youtube for fun at the time. Then those things kinda took off on their own. Eventually I'm able to support myself doing commissions.
these days I have decent amount of followers and viewers / exposure to keep the commission side going while pursuing other avenues such as sponsorship and what not. I feel pretty lucky since i get to be my own boss and work from wherever I want doing something i enjoy. (need internet and working post office near by tho)
I also really enjoy designing of all sorts but these days don't have much time to look too much into it. I also wish I have more time to look into investing but w/e. appreciating life one moment at a time.
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On July 11 2015 03:42 Glider wrote:
It's awesome how many smart and successful ppl there are on TL.
I actually graduated with a finance degree in business school (almost got job working in finance / banking industry, thank god i didn't) I did some random drawings on the side and put them up on my website and youtube for fun at the time. Then those things kinda took off on their own. Eventually I'm able to support myself doing commissions.
these days I have decent amount of followers and viewers / exposure to keep the commission side going while pursuing other avenues such as sponsorship and what not. I feel pretty lucky since i get to be my own boss and work from wherever I want doing something i enjoy. (need internet and working post office near by tho)
I also really enjoy designing of all sorts but these days don't have much time to look too much into it. I also wish I have more time to look into investing but w/e. appreciating life one moment at a time.
i'd love to see some of your stuff if it's not a secret. in fact i like to do drawings as a hobby but too shy to show them to people, but i've been thinking about doing something like what you do would love to be my own boss. bosses suck.
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Do you not know Glider? Here's his youtube channel:
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxJ67xR4HBkLe5gnwJZRhXg
His art is absolutely amazing, do check it out and spread the word.
Also:
Thank you VERY much for taking the time and describing your experience with engineering. I really appreciate it.
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I studied industrial engineering (wirtschaftsingenieur) and work as an engineer part time. I started to study Math last year.
From my experience engineering is a great choice as its super interesting, keeps your choices flexible and gives you great carreer opportunities.
That being said, I always thought of myself as too dumb for mathematics and it was a really hard choice last year for me... but now I manage quite well. You should do what interests you the most, being too dumb for sciences, as you wrote, shouldnt hold you back if you otherwise wanted to try it. Motivation is everything.
Also I wanted to add that I love your honesty and how open you are in all your posts, really refreshing! GLHF
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EPT
