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Yeah this is just QQ but if you feel like reading with me and enjoy me wallowing in my sorrow, go on ahead.
I've played SC for about 3 years, on and off. I spent 3 months getting to Platinum until I hit a roadblock. I spent a year and 3 months in Platinum and I was so relieved when I got to diamond.
I spent a year in diamond until last June when I finally got masters' league. I was so happy yet so burnt out from intense ladder sessions, so I decided to take a break.
I played about 40 games last season, getting placed into diamond and staying there. I was ridiculously disappointed to find out that I was placed in Platinum for season 6. However, I decided to try and get to masters, and I can't.
The problem is that the MMR system is complete bullshit. Every time I play someone in plat, they are always masters players who have been kicked out because of MMR decay. How is anyone supposed to get back into Masters when all they are playing are players with Master league skill but are stuck in Platinum? To be honest, it seems like the only thing MMR decay has done is create 3 master leagues: Platinum (filled with high diamond and low masters players), Diamond (filled with people lucky enough to not lose league and mid-masters players), and Master (players who got really lucky or are good enough to stay in Masters' league constantly).
How is anyone supposed to get on a winning streak when they are playing masters' players? It's just a cycle of basically ELO hell where no one can ever get promoted because people with super high MMR are in your same league. Your winrates are going to be stuck at 50% and your MMR will never get any higher even though you are playing better players than you. It frustrates me, as a mid to high diamond player, to be ranked 30+ in Plat with 5 more losses then wins. How is this fair? It is like they took all of the grinding I did to get to Diamond and Master and and just told me it was not valid?
The MMR system is broken and needs to be fixed. Masters league needs a bigger percentage of players (I don't even look at the percentages but I can tell that many people are feeling my pain) or they need to make it so if my MMR is truly Plat, I can play true platinum players more often and have a better chance to increase my MMR and get on a winning streak. It's just too frustrating right now.
TL;DR MMR system is broken, Blizzard hates me and Platinum is the new Diamond. It's not right.
Thanks for reading. QQ over.
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imo, the ladder changes are good. The last 5 seasons i have been diamond and and currently plat as i have only played 10 games this season, but these changes are bring back the respect for ones league status imo. as it was, being diamond was nothing special, the avg diamond player still sucked ass. hell i was only top 20 diamond and i could stomp master zergs if they didnt know what mech was with relative ease (and shocking enough it was easier to beat master zergs than diamonds as diamonds seem to know how to vs mech better, maybe from experience?). master league was inflated which brung down the skill that players in that league had thus on the whole making it a less respectable acheivement, (top of masters was always and will always be boss though). I have always viewed masters league as blizz intended, a league for the best only. im not in masters and never have been but i have heard how big the skill gap between low and high masters is, i think these ladder changes may actually help fix that. Making masters harder to get to is always a good move in my book as masters should be increadably hard to get to.
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Canada16217 Posts
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A positive is that the leagues are more meaningful and harder to maintain. A downside is actually there are a lot more one sided stomps. Gold and Silver players are meeting former masters for a lot of games in a row, going 0-10. Conversely many players go long stretches without meeting a single player anywhere near there skill. All because of a short time off.
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So, you're ex-Diamond / Master and are now in Platinum league playing versus other ex-Diamond / Master players? I don't see a problem. The number of people playing ladder is most likely significantly lower than before. It's reasonable to assume that mostly it was the lower league players that quit and therefore everyone is shifting towards lower leagues.
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Masters League is 2% of the player pool. Increasing the size of the masters league is not going to do anything except make you feel better for artificially being in a higher league than your mmr allows. Your mmr is going to be the same regardless of a league expansion.
But, yes. People taking breaks and a slight decline in players is making it harder to break into that top 2%. In turn, it's making every other league harder because people are being demoted due to the percentages with the same mmr they had before. But, increasing the size of Masters league isn't the answer. I think Blizzard just needs to make the mmr decay a little less steep than it is right now to fix the problem.
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How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first?
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I don't really care about rank, but matchmaking has been straight up busted since they implemented these changes. I just played someone who was an 8 time Master player (high master for some seasons) who was sitting in mid-Platinum with a W/L of 56-9. He completely leveled me. It could not have been fun for him and it definitely wasn't fun for me. Next game was the opposite, I was up in supply on my opponent the entire game and won with minimal effort.
They need to bring the old system back. The new system is not fun in any way. I never get matched equally anymore. It always results in either me getting completely stomped or me completely stomping someone. No close games, no way to improve or figure things out.
Edit: Yup, just played a 12 time Master Terran. Got rolled one sided yet again. This is not fun. And they wonder why people are quitting. This guy had 9 wins in a row today but prior to today hadn't played for 2 weeks.
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I feel your pain man. I'm stuck in Top 75 Grandmaster league, and I really wish I could push myself into top 16 grandmaster. But Blizzard does not agree with me, I just wish they would make Grandmaster league easier.
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On November 23 2013 06:27 ReMinD_ wrote:
So, you're ex-Diamond / Master and are now in Platinum league playing versus other ex-Diamond / Master players? I don't see a problem. The number of people playing ladder is most likely significantly lower than before. It's reasonable to assume that mostly it was the lower league players that quit and therefore everyone is shifting towards lower leagues.
It wouldn;t be a problem except there are actually gold and plat players who have been there forever getting only ex masters and getting destroyed game after game. There are also former masters down in gold or plat going 30-0.
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On November 23 2013 06:19 AlaxWayLaxed wrote:
imo, the ladder changes are good. The last 5 seasons i have been diamond and and currently plat as i have only played 10 games this season, but these changes are bring back the respect for ones league status imo. as it was, being diamond was nothing special, the avg diamond player still sucked ass. hell i was only top 20 diamond and i could stomp master zergs if they didnt know what mech was with relative ease (and shocking enough it was easier to beat master zergs than diamonds as diamonds seem to know how to vs mech better, maybe from experience?). master league was inflated which brung down the skill that players in that league had thus on the whole making it a less respectable acheivement, (top of masters was always and will always be boss though). I have always viewed masters league as blizz intended, a league for the best only. im not in masters and never have been but i have heard how big the skill gap between low and high masters is, i think these ladder changes may actually help fix that. Making masters harder to get to is always a good move in my book as masters should be increadably hard to get to.
The problem with the MMR decay isn't that Master's League is harder to get into. That is probably the biggest UPSIDE of the whole thing.
The problem is that thanks to MMR decay you are getting Former Master's players now being thrown into as low as Gold League if they are inactive and facing other players in a similar situation creating a bottleneck that has dramatically shrunk Platinum and Diamond Leagues as well as Master's league.
http://www.sc2ranks.com/stats/league
Bronze: 33.38%
Silver: 29.42%
Gold: 21.00%
Platinum: 8.35%
Diamond: 5.12%
Master: 2.40%
Grandmaster: 0.33%
Percentages above are for NA.
This isn't good for anyone in the lower leagues. Bronze was before the previous revamp of the Ladder rankings harder than the other leagues to escape because of the severity of the difference between a top Bronze player and a low Bronze player and now you're throwing Gold and Silver players into it to just make it worse.
MMR Decay has made an absolute mess of every league below Master's. It definitely needs a rework, losing to an equally skilled opponent is fine, going for a 50% winrate with completely lopsided matches all day is NOT fun.
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I made masters around June as well, including a few of my friends. Prior to that promotion I stayed in top diamond for more than a year, and now I'm suddenly back in top plat even when I've been playing a lot of ladder this whole time. The system may be broken, or the fault just lies with us.
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On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first?
I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work.
I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot.
On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss).
I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous.
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On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous.
That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate?
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The problem with this system is that you can't be a casual player (20 or so games a month) and play at your level.
I'm a was a consistent mid-highMaster player in WoL and first season of HotS. Then I stopped playing. Now I play like 2-5 games a week in platinum and only facing bad players. It's not that I'm not good enough to be master league, it's just I don't have time to put in the games. So basically I can't have anymore interesting games on the ladder because of MMR decay.
Pretty bad system if you ask me.
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Tbh I understand what you're saying, but the thing is if you're a masters league player then you will get masters. For example I started playing on europe this season for the first time and I got masters in 20 games. So yeah you may play people who are former master players, but not everybody is going to be a former masters player just here and there, you deserve whatever league you get. Just practice up and you will get masters back.
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It is extremely disheartening, I just keep telling myself I am playing the same level players I always have. Except some are good, and some are bad. Hopefully the ladder will even itself out eventually, the good players will move up, some will move down and others will stay. Right now its a mess. And the people denying it are mostly just people that have their captain opposite hat planted a bit too firmly on their opinionated head.
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On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate?
That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond.
If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason)
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On November 23 2013 06:49 MyNameisYueY wrote:
Tbh I understand what you're saying, but the thing is if you're a masters league player then you will get masters. For example I started playing on europe this season for the first time and I got masters in 20 games. So yeah you may play people who are former master players, but not everybody is going to be a former masters player just here and there, you deserve whatever league you get. Just practice up and you will get masters back.
But if I'm a diamond player, shouldn't I get diamond?
Your advice is sound but it is frustrating to lose over and over again to players who shouldn't be in Platinum.
If I was losing to true diamond/plat players, I would be fine and I would accept the fact that I suck. But if I'm playing the same players as I was when I was trying to get to Masters' league, shouldn't I be in diamond league?
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United States744 Posts
People who stayed in masters probably aren't the lucky ones, they are most likely the ones who didn't take breaks and played the most. Therefore they deserve it. I'm not saying that the system isn't flawed or that I don't feel bad for you and anyone else experiencing this, but don't take anything away from the people who are still in Masters
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On November 23 2013 06:55 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate? That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond. If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason)
It does matter. Because it takes more games to get promoted now, unless you go on insane win streaks. Didn't you just say you knew how it works?
Rather than spend your energy here ranting on the forums, why don't you go play some more games? If you play 200 games with a positive win rate against masters players and don't get promoted, then maybe I might concede that you've earned the entitlement to announce that the system is broken, and that it isn't infact just you that can't get into Masters.
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Also this could be the aftermath of blizzard severely shrinking the master league, because people were complaining the skill variance was too big. So the result created this mess.
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I made a thread about this.
Basically because MMR decay is so steep, a bunch of ex masters and diamonds who havent played for a little are now in plat (like me). Because there are so many people in plat, we can't actually get out of it because we can't get to a win rate significantly higher than 50% (because we're facing similar skill opponents who also used to be Masters).
Blizzard has basically aknowledged that there is a problem and are working to fix it.
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On November 23 2013 07:00 DinoMight wrote:
I made a thread about this.
Basically because MMR decay is so steep, a bunch of ex masters and diamonds who havent played for a little are now in plat (like me). Because there are so many people in plat, we can't actually get out of it because we can't get to a win rate significantly higher than 50% (because we're facing similar skill opponents who also used to be Masters).
Blizzard has basically aknowledged that there is a problem and are working to fix it.
Well if they won't be able to solve the problem until the next season, why bother playing now? it's just frustrating =(
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On November 23 2013 06:59 rd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:55 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate? That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond. If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason) It does matter. Because it takes more games to get promoted now, unless you go on insane win streaks. Didn't you just say you knew how it works? Rather than spend your energy here ranting on the forums, why don't you go play some more games? If you play 200 games with a positive win rate against masters players and don't get promoted, then maybe I might concede that you've earned the entitlement to announce that the system is broken, and that it isn't infact just you that can't get into Masters.
Yes, I'll play more games so I can lose to more Masters' players stuck in Platinum.
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On November 23 2013 07:01 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 07:00 DinoMight wrote:
I made a thread about this.
Basically because MMR decay is so steep, a bunch of ex masters and diamonds who havent played for a little are now in plat (like me). Because there are so many people in plat, we can't actually get out of it because we can't get to a win rate significantly higher than 50% (because we're facing similar skill opponents who also used to be Masters).
Blizzard has basically aknowledged that there is a problem and are working to fix it.
Well if they won't be able to solve the problem until the next season, why bother playing now? it's just frustrating =(
Well If you don't play you will decay to gold 
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There have been many people complaining about this. I was like a 7-8x masters (can't confirm this exact number, but was sinsce WoL, a long time), took a break cuz gf and life, came back and now I'm stuck in plat league playing ex-masters only.
It's happening to everyone.
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On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:
I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work.
I think only Excalibur_Z can make that claim outside Blizzard employees 
Also, please take a look at this chart before you make more claims.
![[image loading]](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BZaXMeoCMAEd2k3.png)
MMR decay is not the only reason why you are facing past Master players in diamonds and platinums.
Just accept it and try to get better.
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If I was in Platinum and I was facing former Master players, I would see it as an opportunity for me to practice against these players who technically have more experience than myself and try to become better rather than whining about it. I highly doubt the skill gap is so vast that people in platinum will find it impossible to beat these former master players.
I am a grandmaster top 75 zerg right now and let me tell you, the masters you are playing right now have never been anywhere near high or mid master level. They were the low masters who basically just got by. There was a huge skill gap between low and high masters, I don't know if its still there because I've been GM the past 3 seasons.
If I were you guys, i'd see this as an opportunity to get free games vs people that technically are better than me and test myself if I have the prowess to take them down. #KeepLaddering
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Master league doesn't need more players in it, but for fuck sake try to tune down the fucking decay, Blizzard :D
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On November 23 2013 07:07 Days wrote:
If I was in Platinum and I was facing former Master players, I would see it as an opportunity for me to practice against these players who technically have more experience than myself and try to become better rather than whining about it. I highly doubt the skill gap is so vast that people in platinum will find it impossible to beat these former master players.
I am a grandmaster top 75 zerg right now and let me tell you, the masters you are playing right now have never been anywhere near high or mid master level. They were the low masters who basically just got by. There was a huge skill gap between low and high masters, I don't know if its still there because I've been GM the past 3 seasons.
If I were you guys, i'd see this as an opportunity to get free games vs people that technically are better than me and test myself if I have the prowess to take them down. #KeepLaddering
I agree that's definitely the right mentality to have, but you should also think about the people you face whos skill is below your own that you have to face after demotion. You never know what skill level you face, it could be master league or gold, and if your own skill is above regular gold/plat level, that's what I would consider a waste of time.
I do however think it will sort itself out eventually, right now its a mess though.
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On November 23 2013 07:03 JacobShock wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 07:01 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 07:00 DinoMight wrote:
I made a thread about this.
Basically because MMR decay is so steep, a bunch of ex masters and diamonds who havent played for a little are now in plat (like me). Because there are so many people in plat, we can't actually get out of it because we can't get to a win rate significantly higher than 50% (because we're facing similar skill opponents who also used to be Masters).
Blizzard has basically aknowledged that there is a problem and are working to fix it.
Well if they won't be able to solve the problem until the next season, why bother playing now? it's just frustrating =( Well If you don't play you will decay to gold
TROLOLOLOLOL
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On November 23 2013 06:58 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:49 MyNameisYueY wrote:
Tbh I understand what you're saying, but the thing is if you're a masters league player then you will get masters. For example I started playing on europe this season for the first time and I got masters in 20 games. So yeah you may play people who are former master players, but not everybody is going to be a former masters player just here and there, you deserve whatever league you get. Just practice up and you will get masters back. But if I'm a diamond player, shouldn't I get diamond? Your advice is sound but it is frustrating to lose over and over again to players who shouldn't be in Platinum. If I was losing to true diamond/plat players, I would be fine and I would accept the fact that I suck. But if I'm playing the same players as I was when I was trying to get to Masters' league, shouldn't I be in diamond league?
Yeah you should if your skill level is truly diamond, the only 2 reasons why you aren't diamond if you are like I said truly diamond skill level at this very moment is you didn't play enough games yet to get promoted so your mmr still might be trying to stabilize or you just aren't playing enough throughout the week or however fast the decay rate is to time. I have no idea what the formula actually is so I can't give you a specific time period, but yeah either way both possibilities I named just deal with playing more so yeah gogo ladder and you will get diamond no problem, gl~
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On November 23 2013 06:32 Ben... wrote:
I don't really care about rank, but matchmaking has been straight up busted since they implemented these changes. I just played someone who was an 8 time Master player (high master for some seasons) who was sitting in mid-Platinum with a W/L of 56-9. He completely leveled me. It could not have been fun for him and it definitely wasn't fun for me. Next game was the opposite, I was up in supply on my opponent the entire game and won with minimal effort.
They need to bring the old system back. The new system is not fun in any way. I never get matched equally anymore. It always results in either me getting completely stomped or me completely stomping someone. No close games, no way to improve or figure things out.
Edit: Yup, just played a 12 time Master Terran. Got rolled one sided yet again. This is not fun. And they wonder why people are quitting. This guy had 9 wins in a row today but prior to today hadn't played for 2 weeks.
Blame inactive players, that are good ^_^
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On November 23 2013 07:07 Days wrote:
If I was in Platinum and I was facing former Master players, I would see it as an opportunity for me to practice against these players who technically have more experience than myself and try to become better rather than whining about it. I highly doubt the skill gap is so vast that people in platinum will find it impossible to beat these former master players.
I am a grandmaster top 75 zerg right now and let me tell you, the masters you are playing right now have never been anywhere near high or mid master level. They were the low masters who basically just got by. There was a huge skill gap between low and high masters, I don't know if its still there because I've been GM the past 3 seasons.
If I were you guys, i'd see this as an opportunity to get free games vs people that technically are better than me and test myself if I have the prowess to take them down. #KeepLaddering
Yeah I was actually going to say this exactly, but I was too lazy <3 I completely agree with all of this ty
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On November 23 2013 07:02 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:59 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:55 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate? That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond. If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason) It does matter. Because it takes more games to get promoted now, unless you go on insane win streaks. Didn't you just say you knew how it works? Rather than spend your energy here ranting on the forums, why don't you go play some more games? If you play 200 games with a positive win rate against masters players and don't get promoted, then maybe I might concede that you've earned the entitlement to announce that the system is broken, and that it isn't infact just you that can't get into Masters. Yes, I'll play more games so I can lose to more Masters' players stuck in Platinum.
If you're losing to masters then why are you complaining that you can't get back in?
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On November 23 2013 07:54 rd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 07:02 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:59 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:55 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate? That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond. If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason) It does matter. Because it takes more games to get promoted now, unless you go on insane win streaks. Didn't you just say you knew how it works? Rather than spend your energy here ranting on the forums, why don't you go play some more games? If you play 200 games with a positive win rate against masters players and don't get promoted, then maybe I might concede that you've earned the entitlement to announce that the system is broken, and that it isn't infact just you that can't get into Masters. Yes, I'll play more games so I can lose to more Masters' players stuck in Platinum. If you're losing to masters then why are you complaining that you can't get back in?
Why can't I get into Diamond?
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On November 23 2013 07:54 rd wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 07:02 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:59 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:55 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate? That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond. If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason) It does matter. Because it takes more games to get promoted now, unless you go on insane win streaks. Didn't you just say you knew how it works? Rather than spend your energy here ranting on the forums, why don't you go play some more games? If you play 200 games with a positive win rate against masters players and don't get promoted, then maybe I might concede that you've earned the entitlement to announce that the system is broken, and that it isn't infact just you that can't get into Masters. Yes, I'll play more games so I can lose to more Masters' players stuck in Platinum. If you're losing to masters then why are you complaining that you can't get back in?
He means losing to players that USED to be in Masters but now are in the same league as him because of how messed up the ladder is.
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On November 23 2013 07:07 Days wrote:
If I was in Platinum and I was facing former Master players, I would see it as an opportunity for me to practice against these players who technically have more experience than myself and try to become better rather than whining about it. I highly doubt the skill gap is so vast that people in platinum will find it impossible to beat these former master players.
I am a grandmaster top 75 zerg right now and let me tell you, the masters you are playing right now have never been anywhere near high or mid master level. They were the low masters who basically just got by. There was a huge skill gap between low and high masters, I don't know if its still there because I've been GM the past 3 seasons.
If I were you guys, i'd see this as an opportunity to get free games vs people that technically are better than me and test myself if I have the prowess to take them down. #KeepLaddering
I can confirm regarding the master's thing, I'm mid-high master's at the moment (top ~15, still a long way from GM MMR) and I've never had any trouble getting out of lower leagues on decayed accounts. I had an account that decayed all the way down to bronze as of a couple weeks ago. I played the placement, got put in bronze, and I was already back up to diamond after going 21-0. All the ex-master's I played on the way up (there were maybe 6 or 7 total out of the 21) were very clearly not currently master's level. To be honest, I wouldn't even have been able to guess during the game that they were ex-masters. IMO the only real way to deal with MMR decay is to just focus on improving your game; the rest is just noise and will take care of iteslf.
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On November 23 2013 08:02 cDgCorazon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 07:54 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 07:02 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:59 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:55 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:47 rd wrote:On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:On November 23 2013 06:31 rd wrote:
How many games have you even played in total? 40 is not nearly enough to get promoted unless you won 90%+ of them. Rather than immediately assume the system is broken and that you aren't at fault, why not humble yourself and simply ask how it works first? I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work. I was a high diamond player before they changed the MMR decay. I could say that my skill went down a little bit, but to say it went from high-diamond to mid-platinum is a long shot. On my second account (where I play random), I'm currently around 16-5 and went from silver to gold (after having the account in Platinum last season) and I'm playing true gold players and stomping them with both my Zerg and Terran (which are way outclassed by my Protoss). I've played about 4-5 players that have never been higher than Platinum and I've beaten them all. My losses are to 3-time Masters, 4-time Masters, even a 13-time Masters' player. I'm 1-1 vs current Masters' players and about 2-3 to current Diamond players. It's ridiculous. That doesn't answer my question. How many total games have you played without seeing promotion, and at what winrate? That should not matter. If I was diamond before and I got demoted to platinum, I should be playing Diamond players and a quick win-streak should allow me to get back to diamond. If it makes you feel better, I'm 11-16 right now. My Bnet profile (I can't update SC2 ranks for whatever reason) It does matter. Because it takes more games to get promoted now, unless you go on insane win streaks. Didn't you just say you knew how it works? Rather than spend your energy here ranting on the forums, why don't you go play some more games? If you play 200 games with a positive win rate against masters players and don't get promoted, then maybe I might concede that you've earned the entitlement to announce that the system is broken, and that it isn't infact just you that can't get into Masters. Yes, I'll play more games so I can lose to more Masters' players stuck in Platinum. If you're losing to masters then why are you complaining that you can't get back in? Why can't I get into Diamond?
Play more games. If you can't get to diamond within 100 at a >50% win ratio then you're justified in bitching. (assuming you really are fighting at masters mmr and winning.
On November 23 2013 08:10 DueleR wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 07:07 Days wrote:
If I was in Platinum and I was facing former Master players, I would see it as an opportunity for me to practice against these players who technically have more experience than myself and try to become better rather than whining about it. I highly doubt the skill gap is so vast that people in platinum will find it impossible to beat these former master players.
I am a grandmaster top 75 zerg right now and let me tell you, the masters you are playing right now have never been anywhere near high or mid master level. They were the low masters who basically just got by. There was a huge skill gap between low and high masters, I don't know if its still there because I've been GM the past 3 seasons.
If I were you guys, i'd see this as an opportunity to get free games vs people that technically are better than me and test myself if I have the prowess to take them down. #KeepLaddering I can confirm regarding the master's thing, I'm mid-high master's at the moment (top ~15, still a long way from GM MMR) and I've never had any trouble getting out of lower leagues on decayed accounts. I had an account that decayed all the way down to bronze as of a couple weeks ago. I played the placement, got put in bronze, and I was already back up to diamond after going 21-0. All the ex-master's I played on the way up (there were maybe 6 or 7 total out of the 21) were very clearly not currently master's level. To be honest, I wouldn't even have been able to guess during the game that they were ex-masters. IMO the only real way to deal with MMR decay is to just focus on improving your game; the rest is just noise and will take care of iteslf.
Double confirm; Half of diamond was probably masters at some point. It's pretty common for everyone to be a former masters, but that really means nothing when evaluating their current mmr (by checking their opponents), and how good they actually play.
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On November 23 2013 07:07 KaienFEMC wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2013 06:44 cDgCorazon wrote:
I've been playing this game for 3 years. I understand how ladders work.
I think only Excalibur_Z can make that claim outside Blizzard employees Also, please take a look at this chart before you make more claims. MMR decay is not the only reason why you are facing past Master players in diamonds and platinums. Just accept it and try to get better.
Interesting chart, really can explain this very clearly. It's possible for a small percentage of people to have gone from bottom masters to top platinum while maintaining the exact same mmr.
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This thread and that chart are perfect illustrations of why these named leagues were always a dumb idea. As the population of players decreases over time, which is to be expected to some degree, the players that stick around are more likely to be better and improving. Having labels that are relative to the overall player population rather than indicating how a player has improved over time is really crap. Worst case there could be as many as 10k masters players that have improved over the past two seasons but are in lower leagues now. Things like league labels really matter in competitive communities.
Just yet another painful example of how Blizzard refused to learned from what made BW such a long lasting success. Everyone would be so much happier if bnet2.0 had gone with a system like iccup had. A ranking system that rewarded dedication and striving to improve by letting you see raw scores and compare season to season.
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EPT
