• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 21:03
CEST 03:03
KST 10:03
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview9Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL44Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4[ASL19] Finals Preview: Daunting Task30
Community News
GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th7Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0EWC 2025 Regional Qualifier Results26Code S RO12 Results + RO8 Groups (2025 Season 2)3Weekly Cups (May 19-25): Hindsight is 20/20?0
StarCraft 2
General
Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview Serious Question: Mech CN community: Firefly accused of suspicious activities The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL
Tourneys
$5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo) WardiTV Mondays Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) $1,200 WardiTV June (June 4th-June 15th) SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance Mutation # 473 Cold is the Void
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans? BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Battle.net is not working
Tourneys
Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL19] Grand Finals
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Mechabellum Monster Hunter Wilds
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Plays: Diplomacy TL Mafia: Generative Agents Showdown Survivor II: The Amazon
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024 NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
Research study on team perfo…
TrAiDoS
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Poker
Nebuchad
Info SLEgma_12
SLEgma_12
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 13869 users

Rant about watching (mostly foreign) tourneys

Blogs > KeksX
Post a Reply
KeksX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Germany3634 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-06 16:53:54
December 06 2013 16:52 GMT
#1
(Beware, Dreamhack and some other spoilers inside.)

Hi, I've been wanting to do this post for quite a while, but never found the time to actually write it. So here it goes now.

When I watched BW back in the day, one of the most exciting things was to see how other people reacted to it. Being
the lonely guy I was in my schooldays, these people were mostly just guys on the internet. But I had a very good replacement:
Korean casters and audiences.

I don't know exactly why, but hearing the korean casters shout "JEEJEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!" while hard basses/guitar riffs were coming out of the speakers that caused the audience to go nuts and clap with their little plastic thingies always got me
excited. It was even better when while all that happened players jumped out of their booths and taunted their opponent.

I then always felt like something epic happened. Two players were battling it out. For 5, 10, 15 or even 30 minutes there was was action, mind games, nailbiting engagements and much more. They were sometimes even, sometimes one was behind, someone planned a counter-attack or maybe a contain. One ended
up having a superior strategy, getting a lucky punch or maybe was just overwhelmingly fast and his opponent could not keep up.

In the end, someone lost the game.
He would then type "gg" and tap out of the game. He surrendered, accepting his defeat.
This meant something. Even if you take it out of context, those guys were having a fight and the other lost. Add the fact that those are games for money, for tournament spots or just for prestige, even if the BoX wasn't over after that game, the playing field changed and it had impact.

Impact that, especially for newer players, is not always that obvious. If I watch a game for the first time I don't know the stories, I maybe don't even know the game all that way and the concept of "GG" is nothing I can connect to.

Last weekend I had some friends over. We were watching some movies (R.E.D. and some other movies, good movie btw) and sometimes I would open up Dreamhack to introduce them to Starcraft. They liked it, they even asked me to turn the movie off so we could watch the finals. One thing I noticed:
The game hooked them. All of them are LoL players and fans. They know eSports exists but only really watched LoL eSports, if any.

But Starcraft 2 seemed so exciting to them that they wanted it to watch all evening long. One game that I remember in particular was Taeja vs Life, I explained the "alien bug race" and the Terrans to them, they liked Zerg more so they began cheering for Life. I told them about his playstyle, about him being a Royal Roader
and everything and they soaked it all up like a dry sponge in the ocean.

And then it happened. After a few minutes of explaining, a few moments of clapping, nailbiting and cheering it finally happened. The last sentences from the casters:
(VOD: http://www.twitch.tv/dreamhacksc2/b/483683325?t=11h36m00s)
"Look at the supply difference, 160 for Taeja 130 after cracking that third base and Taeja hase done it. Game number one goes over to the Liquid Terran after being on the backfoot for almost all of the game"
All WHILE the GG happens, all WHILE one player gives up. The casters don't even see a reason to just stop and acknowledge the win or the loss, they just keep on talking as if the game was still going on.


Now, I know that it was only the first game. But seriously, this was the winners finals. This game MEANT something, even if it just mean that Taeja is in the finals and Life has to battle it out in the Loser's Bracket, this game meant that Taeja was one step ahead on the road to the finals.

But nothing from that got conveyed from the casters. I had to explain everything to my friends, it felt like I was filling the holes the casters left behind.

Okay, this is mid-series. So let's give this another shot. Here's the ending of the second game leading to Taeja's advancement into the Grand Finals.
http://www.twitch.tv/dreamhacksc2/b/483683325?t=11h36m00s

Can you feel it? Can you feel just how tired these guys are? That is NOTHING that creates excitement. If you don't know that game, if you're not already a fan, this feels like shit.

I don't want to blame the casters on this one. You can clearly feel that they are trying, that they WANT to show you how excited they are, but you can only do so much.
But what else is there? Well, you hear clapping. That's good. Clapping creates some kind of excitement, but is it the dominant part? No, the dominant part here is Apollo trying to make it look exciting, but the moment Life GG'd out the production lost it's way and everything went kinda...
[image loading]

No music, and you instantly see the production hurrying to get the interview going so they can all go on and/or probablys go to sleep sooner.

Casting a tournament is nothing you can "just do", it is a really hard task especially for a tournament like Dreamhack. I can understand when the earlier games are not casted as exciting as the later ones, but in my opinion it is extremely important to let the viewers know what just happened. In comparison, let's just watch a video on YouTube called "Firebathero Ceremonies" uploaded by xHydrax:



I'm not saying I want casters screaming like this, but if you watch that video you will see how incredibly good the production takes the excitement of a game and portrays it for something understandable: The casters soak it up and shout, the music goes RAWR and the crowd goes wild.

Music is so big, I can not emphasize enough how important it is. Music determenites the general colour for a broadcast. If you blast loud rock music and have shiny lights blinking into the crowd and on the stage, it can create an epic feeling of what I like to call "The Starcraft Zone". You're being sucked into it and you can not stop it, and then the game starts and you just HAVE to watch until you jump out of your seat after the game ends with a "GG".

To stop myself from talking so much, I will now just list a few things that I consider important to make a set feel more rounded and perhaps also give Casters a little more break to actually be able to show excitement when needed:

1) Don't treat every game like it is the most epic game you ever (will) watch. BUT - when you have a game that is truly important to at least the players OR the tournament, don't forget to SHOW that in every possible way. Shout, tell everyone just how good this is and give the crowd the opportunity to do their part. Also, play MUSIC, but for that see my next point

2) Music. Play it. Play it loud, let the crowd go wild over it if you want to. Let the music show the audience, at the venue and at home, that this game is epic, that this is MOTHERFUCKING STARCRAFT.

3) Stop talking. I did not address this in the text, but another big point is that after a game, when it was good enough, just say "GEEEGEEEEEEEEEE" and leave it be. I don't want to hear your bedtime stories or funny jokes, I want to FEEL what the player feels: Music, crowd cheering and just EPIC WINNING. Or the bittersweet taste of tears when my favourite player lost.

4) Take your time. Rushing everything never ever feels good to a viewer. And we will ABSOLUTELY see when things are too rushy. And it will ruin the experience.


Obviously, many things I wrote here can not be addressed by just a few persons. Tournament organizers and producers have to do their job properly and for that to happen you have to pull a lot of stuff and work really hard, so I'm not saying this because I think it is easy.

I say this because I'm seeing this since SC2 tournaments started occuring in the foreign scene. The GSL, funnily enough, did all these things from the beginning and it's the tournament I enjoy the most, not only due to it's players but also due to it's high production value. Even if I don't care about a single player playing right now I just tune in to enjoy the sweetass production.

Thank you to whoever is going to read this, probably no one but I really wanted to make a point about this. I also really suck at formatting and writing in general, so please don't be so harsh on me.

*****
EJK
Profile Blog Joined September 2013
United States1302 Posts
December 06 2013 17:38 GMT
#2
I have bones to pick as well, your not a lone


But all we can do is hope for a better future for our kids to grow up in so that they may not experience these first world problems that plague us and make our life miserable
Sc2 Terran Coach, top 16GM NA - interested in coaching? Message me on teamliquid!
intrigue
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Washington, D.C9933 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-06 21:04:20
December 06 2013 18:03 GMT
#3
yeah man totally agree. loud music is important, esp loud music with wailing guitars and driving drums. emo music works especially well, and it doesnt even matter that i dont listen to that stuff. in-game music is good too - you can always tune it out when cool stuff happens, but it can feel empty without. over-the-top casters, shots of a fun crowd, shots of the players warming up in their cool uniforms, all leading to the game lobby where you can see the player's ids and maybe mysterious tags/aliases they would sometimes use that make you wonder and them spamming "GO GO GO GO GO" "GooDLucK" "gl" and finally...

the COUNTDOWN. the countdown sound for bw was amazing. that boop boop boop boop boop while the music fades out and commentators die down has this sick je ne sais quoi, this unbelievable sense of buildup and of something amazing starting. it brings a sense of wonder over to your own ladder games too

when the prep screen whooshes away to the map you feel like you're in this sacred place. the casters are hushed, almost reverent. there's no comment about how excited they are or how they got there (why do english casters always make it about themselves?), filler or stupid stories and jokes (these can be nice, but not every game). there's none of that talking-as-a-game-starts shit, or talking over the gg shit, all this lifeless talk.

gsl did all the good things pretty well, and recent english productions have been alright (korean casters are just on another level though). but for me perfection in starcraft production were from these days:
Moderatorhttps://soundcloud.com/castlesmusic/sets/oak
KeksX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Germany3634 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-06 18:46:31
December 06 2013 18:44 GMT
#4
OMG, great point. That countdown is probably one of the most iconic sounds for me. I still have it loud and clear in my head even without looking at a VOD.
Also, thanks for that vid. Effin' EPIC. I just LOVE watching old BW production!

I'm also honored that intrigue read and even responded to my Blog :D!

On the topic of "emo music", this is by far my most favourite intro and I couldn't imagine any other song for that:


@Smurfett3:
Yeah, I know this is a really high level rant, but I think it's essential to the appeal of starcraft for a new audience. I also really miss that feeling that I get from watching BW. As I said GSL and other productions do it as well, but other than that I'm really missing "the fire", you know?
rafaliusz
Profile Joined December 2009
Poland482 Posts
December 06 2013 19:01 GMT
#5
On December 07 2013 02:38 Smurfett3 wrote:
I have bones to pick as well, your not a lone


But all we can do is hope for a better future for our kids to grow up in so that they may not experience these first world problems that plague us and make our life miserable

What a god-awful post
EJK
Profile Blog Joined September 2013
United States1302 Posts
December 06 2013 19:01 GMT
#6
On December 07 2013 03:44 KeksX wrote:
OMG, great point. That countdown is probably one of the most iconic sounds for me. I still have it loud and clear in my head even without looking at a VOD.
Also, thanks for that vid. Effin' EPIC. I just LOVE watching old BW production!

I'm also honored that intrigue read and even responded to my Blog :D!

On the topic of "emo music", this is by far my most favourite intro and I couldn't imagine any other song for that:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUB398ltrgM

@Smurfett3:
Yeah, I know this is a really high level rant, but I think it's essential to the appeal of starcraft for a new audience. I also really miss that feeling that I get from watching BW. As I said GSL and other productions do it as well, but other than that I'm really missing "the fire", you know?

no ya i completely agree with you, there's a passion that is lacking that is required to take the game to a larger level of appreciation
Sc2 Terran Coach, top 16GM NA - interested in coaching? Message me on teamliquid!
Pangpootata
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
1838 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-07 01:06:22
December 07 2013 01:05 GMT
#7
That is why I prefer watching the korean stream. I don't understand what they are saying, but they sound bloody excited and always yell GEEEEGEEEE at the end.

About the lack of countdowns, Proleague productions do show a countdown before getting into the game and random fangirls will scream "[insert team name here] HWAITING!!!"

After all this years, I still think OGN has the best production values. I especially like the epic face zooms.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Monday
00:00
#34
PiGStarcraft514
CranKy Ducklings159
SteadfastSC93
rockletztv 43
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft514
RuFF_SC2 144
Livibee 99
SteadfastSC 93
Nina 77
StarCraft: Brood War
Artosis 874
ZZZero.O 42
Icarus 5
Dota 2
monkeys_forever635
NeuroSwarm77
Counter-Strike
Fnx 1713
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox470
C9.Mang0227
AZ_Axe124
PPMD116
Other Games
summit1g7407
shahzam1387
Day[9].tv1098
ViBE248
Maynarde209
Trikslyr42
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1239
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 93
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki12
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Doublelift6397
Other Games
• Day9tv1098
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Qualifier
9h 58m
Bellum Gens Elite
10h 58m
OSC
14h 58m
The PondCast
1d 8h
Bellum Gens Elite
1d 9h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 9h
Replay Cast
1d 22h
OSC
1d 22h
Bellum Gens Elite
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
SC Evo League
3 days
Bellum Gens Elite
3 days
Fire Grow Cup
3 days
CSO Contender
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
SOOP
4 days
SHIN vs GuMiho
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
AllThingsProtoss
4 days
Fire Grow Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 1
DreamHack Dallas 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
2025 GSL S2
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2025
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLAN 2025
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.