• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 19:49
CET 01:49
KST 09:49
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win0Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.175Evil Geniuses - shutting down23ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier7Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1
StarCraft 2
General
[D] Hacker peak in sc2 ? No more SC2 streamers on team liquid? Liquibets sc2 season 30 Evil Geniuses - shutting down Weekly Cups (Oct 26 - Nov 1): MaxPax, herO, Solar win
Tourneys
SC4ALL: II Venue Change Announcement! Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20)
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps Starcraft 2 Advance [D] the control group Simple Questions/Answers
External Content
Mutation # 550 Graveyard Shift The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles Mutation # 548 Shining Bright
Brood War
General
[Megathread] Daily Funny Videos List of top players active on ShieldBattery BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion Rollback Netcode in Brood War
Tourneys
[$1250] International ShieldBattery League [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
Strategy
50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stratus: Battle for the sky now on steam Early acc Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Deus Ex 3!?
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Dating: How's your luck? Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
Fan Club Resource Thread Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Why I built Repalyzer (1.1.…
BlueStar
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 6966 users

Siege draft 311

Blogs > govie
Post a Reply
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-07 03:37:26
December 29 2014 19:10 GMT
#1
My 2nd blog about trench pubdrafting, which in my opinion is totally different from what we see in progames. I will try to blog posts with a maximum of 10 textlines for specific draftconcepts, pick&bans, examples and/or additional info I want to share or discuss. In my opinion short reads tend to be nice reads if updated frequently.

DRAFT 311 : SIEGE DRAFT

[image loading][image loading][image loading]

- Tide & DP as your first two picks means 100% commitment, pick a tanky AC carry and lifesaving support (i.e. dazzle) after;
- Has -armour potential if you draft slardar and vengefull spirit. Dazzle & venge can counteract most of slardar' yolo behaviour;
- Carry wraithking grants a more versatile siege draft, it leaves you open to get any second support you prefer;
- Carry Doom- and Axeplayers seem to be less objective based by nature, but I assume it can work. In 6.83 lone druid possesses a lot of siege potential as a natural AC & pipe carrier, but his skillcap is high and I havent tested it yet;
- I mostly ban silencer, void, omni, sven, magnus because they are: Annoying, grant armour or worse (=buff & RP).

+ Show Spoiler [-armour siege draft] +
[image loading]
[image loading] [image loading][image loading] [image loading] [image loading][image loading][image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading][image loading][image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

48 KILLS 34

[image loading]



+ Show Spoiler [versatile siege draft] +
[image loading]
[image loading] [image loading][image loading] [image loading][image loading][image loading][image loading][image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

[image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading][image loading][image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading] [image loading]

44 KILLS 31

[image loading]

red = green and viceversa



+ Show Spoiler [Example game D2L: EG vs VP Polar] +
On January 07 2015 10:41 govie wrote:
EG is drafting similar in D2L finals vs VPPolar game 3, only difference is the batrider instead of the tidehunter (they lost partly because of that imo. Anchorsmash and ravage is that good for sieging):



http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1145614198

*Still, PPD is a trenchdrafter confirmed, haha

The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-12-29 19:41:27
December 29 2014 19:32 GMT
#2
- Tide & DP as your first two picks means 100% commitment, pick a tanky AC carry and lifesaving support (i.e. dazzle) after;

This isn't really true. DP is interesting in that she can act as both a frontline core or a backline DPS core due to variable item progression and therefore does not necessarily force your draft in either direction. DP+Tide allows for very flexible carry choice provided the supports complement it well. Consequently, the idea of a "lifesaving support" being necessary here is wrong as well given that you haven't committed your carry pick yet.

DP Tide is a combination that saw a lot of play in 6.82, and the carry picks with it have been all over the place.
Moderator
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-12-29 23:45:42
December 29 2014 23:39 GMT
#3
It is about pubgames and not promatches, thats a big difference. Clearly you havent been in the trench for a long long time yango

In the trench wrong or right doesnt really exist because its a different universe with other laws of dotopsychics, closer to chaostheory. Your not talking +5k mmr bracket here, this is the trench where most coreplayers dive, suck and rather dive some more for that one more kill. Thats why in my opinion we see those high winrates on dotabuff.com with abbadon, wraithking, necrolyte, venge, dazzle, centaur etcetc, because playing them in the trench prevents deaths or even unneccesary feeding by mediocre players.

The more pressure or tension a draft puts their mediocre coreplayers under, the more likely they are gonna feed or dive to far for kills etcetc. Thats why depending on the herocombinations and the idea behind the draft, i tend to incorporate some "semi redundancy" if needed, because experiences have taught me to do so (and i have alot of trenchgames under my belt, all at mediocre mmr). The level of play in the trench is very very volatile (i.e the difference between playing random or a favorite hero etcetc) and when you take note of that when your drafting, it tends to help contribute to more positive outcomes.

You can disagree with me based on your own experiences, but both examples granted me more wins then losses, same goes for the global draft from yesterday, all three are fun to play. In my experience semi-redundancy isnt that bad when you can assure yourself of the fact that all players on your team will most likely fail as much critical actions as they can pull of succesfully.
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
Kraznaya
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States3711 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-12-30 02:37:47
December 30 2014 02:37 GMT
#4
if ur really good at playing/drafting against 3k players shouldnt u no longer be 3k
do you have enough resolve, hero of justice?
Velr
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Switzerland10989 Posts
December 30 2014 13:52 GMT
#5
3k MMR isn't about the draft.

You can draft "perfect" and people will still manage to lose lanes they really, really shouldn't or aren't working together like they should.
the bear jew
Profile Joined August 2014
United States3674 Posts
December 30 2014 22:56 GMT
#6
On December 30 2014 22:52 Velr wrote:
3k MMR isn't about the draft.

You can draft "perfect" and people will still manage to lose lanes they really, really shouldn't or aren't working together like they should.


I've lost more games cause of people refusing to cooperate then I like to think about.
DeMoN pulled off a Miracle and Flies to the Moon
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-02 22:45:00
January 02 2015 22:40 GMT
#7
ofcourse, cooperation is key, but having a little synergy in skills or items cant hurt either and makes the game more enjoyable for me personally.
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
govie
Profile Blog Joined November 2012
9334 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-07 02:04:25
January 07 2015 01:41 GMT
#8
EG is drafting similar in D2L finals vs VPPolar game 3, only difference is the batrider instead of the tidehunter (they lost partly because of that imo. Anchorsmash and ravage is that good for sieging):



http://www.datdota.com/match.php?q=1145614198

*Still, PPD is a trenchdrafter confirmed, haha
The two NBA teams in states with legal weed are called the Nuggets and the Blazers...
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL
05:00
RO24 Group E
JDConan vs Julia
UltrA vs hanniGan
ZZZero.O152
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
ZZZero.O 152
Terrorterran 21
Dota 2
syndereN887
League of Legends
Doublelift4347
JimRising 660
Super Smash Bros
AZ_Axe97
Other Games
summit1g8427
XaKoH 185
NeuroSwarm80
ViBE76
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick729
BasetradeTV175
Counter-Strike
PGL106
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• EnkiAlexander 63
• musti20045 48
• Adnapsc2 30
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• Pr0nogo 12
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis3626
• Jankos2562
• Scarra1058
Other Games
• imaqtpie691
• Shiphtur110
Upcoming Events
IntoTheTV X SOOP
10h 11m
IPSL
16h 11m
Azhi_Dahaki vs ggnore13
Double vs WIZARD
Replay Cast
22h 11m
Replay Cast
1d 22h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
YoungYakov vs Lambo
SHIN vs TBD
Percival vs Shameless
Solar vs TBD
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
[ Show More ]
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
IPSL
6 days
TerrOr vs IJ_Terran
rasowy vs Hazorath
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-11-05
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
IPSL Winter 2026-27
Calamity Cup Div. A Season 8
IEM Beijing 2026
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026

Upcoming

Sector 951
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Underdog Cup 2026 Div 2-3
PGL Bucharest 2027
BLAST Bounty Winter 2027
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.